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Astonishing Wang posted:We have the truck at our cousins house, but he is running out of room for more stuff. He rolled his ZJ so that's there next to my truck, and then a couple days ago he picked up a 5.9 ZJ to swap the suspension to. Once he gets rid of the rolled jeep uh.... what motor is in the rolled jeep?
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Jun 12, 2015 18:03
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Slow is Fast posted:uh.... It's the 5.2. I've considered it but kind of want to go with something that has a bigger following. Maybe that's a silly idea? Looks like 230/295 hp/tq, that would probably be enough... actually it looks like it's in a lot of stuff. I'll have to ask him about it! 1992–2000 Dodge Dakota 1992–2001 Dodge Ram 1998–2000 Dodge Durango 1992–1993 Dodge Ramcharger 1992–2003 Dodge Ram Van 1993–1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Jun 12, 2015 |
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Jun 12, 2015 18:07
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Astonishing Wang posted:starting with the engine and trans, then the rear axle This is also the order they should go in in, since you want to set the pinion angle right the first time. I would skip the 5.2, it is really not worth the effort to use those instead of a 5.9, the trannies suck (the 5.9 also has lovely trannies), if the "it's free" factor is driving this decision, sell it to someone with a ZJ that needs fixing and use the money to buy chevy drivetrain stuff for the IH.
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Jun 12, 2015 18:24
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Yeah I was hoping for another 5.9 or a 4.0. Back to the drawing board. I'm still rooting for a gen 3 vortec.
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Jun 12, 2015 18:26
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If you do wind up with another GM donor (or really, any donor with an alternator), kastein was spot on on pretty much everything. The only thing is that's an ammeter, not a voltmeter - it's meant to have the full current of the alternator going through it (which back then, wasn't much, as it was just a generator and likely 6V, only had to crank out enough power to run the lights and coil... but toss a modern charging system at it and  ). They're fire hazards on the best of days, you're better off bypassing it and wiring in some kind of alternator warning light.
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Jun 13, 2015 07:44
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There is probably a way to eliminate the shunt resistor in the gauge so it turns into a microvolt/millivolt meter (of uncertain scale - this needst o be determined by reading any manuals available, ohms law, math and experiment, etc) and then mounting a remote shunt resistor under the hood with the not-an-ammeter-anymore wired to it, but whether that is worth doing is up to you. I would definitely leave it till absolute last, you can do without it and add that later if you really decide you want to.
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Jun 13, 2015 15:11
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Just wanted to add my piece here about a steer axle for you. In the wild I have seen people make HD steer axles out of Dana 44's. Just buy one for the knuckles and have a shop weld in a tube and perches with no differential. Then you have steering, front HD disc conversion and adjustable width to your vehicle. I actually have a Dana 44 that I'd be happy to strip for you, if you lived in Canada. Then you can just choose any engine +trans combo from a scrap yard. I'd use an LM4/7 5.3 + 4l80e or LQ4/9 + 4l80e because they were in every 1500 and 2500 GM truck from 1999 until 2006, then just throw an MSD or similar control unit at it. At least where I am I can pick up that combination at the local scrapyard for $1000.
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Jun 15, 2015 15:11
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CBD posted:Just wanted to add my piece here about a steer axle for you. The benefits of this versus just using a raw dana 44 would be the adjust-ability of width and not having to worry about a pumpkin interfering with the engine space, right? What do you guys think about the Ford I6 300 4.9 motor? Stock specs seem a little weaker than what I've been looking at but still pretty decent compared to what this had in it originally - and everything I read says they just pull like crazy. The engine bay is already sized for a straight six with an indentation back into the firewall. Steering would probably be a lot easier to set up going along-side a straight 6 as well. Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Jun 15, 2015 |
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Jun 15, 2015 17:08
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Astonishing Wang posted:The benefits of this versus just using a raw dana 44 would be the adjust-ability of width and not having to worry about a pumpkin interfering with the engine space, right? They'll run for-goddamned-ever, but "power" isn't really something I associate with them. They're decently torquey, but you're not going to win any drag races. What kind of weight are you looking at with this truck?
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Jun 15, 2015 17:10
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Astonishing Wang posted:The benefits of this versus just using a raw dana 44 would be the adjust-ability of width and not having to worry about a pumpkin interfering with the engine space, right? Exactly, I first saw it done on a '79 GMC K25, the owner fit a 4-53 Detroit in it with a T5, Of course a DD is a lot taller then what you want to use. If you can justify air suspension you could buy from these guys: http://www.hendrickson-intl.com/Truck/Bus-RV-Medium-Duty My brother and I were in contact with them to get a customized air ride for our '52 GMC 5-ton. That project is on hold until we find another cab, an RTO-6610 and a silver series Detroit.
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Jun 15, 2015 18:08
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Boaz MacPhereson posted:They'll run for-goddamned-ever, but "power" isn't really something I associate with them. They're decently torquey, but you're not going to win any drag races. What kind of weight are you looking at with this truck? I don't know the weight of this thing - I'm guessing it's about 6,000 lbs. but I really have nothing to base that on. I will get it weighed once it's running, then I'll know if I built it right for the weight or not  CBD posted:Exactly, I first saw it done on a '79 GMC K25, the owner fit a 4-53 Detroit in it with a T5, Of course a DD is a lot taller then what you want to use. If you can justify air suspension you could buy from these guys: http://www.hendrickson-intl.com/Truck/Bus-RV-Medium-Duty I talked to a local 4x4 shop a while back about front axles and they recommended the same thing. I'm sure I'd be paying at least $7-1000 for that kind of work from a shop, so I'm going to see how things look once the motor is in. Keeping the current axle beam and adapting it to new wheels/brakes/steering is an option as well. This weekend I put the truck up on stands and pulled the steering column and steering box. We got one side 90% stripped. Found some more rust, which is weird   We first tried one of the 'gentler' eco-friendly paint strippers that had citrus in the name. When that didn't work very well we bought a can of Jasco, which worked much better. I need to find some aircraft stripper, because I hear that's even better. My girlfriend wore long gloves while brushing it on, but she kept having to run to the sink when some got on her arms. She's got 3 or 4 little chemical burns now, so maybe I don't need the aircraft stripper.  Here's some of the worst that we've found so far, most of the rot looks relatively easy to repair (once I learn how to weld lololol) and I should be able to just buy a bunch of 16g sheets from the hardware store. This is for a little further down the road.  Next weekend I'll have the engine hoist, so I'm planning on pulling the motor and transmission. After that I'm going to clean up the engine bay and box the frame rails for the engine and steering stuff. I'm thinking of either getting some sort of tall "L-channel" metal that can sit on top of the frame and reach down to the bottom, or just flat stock that is cut to fit in as a fourth wall to the frame. My cousin has a nice big welder, and he's pretty good with it, but I want to have him show me the basics so that I can do most of this myself (aside from the super important stuff like motor mounts). I definitely won't be asking anyone else to help with body work, that's my demon to slay.
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Jun 15, 2015 19:24
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CBD, it sounds like you guys do some fun stuff and when you get more parts lined up, I want a thread I can subscribe to  AW - a 300 will go forfuckingever. Like everyone said, you aren't winning any races but I bet it's more powerful than the stock motor. At least those body lines look pretty easy to replicate with sheetmetal when you do the bodywork.
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Jun 17, 2015 04:01
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kastein posted:CBD, it sounds like you guys do some fun stuff and when you get more parts lined up, I want a thread I can subscribe to My brother and I tried to run a thread about my project '86 4runner, but we are bad at upkeep. We have a bad habit of building odd engine/trans combos and stick them in things. Our current restorations include a 400SBC/SM465/NP205 into a '79 GMC K35 with 14BFF rear and DANA 60 front for towing and a 455BBB/TH700R4 equipped 72 Buick Riviera. Also some sick addiction to 70's GM green paint colors. Back on topic, I think you will find a 300 ford woefully underpowered when you get to using the truck, especially if you ever decide to throw a single axle trailer in tow. When it comes to working with a truck I recommend as much swinging iron as possible, inertia is all that matters. On that note, have you considered updating the wiring harness enough to add towing provisions (7 pin plug and brake controller)? Even if you don't plan on towing now, it may be useful in the future.
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Jun 17, 2015 16:13
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I worked a bit on the truck this weekend - got the steering a little closer to out. I think I need a gear puller to get the arm off the steering box. Anybody have an idea of how the steering column would be attached to the box? I undid a clamp collar where the shaft meets the box, and undid three bolts holding the two together (with gaskets between the two). There is now a medium amount of play in and out between the box and the shaft but I can't seem to separate the two. This is where I need the puller I think. The nut came off easy but the arm is stuck on the splines pretty well. I don't want to hack through this old stuff in case someone needs it :/  Since it was father's day I started thinking about all the stuff my dad did to this thing when he had it. I noticed the stickers glued onto carpet for the gas tank switch, and that seemed like something he would've done, but it wasn't. According to my mom, he replaced the mufflers, swapped the fridge, added some curtains and had it painted root-beer brown. He also got the crawl-thru upholstered in the heartiest of Naugahyde.  We also did a bunch of stripping and grinding - my girl is getting a lot better with the paint stripper, not a single chemical burn this time! I used the wire wheel on some of the rough stuff, I swear it's like therapy. When I got home I realized why you aren't supposed to grind in a tank top. I have tiny red spots all over my chest, which I assume are from burning hot flecks of flying metal    A dude that I'd never met before came by to see my cousin, who's house it is, but he was gone to the beach for the day. We got to talking and before I knew it he was scraping old paint with us. Seems like folks are always more willing to help in the country 
Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Jun 22, 2015 |
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Jun 22, 2015 17:04
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Yeah, you'll need a pitman arm puller for that job for sure. The splines are tapered a bit, they move pretty easy once you break them free. Just get some decent tension built up on it (about as much as you can muster with a box wrench) and then give the end of the pitman arm where the shaft goes through it a love tap or five with a 3lb hammer (start out gently, you don't want to flatten the bearings that support the shaft inside the box) and when you hear a crack or a pop it has probably broken loose. Tighten the puller again, repeat as necessary till it just walks it off by hand.
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Jun 22, 2015 23:47
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I helped a buddy take apart a '79 F-250 today. He bought this for $600 and the guy delivered it. I'm taking the rear end for my truck and he's using the front end on his. He's taking the dana 44 from the 79 to replace the 44 that is currently in his truck, which is drum brake. He said he couldn't find a good way to convert his to disk, but I'm not sure how hard he looked. I guess 8-lug dana 44s are a little rare, not rare in a good way, just less common, so there may not be a cheap way to get disks. Anybody have an idea? It seems plenty sturdy for the big beast but I definitely want good brakes in the front. I can get this axle from him if there ends up being a way. Fingers crossed! Here's a few photos from today, we did a ton of work in 5ish hours. This gave me a little confidence for my project, dude really knows how to take a truck apart. Rear end is a Dana 60, and this truck is a highboy so I have the option of a 4"(I think) lift in the rear when I install it! The springs were hosed unfortunately, but It's complete other than one soft brake line that I ended up cutting because I was tired of messing with it. I probably would've replaced it anyway being that old.    This is pretty much how we left it - We pulled the axles, drivelines, transfer case, hood, front grille, radiator and core support, front quarter panels and one inner fender, steering column, headliner trim and visors  The motor is a 351 that sat with the intake open for years. It turns over but doesn't seem worth putting time into. Transmission is a manual, and was the second dirtiest part of the truck, after the transfer case. Check out this flex-shaft! Somebody clearly beat this truck into the rocks. Front shaft was hilariously bent, but I guess not enough to take a better picture of  I removed all of the driveshafts and dropped the transfer case. It was pretty cool to see how the NP205 is separate from the transmission and uses 3 driveshafts. I only really know about the Jeep, so it's neat to see another way of doing it. Today I learned to think about a job before you do it - you're less likely to have to get up for more tools 5 times per part. e: looks like kits are around $300 to convert an 8-lug dana 44 to disk brakes. I'm probably better off finding a whole axle. Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Jul 13, 2015 |
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Jul 11, 2015 22:29
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Depending on the age of his truck the issue may be that his is a closed-knuckle 44, not that it's drum. I mean, they go hand in hand, but basically no one gives a single poo poo about the old closed-knuckle 44s and 60s so there is basically nothing aftermarket available, just (very occasionally) OEM replacement type stuff. If it is an open-knuckle 44, you can convert it pretty easily, at worst you buy a new set of balljoints, new seals, new bearings since you're in there, new ujoints, rip all your outer knuckle/brake parts off, put all the 8 lug stuff on with new balljoints, etc. In fact, let me know if it is and what your preferred parts-pile price is and I'll see if I can pillage an axle out here, I see them occasionally. Also, it looks like a lot of the bodywork off that donor truck is in good shape, at least corrosion wise, and I bet you guys can make your money back selling off what's left instead of scrapping it.
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Jul 13, 2015 23:47
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kastein posted:Depending on the age of his truck the issue may be that his is a closed-knuckle 44, not that it's drum. I mean, they go hand in hand, but basically no one gives a single poo poo about the old closed-knuckle 44s and 60s so there is basically nothing aftermarket available, just (very occasionally) OEM replacement type stuff. His is definitely closed-knuckle - I just did a little reading on it and it looks like I don't want any part of these closed-knuckle axles. It looks like they ALL leak, and they have a worse turning radius than open knuckle. Also the cost of swapping to disk. It's good to know that an open knuckle can be converted pretty easily and would be using a lot of parts that should be replaced anyway. Thanks 
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Jul 14, 2015 16:43
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Yeah, if it's closed knuckle its only real place in life is in a 100% OEM restored truck, everyone else ditches that garbage. The 8 lug specific stuff (as far as I know - some of this may actually be the same) consists of the knuckles (pretty sure), spindles (sorta sure), hubs+rotors (100%), calipers, caliper brackets if they aren't cast into the knuckles, and maybe the stub shafts. But yeah, it all straps on pretty easy as long as the axle you end up with uses 5-760x size ujoints, which is most d44s. Only really early ones got 5-260x size ujoints as far as I know. I see a lot more dodge 8 lug 44s go through the yards than I do ford ones. I doubt it really matters though as long as you know what the donor was for parts ordering purposes.
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Jul 14, 2015 16:55
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I'd never dropped a vehicle off the jacks before, so today was cool. I pulled the steering box and column today - I finally figured out how the column connects to the box, so I just had to basically pry it a bit past the bearings and then unscrew the worm gear from the box. Cool stuff! The people that designed all of this in the 1950s were so much smarter than me. Here's the gearbox - I was able to get it this high by cutting one of the steering arms with a hacksaw. I couldn't tell how they connected through the literal half inch of grime so I took an angle grinder to it. I feel a little bad about cutting a part in half when it might be a little hard to replace, for someone else, but I guess I'm lazy.  I raised my trophy unto Valhalla. But not for the photo. I really feel like this has some potential, hopefully there will be a way to at least keep the steering wheel.  So after that victory, I set about removing the wheels to get a little more space to work with. I remembered from the first time that the drivers side wheels are left hand threaded, so I was able to get all of the lugnuts off easily enough. I undid the front wheels and took them off, then I undid the driver side rear. I left the wheels on after removing the nuts and then started on the rear passenger. The lug nuts came off easy, so I jacked up the truck from the frame to get the wheel off the ground. I stopped a bit short and started wiggling the wheels off. The whole truck started a slooooooooow slide off of the jack stands and into the ground. It was getting dark and that felt like a good event to stop on, so I packed up and headed home. I'm going out again in a couple of days to get it back on stands, this time with a way sturdier and higher base. I had stacked three 2x8 pieces under each jack stand, which I now see is a pretty bad thing. The thing the really saved me from more damage to the truck was having wheels still on one side and the jack in place sort of. The jack is now pinned under the truck, but it definitely slowed the descent. A good day to learn a scary lesson the easy way. Only damage that I see is a trim piece shook off, but it was 98% rust anyway.  Look at that loving thing. I might need to lower and bag it. Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 05:58 on Aug 5, 2015 |
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Aug 5, 2015 05:54
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Astonishing Wang posted:
This would be pretty loving amazing. Get the wheels tucked...
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Aug 5, 2015 08:57
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The first time dropping a car off the stands is always a pants-making GBS threads moment for sure, glad you were OK and the truck came out unscathed! Also completely agree with some bags and a mild drop.
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Aug 5, 2015 11:53
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Terrible Robot posted:Also completely agree with some bags and laying frame. Fixed that. 
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Aug 5, 2015 14:32
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Pfft. I say donk that fucker out.
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Aug 5, 2015 16:56
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Realistically I want the truck to ride sort of high - Normal truck height give or take a few inches in either direction. Even if this ends up 2wd I don't want to worry about ground clearance and speed bumps. Air bags in the rear might be a thing to do though, especially if I end up able to tow the jeep behind. I have basically $0 for this project for the next few weeks due to various life issues*, luckily there's a shitload of free work to be done. I'm ramping up the frequency of work since I found a way to get to the truck after work that takes 45 minutes in rush hour instead of 90. Not the ideal situation but I get to work on my project *lovely with money
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Aug 5, 2015 17:36
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I went out and got the truck situated quite a bit better. We jacked each corner up and set the drums on blocks. We took some big chunks of 6x10 and screwed some 2x6 pieces to the bottom for a little more height and a wider foot print. We also put the wood under the drums with the grain running counter to the weight, since we did it the other way without thinking about it and a few boards split. Definitely feels better than how I was doing it before with stacked 2x6s with a jack stand on top. I do want to add some strips of wood in front of and behind each drum, in case there's an earthquake or something I guess. Wouldn't want this thing to roll away! It's looking pretty Sanford and son out there.  Baby got back   I found this under the seat. This is probably from when I was a kid, anyone else remember milk caps/pogs? I had a tackle-box full of them, and I remember being SO PISSED when a kid in 6th grade stole my gold Popeye slammer  Check out this door! I could fit about 20 kilos in there, or some insulation I guess.  Next is the last few pieces holding the motor and trans in, then we pull it and clean up the engine bay! I'm going to get it all wire brushed and painted, and also probably box in some of the front portion of the frame. Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 16:21 on Aug 7, 2015 |
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Aug 7, 2015 15:56
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I spent a few hours on the truck last night - Pulled the carpet from the cab, then removed the cover plate over the transmission and removed the e-brake handle. I undid the bolts holding the trans to the motor. I thought I'd be able to pull the motor and transmission together but there's a riveted cross member in the way, so I'm going to have to drop the trans and THEN pull the engine (I think.) I'm tired of working around stuff because I'm not sure if I'll reuse it or not. There's very little here that I think I'll need, so I'm just going to pull everything off to get it out of the way from here on. Really the only thing that might be worth keeping is the fuel tank switching mechanism, The e-brake handle boot was fashioned carefully from a latex glove  Here's the escape hatch  Where the transmission meets the engine  Transmission marking detail  Gnarly carpet - should be easy to reproduce 
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Aug 15, 2015 00:32
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This is kind of a bummer post for me - it's been over a year and really nothing has been done on the truck. I've mostly gutted it, but that's about it. My cousin is asking now (reasonably so) if we have a solid plan for finishing the truck and getting it out of his yard. We don't have a plan, we don't have the money, and stuff just keeps coming up. I think this project is ending before it really started. The truck may be going back to family (hopefully) so I may get to see it again somewhere down the road. Astonishing Wang fucked around with this message at 20:10 on Sep 4, 2015 |
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Sep 3, 2015 17:26
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My dad and I collect and restore this era of IH trucks. Where are you, and do you have original parts still?
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Sep 4, 2015 17:19
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I'm in San Diego - I'm going to wait on unloading parts until I find out who the truck will end up with.
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Sep 4, 2015 20:10
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shoncook posted:My dad and I collect and restore this era of IH trucks. Where are you, and do you have original parts still? If you ever find yourself in the central alberta area, there is a little international museum in rimbey that has one of each gen. http://paskapoopark.com/Full-Truck-Collection.html it's a really small museum, and really not worth traveling specificially for it, but if you're within an hour anyways, it's a neat place to check out and the old guy that runs it is awesome
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Sep 4, 2015 20:22
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Powershift posted:If you ever find yourself in the central alberta area, there is a little international museum in rimbey that has one of each gen. Wow, that is a very cool museum. After finally making it through grad school (and paying off student loans, etc) without progress on project cars, my wife and I are upgrading houses and I'll finally have a three car garage. I'd like to first get my IHC truck running, so that we have a useable pickup for random chores. In high school, I threw a rod on the original block, and years later stuck in a replacement. The "running" engine in it now is a joke, though. Compression is basically nonexistent. I've called around for quotes to get it rebuilt, and it's not cheap, even if parts are available. Since the original engine is a 220 cu. in. straight six, I was thinking that an ideal swap would be the Jeep 4.0, since it's the same-ish displacement, and keeps the spirit of the straight six in mind (not to mention fuel injection is a miracle). This would also have the benefit of mating to a transmission that could go over 60 mph. Upgrading rear ends would be great too, since these trucks chew up axles like crazy. I've sheared one just leaving a stop light. Not to hijack Astonishing Wang's thread, but what says AI? Ruin "originality" for ease of use, or spend hella bucks to get the original engine working, and go slow?
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Sep 4, 2015 22:23
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Spend thousands on a faithfully restored truck you can't (barely) drive or half that on a truck you will drive, seems obvious to me.
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Sep 4, 2015 22:27
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shoncook posted:Wow, that is a very cool museum. Even if you upgrade the drivetrain to something modern, it's still an old truck with an old truck ride and old truck creature comforts. Pick the path that gives you the most pleasure. You can restore it fully and have a truck you can toodle around in, and enjoy the process, or get it back on the road right away and get some use out of it to enjoy getting on with your life. I'd personally go for originality as much as possible. Something about having it the way it was from the 50s has more appeal due to rarity and the museum aspect of it.
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Sep 4, 2015 22:41
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I went the spend a ton of money and time way to make my 56 all original and it is a HUGE pain in the rear end to drive. Its slow as hell, have to double clutch and tops out at about 40mph. It rides like a lumber wagon since it doesnt even have dampers on the rear springs. That being said I love the hell out of driving it, Im just glad I have other things to drive when I have to actually get places.
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Sep 5, 2015 15:01
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