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Pug posted:Outsider looking at daytrading. How much starting capital do you need to be successful? How many months of education would you say is also recommended / required? Considering that the SEC's de facto guideline is $25k minimum (i.e. the minimum balance you need to be able to maintain in a pattern day trader account), that's about the smallest amount of capital you should have immediately available and able to lose without pain in order to be trading regularly. Doing so for a living is a whole other story and I wouldn't even feel comfortable trying it with a small 6 figure balance.
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May 13, 2010 21:10
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Pug posted:Outsider looking at daytrading. How much starting capital do you need to be successful? How many months of education would you say is also recommended / required? There is a pretty well documented fail rate between 75-90% irrespective of experience and capitalization (though they are factors). I have some hard data to back that up if you would like more detail. If you explore the internet you can find whole daytrading communities with thousands of people that are now ghost towns where nobody was successful, and advisory services that fail like clockwork every 2-3 years. I'd also recommend against learning online poker. The easy money there has been gone for 10 years. Its a lot of grind for very little cash. If you want to play, just play the Sunday majors; grinding multi-tables all day, every day will crush most normal people. To actually answer your question and not just throw a bunch of advice you didn't originally ask for at you (though it is important to consider): You can daytrade with as little as 5k at a prop, futures broker, or FX broker. I'd recommend being able to string together at least 4 profitable weeks in a row before trading in cash -that may take months or years depending on how quickly you are able to figure things out. Once again, the odds of success are not in your favor. Chances are you won't heed the warnings anyway.
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May 13, 2010 22:30
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LactoseO.D.'d posted:There is a pretty well documented fail rate between 75-90% irrespective of experience and capitalization (though they are factors). I have some hard data to back that up if you would like more detail. If you explore the internet you can find whole daytrading communities with thousands of people that are now ghost towns where nobody was successful, and advisory services that fail like clockwork every 2-3 years. This. Daytrading is pretty much a sucker's game. Please don't do it.
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May 14, 2010 14:45
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The best I ever did was daytrading, but I had under $25k, so I could only do it a few times a week, and once I did it too much and basically ended up with a crappy cash account. Daytrading is actually fairly easy if you choose the right targets and trade like a robot. Something like SPY would be more predictable. The longer you watch the stock market, the more you realize that there are points in a price's movement where there has to be some retracement, during those .1%-1% movements you can start racking up your money if you do a few a day, especially if you have $100k+ to trade with. But greed will get almost everybody and they won't wait for the absolute best, nearly guaranteed time, and they'll lose money, then lose more trying to catch up etc. So yeah, it is kind of like poker, you're grinding, trying to find the highest % chance of payoff opportunities. That's why banks make so much loving money, because they do the exact same thing, but millions of times a day.
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May 14, 2010 14:54
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Holy crap, what just happened to TiVo? http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:TIVO I tried looking for news, but didn't find anything.
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May 14, 2010 15:56
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Dr. Eldarion posted:Holy crap, what just happened to TiVo? http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:TIVO http://preview.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive_en10&sid=aum3bPRe2F94
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May 14, 2010 16:08
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Dr. Eldarion posted:Holy crap, what just happened to TiVo? http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:TIVO
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May 14, 2010 16:08
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strwrsxprt posted:It jumped that high when they won a patent-infringement case against Dish and EchoStar in February. An hour ago it was announced that the decision was being reconsidered.
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May 14, 2010 17:25
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gvibes posted:Seems like a serious overreaction to me. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZvRpnZbNio This is what always pops in my head, unfortunately there was no good quality vids of Bender yelling ABANDON SHIP on youtube.
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May 14, 2010 17:49
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Doesn't Tivo actually derive a significant portion of its revenue from patent royalties? I seem to remember hearing about this when the patent case was first going on.
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May 14, 2010 18:06
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gvibes posted:Seems like a serious overreaction to me. ie; a great mid risk play.
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May 14, 2010 18:21
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abagofcheetos posted:Doesn't Tivo actually derive a significant portion of its revenue from patent royalties? I seem to remember hearing about this when the patent case was first going on.
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May 14, 2010 20:20
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/15/secretive-speed-traders-i_n_577557.html "More than a week after the Dow Jones industrial average fell nearly 1,000 points, its biggest intraday drop ever, regulators are still sifting through buy and sell orders to figure out what sparked it. One big focus are orders placed by high-frequency traders, or HFTs, and for good reason. These quick-buck firms barely existed a few years ago but now account for two-thirds of all U.S. stock trading." I know these kinds of firms have existed pretty much since the beginning of the NASDAQ listings really, but this is the kind of thing diehards of that "creating markets" philosophy inevitably make happen. I've watch enough movies to know it's a bad thing when you start to let the robots run the show. Dotcom Jillionaire fucked around with this message at 06:57 on May 16, 2010 |
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May 16, 2010 06:39
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It wasn't a flash crash. It was everyone backed out because the market volume was hosed. Also, market orders should be banned and would solve this. But yeah apparently a sell of 75,000 sells of the ES were announced prior then sold and hosed things over. Seems pretty bs, basically no volume and a sell hosed things over along with forex issues.
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May 16, 2010 07:03
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edit - poo poo i think i posted in the wrong thread, sorry, maybe i should put this money into stocks instead? Ok, ETrade is frustrating me. I rolled over money from my old 401k from when I was a substitute teacher to an ETrade Rollover IRA. Granted, it's a small amount of money, $414 approximately, but it's still worth investing, right? So I go through their automated questionairre, and it dumps me on step 3 out of 4 telling me their recommended solution is to build my own portfolio, even though the previous 3 questions I stated I have no investing experience and would rather have things chosen for me. So with the recommended amounts for my large cap and small cap and all that, I decide to just go ahead and look at some mutual funds and do it myself. However, the transaction fee for each is $20! That's going to cost me 5% of my rollover IRA for each time I distribute my money into mutual funds! Is there any solution to this that doesn't end in me losing 20%? I should go ahead and state that losing this $414 doesn't bother me in the slightest, I just want to invest as much of it as I can without blowing a huge chunk on transaction fees. In case anyone is wondering, here's the results I got: Large Cap 44% Small Cap 16% International 20% Fixed Income 17% Other 0% Cash 3% sublyme fucked around with this message at 01:09 on May 18, 2010 |
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May 18, 2010 01:06
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ok first, diversifying 400 dollars is a joke. Just stick it into an index fund for 10 dollars. Even that is painful, 2.5%. do you have another 401k you can add to this rollover? You can also transfer up to 5k into that account as your roth IRA. So get some more money into that account somehow, put it into (1) index fund, and forget about it for awhile.
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May 18, 2010 01:14
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Baddog posted:ok first, diversifying 400 dollars is a joke. Just stick it into an index fund for 10 dollars. Even that is painful, 2.5%. sublyme fucked around with this message at 01:30 on May 18, 2010 |
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May 18, 2010 01:22
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sublyme posted:No other 401k, I have 4k in savings but that's about 6 months living expenses so I'd like to keep that liquid in case of injury, losing my job, etc etc. Guess I'll just throw the $400 into an index fund, like I said I don't know much about investing so I didn't realize 400 bucks was so worthless. ETrade's automated crap confused me. Sorry for derailing your thread, guys, I reposted over in the newbie thread so you can just ignore this. its not so worthless, but you're just going to get killed on commissions if you try to do anything much with it. Here are some common ETFs to look into. spy or qqqq probably have the lowest expense ratios. I'm not sure what they are exactly these days, but it should be pretty low. iwo - russell 2000 qqqq - nasdaq 100 spy - s&p 500 dia - dow jones
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May 18, 2010 02:05
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My guess for the next few weeks:
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May 18, 2010 17:10
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ayekappy posted:My guess for the next few weeks: If we close the week below 1135 (and I'll be very surprised if we don't) we'll test 1100 but I think it will hold. Barring bad news I think we'll be back above 1200 by the end of July (though I'm not placing any bets on that just yet).
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May 18, 2010 17:17
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I WANT TO EAT BABBY posted:If we close the week below 1135 (and I'll be very surprised if we don't) we'll test 1100 but I think it will hold. Barring bad news I think we'll be back above 1200 by the end of July (though I'm not placing any bets on that just yet). Oh, go on, place a bet. Write a June S & P call at 1200 and buy a July call at 1200. If it goes well you'll make a huge return on your investment, and can come back and brag to us for months.
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May 18, 2010 17:36
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anyone see the LDK upgrade? I dumped my shares yesterday; :-( itching to get back in but I'm afraid the Euro storm isn't over for chinese solar, any opinions? Also, what do you all think of Altria (MO)? any more upside beyond the 24 mark?
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May 18, 2010 17:41
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Hobologist posted:Oh, go on, place a bet. Write a June S & P call at 1200 and buy a July call at 1200. If it goes well you'll make a huge return on your investment, and can come back and brag to us for months. No no, you see in this thread you never talk about trades when you make them, you just come in afterward and talk about how brilliant you are.
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May 18, 2010 17:53
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WDC is driving me nuts.
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May 18, 2010 18:12
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abagofcheetos posted:WDC is driving me nuts.
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May 18, 2010 18:15
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Same for STX. I dont get it. I just dont loving get it.
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May 18, 2010 18:26
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Maybe the market thinks that computers are just a passing fad.
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May 18, 2010 18:29
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Yet Intel had a great quarter, AAPL as well, Seagate and WDC did too. You dont buy a PC/Laptop without storage. Facebook has to store all the privacy violating poo poo they do somewhere. I just dont understand how the market hates harddrives.
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May 18, 2010 19:22
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They're too busy pumping 'cloud computing' and CRM. God I can't wait until someone gets fed up with the razor thin margins and pushes the sell button. Thing will fall 30% overnight. I'm hoping its this Thursday with earnings. I have my short all set from $88 and with a nice cheap $90 call option hedge thanks to the past 2 day sell off. Lose $1000 (+2k in unrealized gains) or gain $5000+ if it does what it should have done ages ago. Took FSLR only about half a year to get cut by $200 and CRM will trade in the 40s eventually too I'm sure.
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May 18, 2010 20:04
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I can understand pumping the cloud, but where is that cloud gonna be stored? Hence my inability to understand why storage stocks arent doing well with all the cloud craze.
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May 18, 2010 20:23
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Not to mention the fundamentals of these stocks are absurd. About $12 of WDC's share price is literally cash, with only $400 million long term debt, and they are earning like $1.70 a share per quarter.
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May 18, 2010 20:37
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abagofcheetos posted:Not to mention the fundamentals of these stocks are absurd. About $12 of WDC's share price is literally cash, with only $400 million long term debt, and they are earning like $1.70 a share per quarter.
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May 18, 2010 20:40
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MrBigglesworth posted:I can understand pumping the cloud, but where is that cloud gonna be stored? Hence my inability to understand why storage stocks arent doing well with all the cloud craze. Cloud storage reduces overhead tremendously. Instead of 100 people each having a couple terrabytes free storage as overhead, maybe there is a couple terrabytes free for that whole group (purchased in bulk at even thinner margins than usual). edit - I believe western digitals percent of the SSD market is much smaller than traditional drives, right?
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May 18, 2010 20:45
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strwrsxprt posted:I'm an idiot who understands nothing about the market, but I own a decent amount of WDC. Do you mind explaining why those conditions are absurd? It also means that their P/E is a crazy low 6.5, whereas the S&P's P/E is about 20. Seagate is in a very similar situation, except they have much more debt on the books. Baddog posted:edit - I believe western digitals percent of the SSD market is much smaller than traditional drives, right?
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May 18, 2010 20:59
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Still short for this week and she's treating me good. I bought some january 10 puts on mco last week early for the failure trade. Their head sovereign guy left today and governments keep going after them, so why not. Also, hedge hedge hedge. Don't be 100% long and keep asking questions of "Why is WDC down" when the whole drat market is practically down. http://www.businessinsider.com/global-macros-raoul-pal-heres-why-a-crash-is-coming-in-two-days-to-two-weeks-2010-5
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May 18, 2010 23:39
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Oh no doubt, I've gone over 75% bonds in my retirement accounts. I think a terrible market correction is going to occur by years end. Still, WDC's movement though is puzzling regardless if it is a down day or not.
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May 18, 2010 23:54
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fougera posted:
It basically depends on three interconnected things: 1) how the new FDA stuff shakes out; 2) how successful their non-cigarette tobacco products are; and 3) litigation. Otherwise they are still very profitable and kick out a great consistent dividend since their product is addictive. While their customers are rapidly dieing there seems to be a steady stream of new customers.
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May 19, 2010 02:21
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Annoyed. Happy with my GE calls, did it at the right time, so I got some protection there. QCOM killed me, but I held way less of that than GE. I should have sold calls when I bought it. I thought about it. Since it's so volatile, they were fetching a good premium too. But I'm holding. QCOM has followed a pattern for years, and I'm still confident in them as a company and with where 3g/4g is going.
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May 19, 2010 02:51
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Selling calls can trap you in a falling market too, be careful. We might rally on friday with options friday if we keep going down till then. Good exit time, gap has to fill sometime but continuation of down is on.
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May 19, 2010 03:03
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Does anyone have WSJ online access? I got linked to this article by someone but I can't read it: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703745904575248661121721980.html#articleTabs%3Darticle
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May 19, 2010 04:49
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