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KnoxZone posted:I dunno how PTN is playing it, but she is one of the 20 hostages, so she might end up dying at a certain point by default. After that the blood shall flow. I've actually been secretly rolling to see if it's her every turn. If she's next on the wall, it will be announced the turn before. Also, I'm being a bit forgiving with consciousness tests in the early games.
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Mar 7, 2011 05:38
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I'd have laughed my rear end off if she had been like the third hostage. Would have been a nice surprise for the Space Mexicans. Then they'd have to charge forward rather than sniping all the Cappellans and searching out the minefields with their squads, lol. [EDIT] Good on you for thinking ahead to actually roll to see if she's the hostage getting ready to get shot in the face though. Zaodai fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Mar 7, 2011 |
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Mar 7, 2011 05:57
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Defiance Industries posted:Outside of ComStar's hidden fleet, the last warship in the Inner Sphere was the LCS Invincible, which was lost during the Second Succession War. Wait, if that was the last warship, what are the fox, avalon and mjolnor classes?
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Mar 7, 2011 06:08
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Saint Celestine posted:Wait, if that was the last warship, what are the fox, avalon and mjolnor classes? Post-clan Inner Sphere Sudden Technical Renaissance handwavium stuff. It's pretty amazing, in the span of 10 years from the clans making landfall in the IS, all of a sudden these IS military machines, hampered by centuries of basically not even knowing how to build jump cores or the batteries to go with them (IIRC) are suddenly cranking out million-ton warships with all manner of absurd huge-calibre weaponry, the likes of which haven't been manufactured in all of what they thought to be human-inhabited space since...what, the mid 2700s? But hey, they needed to have something more interesting than Leopard dropships to play Battlespace with, right?
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Mar 7, 2011 06:15
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Hob_Gadling posted:Also, I'd like to politely remind PoptartsNinja that Lil' Sure Shot has a wounded pilot who needs to roll for consciousness every end phase... You only roll to see if you regain consciousness in the end phase.
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Mar 7, 2011 06:31
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WolfhoundFC posted:Post-clan Inner Sphere Sudden Technical Renaissance handwavium stuff. It's pretty amazing, in the span of 10 years from the clans making landfall in the IS, all of a sudden these IS military machines, hampered by centuries of basically not even knowing how to build jump cores or the batteries to go with them (IIRC) are suddenly cranking out million-ton warships with all manner of absurd huge-calibre weaponry, the likes of which haven't been manufactured in all of what they thought to be human-inhabited space since...what, the mid 2700s? But hey, they needed to have something more interesting than Leopard dropships to play Battlespace with, right? You have to remember that the only thing holding down the technical resurgence of the Inner Sphere was Comstar. Having the people who control ALL communications out to keep the Successor States crippled meant they pretty much stayed that way for a long drat time. Once they were out of the info-denial biz, people started putting the pieces back together right quick-like.
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Mar 7, 2011 06:42
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Kenlon posted:You have to remember that the only thing holding down the technical resurgence of the Inner Sphere was Comstar. Having the people who control ALL communications out to keep the Successor States crippled meant they pretty much stayed that way for a long drat time. Once they were out of the info-denial biz, people started putting the pieces back together right quick-like. The budget for warship research and development also got kind of a huge boost when the Clans showed up with 'em and demonstrated the consequences of unopposed orbital bombardment to the Inner Sphere (read: WMD on a Draconis Combine city to end a revolt). More to the point, Comstar went from suppressing such tech to outright enabling it by authorizing Rolls-Royce on Terra to sell warship engines to the Draconis Combine and Federated Commonwealth to earn some rebuilding cash (FWL and CC got similar technical assistance from Word of Blake if memory serves, though in the FWL case the Blakists also managed to appropriate said warships for themselves later). Even at their height of production the IS never had anything approaching a true war fleet, their warship programs were more or less "get something out there and smash away with it". With the exception of the FWL (which was the only force to try to build an actual working fleet with battleships supported by lighter craft) everyone pretty much went for something like one corvette/light warship class and one big type of ship, and had drat few of either built by the time the Jihad hit and blew most of 'em to bits. Post-Jihad everybody seems to be going for "pocket warships" which are just dropships based around the large scale naval weapons (usually capship missiles if memory serves); much cheaper than true warships and easier to build.
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Mar 7, 2011 07:09
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Kenlon posted:You have to remember that the only thing holding down the technical resurgence of the Inner Sphere was Comstar. Having the people who control ALL communications out to keep the Successor States crippled meant they pretty much stayed that way for a long drat time. Once they were out of the info-denial biz, people started putting the pieces back together right quick-like. Oh I don't doubt that at all, but the skeptic in me boggles at the situation when you think about the type of infrastructure that would be required to put together a warship construction program when the practical knowledge has been dormant for so long, and the facilities to construct them have been in mothballs at best. Granted, what happened at, say, Turtle Bay is as big an incentive as you're likely to get to put state resources in that basket, but we're not talking about retooling a mech production line to allow for XL engines to be mounted on an endo-steel chassis, we're talking about orbital facilities being activated, updated, and operated. The economies of battletech are vaguely-defined at best, which I think helps sweep such problems under the rug, but it doesn't pass the smell test to me.
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Mar 7, 2011 07:39
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WolfhoundFC posted:The economies of battletech are vaguely-defined at best, which I think helps sweep such problems under the rug, but it doesn't pass the smell test to me. It's a little fishy, I'll agree, but I think when you're talking about empires measured in the hundreds of worlds, then the actual infrastructure/manpower is THERE, as long as you throw enough money at it. You just need the knowledge (see: Helm datacore) and to NOT have the galaxy's phone service monopoly loving with your calls. But overall, yeah, there were way too many technological advances and new mech designs and junk coming out of the 'Sphere in the late 50s and through the 60s. I guess you need new designs to sell TROs and miniatures, but 'realistically' I think you only really need 10% or so of those new designs, and refurbished/updated/modified 'classic' designs would be easier to do and still cover 90% of necessary battlefield positions. Edit: Also IMO the Clans' mech inventory should really only be the 13 omnis in TRO 3050 (maaaaaybe a handful of other omnis that are clan-specific or whatever) because there is literally no reason for them the be making old-style battlemechs when they have omni technology. With 13 or 16 or 18 chassis that can all be modularly set up you don't need anything else, that's plenty of options to cover any battlefield need. WarLocke fucked around with this message at 08:06 on Mar 7, 2011 |
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Mar 7, 2011 08:03
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WarLocke posted:It's a little fishy, I'll agree, but I think when you're talking about empires measured in the hundreds of worlds, then the actual infrastructure/manpower is THERE, as long as you throw enough money at it. You just need the knowledge (see: Helm datacore) and to NOT have the galaxy's phone service monopoly loving with your calls. I can't imagine a star-spanning government so reliant on things like an interstellar pony express of jumpships ever being able to concentrate resources in a way that makes sense to our earthbound experience, regardless of political will. But, you know, soft sci-fi and all. It's unfortunately a slippery slope when we start talking about 'realistic' because we start talking about why these massive tanks have things like knee actuators and fragile gyros and why fire control won't allow for situations like firing a laser from a standing position at a target dozens of kilometers away in good visibility ohgod let's just forget this ever happened I just want giant robots bursting into flames and "melting sheets of ferro-fibrous plate" onto the ground as "pulse lasers stab smoking holes" in them. edit: questionably written combat fiction might be the best part of the franchise and I would never trade it for the world.
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Mar 7, 2011 08:09
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WarLocke posted:Edit: Also IMO the Clans' mech inventory should really only be the 13 omnis in TRO 3050 (maaaaaybe a handful of other omnis that are clan-specific or whatever) because there is literally no reason for them the be making old-style battlemechs when they have omni technology. With 13 or 16 or 18 chassis that can all be modularly set up you don't need anything else, that's plenty of options to cover any battlefield need. They really wanted to avoid all the clans feeling "samey" you can tell by the stupid totem mechs and the weird little stuff that makes no sense *cough*randomlyfataldruguse*cough*
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Mar 7, 2011 11:07
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WarLocke posted:Edit: Also IMO the Clans' mech inventory should really only be the 13 omnis in TRO 3050 (maaaaaybe a handful of other omnis that are clan-specific or whatever) because there is literally no reason for them the be making old-style battlemechs when they have omni technology. With 13 or 16 or 18 chassis that can all be modularly set up you don't need anything else, that's plenty of options to cover any battlefield need. 1: Omnis are reeeeeeeeally expensive. 2: Omni pods and the weapons to stock them take up a lot of space.
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Mar 7, 2011 14:31
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I am so totally down for a game of Succession Wars, and I've already called dibs on The Fox. Other'n that... Minelayer? Geeze. Wonder what other surprises are in store for the Cabballeros.
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Mar 7, 2011 15:06
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Yay, mines! I cannot wait for this poo poo to get downright esoteric as PTN finds the most obscure, horrific rules and devices to use.
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Mar 7, 2011 16:45
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Rain of frogs! RAIIIIIIIN OOOOOOOFFF FROOOOOOOGS!
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Mar 7, 2011 17:30
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Arquinsiel posted:Two points: This the in-universe justification why, aside from the Celestials, IS omni production kinda petered out after the Templar. There are also a bunch of other 3067 units that were designs originally meant to be omnis but downgraded because of the cost (Thanatos, Argus, off the top of my head). This is also ostensibly the reason why the worse off clans in the sphere (IE: everyone but the Falcons and maybe Bears) started rushing what would normally be second-line designs into their toumans.
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Mar 7, 2011 17:44
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WarLocke posted:Edit: Also IMO the Clans' mech inventory should really only be the 13 omnis in TRO 3050 (maaaaaybe a handful of other omnis that are clan-specific or whatever) because there is literally no reason for them the be making old-style battlemechs when they have omni technology. With 13 or 16 or 18 chassis that can all be modularly set up you don't need anything else, that's plenty of options to cover any battlefield need. My explanation has always been that Omnimechs really aren't truly "omni". Sure, it's theoretically possible to outfit them any way you want, but with the amount of tech time and effort needed to balance and configure the machine, it's not worth it. Instead, they use the prepackaged Prime/A/B/C/D configs to extend the flexibility of their 'mechs, with the real benefit of Omni technology being the ease of replacement and repair.
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Mar 7, 2011 18:41
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Kenlon posted:My explanation has always been that Omnimechs really aren't truly "omni". Sure, it's theoretically possible to outfit them any way you want, but with the amount of tech time and effort needed to balance and configure the machine, it's not worth it. Instead, they use the prepackaged Prime/A/B/C/D configs to extend the flexibility of their 'mechs, with the real benefit of Omni technology being the ease of replacement and repair. I always assumed the way the omnimech's engine, criticals, and jumpjets were laid out was extremely difficult to change. If you wanted to put, say, jumpjets and a slower engine on a Timber Wolf, you could do so- but it took a lot of sophisticated and expensive equipment and kept the 'mech out of action for a decent period. So the Jade Falcons made the Night Gyr for warriors who wanted something heavier and meaner than a Summoner without losing jump capability. Likewise, the Hellbringer carries a shitload of firepower at 65 tons but is very lightly armored, so the Smoke Jaguars used advanced materials to try to decrease its vulnerability and created the much more durable, low-slung Cauldron-Born (I will never call it the Ebon Jaguar) for warriors and tacticians who favored that.
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Mar 7, 2011 19:00
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an oddly awful oud posted:I always assumed the way the omnimech's engine, criticals, and jumpjets were laid out was extremely difficult to change. If you wanted to put, say, jumpjets and a slower engine on a Timber Wolf, you could do so- but it took a lot of sophisticated and expensive equipment and kept the 'mech out of action for a decent period. So the Jade Falcons made the Night Gyr for warriors who wanted something heavier and meaner than a Summoner without losing jump capability. Likewise, the Hellbringer carries a shitload of firepower at 65 tons but is very lightly armored, so the Smoke Jaguars used advanced materials to try to decrease its vulnerability and created the much more durable, low-slung Cauldron-Born (I will never call it the Ebon Jaguar) for warriors and tacticians who favored that. You're kind of right. There's some things that can be changed with omni pods and some things that can't. Weapons, ammo, electronics, extra heat sinks and jump jets can all be mounted in omni pods, which means they can be removed and added as omni pods, which means they take one hour to change. Engines, armor, internal structure, MASC/TSM, CASE and heat sinks built in to the engine cannot be changed and must be modified like with a standard BattleMech. So changing your internal structure out or the engine can sideline a machine for possibly months.
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Mar 7, 2011 19:28
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an oddly awful oud posted:(I will never call it the Ebon Jaguar) As is proper.
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Mar 7, 2011 19:29
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Didn't most of the Clanners call it the Cauldron Born save for the Jaguars?
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Mar 7, 2011 19:57
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Krumbsthumbs posted:Didn't most of the Clanners call it the Cauldron Born save for the Jaguars?
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Mar 7, 2011 20:26
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That entire series is pretty much lifted straight out of Celtic, particularly Welsh, folklore so no, it's not a reference to Prydain. It's a reference to Celtic folklore that those books just happened to popularize in America.
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Mar 7, 2011 20:53
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Krumbsthumbs posted:Didn't most of the Clanners call it the Cauldron Born save for the Jaguars? Yeah. The IS reporting name spread through the other Clans faster than the CSJ name for it, and people saw that Cauldron Born was a more  name for it than Ebon Jaguar anyway.So it just stuck.
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Mar 7, 2011 23:55
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Hm. Okay, after looking at things further there's basically no possible move I can make that isn't right into the SRM Carrier's line of fire without making myself basically useless for the fight. So I'm charging up to 1112 and putting a shot into the Vindie. Bunny, that SRM Carrier's all yours. If you don't take it out this turn we're in huge amount of poo poo.
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Mar 8, 2011 04:28
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I'm blasting and kicking the poo poo outta it. Hopefully I kill it good.
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Mar 8, 2011 04:45
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Tempest_56 posted:Hm. Okay, after looking at things further there's basically no possible move I can make that isn't right into the SRM Carrier's line of fire without making myself basically useless for the fight. So I'm charging up to 1112 and putting a shot into the Vindie. Bunny, that SRM Carrier's all yours. If you don't take it out this turn we're in huge amount of poo poo. That's the spirit! Surely that SRM carrier won't put that many (more) holes in your mech. He either fears his fate too much, Or his desserts are small, Who dares not put it to the touch, To win or lose it all!
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Mar 8, 2011 05:11
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bunnyofdoom posted:I'm blasting and kicking the poo poo outta it. Hopefully I kill it good. Time for those lucky LP dice to bust out.
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Mar 8, 2011 05:16
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bunnyofdoom posted:I'm blasting and kicking the poo poo outta it. Hopefully I kill it good. I have a good feeling about this plan. 
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Mar 8, 2011 05:26
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Trast posted:Time for those lucky LP dice to bust out. It's got 12 armor on a side and no turret to distribute the damage to, it's not going to be that hard to punch through. Of course, the question I'm really, really surprised nobody's asked is: how many of its launchers are full of Infernos? PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Mar 8, 2011 |
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Mar 8, 2011 05:26
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PoptartsNinja posted:It's got 12 armor on a side and no turret to distribute the damage to, it's not going to be that hard to punch through. Yay! Assuming I hit of course
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Mar 8, 2011 05:28
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PoptartsNinja posted:how many of its launchers are full of Infernos? all of them
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Mar 8, 2011 05:48
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PoptartsNinja posted:Of course, the question I'm really, really surprised nobody's asked is: how many of its launchers are full of Infernos? I've got a slightly different question, but given that I'm rooting for the Cappellans in this, asking it would just give away any surprises you might have in store. That said, if it's sitting there for the reason I would have it sitting there, you are a magnificent bastard and I wholeheartedly salute you for your throughly Cappellan tactics. 
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Mar 8, 2011 05:56
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PoptartsNinja posted:It's got 12 armor on a side and no turret to distribute the damage to, it's not going to be that hard to punch through. .....  That question fills me with terror, and I'm not even playing in this scenario. E: By the way PTN, did you notice my request to be placed in the lineup? landcollector fucked around with this message at 06:01 on Mar 8, 2011 |
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Mar 8, 2011 05:58
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PoptartsNinja posted:Of course, the question I'm really, really surprised nobody's asked is: how many of its launchers are full of Infernos? At this point? I hope they all are. I'm running out of ammo to cook off.
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Mar 8, 2011 06:14
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PoptartsNinja posted:Of course, the question I'm really, really surprised nobody's asked is: how many of its launchers are full of Infernos?  All of them are, of course!
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Mar 8, 2011 07:32
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Zaodai posted:I've got a slightly different question, but given that I'm rooting for the Cappellans in this, asking it would just give away any surprises you might have in store. If you think it's sitting there for the reason I think you think it's sitting there, then I expect we'll see your name on the docket of a war crimes trial in the future. The Ares Conventions aren't suggestions, you know.
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Mar 8, 2011 08:19
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Fraction Jackson posted:If you think it's sitting there for the reason I think you think it's sitting there, then I expect we'll see your name on the docket of a war crimes trial in the future. The Ares Conventions aren't suggestions, you know. Who the heck do you think we are, C*? Y Cabballeros del Coronel Carlos Camacho don't do no steenkin' war crimes tribunals. We just show up in the middle of the night, guns blazing, and our justice floweth forth from the barrel of an Autocannon/20.
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Mar 8, 2011 08:22
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Fraction Jackson posted:If you think it's sitting there for the reason I think you think it's sitting there, then I expect we'll see your name on the docket of a war crimes trial in the future. The Ares Conventions aren't suggestions, you know. We're already murdering children, I don't think additional war crimes really matter. But no, I don't think my particular tactic is considered a warcrime, it's just very surprising. ShadowDragon8685 posted:Who the heck do you think we are, C*? And we show up in the middle of the night and murder your women and children. One of us is doing better at those goals than the other. 
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Mar 8, 2011 08:26
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Zaodai posted:And we show up in the middle of the night and murder your women and children. One of us is doing better at those goals than the other. That's it. F*ck the clans, shove their ComStar up their collective arse. I hereby request that the next scenario be a 17th Recon grudge match dropping in unannounced and unwelcome on the Death Commandos.
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Mar 8, 2011 08:44
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