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namesake
Jun 19, 2006

"When I was a girl, around 12 or 13, I had a fantasy that I'd grow up to marry Captain Scarlet, but he'd be busy fighting the Mysterons so I'd cuckold him with the sexiest people I could think of - Nigel Mansell, Pat Sharp and Mr. Blobby."

HortonNash posted:

What does that mean?

To appeal against a specific order means you have to argue against the principles and context of the order being issued rather than relying on direct evidence relating to the order.

Basically be prepared to have to pay very expensive barristers.

1986: The International Year of Peace.

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Regarde Aduck
Oct 19, 2012

Grimey Drawer

baka kaba posted:

Right, but it still allows the horrors of AV like :byodood: PEOPLE GET MORE THAN ONE VOTE!! and :byodood: TEH PERSON IN SECNOD PLACE WINS! and :byodood: ITS TOO COMPLCATED, and PCC elections came after all those dynamic arguments had already been made! I just wondered if they bothered to justify it with some handwaving

Don't forget Labour grandees came out against AV as well, even if Miliband was on the Yes panel

AV primarily lost because they forgot to actually run a pro AV campaign.

TinTower
Apr 21, 2010

You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.
It'd also get struck down as breaking the ECHR faster than you can count UKIP MPs after next year.

ThomasPaine
Feb 4, 2009

We have no compassion and we ask no compassion from you. When our turn comes, we shall not make excuses for the terror.
Labour to replace the Lords with an elected 'senate'? Hmm. Seems like an actual ballsy move from Miliband (of course he's lying and will never do this).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29857849

tooterfish
Jul 13, 2013

Yeah, it cannot be right that London has more peers than most of the rest of the country combined... So appoint more peers from outside loving London. They could do that right now if they wanted to.

I'm a bit leery of an elected second chamber if all it will do is mirror all the political bickering and back room dealing of the commons. The only thing the Lords has going for it is that they can tell the political parties to go gently caress themselves and vote on their conscience. Just making it elected isn't going to magically improve anything, it'll probably make things worse.

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal

JFairfax posted:

But George Osborne, the Chancellor, has made clear in a letter to constituents that the aim of the orders would be to “eliminate extremism in all its forms” and that they would be used to curtail the activities of those who “spread hate but do not break laws”.
A law to selectively regulate the activities of people who have broken no laws. :allears:

ThomasPaine
Feb 4, 2009

We have no compassion and we ask no compassion from you. When our turn comes, we shall not make excuses for the terror.

tooterfish posted:

Yeah, it cannot be right that London has more peers than most of the rest of the country combined... So appoint more peers from outside loving London. They could do that right now if they wanted to.

I'm a bit leery of an elected second chamber if all it will do is mirror all the political bickering and back room dealing of the commons. The only thing the Lords has going for it is that they can tell the political parties to go gently caress themselves and vote on their conscience. Just making it elected isn't going to magically improve anything, it'll probably make things worse.

Yeah, ideally I'd like to see a wholly elected Lords but members are elected for life (with strict rules on regional/party representation) and replaced as they die or resign (though I'd like to see them able to be recalled if the situation demands it). So just a load of by-elections really. You make it democratic but you retain that useful long term isolation from the mainstream political process/concerns about re-election.

In completely unrelated news, I've been tossing around the idea of my perfect utopian electoral system. Hit upon the strange idea of returning to a form of wealth franchise, but inverted. Only those who fall below a certain level are eligible to stand for parliament. It's kind of undemocratic, but it enforces a system that would be governed in the interests of the most vulnerable and needy. You choose between economic success and political power, effectively - which is more important to you? You're not barred from wealth, it just comes at a cost. Actually seems like a half decent (if impossible to implement) system.

namesake
Jun 19, 2006

"When I was a girl, around 12 or 13, I had a fantasy that I'd grow up to marry Captain Scarlet, but he'd be busy fighting the Mysterons so I'd cuckold him with the sexiest people I could think of - Nigel Mansell, Pat Sharp and Mr. Blobby."

^^^Only if being a politician is something you can't ever lose or get rid of. Someone gets voted out; what stops them going to be a rich lobbyist like we have now?

The Lords is something like the third largest legislative body in the world behind some Indian and Chinese houses because everyone keeps appointing Lords to it and not enough of them are loving dying off. It's not particularly effective as a body of experts because they only know about the things they care about, it's not representative demographically and it's generally a stupid idea where its saving graces lie in the aristocratic memory of peasants murdering them if things change too much for the worse in a short period of time.

namesake fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Nov 1, 2014

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal

ThomasPaine posted:

In completely unrelated news, I've been tossing around the idea of my perfect utopian electoral system. Hit upon the strange idea of returning to a form of wealth franchise, but inverted. Only those who fall below a certain level are eligible to stand for parliament. It's kind of undemocratic, but it enforces a system that would be governed in the interests of the most vulnerable and needy. You choose between economic success and political power, effectively - which is more important to you? You're not barred from wealth, it just comes at a cost. Actually seems like a half decent (if impossible to implement) system.
There would have to be some radical changes to the ideas around national borders (moves all wealth offshore, runs for election :smug:), corporate investment status and personhood (invests everything in a series of corporate bodies, runs for election :smug:), and even the old tricks that people used when fleeing oppressive regimes like apartheid South Africa (moves all wealth into postage stamps, runs for election :smug:).

More immediately, it would have to be made by a system where those with immense wealth didn't have disproportionate power in the first place.

Jose
Jul 24, 2007

Adrian Chiles is a broadcaster and writer

JFairfax posted:

This sounds sensible.


It seems like the tories are getting all their really insane stuff into the public now knowing that nobody will pay attention because either they lose the election so it doesn't matter or its a bit too early and UKIP are dominating the headlines instead

Venomous
Nov 7, 2011





Jose posted:

or its a bit too early and UKIP are dominating the headlines instead

This is more likely to me. Like last time they'll probably campaign on somewhat centrist, compassionate grounds, and if they're elected (either as a majority or in a coalition with UKIP) they'll enact all of that insane shite and more.

African AIDS cum
Feb 29, 2012


Welcome back, welcome back, welcome baaaack

Jose posted:

It seems like the tories are getting all their really insane stuff into the public now knowing that nobody will pay attention because either they lose the election so it doesn't matter or its a bit too early and UKIP are dominating the headlines instead

Sounds like the case doesn't it.

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serious gaylord
Sep 16, 2007

what.
Its been a barnstorming October everyone.

See you all in the November thread

http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3677921

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