Thoren posted:

How biased or unbaised is Al-Jazeeza generally considered? A lot of people I know, especially activist friends love to turn to Al-Jazeera as an unbiased news source. I remember they totally skipped over the Lara Logan story recently.

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A Nato official says the alliance's warships will begin patrolling off Libya on Wednesday, AP reports. And diplomats say agreement is gradually emerging about how Nato can assume responsibility for enforcing the no-fly zone over Libya.

Soviet Commubot posted:

I get the joke but Sarko is already pretty much balls deep in this. If the whole operation falls apart Sarko is utterly hosed in May, especially among the FN types who love bombing Arabs. If anything he's got more riding on this than Obama.

Mr.Nice posted:

The FN is strongly against this war, on most polls on some french far right wing website like fdesouche , support doesn't go over 20% and they are supposed to be more pro Us than the other branch of the far right. Kaddhafi was controlling immigration to europe, if the insurgents win, the far right are afraid to see a lot of incoming immigrants in France.

Since the 80' the french far right has been anti war and even had a pro arab foreign policy, Le Pen was a personal friend of saddam hussein. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x99hci_le-pen-recontre-saddam-hussein-en-1_news

You are right that sarkozy is hosed for the next election.

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@AlertNet: Gaddafi artillery, tanks, stopped firing on Misrata after air strikes, resident says #libya #misrata

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@BBC: Coalition aircraft have launched two strikes against pro-Gaddafi forces in Misrata, Reuters reports.

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The rebels in #Misrata trying to secure a perimeter around the hospital but it's not safe because the rebels holding light weapons. #lybia

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More on the strikes in Misrata reported by Reuters: "The allied planes bombed twice so far. At 1245 (2245 GMT) this morning and then again less than two hours ago," a resident tells the agency. "They (pro-Gaddafi forces) haven't fired a single artillery (round) since the air strike."

Thoren posted:

How biased or unbaised is Al-Jazeeza generally considered? A lot of people I know, especially activist friends love to turn to Al-Jazeera as an unbiased news source. I remember they totally skipped over the Lara Logan story recently.

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Kim Sengupta of Britain's Independent newspaper recently travelled to Ajdabiya on the the Libyan front line. "Ajdabiya has a population of about 140,000, it seems about three-quarters of them have gone," he told the BBC World Service. "All the shops are shut, they have run out of most of their food, there is no water and there is no power. So it is basically a city under siege." He said pro-Gaddafi forces control the outside perimeter of the city. "No-one really is in control inside, you've got Shabab [Libyan Youth Movement] rebel fighters' checkpoints in various places, but they are not permanent ones."

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Al Jazeera's Andrew Simmons, aboard the USS Kearsarge, says the aim of the Harrier jets aboard the ship is to help push Gaddafi's troops back from their lines - not enforce a no-fly zone. He tells us:

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The rebels aren't making much headway, so we're seeing an escalation here.

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Tom Kington on the USS Kearsarge has another update from last night's operations:

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Four US Harrier jump jets flew bombing missions from an Navy vessel off the Libyan coast on Tuesday night as coalition forces continued attempts to dislodge Libyan forces loyal to Muammar Gaddafi.
The Harriers, armed with GPU 12 laser guided bombs, took off from the USS Kearsarge at 11pm local time, returning at 2am before aircraft refuelled and took of for a second sortie.
The Kearsarge's group of six Harriers attacked targets outside Benghazi on Sunday morning and near Ajdabiya on Sunday night, hitting tanks, artillery pieces and mobile missile launchers.
Officials did not reveal Tuesday night's targets, but Libyan government forces were reportedly continue to shell rebels in Ajdabiya, suggesting they remain a viable target for coalition aircraft.
Marine Colonel Mark Desens, who commands the Harriers, said that flying the vertical take-off jets from the Kearsarge gave them an advantage over conventional jets flying from airbases further away from Libya.
"With the Harriers we can turn them around very quickly and do two sorties a night," he said.

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French government spokesman Francois Baroin has said Nato will have a "technical role" in the Libyan intervention, Reuters reports.

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And French Foreign Minister Alain Juppe says Nato won't be taking a political lead in the Libya mission, but will carry out a planning and operational role.

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Zintan resident, quoted by Reuters: "Gaddafi's brigades started bombardment from the northern area half an hour ago... The town is completely surrounded... They are getting reinforcements. Troops backed with tanks and vehicles are coming. We appeal to the allied forces to come and protect civilians."

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An interesting snippet from Reuters, who have spoken to an official at Agoco, a Libyan oil firm based in rebel-held Benghazi. Despite the surrounding chaos the company is still producing 95,000 barrels per day of oil, with two oil field working. This is around 25% of the normal level but they hope to resume full production in a couple of weeks.

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Al Jazeera 14 people were killed in Misrata overnight and 23 people were injured. Al Jazeera’s James Bays says:

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Gaddafi’s forces now taken over hospital in the town, and have positioned snipers on the roof and tanks outside. The rebels are calling for a hospital ship to be sent in, as they still control the port, and say that would save many lives, as they now have nowhere to take their injured.

More civilian deaths have been reported in Ajdabiya and elsewhere, and they calling on international powers to interpret the UN resolution more widely to support them.

A doctor speaking to AFP puts the death toll at 17, including 5 children.

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NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen said in a statement that the alliance will monitor sea traffic in the region and intercept vessels suspected of carrying illegal arms or mercenaries.

"All allies are committed to meet their responsibilities under the United Nations resolution to stop the intolerable violence against Libyan civilians," he said.

NATO's decision prompted Germany, reluctant to play a military role in Libya, to immediately announce it was pulling out of alliance operations in the Mediterranean. Four ships will be returned to German command, a Defence Ministry spokesman in Berlin said.

Because of the risk of getting drawn in, the Defence Ministry said Tuesday Germany was putting two ships and two smaller boats with a total of some 550 sailors in the Mediterranean back under national command.

QuentinCompson posted:

AJ is guided quite a bit lately by their owner, the Qatari House of Thani. They don't really cover Bahrain since Saudi and Qatar came to an understanding over these things, they didn't cover the Saudi protests very much either.

But there's no such thing as a 100% objective news site anyway and they're the best you're going to get. The other options are the Hezbollah channel, Press TV, Al Arabiyah... all lousier or more transparently biased to one side or the other.

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Reuters have managed to get another telephone update from Misrata:

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Western air strikes early on Wednesday hit an air base south of Libya's rebel-held Misrata where government forces are positioned, but snipers shot two people dead in the centre of the city, a resident said.
"This morning, air strikes twice hit the airbase where Gaddafi's brigades are based," the resident, called Sami, told Reuters.
"Two people were killed by snipers an hour ago in the centre of the town. Their bodies are now at the hospital, which I visited a while ago. Shooting is still going on there (in the city centre) now," he said.

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Reuters reports that the air strikes reported at Misrata hit a base for pro-Gaddafi forces south of the city.

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BBC A Misrata resident tells Reuters that pro-Gaddafi snipers are firing on a hospital and that at least three people have been killed.

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A brief, and expected, update via the Associated Press - Nato commanders have confirmed that the alliance's warships are now patrolling off Libya's coast to enforce the arms embargo.

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AFP Turkey, which has voiced opposition to Nato taking a commanding role in the Libya mission, has offered a submarine and warships to help enforce the arms embargo off the North African country, according to a Nato general cited by AFP.

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News of a renewed assault my Gaddafi loyalists on another rebel-held town, Zintan, about 50 miles south-west of Tripoli. Reuters spoke to a resident:

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Gaddafi's brigades started bombardment from the northern area half an hour ago. The bombardment is taking place now. The town is completely surrounded. The situation is very bad... They are getting reinforcements. Troops backed with tanks and vehicles are coming. We appeal to the allied forces to come and protect civilians.

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Iyad El-Baghdadi writes that Gaddafi’s Zintan reinforcements have been coming from the Faris Brigade, normally stationed in Sabha & the south.

kingturnip posted:

Frankly, it doesn't help that the loudest voices in US media seem (to this foreigner, at least) to be the most frothy-mouthed. Could Obama have made the case more clearly? Probably, but the people who're jumping up and down, screaming that he's being stupid, liberal, war-mongering, Muslim or gay would still be screaming those things anyway, because they're children. And that's what children do - scream until someone pays attention to them.

Narmi posted:

I'm assuming that whenever someone says they're afraid of expansion (in this case), they mean escalation, i.e. sending troops in Libya.

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A group of rebel fighters positioned about 9km from the entrance of Ajdabiya said there were 11 tanks stationed at the town’s east gate, AFP reports. “When we try to advance they shoot at us with heavy weapons — tanks and 14.5 calibre machine guns,” they quote one fighter as saying. “All we have are Kalashnikovs.”

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A doctor in Misrata has told the BBC World Service that there are no pro-Gaddafi tanks in the city today, "because all the tanks have either escaped or been destroyed by the allied forces". But he says the hospital where he works is still surrounded by snipers loyal to Col Gaddafi. "They are shooting anybody going in or coming out of the hospital. Until now we have four civilian dead."

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The Misrata doctor who spoke to the BBC World Service said he was worried that ambulance wokers and doctors were also at risk from snipers. "Our hospital is overcrowded," he added. "We are treating people on the floor. We have stopped counting injured people, we just count the dead. We are dealing something you cannot believe." The doctor said he was in favour of air strikes by the international coalition, "because those [pro-Gaddafi] troops, when they hear the aircraft in the sky, they escape".

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Another doctor in Misrata (see previous entry) has given this account to the BBC. "In the early morning of this day, there were several attempts to enter Misrata from different sides. This time, Gaddafi's troops and mercernaries are following tactics. They're using ordinary civilian cars... and they're using light weapons like AK-47s. Yesterday, me and other eyewitnesses heard the sound of aircraft flying in the sky of Misrata. Right afterwards, we saw an uprising flame of strong explosions - at least 10. These explosions were in the south-west of the city, probably in the Seket area where is the stronghold of Gaddafi troops, but so far no one has managed to confirm the results of these air strikes."

Brown Moses posted:

I'm starting to think that the coalition will have to systematically destroy every Gaddafi, vehicle, aircraft, ammo dump, military base, and camp for the rebels to win this one.

Brown Moses posted:

I'm starting to think that the coalition will have to systematically destroy every Gaddafi, vehicle, aircraft, ammo dump, military base, and camp for the rebels to win this one.

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A Libyan government press trip to inspect some of the damage from bombing raids seems to have hit a snag. CNN correspondent Nic Robertson, in Tripoli, tweets: "Govt officials taking journalists into east Tripoli are lost and can't find the so-called damaged house. Just driving around."

Cartouche posted:

I'm starting to think the rebels realize that we are in this for the long haul, and decided to let the coalition do the work. We cannot exactly take our ball and go home at this point.

I am feeling more and more disgust at this situation.

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@NicRobertsonCNN‎: Govt officials abort trip to find "damaged" civilian house, returned us to the hotel.

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The Telegraph came out of the closet to report:

Scores of ambulances converged on the area, near the central bus station and a city conference hall in a Jewish neighbourhood of Jerusalem. Around 25 people had been wounded, according to medical sources, 15 of them seriously. No deaths were reported.

The explosion appears to be the first bus bombing in the region in several years and comes amid rising tensions between Hamas militants and Israel. Palestinians carried out dozens of bombings in Jerusalem at the height of an uprising that began in 2000, but the city has been quieter recently.

Witnesses said people could be seen lying on the floor covered in blood, and many cars and buses had shattered windows. It was not yet clear whether a suicide bomber was behind the attack.

The entrance to the city has been closed, according to the Haaretz newspaper. It comes after Israeli warplanes launched fresh air strikes in Gaza city in response to a rocket attack from Palestinian militants.

Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, vowed decisive action against militants and suggested that future operations would not be surgical. "No state would tolerate ongoing rocket fire on its cities and its citizens, and the state of Israel obviously will not tolerate it," Mr Netanyahu said in parliament following the latest escalation.

Brown Moses posted:

Finlander posted:

Hmm. I wonder why. I also wonder why "damaged" was in quotes, when "civilian house" would've been a bit more accurate. Or, hell, why not say ""damaged" "civilian" "house""? It's probably not all that damaged, not a civilian building, and probably not even a house.

Nombres posted:

"Damaged civilian house" = Charred Loyalist Tank

Slantedfloors posted:

"Tree Stump that's been beaten with a Sledgehammer"

Korak posted:

^^^ Without even some milk and cookies?! loving Libyans.

Sort of a non sequitur, but then again maybe this is the beginning of another Palestinian uprising.

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The Guardian has been told that text messages are being sent to people in Tripoli, claiming to be from rebels in Benghazi and the east, but actually sent by Gaddafi's regime.

A source in Libya said the texts say the country will be split in two. The texts also threaten that rebels from Benghazi are heading to the west of the country to rape and pillage in Tripoli, with the help of western powers.

Separately, our source claims that state television in Tripoli is showing pictures of dead people which the reports say were killed in the coalition air strikes – however some of the dead have been recognised by viewers as relatives who disappeared during Gaddafi's crackdown on Tripoli.

The Guardian is unable to confirm the source's account at this moment in time.

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In Misrata, eyewitnesses say the polyclinic has been a focus for attacks by pro-Gaddafi forces. One person in the area has told the BBC: "They have managed to surround the polyclinic with snipers... These snipers have taken the high buildings that surround the clinic to shoot... and they're shooting on sight, whoever tries to come in or out of the polyclinic."

Jamsque posted:

If by 'Palestinian uprising' you mean 'Israeli invasion of Gaza' then I think you are dead right.

Brown Moses posted:

Tripoli:
The Guardian has been told that text messages are being sent to people in Tripoli, claiming to be from rebels in Benghazi and the east, but actually sent by Gaddafi's regime.

A source in Libya said the texts say the country will be split in two. The texts also threaten that rebels from Benghazi are heading to the west of the country to rape and pillage in Tripoli, with the help of western powers.

Cartouche posted:

I'm starting to think the rebels realize that we are in this for the long haul, and decided to let the coalition do the work. We cannot exactly take our ball and go home at this point.

I am feeling more and more disgust at this situation.

octoroon posted:

I'm echoing this sentiment. Looks like it's going to drag on for longer than I expected.

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The rebel Libyan interim government is to set up its own independent television station, the Guardian has been told.

The Democratic Libya Information Bureau said the interim government would set up an "independent, free" television station based in Qatar and streaming in Libya.

No more information was immediately available.

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Overnight, the US bombed the wreckage of the F-15 fighter jet which crash-landed near Benghazi, Reuters says, quoting a US official.

froufrougump posted:

How long did you guys expect this operation to last for, days?