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i got into columbia because ??? and getting to just below median was a herculean effort
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Apr 11, 2011 05:49
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evilweasel posted:You're fine, at HLS you don't need to be king grizzly. well, I also asked because I vaguely recalled red bean juice mentioning something about trouble finding employment, but I may be remembering wrong.
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Apr 11, 2011 06:07
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I know there are Harvard students graduating with unemployment, but without grades, what makes someone end up at the bottom of their class?
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Apr 11, 2011 07:01
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Ainsley McTree posted:I know there are Harvard students graduating with unemployment, but without grades, what makes someone end up at the bottom of their class? Lots of low passes.
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Apr 11, 2011 07:07
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Ainsley McTree posted:I know there are Harvard students graduating with unemployment, but without grades, what makes someone end up at the bottom of their class? yeah, the "no grades" thing is sort of a misnomer. any firm that hires a lot of HLS grads know how to convert the HLS system into more conventional grading. only YLS 1L legitimately has no grades.
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Apr 11, 2011 07:19
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Red Bean Juice posted:I just want to add that even if you end up lucky and get into a school beyond your credentials (like me), the effect will be roughly analogous to signing up for an underground rugby league populated entirely by grizzly bears why did no one quote this.
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Apr 11, 2011 07:58
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Baruch Obamawitz and/or resident thread patent examiner guy Did you ever look into the work at home and live overseas option? Did you need to tote your laptpop around and work at the consulate or something? Also, could you please post in this topic when the USPTO is hiring again?
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Apr 11, 2011 09:26
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scribe jones posted:why did no one quote this. These comics always remind me that I should eventually buy an avatar.
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Apr 11, 2011 09:55
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entris posted:A few caveats: I know exactly two lawyers who practice something like international law, and they both got into it the same way - by representing local small businesses which became medium size businesses over the years and began importing products or parts from overseas. There were lots of years of practicing normal Boringlaw before they went international. You typically don't get hired as a new grad to jet off to the pacific rim and handle deals.
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Apr 11, 2011 11:12
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Solomon Grundy posted:You typically don't get hired as a new grad to jet off to the pacific rim and handle deals. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5jNnDMfxA
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Apr 11, 2011 13:12
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MEET ME BY DUCKS posted:you go to HLS, right? I feel like I'm in a comparable situation with regard to getting in to HLS beyond my credentials. I'm guessing my worries are well founded? any elaboration would be helpful. I don't want to be eaten alive by grizzly bears To be fair, I think the public interest side has it worse. My one 3L friend who worked at the FTC last summer and seems pretty on top of things still doesn't have a job even now. I'm pretty afraid of ending up in the same boat, since I got killed at EIP (no callbacks, even from my safeties) and will be doing state government my 2L summer. As for what happened at EIP, it's hard to say because--stop me if you've heard this before--I did everything I was supposed to. OCS podcasts, OCS-appointed headhunters, job search books, reading the latest news on each employer the morning of, that sort of thing. I can only speculate that employers were driven off by a confluence of A) straight P's, and B) my resume "looking like an academic's" (something I was told in the Quinn Emanuel hospitality suite), and C) my face being dumb. But then, I have a 1L friend who actually has pretty good grades and didn't have his summer lined up until literally last week (and needless to say, it's no firm job), so consider that as well. I mean, don't get me wrong, there are plenty of people here doing amazing things, but I get the feeling they're the type who would be leading the free world, HLS or no HLS. So where does that leave the rest of us? Well, the HLS brand is a weighty one. My wild speculation is it carries with it two main presumptions--that you're smart, and that you're a pompous East-Coast elitist rear end in a top hat. So when an employer sees your transcript and decides that maybe you're not actually that smart, what does that leave you with? MEET ME BY DUCKS posted:yeah, the "no grades" thing is sort of a misnomer. any firm that hires a lot of HLS grads know how to convert the HLS system into more conventional grading. only YLS 1L legitimately has no grades. The P/H dichotomy (because that's what it is) literally maps perfectly onto the B+/A- dichotomy from undergrad
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Apr 11, 2011 13:58
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Four Seat posted:I also need help choosing a law school. Yes, I know going to law school is a horrible decision, but it's one I've already made. My choices are: one page before you posted, I posted a condensed version of this as a troll that is how bad your idea is
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Apr 11, 2011 14:16
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nm posted:Starting a fulltime, paid job tommorow. Congrats. Does anyone have any experience setting up business email. Is the Yahoo domain name and business email service ok?
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Apr 11, 2011 14:18
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I know I'm quoted on the first page as rethinking the whole law school thing, which is totally fair as I haven't posted in this thread in a few years, but I ended up going to GW Law. I'm just about to finish my 2L year, and I wanted to comment on the job situation and ask a question. Jobs: I have a couple friends with biglaw summer jobs, a larger number of friends going to government, a few friends who are doing nonprofit/small firm things, and a number of friends who are 3Ls and literally have no job. It's not all roses, but it's not THAT bad, and I'm not even in the T14. One thing that I've done is find a (relatively) narrow niche and pursue that; I did 2 small-firm internships last summer, some pro bono volunteering and a clinic this year, all of which are in my field. More importantly, I've gone to a lot of networking events in that field, met a lot of ALJs, private & gov't attorneys that appreciate my level of interest in their field. Almost all of what I've been able to do has been through networking. I don't think I can overstate the importance of networking. If you are socially retarded, nobody is going to want to work with you and you won't get a job. Even if you're an introvert like me, you have to suck it up, smile at people, be interested in what they have to say, and be ready to tell them about yourself. I'm probably in the bottom half of my class, but I got a federal gov't offer for this summer because I accumulated a lot of specialized experience after 1L year, knew what I was talking about at my interview, and was a sociable person who introduced myself to people. I still tell people not to go to law school and cite everything from the OP at them, but if you're going to go to law school anyway, you need to have some strategy for positioning yourself to start a career. You can't just do classes and OCI, unless you're at the top of your 1L class. My question for people is this: Does anyone have experience with security clearances for summer legal internships? I'm concerned because I turned in some fingerprint cards and a basic form a couple weeks ago, but I've heard stories about it taking forever in some cases. My concern stems from the fact that despite getting a summer job I really want, my clearance might not go through in time. I can't take another job, because I've already accepted the gov't one, and so I'm a little stuck. Any suggestions?
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Apr 11, 2011 14:23
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MEET ME BY DUCKS posted:yeah, the "no grades" thing is sort of a misnomer. any firm that hires a lot of HLS grads know how to convert the HLS system into more conventional grading. only YLS 1L legitimately has no grades. First semester of 1L. Second semester is on the H/P/LP scale that you guys aped from us, though we don't have any hidden curves or grade point averages. 
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Apr 11, 2011 14:27
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Four Seat posted:I've been told that it's common for students to change what area of law they want to concentrate on, but given that I was an international business major for my undergrad, I am pretty sure I want to stay international. Is AU worth the quarter of a million in debt? If not, is Hofstra's better ranking worth giving up New England's better international options? You can look to everyone else to tell you how Int'l Law is not a real field, just like there aren't any jobs for being a "Constitutional Lawyer." But have you considered trying to get a job at a multinational organization in DC or NY? You have a decent undergraduate GPA, and while you're working you can study for, and retake the LSAT. You could also probably get into a part-time program at a school better than any of those you listed. You're also probably going to be a lot happier if you get into a MA program for some "international" field than going to Law School. But if you're really set on law, at least get some work experience while you try to get into a better school--the only people I know who are actually doing "international" stuff (and there are only a couple) are people who had experience doing that kind of work before they came to law school.
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Apr 11, 2011 14:34
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euphronius posted:Does anyone have any experience setting up business email. Is the Yahoo domain name and business email service ok?
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Apr 11, 2011 14:36
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evil_bunnY posted:Use google apps. Thanks. That is a pretty good service. PS Don't go to law school. euphronius fucked around with this message at 15:40 on Apr 11, 2011 |
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Apr 11, 2011 15:11
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Kinuven posted:My concern stems from the fact that despite getting a summer job I really want, my clearance might not go through in time. What level of security clearance do you need?
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Apr 11, 2011 16:36
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i81icu812 posted:Baruch Obamawitz and/or resident thread patent examiner guy Yes, I did ask, and they don't take the question seriously. There is at least one guy who lives in Canada and rents and office in America and drives across the border every morning. I don't think they've gotten rid of the 50-mile agreement yet, so you still have to come in twice a month if you're living outside 50 miles from the campus, I think.
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Apr 11, 2011 17:19
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Kinuven posted:I turned in some fingerprint cards and a basic form a couple weeks ago... Just out of curiosity, where did you go to get your fingerprints taken? I'm in DC and I need to have some fingerprint cards filled out.
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Apr 11, 2011 17:40
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HiddenReplaced posted:Just out of curiosity, where did you go to get your fingerprints taken? I'm in DC and I need to have some fingerprint cards filled out. I went down to Judiciary Square, the police have an office there that does fingerprinting. I can't find anything about it on their website, however.
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Apr 11, 2011 17:49
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TheMadMilkman posted:What level of security clearance do you need? The "I knew I shouldn't have smoked weed in college" level is reserved for working for the FBI and stuff like that. The "I have never murdered a kitty cat and I'm sane" level is used for just about all other federal jobs.
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Apr 11, 2011 18:24
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Red Bean Juice posted:To be fair, I think the public interest side has it worse. My one 3L friend who worked at the FTC last summer and seems pretty on top of things still doesn't have a job even now. I'm pretty afraid of ending up in the same boat, since I got killed at EIP (no callbacks, even from my safeties) and will be doing state government my 2L summer. Thanks for the advice. I'm not that smart and I'm not a pompous East Coast elitist rear end in a top hat, so it sounds like we're in about the same boat. It sounds like you did everything right and they just didn't like your resume (I also have a bit of a weird resume), but would you have any suggestions if you had to do it over? Anything you would have done differently? Secondly, I'm headed to the ASW this weekend, is there anything you'd recommend specifically checking out?
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Apr 11, 2011 19:02
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entris posted:I went down to Judiciary Square, the police have an office there that does fingerprinting. I can't find anything about it on their website, however. Could tell me specifically where you went? I just called a few numbers and got the run around.
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Apr 11, 2011 19:25
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HiddenReplaced posted:Could tell me specifically where you went? I just called a few numbers and got the run around. I went to: Henry J. Daly Building MPDC Headquarters 300 Indiana Avenue, NW, Room 3055 Washington, DC 20001 (202) 727-4245 Try calling that number and telling them you need a fingerprint card. They should be able to connect you.
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Apr 11, 2011 19:47
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entris posted:I went to: Thanks!
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Apr 11, 2011 20:31
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Ugh, I got no grant aid from Columbia, and I am starting to re-think this whole decision to go to law school. I guess I'm not I'm worth a dime in need or merit-based aid and they think I should be in a quarter million dollars of debt.  On the upside, I'm pretty sure I want to do patent prosecution since I met with one of the patent counsel in the biotech company I work for, and it sounds awesome. The hours aren't as bad as litigation, and you get to really understand the science. She said the legal market is terrible, the the market for patent attorneys with graduate degrees in science and engineering degrees is still pretty good (although certainly not as good as before).
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Apr 11, 2011 21:39
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MEET ME BY DUCKS posted:Thanks for the advice. I'm not that smart and I'm not a pompous East Coast elitist rear end in a top hat, so it sounds like we're in about the same boat. It sounds like you did everything right and they just didn't like your resume (I also have a bit of a weird resume), but would you have any suggestions if you had to do it over? Anything you would have done differently? As to your first question, the big thing would probably be to lowball your EIP bids. Take more safeties than you think you need, use the add/drop period if necessary, don't worry too hard about the V10 or even the V50. Another thing is interview practice--I had two formal mocks over the summer, random networking, and some practice in front of the mirror, and while I think all my interviews went well in the sense that they were fairly cordial and I was never caught unprepared, I realize that OCI interviewers are always cordial regardless of whether they're actually interested. Regarding your second question, I'm actually of the opinion that you'll have time to familiarize yourself with hangouts around campus (and most of them aren't that amazing.) For my ASW, I went to Wonder Bar in Allston with some friends from town. That's far enough out that girls will be impressed by the HLS name.
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Apr 11, 2011 21:49
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Colorblind Pilot posted:Ugh, I got no grant aid from Columbia, and I am starting to re-think this whole decision to go to law school. I guess I'm not I'm worth a dime in need or merit-based aid and they think I should be in a quarter million dollars of debt.
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Apr 11, 2011 23:06
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I have been working a lot lately but I just skimmed this thread and felt the need to jump in and tell Four Seats that he is a loving moron as well and literally one of the dumbest people I know went to Seton Hall and the best he could do after finishing near the top of their class was getting a clerical job at an insurance litigation firm.
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Apr 12, 2011 04:03
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To the guy even considering Seton Hall: There are three law schools in New Jersey - the two Rutgers schools and Seton Hall. All three of them are roughly equally terrible. You will not get a job graduating from any of them. You are retarded to consider going to any of the three. However, Seton Hall is roughly twice as expensive as either Rutgers school, meaning that for an equally worthless degree, you will spend twice as much money. That makes you twice as retarded as the average student considering Rutgers. Seriously - Seton Hall is 22 grand a semester, Rutgers-Camden in-state tuition is 21 grand a YEAR. Rutgers is ranked #84, Seton Hall is #61. You will be equally unemployed with a degree from either, but in twice as much debt at Seton Hall. If you are not in-state, why are you even considering a NJ school? Newark is a shithole and there are terrible law schools in far better places to live that will graduate you with less debt and an equally terrible law degree.
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Apr 12, 2011 05:41
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NJ Deac posted:To the guy even considering Seton Hall: Anyone considering Seton Hall should be required to read the Big Debt Small Law Archive . Consider the passion and venom this grad used to generate such hilarious posts before taking out those Seton Hall loans.
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Apr 12, 2011 14:18
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For all of you lawgoons in the know about such things, anyone care to share any incites about Moot Court versus Journal or Mock Trial? Do these activities really make a difference come job search time or is it simply important just to be on one of them? Also, if participating on one of these teams would prevent participation in various clinics, which would you choose?
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Apr 12, 2011 20:13
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Journal varies from school to school but at Columbia it's basically standard: I assume any employer who knew Columbia and noticed you weren't on one would assume you were sort of a slacker. A moot court is required, though many people do the default one that isn't a real moot court.
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Apr 12, 2011 20:18
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beefnchedda posted:For all of you lawgoons in the know about such things, anyone care to share any incites about Moot Court versus Journal or Mock Trial? I can't speak to the effect they have, but in terms of time commitment, the Memento rule applies: they are loving liars and do not trust them. Take whatever weekly commitment they claim to expect and double, if not triple, it. Oral arguments on Thursday. Seriously considering winging it and just screaming "Citizens United, bitches! Everything is speech! We win, suck my balls!"
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Apr 12, 2011 20:25
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beefnchedda posted:For all of you lawgoons in the know about such things, anyone care to share any incites about Moot Court versus Journal or Mock Trial?
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Apr 12, 2011 20:29
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beefnchedda posted:For all of you lawgoons in the know about such things, anyone care to share any incites about Moot Court versus Journal or Mock Trial? Conventional wisdom is that you choose the activity based on what your target job is. Mock trial = litigation, criminal prosecution/defense; Moot Court = appellate work; journals = clerkship. I don't know that it actually matters all that much, in terms of landing a job. The learned skills could be valuable regardless. I did Law Review, worked for a state supreme court justice, then went on to do policy/legislative work. So the research and writing skills were certainly beneficial.
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Apr 12, 2011 20:46
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beefnchedda posted:For all of you lawgoons in the know about such things, anyone care to share any incites about Moot Court versus Journal or Mock Trial? If it is a specialized journal there is a nuance to it and it depend on your goals, the journal, the school and so on.
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Apr 12, 2011 21:07
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beefnchedda posted:For all of you lawgoons in the know about such things, anyone care to share any incites about Moot Court versus Journal or Mock Trial? Anything is basically just showing that you aren't lazy. I was lazy.
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Apr 12, 2011 21:25
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