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Green Crayons posted:Whenever I think of technology on Buffy I always think of "If you aren't jacked in, you aren't alive." It makes me chuckle. Kennedy was butch in personality, certainly, but I was just thinking more looks-wise. She's pretty, has long hair and looks more or less like what she's supposed to according to (arbitrary) societal standards. When I think "butch," I think short-hair, boyish features and boyish clothes. I wasn't saying that hooking up with someone just because they're gay and not gross-looking describes the relationships of most gay people, but just that it's not uncommon. A lot of femmes want butch girls and vice versa, so it narrows an already narrow field even further if you're a femme that likes femmes. DrBouvenstein posted:And speaking of conjuring, another season 6 sperg...ok, the gang spent all of Joyce's life insurance money on her hospital bills and what little bit of the mortgage they could...so why didn't Willow and Tara just magic up some more? I can't imagine it's against "The rules" of magic to conjure some measly little pieces of paper, that just happen to be green with large "$100" written on them, right? Haha holy poo poo, you're right. That would've been great. HoAssHo fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Jun 30, 2010 |
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Jun 30, 2010 01:51
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My own experience with gay couples (that is, with people I actually know rather than folks I pass by on the street) doesn't confirm this notion, but that's an exceptionally small sample I'm pulling from and - now that I think about it - only involves male couples.
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thebardyspoon posted:I always thought it was a bit weird Xander didn't carry a gun or at least one of those initiative taser guns, seems like while guns don't kill vampires they would still tear out muscles and crap when you shot them surely. I mean he had that Army training, remember that, guys?  DrBouvenstein posted:And speaking of conjuring, another season 6 sperg...ok, the gang spent all of Joyce's life insurance money on her hospital bills and what little bit of the mortgage they could...so why didn't Willow and Tara just magic up some more? I can't imagine it's against "The rules" of magic to conjure some measly little pieces of paper, that just happen to be green with large "$100" written on them, right? Because (and I forget if this exact point came up at any time in the series, I am in dire need to a rewatch, so I might be wrong wrong wrong but who cares) it is the most common fact about magic: you can never get something for nothing. Things frequently went pear shaped when they did piddly little spells about nothing, who knows what havoc might have happened if they zapped up the GNP of a small African nation.
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Jun 30, 2010 02:12
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whatsabattle posted:I mean he had that Army training, remember that, guys? Damnit, I love that army training that only works when he has to do something important. Otherwise, its nothing but a Harmony slapfight. I just watched the Superstar episode (which is awesome/hilarious), Danny Strong is fricking great. It's also an example of why you don't use magic to generate wealth.
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Jun 30, 2010 04:22
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whatsabattle posted:Because (and I forget if this exact point came up at any time in the series, I am in dire need to a rewatch, so I might be wrong wrong wrong but who cares) it is the most common fact about magic: you can never get something for nothing. Things frequently went pear shaped when they did piddly little spells about nothing, who knows what havoc might have happened if they zapped up the GNP of a small African nation. thedouche posted:I just watched the Superstar episode (which is awesome/hilarious), Danny Strong is fricking great. It's also an example of why you don't use magic to generate wealth. True, though you could have Willow try (even succeed to some measure) at it as an example of her just not giving a gently caress about the consequences of magic-ing everything that season. Hell, she's raised the dead, what does she care about little problems that might arise from trying to get something for nothing? She can just magic them away!  Doing things like that would also be ostensibly to help her friends, which would make it more in character for her, less immediately obviously a bad idea, and significantly less lame than Willow going down to get her magic fix at the local
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Jun 30, 2010 07:23
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I doubt you can just conjure up a pile of cash or else the trio wouldnt have gone through the trouble of robbing the armored car and the kid from Home Improvement wouldnt have had to summon the demon to make him rich or whatever the hell that episode was about.
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Jun 30, 2010 08:11
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redshirt posted:"Dumbass"?! Explain - cuz I feel pretty strongly the hubcap axe was awesome. And it went out awesome. Dunno. I guess it always looked unwieldy (probably because in addition to being a loving hubcap, its haft also looked like it was ergonomic or some poo poo) and not very useful in a fight. Compared to Angel's broadsword, it just looked like Gunn was a sacrificing functionality for something that looked "badass." Then again, I never understood in Buffy why the Scoobies never had crosses tattooed on them, or stakes lashed to their wrists on a bungee rope. I'll take practicality over flashiness any day of the week. DrBouvenstein posted:And speaking of conjuring, another season 6 sperg...ok, the gang spent all of Joyce's life insurance money on her hospital bills and what little bit of the mortgage they could...so why didn't Willow and Tara just magic up some more? I can't imagine it's against "The rules" of magic to conjure some measly little pieces of paper, that just happen to be green with large "$100" written on them, right? Much as I would have been down with that plan, you just KNOW that some stick-in-the-mud like Buffy or Giles would have come down on them for abusing magic. Buffy would have been all "I can't take this money! I didn't earn it!" But yeah, considering they could use it to buy amenities without anyone noticing (as opposed to making large deposits in a bank without having any jobs), it's a little strange that Willow/Tara never once tried magic to resolve their financial woes. I get that medicine and magic don't mix, but economics have always been pretty mystical. zVxTeflon posted:I doubt you can just conjure up a pile of cash or else the trio wouldnt have gone through the trouble of robbing the armored car and the kid from Home Improvement wouldnt have had to summon the demon to make him rich or whatever the hell that episode was about. Which is funny, because until that episode I always assumed the trio DID just make money out of thin air, because they always seemed to have so much ridiculously expensive tech just laying around. Astfgl fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Jun 30, 2010 |
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Jun 30, 2010 15:18
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Astfgl posted:
While it would look awful, I don't know why everyone (or at least someone) in Sunnydale didn't tattoo crosses to their neck. Buffy wore a cross (I guess just in the early seasons), but it would seem like at least cross earrings would have come in handy to protect the neck from a quick/surprise bite. This whole thread is making me think that Joss (after the lore of one of his series is fairly established) should pay the airfare for some dorks/superfans to watch each episode before the public to nitpick and/or point out glaring inconsistencies of the episode the universe (or at least someone that isn't the writer of the episode).
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Jun 30, 2010 16:26
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My question is, why the hell didn't Willow and Tara get jobs? They were living in that big rear end house, eating the food, enjoying the electricity, etc. Between those two, Buffy, and hell, why not make Dawn get a part-time job too, surely they could have survived.
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Jun 30, 2010 16:45
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Because life is hard and it's easier to dump on Buffy because she's supposed to take care of them like she's their wet nurse rather than face the fact that they are a bunch of leeches who will criticize/pile on Buffy from their ivory towers at the drop of a hat. Excuse me while I polish a nice shine on the white of my knight's armor, here.
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Jun 30, 2010 17:42
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And while we're on the subject, while it's almost universally understood that the magic=drugs storyline in season 6 is dumb, I'm in the middle of that arc now and it's even dumber than I remembered it. How does Amy even know the spells and such, she was struggling to do pretty basic stuff back in season 3. But man, they don't even beat around the bush a little with the magic=drugs. In "Wrecked", we have Willow getting magic-hosed by Rack ("just wanna take a tour...give a little to get a little" and then they both get pleasure faces) and then going on a psychedelic trip complete with spinning green flowers. The main problem with season 4 is that the overall idea is decent but the execution of some arcs (The Initiative needed to be larger and do more, Adam appeared too early for what he did) is just not right and there are too many stand alone episodes for it to really flow as a continuous whole. Season 6 has really similar problems (magic=drugs needs to be toned the gently caress down, the idea that life is hard and they're all making the wrong decisions is okay but it's so over the top that it is hard to believe nobody calls each other on their poo poo) but instead of having too many stand alone episodes it has too many episodes where it at least feels like not a lot happens. It's so negative, too. I'm about to hit the Willow turns evil arc so hopefully those episodes can pick it up a little. Many of the best Buffy episodes are the huge end-of-season big bad event episodes.
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Jun 30, 2010 23:13
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Astfgl posted:Dunno. I guess it always looked unwieldy (probably because in addition to being a loving hubcap, its haft also looked like it was ergonomic or some poo poo) and not very useful in a fight. Compared to Angel's broadsword, it just looked like Gunn was a sacrificing functionality for something that looked "badass." According to Keynes if you use magic to mess with economics you might be attacked by animal spirits.
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Jun 30, 2010 23:59
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Adam Bowen posted:My question is, why the hell didn't Willow and Tara get jobs? They were living in that big rear end house, eating the food, enjoying the electricity, etc. Between those two, Buffy, and hell, why not make Dawn get a part-time job too, surely they could have survived. Also, Marti Noxon is a boob.
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Jul 1, 2010 00:11
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Astfgl posted:Nope. Gunn usually had that dumbass hubcap axe. Well what the hell else are you going to make an axe out of?
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Jul 1, 2010 00:11
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LividLiquid posted:Also, Marti Noxon is a boob. True, but she gave us "The Wish," which owned, so I can never fully hate her. 
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Jul 1, 2010 00:22
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A Big Dark Yak posted:True, but she gave us "The Wish," which owned, so I can never fully hate her. Good writer does not equal good showrunner, and one good episode does not make a good writer. Everything else she's ever done has been utter poo poo, with the exception of working on Mad Men.
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Jul 1, 2010 00:35
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Rhyno posted:Well what the hell else are you going to make an axe out of? Umm...an axe? Seriously, though, have you looked at a hubcap lately? Even a well made one? It is NOT the type of metal you want to make an axe out of.
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Jul 1, 2010 00:47
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DrBouvenstein posted:Umm...an axe? It was obviously an old school DETROIT STEEL hubcap.
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Jul 1, 2010 00:56
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You're assuming he made an axe out of a hubcap, rather than modified an axe to look more like a hubcap. And it looked awesome.
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Jul 1, 2010 00:56
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Flatscan posted:Good writer does not equal good showrunner, and one good episode does not make a good writer. Everything else she's ever done has been utter poo poo, with the exception of working on Mad Men. It's kind of like Michael Scott on the office: horrible boss, awesome (unconventional) salesman. Anya is a pretty sweet character.
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Jul 1, 2010 01:19
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greatn posted:You're assuming he made an axe out of a hubcap, rather than modified an axe to look more like a hubcap. And it looked awesome. He didn't. Some younger kids from his anti-vamp gang out on the streets did as a going away present. So yes, it is quite likely that it's a sharpened hubcap.
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Jul 1, 2010 01:34
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404GoonNotFound posted:He didn't. Some younger kids from his anti-vamp gang out on the streets did as a going away present. So yes, it is quite likely that it's a sharpened hubcap. Well it could be magic. It is enhanced by the magic of friendship.
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Jul 1, 2010 01:49
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Flatscan posted:Good writer does not equal good showrunner, and one good episode does not make a good writer. Everything else she's ever done has been utter poo poo, with the exception of working on Mad Men. Holy poo poo, I just found out she wrote "She" on 'Angel.' I have nothing good to say about her. That episode is the only one out of either 'Buffy' series I skip. drat, it is Bad.
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Jul 1, 2010 02:34
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egon_beeblebrox posted:Holy poo poo, I just found out she wrote "She" on 'Angel.' I have nothing good to say about her. That episode is the only one out of either 'Buffy' series I skip. drat, it is Bad. I think its a rule that if Bai Ling is an episode it is the worst or close to the worst episode.
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Jul 1, 2010 02:39
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Rhyno posted:Well what the hell else are you going to make an axe out of?
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Jul 1, 2010 02:47
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Rhyno posted:Well what the hell else are you going to make an axe out of? Silver, maybe, because you always run into monsters and poo poo that need silver to defeat them? Cold iron because there are also enemies that have a weakness to that? Pretty much anything except some flimsy, shiny aluminum alloy? Think about it like a video game. If you and your party are venturing off to fight monsters, do you want your team holding that lopsided club they carved when they were eight that has special significance to them, or a weapon designed to take down a variety of magical creatures? In fact, there was this thing on Angel and Buffy where the Scoobies (and their LA equivalents) would go rush off to fight a monster, get their asses handed to them, then run back home and rummage through these massive trunks and chests filled with magical and esoteric weapons. It always made me laugh that every time they'd wait until AFTER getting routed before going for the "big guns," as it were. Just loving start with the big guns.
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Jul 1, 2010 02:58
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Mount a crossbow onto a shotgun. Incapacitate the vampire with the shotgun, kill with the crossbow. We call that the double-tap.
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Jul 1, 2010 03:03
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Astfgl posted:Think about it like a video game. If you and your party are venturing off to fight monsters, do you want your team holding that lopsided club they carved when they were eight that has special significance to them, or a weapon designed to take down a variety of magical creatures? The first, because it most likely gets a HUGE plot-related magic buff near the end of the game (Brotherhood in FFX, that starting sword in Rogue Galaxy, the lute in FFI, the Pray command in Earthbound, etc). Also, the second would probably sell for a couple hundred thousand at a merchant.
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Jul 1, 2010 03:12
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Lycus posted:Mount a crossbow onto a shotgun. Incapacitate the vampire with the shotgun, kill with the crossbow. Flamethrower. Lots of flamethrower. Followed by holy water to put out any stray flames.
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Jul 1, 2010 05:17
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redshirt posted:Wes carried the guns well. Did Gunn ever? I can't recall anything. I think Cordelia would have ridiculed him for it. "I've got a gun, and my name is Gunn!" But I do remember him with the shotgun in Lorne's club, getting pissed at Gio and taking it out on some demon. I think at some point, every single main character either fired or picked up a gun. But the only people that seemed to regularly use them were Wes and Lilah.
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Jul 1, 2010 05:26
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Gordon Shumway posted:I think Cordelia would have ridiculed him for it. "I've got a gun, and my name is Gunn!" In Gunn's case it makes a lot of sense to me that he never used them, since he and his gang pretty much exclusively fought creatures against whom guns were more or less useless. He grew up fighting with stakes and such, and got used to doing his demon-fighting that way. Generally speaking, relying on guns when fighting demons seems like a tricky proposition. Guns require ammo and special training, draw more attention to the fight (mostly police attention), and leave forensic evidence behind. Not exactly the ideal weapon for waging a secret war against evil in a population center.
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Jul 1, 2010 07:29
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A Big Dark Yak posted:True, but she gave us "The Wish," which owned, so I can never fully hate her. What always bothered me about the wish is you think the episode is going to be character development for Cordelia. It's set up that way until about halfway through when she randomly loving dies. Then, the episode keeps going, is reverted at the end, and basically never happened and didn't change anything, nor was anyone aware of it. And thinking of it, I thought it was odd that Joss wrote a fairly unimportant episode retconning the episode to actually matter (Dopplegangland, I think?) Maybe he noticed its uselessness too.
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Jul 1, 2010 09:45
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Scissorfighter posted:What always bothered me about the wish is you think the episode is going to be character development for Cordelia. It's set up that way until about halfway through when she randomly loving dies. Then, the episode keeps going, is reverted at the end, and basically never happened and didn't change anything, nor was anyone aware of it. That's kind of why I love The Wish. Instead of the cliche "learning a lesson in the alternate universe" It's A Wonderful Life crap, we just get a nice alternate universe with all the regular characters. It foreshadows lesbian Willow, Dark Willow, introduces Anya, shows that the prophecy gets fulfilled no matter what (Buffy dies), and is generally just really fun and shows how much worse off they'd be without Buffy. Plus I love Giles' line at the end when Anya asks him if reality might be worse off than the wish universe. "It has to be." It also gave us an excuse to see The Master again, and I love that guy. I don't remember why Darla isn't in the episode though.
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Jul 1, 2010 15:22
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AmbassadorFriendly posted:That's kind of why I love The Wish. Instead of the cliche "learning a lesson in the alternate universe" It's A Wonderful Life crap, we just get a nice alternate universe with all the regular characters. It foreshadows lesbian Willow, Dark Willow, introduces Anya, shows that the prophecy gets fulfilled no matter what (Buffy dies), and is generally just really fun and shows how much worse off they'd be without Buffy. Plus I love Giles' line at the end when Anya asks him if reality might be worse off than the wish universe. "It has to be." Pretty much all this. "The Wish" works for me because it has a lot of fun character stuff--Giles's hope for a better world, a bleak Sunnydale without Buffy, a bleak Buffy without Sunnydale/her friends, hosed-up Willow/Xander, the darkly funny bizarre superstitions that come from a town constantly scared for its life and nonsensical behavioral controls foisted on the students in the name of their security (You shouldn't wear bright colors because of vampires; You're not allowed to drive a car because of vampires). And, of course, Cordelia only making it about halfway through the episode that takes place in an alternate world she wished in, in a nicely funny/hot/disturbing biting scene. That's definitely a feature and not a bug to me. Plus, Alyson Hannigan in leather. quote:It also gave us an excuse to see The Master again, and I love that guy. I don't remember why Darla isn't in the episode though. I always assumed Angel finally gave up on Buffy and started fighting The Master's forces and killed Darla before eventually getting his rear end captured. It's a fanwank, sure, but not really implausible, given what we see of the wish-world. I also figure Spike and Dru just stayed the gently caress away.
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Jul 1, 2010 17:51
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A Big Dark Yak posted:I also figure Spike and Dru just stayed the gently caress away. Why wouldn't they? Spike and Dru never had any interaction with The Master. I'm sure they heard Angel and Darla talk about him, but they probably figured him for a wanker. And since Spike was interested in The Slayer, he was probably in Cleveland...maybe Wish Buffy dusted him and/or Dru, or he just got his rear end beat and decided to stay away and wait for the next Slayer to kill.
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Jul 1, 2010 17:57
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Okay, here's what I really don't get: everyone assuming that Willow's magic use in Season 6 is an allegory for drugs. I've always just seen magic in the Buffyverse as a really powerful force that can be addicting to people with certain personality traits. Addiction to something doesn't automatically mean that particular something is a drug. Ya have sex addicts, gambling addicts, food addicts, etc. Willow's attraction to magic started way back in Season 2. For four seasons, she had Giles there to kinda keep her in line. But you can clearly see that she has the type of personality to become addicted to the power. From the beginig of her magical career, she seems drawn to the danger of magic. It's a thrill to her, much like sex is to a sex addict. As for her spiraling down in Season 6, keep in mind that addicts will expose themselves to some pretty risky behavior to satisfy their addictions. I think when Buffy compares candles to bongs when clearing out the house, she is just simplifying all of Giles's previous "dangers of magic" lectures to quickly explain it to her sister. Fun thing I noticed during Season 4 of Angel: when the gang enters W&H in Habeas Corpses and sees all the dead lawyers, Fred remarks that it "doesn't bode well for us", or something along those lines. Seeing as everyone there at the time other than Angel winds up dead or mortally wounded or replaced by an ancient hell-god by the last episode I think that's a nice subtle bit of foreshadowing.
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Jul 1, 2010 19:18
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/\/\/\/\I'm with you. I didn't notice it the first time, but I'm going to be on the lookout on my current/second Buffy viewing (I heart netflix, I'm currently at the very end of season 4).
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Jul 1, 2010 19:48
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DivisionPost posted:Yeah, I'm just restating what everyone else is saying, but one of the great shames of people singing the praises of Buffy is that they almost ALWAYS forget to mention that Season 1 was mediocre at best. This is because Buffy Season 1 is pretty much consciously trying to channel Kristy Swanson and Rutger Hauer from the original movie; in season 2 Joss kind of 'makes it his own'. Which is kind of why I found it so funny, what with the talk of a possible movie earlier in the thread, and everyone is all "Buffy without Joss? Blasphemy!" The joke being, Buffy wasn't Whedon's to begin with. Personally, the lack of Dollhouse love and/or discussion in this thread makes me sad. But I figure I'm an outlier; except for a few specific things (OMWF, the plot point that Buffy was happier dead, and Evil Willow - but specifically not the nerd stuff leading up to it) I think the fifth season was the high point of the series and Buffy sacrificing herself to save the universe would have been the perfect way to end the series. There's just no way to get 'epicer' than that, and Buffy herself has finally found peace.
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Jul 1, 2010 20:31
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WarLocke posted:Which is kind of why I found it so funny, what with the talk of a possible movie earlier in the thread, and everyone is all "Buffy without Joss? Blasphemy!" The joke being, Buffy wasn't Whedon's to begin with. He wrote the movie he just didn't direct it, you muppet.
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Jul 1, 2010 20:35
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Flatscan posted:He wrote the movie he just didn't direct it, you muppet. Wow. What do you know. Hrmm. I guess this is where I chew on my shoes a bit. Awkward.  So is Buffy S1 him trying to ape Fran Rubel Kuzui's directing style before deciding that it just won't work, or what?
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Jul 1, 2010 20:43
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scarycactusjunior posted:Okay, here's what I really don't get: everyone assuming that Willow's magic use in Season 6 is an allegory for drugs. That's because it very clearly is. She goes to a freakin' back alley, finds a dealer (complete with junkies hanging out inside, no less,) gets a "fix" (I think at one point she even calls it "a fix,") and then proceeds to act like she's on LSD, including driving all wonky and crashing the car. And then when she sucks the magic out of Giles that he was given by the Coven, she once again (for a brief while,) acts like she's high or trippn' balls and is all, "Whoa...that's some good stuff you got there, Giles...I'm, like...one with the Earth and can feel all the people, man..." There is no way in Hell that poo poo is not a direct, blatant, and stupid allegory for drugs.
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Jul 1, 2010 21:02
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