|
Gordon is better than Gurley simply because he is not made of glass
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 19:31
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 24, 2024 00:48 |
|
|
MourningView posted:I would imagine taking that level of punishment in 11 games rather than spreading it out over 14 is harder on the body, and it indicates he was probably asked to carry a bigger load for his team. I agree this could maybe be a factor, but I don't think it makes a big impact. Also, top athletes like Barry and Melvin wear down slower than your average college defensive players. Despite not playing many 4th quarter minutes, Gordon did a disproportionate amount of damage in the second half. Teams usually focused on shutting Gordon down in the first quarter, and he would just go off after defenses start to tire. Up until like the 10th game of the season Gordon had a ridiculous stat where he was averaging >30ypc on the first carry after halftime. He definitely got stronger as the game went on. I don't feel like spending 30 minutes compiling stats to back this up, but I feel like Gordon would have had quite a few more yards if he got an extra 5 carries/games and played a couple fewer games (assuming the extra workload didn't lead to some sort of stress injury).
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 19:37
|
|
|
MourningView posted:I would imagine taking that level of punishment in 11 games rather than spreading it out over 14 is harder on the body, and it indicates he was probably asked to carry a bigger load for his team. Although, defensive players were smaller and slower when Barry was playing compared to currently with Melvin. it's always fun to compare different eras.
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 19:39
|
|
|
Mr Executive posted:People are not trying to argue that.... Am I missing something? Barry had 344 carries, Gordon had 343, right? At best it's a wash.
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 19:42
|
|
|
Blatzmobile posted:Although, defensive players were smaller and slower when Barry was playing compared to currently with Melvin. it's always fun to compare different eras. I wonder how this works. Obviously the defense was smaller and slower, but the people they were tackling were not as big and strong either. I wonder how the injury rate has changed from the 80s through today. Are bigger faster linebackers shredding more ACLs, or are the bigger stronger RB knees holding up?
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 19:42
|
|
|
WHOOPS posted:Am I missing something? Barry had 344 carries, Gordon had 343, right? At best it's a wash. Yeah, it is. For most of the season Gordon had a significantly higher YPC and, if he was going to reach the record, he would have done it with far fewer carries. His production slowed down a bit so that now they have basically the same number of carries and yards. The main point I was making is that playing 3 extra games (Gordon) doesn't really give him any sort of advantage and people should look at #carries rather than #games. I'd also like to see a comparison of rush defense rankings that Gordon/Sanders played, but I don't feel like digging it up.
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 19:46
|
|
|
MourningView posted:You realize you could make literally this exact same argument but sub in Gordon and Wisconsin running backs, right? There have been lots of successful Wisconsin running backs, and none of them have even come close to the season Melvin Gordon put up this season. In fact, no FBS player has for 25 years regardless of school. My argument isn't "well lots of Oregon QBs are good, Mariota is just a system guy", rather it's "his stats are roughly the average of the last 10 best QBs in college football which means he is great, but not historically great". But for the record, I'm also a total homer and made this exact same argument 3 years ago. Nimmy fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Jan 2, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 20:11
|
|
|
Mr Executive posted:The main point I was making is that playing 3 extra games (Gordon) doesn't really give him any sort of advantage and people should look at #carries rather than #games. MV already pretty much explained why this is wrong
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 20:15
|
|
|
Mr Executive posted:Yeah, it is. For most of the season Gordon had a significantly higher YPC and, if he was going to reach the record, he would have done it with far fewer carries. But if he had just two more carries of 25 yards this season, he would have beat the record with more carries. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 20:32
|
|
|
Nimmy posted:There have been lots of successful Wisconsin running backs, and none of them have even come close to the season Melvin Gordon put up this season. In fact, no FBS player has for 25 years regardless of school. My argument isn't "well lots of Oregon QBs are good, Mariota is just a system guy", rather it's "his stats are roughly the average of the last 10 best QBs in college football which means he is great, but not historically great". I think Melvin Gordon is a great football player, but Mariota is something especially special compared to previous Oregon QBs.
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 20:44
|
|
|
It's 2015, can we stop giving credit to running backs when it should go to offensive linemen?
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 20:55
|
|
|
three posted:It's 2015, can we stop giving credit to running backs when it should go to offensive linemen? Running backs aren't the best, it's a team effort.
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 21:34
|
|
|
I never thought I would see Wisconsin fans delusional enough to argue that Melvin Gordon > Barry Sanders but I guess we all have learned something special here.
|
|
#
?
Jan 2, 2015 22:57
|
|
|
Intruder posted:MV already pretty much explained why this is wrong Yeah, but the exact opposite. I think you have a much better chance of picking up yards later in games when the defense is gassed, especially if you're a run-heavy team. Dude probably could have gotten 600 yards against Bowling Green if he carries over 30 times. But he rarely got to play in the 4th quarter because of the blowout factor. Whereas Sanders was merrily tromping along during blowouts, because OSU didn't give a gently caress. So Gordon was artificially limited in games where he could have racked up stupid numbers, and kept in in the ones where yards were difficult to come by.
|
|
#
?
Jan 3, 2015 01:02
|
|
|
Abugadu posted:Giving the backup RB nearly 1000 yards on the season probably didn't help the cause, nor did pulling Gordon in the 4th q. in 5-6 games. I wish more backs were pulled and spelled so they didn't die out at 25 in the nfl.
|
|
#
?
Jan 3, 2015 15:31
|
|
|
Crazy Ted posted:I never thought I would see Wisconsin fans delusional enough to argue that Melvin Gordon > Barry Sanders but I guess we all have learned something special here. I don't really take it seriously, but probably because I grew up watching Barry Sanders and I have this image in my head of him as the greatest athlete I've ever seen. I can't imagine any RB ever surpassing him in my head as the greatest of all time. AP isn't even close. Maxwells Demon posted:I think Melvin Gordon is a great football player, but Mariota is something especially special compared to previous Oregon QBs. My point is that he's not something "especially special" compared to Manziel, Cam Newton, Tim Tebow, Andrew Luck, RGIII, etc, who have all played in the last 10 years. Gordon is the best college back since Sanders. I think that means something. And Gordon is likewise far and away the best Wisconsin back I've ever seen, surpassing Dayne who graduated 15 years ago. Nimmy fucked around with this message at 12:09 on Jan 4, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2015 12:06
|
|
|
Well ok that got out of hand quickly. I am a Wisconsin fan and my wife even works at Kenosha Bradford where Gordon went and I think that comment is ridiculous. Edit: Best college back since Sanders comment.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2015 15:10
|
|
|
Hand Row posted:Well ok that got out of hand quickly. I am a Wisconsin fan and my wife even works at Kenosha Bradford where Gordon went and I think that comment is ridiculous. Well alright, I don't know if I'd go that far either. He's had the best season since Sanders.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2015 16:56
|
|
|
This is the last I'll say about this, but here's the thing about Barry Sanders: His 1988 season was even more amazing to me than it is upon first glance, because the stats from his 1988 bowl game didn't count as at the the time they were still considered exhibitions by the NCAA that people shouldn't count for things  Here's his game log, including the bowl game:  I mean...just look at that beautiful thing. And you can tell - at least in the first two games - that he likely sat early in huge blowouts. So, including his bowl game, Barry Sanders rushed for 2,850 yards in twelve games. That's an average of 237.5 yards per game. He went over 300 yards rushing in a game four times. He scored 44 touchdowns in one year in an era before modern offenses caused scoring to go way up. Of those 44 touchdowns, 41 were rushing touchdowns. He averaged 7.6 yards per carry. He broke the single-season D1 touchdown record with two games to spare. His low rushing total on the year was 157 yards, which occurred in a game that OSU won by four touchdowns. If you include receiving and return yards, he finished with 3,471 All-Purpose Yards - an average of 289.25 per game. Yes, he wasn't a starter the year before. That's because Oklahoma State already had an established #1 RB who many have since become well-familiar with: Thurman Thomas. He was loving obscene: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7S8wN_tL5Y Crazy Ted fucked around with this message at 04:02 on Jan 8, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2015 03:54
|
|
|
Crazy Ted posted:This is the last I'll say about this, but here's the thing about Barry Sanders: His 1988 season was even more amazing to me than it is upon first glance, because the stats from his 1988 bowl game didn't count as at the the time they were still considered exhibitions by the NCAA that people shouldn't count for things Why the gently caress would they play a game in Tokyo?
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2015 04:10
|
|
|
Butthead posted:Why the gently caress would they play a game in Tokyo? These games owned, they need to bring this back
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2015 05:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 24, 2024 00:48 |
|
|
Crazy Ted posted:This is the last I'll say about this, but here's the thing about Barry Sanders: His 1988 season was even more amazing to me than it is upon first glance, because the stats from his 1988 bowl game didn't count as at the the time they were still considered exhibitions by the NCAA that people shouldn't count for things Even more impressive when you consider some of the defenses he played. At Colorado and especially at Nebraska were monster opponents. Hammering Colorado in 1989 is something, and putting up 42 points on a Blackshirt defense in 1989 is even more incredible. I used to watch that youtube video every 6 months or so.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2015 06:56
|
|