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SSH IT ZOMBIE
Apr 19, 2003
No more blinkies! Yay!
College Slice
Two years ago or so I sort of horked my knee doing something stupid on a snowboard. That and tennis several times a week.

My knee likes to give out occasionally and offers up some gnarly pain. I can only play tennis maybe once or twice a week for an hour, have to be careful with squats, and it sucks if I bike more than 4 or 5 hours.

I'm 30.

Not sure if I am just getting old or what.
Saw an orthopedist, he thinks it is plica syndrome and built up scar tissue. That was two years ago. The situation has marginally improved since then.

So I'm considering his recommendation of surgery after all.
Is it worth it? How long did you take to heal?

Given my knee still allows some activity...is it worth it?

He says there is risk in not acting, if scar tissue is building up it can rub in the wrong places and cause arthritis.

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SSH IT ZOMBIE
Apr 19, 2003
No more blinkies! Yay!
College Slice
http://www.kneeguru.co.uk/KNEEtalk/index.php?topic=48219.

Stuff like this scares the crap out of me.

SpeedFreek
Jan 10, 2008
And Im Lobster Jesus!
The surgery itself went well, one moment I was surrounded by cute nurses and then woke up what felt like seconds later with my leg wrapped up. The amount of pain from my knee has decreased but I still get bad days from weather and overuse. Keep up on any physical therapy exercises you're told to do.

SSH IT ZOMBIE
Apr 19, 2003
No more blinkies! Yay!
College Slice

SpeedFreek posted:

The surgery itself went well, one moment I was surrounded by cute nurses and then woke up what felt like seconds later with my leg wrapped up. The amount of pain from my knee has decreased but I still get bad days from weather and overuse. Keep up on any physical therapy exercises you're told to do.

How long have you been on the mend?

The Cubelodyte
Sep 1, 2006

Practicing Hypnolaw since 1990
Grimey Drawer
It's been a few years since I had mine but it went swimmingly, all things considered. I was advised not to drive for at least a week (I didn't), and if memory serves I had to just take it easy for the rest of the month.

I still have to be careful not to put too much acute pressure on it (limits how much I can leg press and it's very uncomfortable to put all my weight on it), but otherwise it's all good. Hiking in the mountains is no problem. I don't think it would be wise to take up skiing again, but maybe I'm being a big baby.

Antifreeze Head
Jun 6, 2005

It begins
Pillbug
I had some torn cartilage, had the procedure in 2000 and things are largely fine, and clearly way better than they were for the year that my knee would randomly lock up. Like others, I can't do quite everything someone with all their cartilage can do, especially stuff that involves a fast pivot. Sometimes the knee hold together, sometime I collapse in a heap. I'm only out of commission for a few minutes when that happens; back up and walking anyway. I'm pretty sure a brace would help with that, but I've never really looked into it. You might want to though, especially for the tennis.

I was given the option or a general or epidural anesthetic for the operation, I went with the chance to be awake and watch. It was boring so I had a nap. They gave me some T3s for the pain, I took three at once and had Vietnam flashbacks despite being born well after the conclusion of that particular bit of military action.

Take the surgery, don't take too many pain killers and enjoy not having persistent pain in your knee for the few decades it will take to develop into horrible osteoarthritis.

HUGE SPACEKABLOOIE
Mar 31, 2010


When I was 15 I somehow managed to break off a chunk of my knee while I was skateboarding. It wasn't painful or anything, just this chunk floating around and every so often it would find its way to a spot and my knee would just give out. Surgery was fine, scars were minimal. I did very briefly wake up during surgery. Again, no pain or anything just a split second memory of all the surgical sheets around my upper body so I didn't see a bunch of cameras stuck into my knee. The weird part for me was anesthesia. I had asthma as a kid so they gave me an epidural. If you are having an epidural they will get you all doped up first, then sit you up. When they tell you not to look back resist the urge. Seeing a giant fuckoff needle that is about to be shoved into your spine will stick with you. It won't bother you at the time but I still remember it nearly 15 years later.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

When I was 12 or 13 I had arthroscopic surgery on both of my knees at once. It was, unironically, a thoroughly pleasurable experience. The cause was that I was born with this varus deformity of my hips and/or knees that somehow resulted in the cartilage in my knee being really hosed up and not working properly. The surgery consisted of going into both knees arthroscopically and scraping away all of the cartilage so that my knees would produce new cartilage over the following weeks of physical therapy (this part was way worse than the immediate post-surgery period).

Anyways, I just spent a week laying down feeling nice on opiates and having fun using crutches, which was a novel experience for me. My knees were swollen up like grapefruits and certainly hurt if I put pressure on them, but it was easy enough to avoid any serious pain. I then had to do a few months of physical therapy, which was very painful (only during the therapy itself though). Because I was dumb and did not do it as diligently as I should have, one of my knees did not fully recover and still causes me pain when doing things like walking up stairs, but it doesn't really affect my lifestyle much. The time I had my appendix out (also arthroscopically) was way, way worse (even though it was a pretty minor surgery). I find that it's a lot easier to deal with pain in your extremities than it is to deal with pain in your "core" (stomach, chest, etc).

english muffin
Feb 1, 2012
the likes of you and I
I've had 2 arthroscopies on my left knee (one with microfracture to try and stimulate cartilage growth but that didn't work). One on my right knee to do a washout and confirm that my right knee is slightly less hosed, but still hosed.

Recovery was surprisingly horrible, as I recall. Each was 6 weeks partial weight bearing with crutches. However, the Tibial Tubercle Transfer I had with open surgery on the left knee was much less fun than that. 6 weeks in a brace and on crutches. The left kneecap is starting to slide around in there again now.

I'm 42 and I need 2 new knees.

Go for your arthroscopies.

socketwrencher
Apr 10, 2012

Be still and know.
Have you had an MRI? I think it's advisable.

I've had it twice on my left knee, 3 years apart, both times to clean up torn and frayed bits of meniscus. The first couple days after surgery were rough because Vicodin makes me nauseous, so I was popping Ibuprofen and acetaminophen, which weren't very effective.

The first time helped a lot as there was apparently a lot to cut away. The second time, not so much; the torn bit that showed up on the MRI was removed but the doc said it wasn't as bad as he was expecting; after recovery, I still had the same soreness after moderate (1 hour of tennis or basketball) exercise.

What did help was talking with the nurse practitioner I met after a physical therapy session. While the orthopedists were basically saying my choices were "lifestyle modification"- i.e. if it hurts when you exercise, stop exercising- or knee replacement, the NP said she had a similar issue and went on a serious weight loss and strength training program. I dropped 20 pounds, changed my diet and do a lot of stretching, yoga and weight lifting. It's made a big difference and I no longer have pain after longer workouts.

Synthwave Crusader
Feb 13, 2011

Yeah the general experience is that the rehab following rhe surgery is far less pleasurable than the surgery itself. My mom underwent knee surgery 5 years ago to repair a torn meniscus and while she had no problems during the procedure, she would dread going to PT, at least until they started aquatic therapy (getting dunked in a pool). She also got this neat ice/water pump that has come in handy ever since. She wasn't able to make a full recovery, but I attribute that more to her age (she just turned 50 this year and has worked warehouse jobs that involve lots and lots of walking/standing most of her life)

SpeedFreek
Jan 10, 2008
And Im Lobster Jesus!

SSH IT ZOMBIE posted:

How long have you been on the mend?

About 5 years now, I think my recovery was affected by not getting any treatment for over a year after I broke the bone. I waited 3 days after I broke it for it to feel better but it didn't, when I went to my doctor he told me it was fine and stop my bitching in more words than that.

Liquid Communism
Mar 9, 2004


Out here, everything hurts.




Had it done on my left knee to fix a bucket handle tear in my medial meniscus. Compared to the old style open surgery I had on my ankle a couple decades back, it was relatively painless, healed quickly, and five years down the line I don't have any noticeable scars unless I get a dark tan on my legs.

SSH IT ZOMBIE
Apr 19, 2003
No more blinkies! Yay!
College Slice
Holy hell. Thanks for the feedback.
I did have an MRI. The radiologist found nothing. The orthopedist saw maybe plica, a cyst, and maybe fluid.

Maybe I will continue doing nothing about it, it seems stories are overwhelmingly mixed at best.

Bloody Hedgehog
Dec 12, 2003

💥💥🤯💥💥
Gotta nuke something

SSH IT ZOMBIE posted:

Maybe I will continue doing nothing about it, it seems stories are overwhelmingly mixed at best.

That's orthopaedic surgery in a nutshell though. Everyones skeleton and range of movement are different, and while ortho surgeries are becoming more tailored to the individual as time goes on, there is still very much a limited choice as to what they can do during each surgery. During a knee surgery, the surgeon may have a choice between dozens of different shapes and sizes of artificial knee, which sounds like a lot, but that's dozens of choices to account for the billions of unique knees on the planet. For some, the fit will be perfect and it'll be like having a real knee. Others won't be so perfect; it'll work well, but there'll always be some sensation of the implant or altered range of motion.

And although the surgery you might be in for is certainly less involved that a Total Knee, it's still an important surgery. Unless you're doctor says otherwise, it's very likely to get worse over time, especially if you continue with your very active lifestyle. And it won't be a question of you finally be fed up with it and then going for surgery, it will have progressed to a much worse point where a Total Knee might be the only answer instead of the comparatively benign surgery they offering you now. That will involve removing the patella, and gross sections of the mating surfaces of the femur and tibia. Far more recovery than a removal of plica and scar tissue. Talk to your doc again, and see if he can hook you up with someone who can get you in touch with any physio groups that have had the surgery you're looking at. You might be able to talk to some real people and find out what sort of outcomes they've had, especially if you can talk to those who had the surgery 5/10/20 years ago and see what their long-term results were.

We do knee arthro cases all the time at my hospital, and it's a fairly simple, quick surgery in most cases. All you'd likely end up with is some soreness, and a few small scars where the telescope was inserted.

Whitlam
Aug 2, 2014

Some goons overreact. Go figure.

socketwrencher posted:

Have you had an MRI? I think it's advisable.

I've had it twice on my left knee, 3 years apart, both times to clean up torn and frayed bits of meniscus. The first couple days after surgery were rough because Vicodin makes me nauseous, so I was popping Ibuprofen and acetaminophen, which weren't very effective.

The first time helped a lot as there was apparently a lot to cut away. The second time, not so much; the torn bit that showed up on the MRI was removed but the doc said it wasn't as bad as he was expecting; after recovery, I still had the same soreness after moderate (1 hour of tennis or basketball) exercise.

What did help was talking with the nurse practitioner I met after a physical therapy session. While the orthopedists were basically saying my choices were "lifestyle modification"- i.e. if it hurts when you exercise, stop exercising- or knee replacement, the NP said she had a similar issue and went on a serious weight loss and strength training program. I dropped 20 pounds, changed my diet and do a lot of stretching, yoga and weight lifting. It's made a big difference and I no longer have pain after longer workouts.

I'm having an MRI in 12 hours exactly because of likely torn meniscus! This post has reassured me that maybe surgery won't be so bad (if it comes to that), so thanks.

socketwrencher
Apr 10, 2012

Be still and know.

Whitlam posted:

I'm having an MRI in 12 hours exactly because of likely torn meniscus! This post has reassured me that maybe surgery won't be so bad (if it comes to that), so thanks.

The surgery is definitely not anything to worry about. I know people say that no surgery is routine, but for an experienced surgeon this comes pretty close.

SpeedFreek
Jan 10, 2008
And Im Lobster Jesus!

Bloody Hedgehog posted:

And although the surgery you might be in for is certainly less involved that a Total Knee, it's still an important surgery. Unless you're doctor says otherwise, it's very likely to get worse over time, especially if you continue with your very active lifestyle. And it won't be a question of you finally be fed up with it and then going for surgery, it will have progressed to a much worse point where a Total Knee might be the only answer instead of the comparatively benign surgery they offering you now.
I don't mean to hijack but at what point should I start worrying about this very thing? I'm 28 and the accident happened about 6 years ago this month.

Bloody Hedgehog
Dec 12, 2003

💥💥🤯💥💥
Gotta nuke something

SpeedFreek posted:

I don't mean to hijack but at what point should I start worrying about this very thing? I'm 28 and the accident happened about 6 years ago this month.

Everyone is different, but ortho surgeries start to get more complicated at about age 40 or older. So you have some time to think about it, but if the doc is recommending surgery now, then now is the best time to go for it.

Even if the surgery goes swimmingly at a later age, recovery times for any surgery increase exponentially as you get older. What could be a multi-month recovery now could turn into a year plus when you get older.

big shtick energy
May 27, 2004


A couple of different arthroscopic knee surgeries failing to beat placebo:
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1305189
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa013259

ChairmanMeow
Mar 1, 2008

Fire up the grill everyone eats tonight!
Lipstick Apathy
I had it for meniscus and arthritis, but had an acl replacement at the same time so it will not be the same healing time. The surgery itself was fine.
The healing was brutal and I hosed up my physical therapy because I couldn't get there. The scars from that bit though are like non existent and I have no regrets.

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

We don't need to have that dialogue because it's obvious, trivial, and has already been had a thousand times.

I am not a doctor. Those articles are both covering a different set of conditions from OP's, gradual arthritic scenarios. They're generally not relevant to OP's situation. I won't get into some statistical problems (which I suspect are largely unavoidable) I also see in the methods., or problems of overstatement (which are less excusable) I see in their conclusions.

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

I had it for a torn lateral meniscus when I was 18, my knee was in unbearable pain beforehand, surgery went fine, had to wear a leg brace for 6 weeks, knee was 100% better afterwards.

I had no idea it was controversial in any way until I saw this thread, I have nothing but good things to say for it.

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Bloody Hedgehog
Dec 12, 2003

💥💥🤯💥💥
Gotta nuke something

WampaLord posted:

I had no idea it was controversial in any way until I saw this thread, I have nothing but good things to say for it.

It's not really "controversial", any more than any other surgery. Some surgeries work out great, others have very grim outcomes. Some are routine, but none are routine. Someone can survive being mangled in a car wreck and then operated on for 14 hours, another can die getting their tonsils out.

The only thing really guaranteed from surgery is that the outcome is never guaranteed.

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