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Elijya
May 11, 2005

Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.

Raimundus posted:

Do viruses die of age, or are their natural "lives" pretty much interminable?

Viruses are not considered alive even though they can be killed. A virus is a very simple organism, relatively speaking, they're a thousand times less complex than a bacteria. They're sort of right on the border between chemistry and biology. They can shut down and be reactivated an almost indefinite amount of time later.

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Raimundus
Apr 26, 2008

BARF! I THOUGHT I WOULD LIKE SMELLING DOG BUTTS BUT I GUESS I WAS WRONG!

Elijya posted:

They can shut down and be reactivated an almost indefinite amount of time later.

Yeah, this is all I was curious of. I understand that viruses are a pretty dubious form of life/machinery.

I think they're pretty interesting. Any given virus is a system designed specifically to self-replicate, nothing more or less, by depending on another system. There are even viruses that depend on other viruses. They're the first utilitarians. If every other organism on Earth were eviscerated, and under the right conditions, I bet a few surviving strains would go right on ahead infecting one another indefinitely.

Raimundus fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Mar 20, 2011

Drunk Driver Dad
Feb 18, 2005
I have a question about choosing an ISP.

I live in rural Alabama about 50 minutes outside of Birmingham so options are limited as far as I know. Right now I'm using dial up which is horrible and I'm desperate. I'm moving into a new house in a week or so. Here is what I know are options:

Dial Up, Charter Cable, Hughes Net Satellite, and mobile broadband.

I called AT&T and they say DSL isn't available. I've had Charter before and know what to expect and it's obviously the best option. I know they service my road, but they have been picky in the past with me about how far off the road my house is, This new house is about 100-150 feet from the road. A guy is coming Tuesday to look and see if they can because they weren't able to tell over the phone if my house was serviceable.

Just in case they aren't what is the best option? A friend has a USB modem and has a mobile broadband plan from AT&T and says it runs good, but all those plans seem to have 3/5/10GB a month caps and I'd require 40-60gigs at the very least.

I've heard horror stories about Hughes Net about how it works good sometimes and sometimes crawls like dial up. I read it's usually better at night when I usually get on and I could honestly deal with wildly fluctuating speeds as long as it's better than dial-up. I can also deal with the latency.

I'm thinking Hughesnet>mobile just because the data cap. From what I understand it's pretty much impossible to get an unlimited or large data cap when it comes to mobile although I had a friend claim tethering a phone with an unlimited phone data plan would work, but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't work.

Any suggestions?

hooah
Feb 6, 2006
WTF?
What other movie used Billy Crystal's speech from near the end of "When Harry met Sally"? Y'know, the "I love that you get cold when it's 71 degrees out..." one, but one of the characters (I think the girl the quote is directed at) wasn't wooed because she knew what it was from?

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

BlazinLow305 posted:

I have a question about choosing an ISP.

I live in rural Alabama about 50 minutes outside of Birmingham so options are limited as far as I know. Right now I'm using dial up which is horrible and I'm desperate. I'm moving into a new house in a week or so. Here is what I know are options:

Dial Up, Charter Cable, Hughes Net Satellite, and mobile broadband.

I called AT&T and they say DSL isn't available. I've had Charter before and know what to expect and it's obviously the best option. I know they service my road, but they have been picky in the past with me about how far off the road my house is, This new house is about 100-150 feet from the road. A guy is coming Tuesday to look and see if they can because they weren't able to tell over the phone if my house was serviceable.

Just in case they aren't what is the best option? A friend has a USB modem and has a mobile broadband plan from AT&T and says it runs good, but all those plans seem to have 3/5/10GB a month caps and I'd require 40-60gigs at the very least.

I've heard horror stories about Hughes Net about how it works good sometimes and sometimes crawls like dial up. I read it's usually better at night when I usually get on and I could honestly deal with wildly fluctuating speeds as long as it's better than dial-up. I can also deal with the latency.

I'm thinking Hughesnet>mobile just because the data cap. From what I understand it's pretty much impossible to get an unlimited or large data cap when it comes to mobile although I had a friend claim tethering a phone with an unlimited phone data plan would work, but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't work.

Any suggestions?

Satellite is awful! And the data cap on a plan that's under $100 is 200 megabytes per day, that's 6 GB per month.If you go over the daily cap they rate limit you to dialup speeds but you still have the horrific satellite latency that makes stuff go even slower.

If you can't get cable, look into getting ISDN. It's an older broadband-ish conenctiont hat can be done over phone lines very far from the central office, unlike dsl, and although it'd only be 128k each direction there's no caps and can be had almost everywhere for $50 a month.

elbow
Jun 7, 2006

hooah posted:

What other movie used Billy Crystal's speech from near the end of "When Harry met Sally"? Y'know, the "I love that you get cold when it's 71 degrees out..." one, but one of the characters (I think the girl the quote is directed at) wasn't wooed because she knew what it was from?

This happened in a Scrubs episode (S3E21, My Self-examination)

Travakian
Oct 9, 2008

hooah posted:

What other movie used Billy Crystal's speech from near the end of "When Harry met Sally"? Y'know, the "I love that you get cold when it's 71 degrees out..." one, but one of the characters (I think the girl the quote is directed at) wasn't wooed because she knew what it was from?

Wikiquote says the followup to this was,

Sally posted:

You see? That is just like you, Harry. You say things like that, and you make it impossible for me to hate you, and I hate you, Harry. I really hate you. I hate you.
[They kiss]

So.. perhaps you're mistaken in the speech. Not familiar enough to help further!

Groundskeeper Silly
Sep 1, 2005

My philosophy...
The first rule is:
You look good.

kimbo305 posted:

Maybe you need to be more descriptive about what are considered fancy things, and examples of things this person would or would not do. Does the latest and greastest roller coaster count as fancy? It takes some sophisticated tech to get one that can dive to 100+ mph. Something an old-fashioned wooden coaster couldn't do safely.

Whatever the anti-snob considers fancy is fancy. I know that fancy is subjective and that what they (the anti-snob) consider fancy might be considered not-fancy by other people, but that's not really the point. I don't want to get into some discussion about fancy vs. non-fancy.

I guess I didn't provide enough detail in my question, so here is some context: Say someone at a microbrewery asks if they have any macrobrews (and refuses to order any microbrews) because "I'm not a beer snob." A word to describe that person is what I'm looking for.

gwar3k1 posted:

A person shunning "fancy things" for the fact they are fancy is as much as a snob as a person who shuns "non-fancy" things in favor of the fancy ones. Grassroots could be an option, traditional, simplistic, thrifty (if you're going for a cost angle)?

Thanks, but I'm looking for a specific opposite of a specific definition of snob.

Sorry to the thread that my post wasn't very clear. I'm sure the Germans have a word that means what I want; I'll ask the Germanophone at work if he can

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.
I think it's hilarious that you were given words for this, but you refuse to use them because they are too fancy.

hooah
Feb 6, 2006
WTF?

elbow posted:

This happened in a Scrubs episode (S3E21, My Self-examination)

Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks.

WillieWestwood
Jun 23, 2004

Happy Thanksgiving!

Groundskeeper Silly posted:

Whatever the anti-snob considers fancy is fancy. I know that fancy is subjective and that what they (the anti-snob) consider fancy might be considered not-fancy by other people, but that's not really the point. I don't want to get into some discussion about fancy vs. non-fancy.

I guess I didn't provide enough detail in my question, so here is some context: Say someone at a microbrewery asks if they have any macrobrews (and refuses to order any microbrews) because "I'm not a beer snob." A word to describe that person is what I'm looking for.


Thanks, but I'm looking for a specific opposite of a specific definition of snob.

Sorry to the thread that my post wasn't very clear. I'm sure the Germans have a word that means what I want; I'll ask the Germanophone at work if he can
There isn't one, afaik, so you can just make one up - contrasnob is an example. There's snob, and there's contrarian, so someone could be a contrarian snob, or a contrasnob. English does this all the time. :)

You could also try rustic, commoner, or layman. "Layman" works better, as lay people don't have the qualifications that a snob has, and they're quite happy drinking the common drink as opposed to the sophisticated one.

WillieWestwood fucked around with this message at 08:46 on Mar 20, 2011

A Real Happy Camper
Dec 11, 2007

These children have taught me how to believe.
Every Halloween I'd get these candies, they were black (or very dark brown), and came in orange and black wrappers with witches and black cats and whatnot on them. They were like a toffee, but hard as hell (kids would literally chip teeth on them) and I want to say they were black licorice flavoured. It's hard to remember the exact flavour because they tasted like like complete poo poo and I've been trying to block it out of my mind for decades. Does anyone know what these were called?

Elijya
May 11, 2005

Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.

elbow posted:

This happened in a Scrubs episode (S3E21, My Self-examination)

Freaky. I am literally watching that episode right now and read that question 30 seconds after I watched that scene. :tinfoil:

Drimble Wedge
Mar 10, 2008

Self-contained

Captain Novolin posted:

Every Halloween I'd get these candies, they were black (or very dark brown), and came in orange and black wrappers with witches and black cats and whatnot on them. They were like a toffee, but hard as hell (kids would literally chip teeth on them) and I want to say they were black licorice flavoured. It's hard to remember the exact flavour because they tasted like like complete poo poo and I've been trying to block it out of my mind for decades. Does anyone know what these were called?

I don't know but I can still feel my fillings loosen; those things were actively dangerous.

nesbit37
Dec 12, 2003
Emperor of Rome
(500 BC - 500 AD)
Cell phone question: I have a roughly 6 year old Razr2 that I don't really want to replace but I need to. I currently am part of a $25 a month family plan with t-mobile that I don't want to leave. Can I just buy an ok non-smart phone and stick my sim card into it without having to contact or do anything with t-mobile? If so, does anyone have recommendations of decent not-too-expensive phones that would work for this and where to get them?

The only reason I need to get a new phone is because the age of my current one is starting to effect it, and I am sick of it only being able to store 30 text messages before being full.

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.
Yeah, any non smart phone that takes simcards will work.

I suggest making a buying thread in SA mart that details what you want.

cosmicjim fucked around with this message at 17:18 on Mar 20, 2011

thehandtruck
Mar 5, 2006

the thing about the jews is,

Raimundus posted:

Yeah, this is all I was curious of. I understand that viruses are a pretty dubious form of life/machinery.

I think they're pretty interesting. Any given virus is a system designed specifically to self-replicate, nothing more or less, by depending on another system. There are even viruses that depend on other viruses. They're the first utilitarians. If every other organism on Earth were eviscerated, and under the right conditions, I bet a few surviving strains would go right on ahead infecting one another indefinitely.

I could be wrong but, I don't think it works like that. Viruses have "nothing" in them so to speak. Meaning they can't make food or energy or "do" anything. It's kind of strange. They basically hijack a cell's machinery and instead of the cell making say proteins or ATP or energy for the body, it starts making more viruses. But you still need energy to run the cellular machinery. Like if you hijacked a printing press and instead of printing a newspaper you printed like rebel propaganda, you still need energy to run the printing press. So I don't think if everything in the world died you would see viruses infecting other viruses because that does no good. There's no cellular machinery to hijack.

Also to answer your question of how does a virus die. Again I'm pretty rusty on this but I think it can happen a couple ways. A virus' entire "body" is like one big needle. All it's trying to do is inject it's DNA into a cell/cell's nucleus and then the needle (body) itself just disintegrates. The other way is that if the virus is common and is spotted by phagocytes or macrophages or other acquired immune system cells it will be gobbled up and destroyed and eaten on the spot.

Lastly there's this french guy who has been arguing recently that viruses are alive. He said if you are just going to say that virus' are just really complex molecules that aren't alive then that's all we are so the debate doesn't hold up. I can't remember his name but he's pretty weird and cool.

Danger Mahoney
Mar 19, 2007

by FactsAreUseless
I'm making a suspended chin-up bar. I need it to be about four feet across. What should I use to make the actual bar, and where would I get the materials? It seems like it would be easy to think up a way to make a weather-proof bar with a ring at either end for attaching the chain, but I'm coming up with nothing.

nesbit37
Dec 12, 2003
Emperor of Rome
(500 BC - 500 AD)
Once you figure out the diameter of bar you want, why not just buy some black plumbing pipe. Then drill a hole through the pipe on either and put in a threaded bolt with a loop on one end so you can attach a chain to it. You should be able to find all of that at most hardware stores and the only annoying part would be drilling through the pipe.

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.
I know plastic pipe can be strong, but the diameter needed for a confortable grip plus being 4 feet long sounds dubious.

Is the bar going across an existing gap or will it be free standing?

If you are making it from scratch and it will be permanent, I suggest burying 2 4X4s to get the desired height, then using a spade bit to make a hole in each the proper diameter(once you have the pole and know what the diameter is) and finding either a hollow scrap metal pipe to go through the holes, or a solid piece of rebar.

If you can't find the pipe/bar at a hardware store, you might find it at a local scrap metal place.

Flay Minion
Sep 23, 2004

hepme

cosmicjim posted:

I know plastic pipe can be strong, but the diameter needed for a confortable grip plus being 4 feet long sounds dubious.


I believe he's talking about black gas pipe. It is ungalvanized steel.

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.
woops. Yeah, Guess you're right. That sounds perfect. But I'd put the pipe through posts. Screw drilling the pipe.

nesbit37
Dec 12, 2003
Emperor of Rome
(500 BC - 500 AD)
Posts will work fine, I thought you wanted to hang it with chains. If you do want to drill through the pipe its not as bad as you think it is. You just need a drill bit that is made for going through metal, which is most of them, and then you drill slowly using some oil at the contact point of the bit and the pipe. It sounds daunting, but its not that bad. I got used to it pretty fast when I had to drill through and thread a bunch of square pipe to build a vacuumform machine a few years back.

Danger Mahoney
Mar 19, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

cosmicjim posted:

woops. Yeah, Guess you're right. That sounds perfect. But I'd put the pipe through posts. Screw drilling the pipe.

My situation is that I have a huge wooden frame for a high swing set in my back yard (sans swings) from the previous home owners. It's tough as hell and already has hooks set in the top bar. The hooks are set through holes drilled through the top with thick-rear end washers and a huge nut on the top.

This makes the "suspended" thing a must - there are no real side posts to set a bar into, and there are already some very sturdy points from which to dangle some chain.

I guess plumbing pipe is my answer, then. How exactly does one drill through metal? Last time I put a hole in metal of any significant thickness was in metal shop in high school, and I had a vice and a drill press back then. Now all I have is a cordless drill, which most likely isn't going to put a hole in any kind of metal seeing as how it balks at every wood knot it encounters.

edit:

nesbit37 posted:

Posts will work fine, I thought you wanted to hang it with chains. If you do want to drill through the pipe its not as bad as you think it is. You just need a drill bit that is made for going through metal, which is most of them, and then you drill slowly using some oil at the contact point of the bit and the pipe. It sounds daunting, but its not that bad. I got used to it pretty fast when I had to drill through and thread a bunch of square pipe to build a vacuumform machine a few years back.

This sounds promising. What would you suggest for keeping the bar stationary while I drill? Am I going to need to go buy a vice?

Danger Mahoney fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Mar 20, 2011

nesbit37
Dec 12, 2003
Emperor of Rome
(500 BC - 500 AD)
Drilling through metal is easy and your electric drill should be fine. See my above post. The trick is going slowly and use lubricant. heat is your enemy.

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.
Can you run a chain through the pipe to hooks? Instead of 2 individual chains attached to the pipe.
If not, like he said, drilling through pipe isn't terrible. I just avoid it if I have alternatives.

cosmicjim fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Mar 20, 2011

Mak0rz
Aug 2, 2008

😎🐗🚬

thehandtruck posted:

Lastly there's this french guy who has been arguing recently that viruses are alive. He said if you are just going to say that virus' are just really complex molecules that aren't alive then that's all we are so the debate doesn't hold up. I can't remember his name but he's pretty weird and cool.

On this: Why exactly aren't viruses considered living things? I'm a biologist and I've never even heard a good reason for this. The only thing close to a justification I've heard was that viruses don't contain a functional cell.

But why should we define life as the presence of a functional cell when viruses have working, replicating RNA? Why can't the presence of replicating nucleic acids be the definition of life?

Goober Peas
Jun 30, 2007

Check out my 'Vette, bro


BlazinLow305 posted:

I have a question about choosing an ISP.

I live in rural Alabama about 50 minutes outside of Birmingham so options are limited as far as I know. Right now I'm using dial up which is horrible and I'm desperate. I'm moving into a new house in a week or so. Here is what I know are options:

Dial Up, Charter Cable, Hughes Net Satellite, and mobile broadband.


My parents live middle-of-nowhere AL and have HughesNet. The nearest cable run is 20 miles away, DSL is a dream, and dialup is pretty much capped at 28.8 because of the ancient phone infrastructure in the area. Cell phone service is spotty, so mobile broadband is out.

HughesNet beats the hell out of dialup if those are the only two options, even though it's expensive and otherwise mediocre. They haven't had any real service issues -- they average 1mb up/256kb down with a 300MB daily cap and are paying $60/mo.

For OP, mobile broadband will probably be faster but more expensive -- here in Memphis all providers are in the 5GB/mo = $50 range, 10GB/mo = $75/mo range.

In general, the best option in rural areas is almost always cable when available.

Binowru
Feb 15, 2007

I never set out to be weird. It was always other people who called me weird.

Mak0rz posted:

On this: Why exactly aren't viruses considered living things? I'm a biologist and I've never even heard a good reason for this. The only thing close to a justification I've heard was that viruses don't contain a functional cell.

But why should we define life as the presence of a functional cell when viruses have working, replicating RNA? Why can't the presence of replicating nucleic acids be the definition of life?

I'm not a biologist, so take that as you will, but I thought part of it also was that viruses can't reproduce on their own -- they have to take over healthy cells.





vvvvvvv Well, all other parasites are made of cells, aren't they? :colbert: (I don't know)

Binowru fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Mar 20, 2011

Mak0rz
Aug 2, 2008

😎🐗🚬

Binowru posted:

I'm not a biologist, so take that as you will, but I thought part of it also was that viruses can't reproduce on their own -- they have to take over healthy cells.

So where do we draw the line between non-living virus and living parasite?

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

Mak0rz posted:

On this: Why exactly aren't viruses considered living things? I'm a biologist and I've never even heard a good reason for this. The only thing close to a justification I've heard was that viruses don't contain a functional cell.

But why should we define life as the presence of a functional cell when viruses have working, replicating RNA? Why can't the presence of replicating nucleic acids be the definition of life?

Viruses only have "working, replicating" RNA once they're inside a cell. Outside a cell, or in the wrong cell, they're inert.

lllllllllllllllllll
Feb 28, 2010

Now the scene's lighting is perfect!

Mak0rz posted:

On this: Why exactly aren't viruses considered living things?

They don't have a metabolism unlike any (other?) living being. They don't breath or eat.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong
Computer viruses are a very good analogy. Just sitting on a disk or in a computer that's off or the wrong kind they do nothing. They require something else and it's abilities to replicate or do anything.

b0nes
Sep 11, 2001

fishmech posted:

Satellite is awful! And the data cap on a plan that's under $100 is 200 megabytes per day, that's 6 GB per month.If you go over the daily cap they rate limit you to dialup speeds but you still have the horrific satellite latency that makes stuff go even slower.

If you can't get cable, look into getting ISDN. It's an older broadband-ish conenctiont hat can be done over phone lines very far from the central office, unlike dsl, and although it'd only be 128k each direction there's no caps and can be had almost everywhere for $50 a month.

How come Japan can get 50+Mbps and we can barely crank out 1meg a second?

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

b0nes posted:

How come Japan can get 50+Mbps and we can barely crank out 1meg a second?

A couple of reasons:

-Starting their telecom development later than we did, with better technology and less legacy baggage.

-geography and population distribution change the economics of large-scale broadband deployments.

-American telecoms are terrible and greedy and control their market to the point that none of them feel much pressure to improve their offerings. They are also heavily influenced by the cable TV industry to make online streaming less competitive (this is the big one)

Danger Mahoney
Mar 19, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

haveblue posted:

A couple of reasons:

-Starting their telecom development later than we did, with better technology and less legacy baggage.

-geography and population distribution change the economics of large-scale broadband deployments.

-American telecoms are terrible and greedy and control their market to the point that none of them feel much pressure to improve their offerings. They are also heavily influenced by the cable TV industry to make online streaming less competitive (this is the big one)

Don't forget the massive government subsidies that have gone to telecom industries to improve our infrastructure that have been simply taken with no improvements made.

The people and the government are doing the right thing, it's the telecoms that are loving things up at this point.

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.

haveblue posted:

A couple of reasons:

-Starting their telecom development later than we did, with better technology and less legacy baggage.

-geography and population distribution change the economics of large-scale broadband deployments.

-American telecoms are terrible and greedy and control their market to the point that none of them feel much pressure to improve their offerings. They are also heavily influenced by the cable TV industry to make online streaming less competitive (this is the big one)

The big one is your #2.
Japan is smaller than California.
It doesn't make economic sense as a company to run 20 miles worth of broadband for a dozen people that might take advantage of it. If it did, they would do it. And I don't think taxpayers should foot the bill so cousin Cletus can watch high quality porn, because of where he chooses to live.

Golbez
Oct 9, 2002

1 2 3!
If you want to take a shot at me get in line, line
1 2 3!
Baby, I've had all my shots and I'm fine
But do the densest parts of the country - the northeast, greater LA, and Chicagoland - have Japanese-quality broadband? If not, then relying on geography as the main reason falls short.

cosmicjim
Mar 23, 2010
VISIT THE STICKIED GOON HOLIDAY CHARITY DRIVE THREAD IN GBS.

Goons are changing the way children get an education in Haiti.

Edit - Oops, no they aren't. They donated to doobie instead.
All 3 of his bullet points were valid.

The population density I guess has more to do with so many Americans not having broadband at all.
It's still economically driven, because the slowest broadband levels are more than adequate for most Americans. To pay for faster infrastructure it requires a cost increase on subscribers and I'd rather keep my slow broadband than pay more and most consumers here feel the same.

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fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

Danger Mahoney posted:

Don't forget the massive government subsidies that have gone to telecom industries to improve our infrastructure that have been simply taken with no improvements made.

The people and the government are doing the right thing, it's the telecoms that are loving things up at this point.

No, that money went right into building 2g and 3g cell phone networks. Would you rather have faster home internet, or the ability to surf the web on the street?

Golbez posted:

But do the densest parts of the country - the northeast, greater LA, and Chicagoland - have Japanese-quality broadband? If not, then relying on geography as the main reason falls short.

My grandmother has 50 meg down and up FIOS in North Jersey.

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