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scribe jones posted:http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vs4a <-- in which I keep getting passed good cards and then lose all the games anyway. p1p1 Honestly, I think Gideon's Lawkeeper is the best card in the pack, but even if you want to go R/B Sengir is clearly the pick. p1p6 Bloodrage Vampire is pretty so-so, I'd rather have the Giant. p1p8 Tunneler is basically never good, Brink can at least kill something. p1p9 Visage is never playable, three of the green cards are good. p2p1 Did you miss the Incinerate? (It would have been nice to have that Lawkeeper.) p2p4 Minotaurs is much better than the dumb Bat. p2p5 Deathmark over four quality maindeck cards is pretty questionable, especially with how mediocre green is. p2p9 Mind Rot is good. p3p2 Visage remains horrible, Lava Axe is pretty decent. p3p5 Child of Night is strictly better.
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Aug 18, 2011 08:34
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Bonebreaker Giant might be the most galling, awful P1P1 I've ever seen in my life. Optimistically it is about the 5th best card in the pack. It is clearly worse than Sengir, Lawkeeper, Drake, and Child of Night. Legitimately, you could wheel it from the pack if people around you are in things like UW Fliers. What the hell is the point in taking a do-nothing body that is decently priced but hardly absurd when Sengir Vampires, one of the all-time great limited 5-drops, is available?
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Aug 18, 2011 09:24
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Daunte Vicknabb posted:Bonebreaker Giant might be the most galling, awful P1P1 I've ever seen in my life. Optimistically it is about the 5th best card in the pack. It is clearly worse than Sengir, Lawkeeper, Drake, and Child of Night. Legitimately, you could wheel it from the pack if people around you are in things like UW Fliers. What the hell is the point in taking a do-nothing body that is decently priced but hardly absurd when Sengir Vampires, one of the all-time great limited 5-drops, is available? I'd definitely prefer Bonebreaker to Child of Night, since red is so much better than black. Maybe even to Chasm Drake, as I always seem to end up with about 8 five-drops when I'm in U.
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Aug 18, 2011 09:33
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Nehru the Damaja posted:You're passing so many good cards from the word "go" because of your preference for red/black. Bloodthirst is a powerful archetype but I don't think you can go in just trying to force it. Mornacale posted:p1p1 Honestly, I think Gideon's Lawkeeper is the best card in the pack, but even if you want to go R/B Sengir is clearly the pick. Daunte Vicknabb posted:Bonebreaker Giant might be the most galling, awful P1P1 I've ever seen in my life. Optimistically it is about the 5th best card in the pack. It is clearly worse than Sengir, Lawkeeper, Drake, and Child of Night. Legitimately, you could wheel it from the pack if people around you are in things like UW Fliers. What the hell is the point in taking a do-nothing body that is decently priced but hardly absurd when Sengir Vampires, one of the all-time great limited 5-drops, is available? @nehru, reconsidering bloodthirst makes sense--I was stuck on "RED/BLACK MANS -> BLOOD THIRST -> DO THING" without really considering what cards would allow me to get there. I lucked out pretty good getting the tormented soul p3 but it wasn't enough.
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Aug 18, 2011 13:51
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Yeah, I'd probably go with Lawkeeper in p1p1 also. I only bring up the vamp just because if you're going to force red/black it's clearly better. I think people here at least undervalue the vamp slightly in that a 4/4 flyer is automatically good and while his ability is almost never used, it can change the dynamic of a race. But I'd still pass it on because I imagine most other players probably overvalue the guy which would be a good way to make sure a lot more white comes your way in pack 2. Nehru the Damaja fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Aug 18, 2011 |
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Aug 18, 2011 14:21
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scribe jones posted:http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vs4a <-- in which I keep getting passed good cards and then lose all the games anyway. P1P1 Gideon's Lawkeeper or Sengir Vampire here. The former if you feel like trying out a control deck, the latter if you want to just take the most powerful thing in the pack and are okay with going BR bloodthirst or something. P1P2 Aven Fleetwing or Stormfront Pegasus if you went with the Lawkeeper, Volcanic Dragon if you went with the Vampire. P1P5 Even if you're in red I still don't like Lava Axe. Grab the spider incase you go green. P1P9 You will never play this card. Grab the Rhino, green is wide open. After seeing pack 1, with my picks I would've been well on my way to a WU skies deck, with an eye for picking up another Lawkeeper + some counter magic to go control if possible/a good bomb comes along. P2P1 ... annnnd here comes the white. But if you're still set on BR you should probably have taken the Incinerate here. P2P4 Tormented Soul is a great enabler and you are lacking. Not many chances left to get a Fireslinger or Tormented. P2P8 Seriously not going green? P2P9 You will never play this card. P3P2 You will never play this card. P3P3 You will never play this card. You could've had a great UW deck if you had gone that route (though can't say for sure as other people's choices would've potentially changed what you saw in pack 2). As your decisions went, you should've probably been in BG and had a pretty sweet deck-- your red was crap and forced. Look how much good green came around in pack 3 after you passed on a few solid green cards earlier for cards you will never even sideboard. While sometimes locking in on an archetype pays off, you have to at least have your foot in the door to be worth it. After pack 1, Volcanic Dragon is the only strong red card you have (shock could be splashed easily if you picked up another one later). Pack 2 saw 1 red card. Pack 3 saw a bear. This was pretty bad.
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Aug 18, 2011 14:36
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Green is almost always wide open because it's the weakest color.
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Aug 18, 2011 14:40
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DariusLikewise posted:Probably the last one I'm going to post because I think I might be getting the hang of drafting, for M12 at least... P1P4 I think I would've taken the bear. Counter magic can be picked up pretty easily later on and having a body on the board never hurts. P1P10 I don't think I've seen someone play this card yet. Probably would hate out the Dark Favors (it usually is harmless and sets up the 2for1, but if it finds its way onto a Fleetwing you can be properly hosed) P2P3 While Stave Off does have uses offensively and defensively, I'm not sure if I would take it over Alabaster. If you get that mage out with anything with a fat rear end you can more or less discourage anyone from attacking you and you have set out on a pretty controlling deck. Granted, once they see the Stave Off game 1, they will think twice whenever you have cards in hand and a plains open. P2P9 Hate the Combust P2P10 Hate the Barbs P3P2 Need to look back on this pick at the end and see how many creatures you have. Looter and Pegasus are both solid picks, but you do lack hard counters currently. Next few picks are counter magic frenzy, whoa. P3P10 Pretty sure you have enough bodies, but I don't think you've picked up any enchantment removal. Wouldn't hurt to have one for the sideboard incase you come up against Trollhide or Angelic and don't have to jump through hoops with bouncing it and then countering it. Yeah, great job. All different picks are a matter of preference and strategy and were matters of discussion, not clear picks. Dross posted:Green is almost always wide open because it's the weakest color. Yes, but in this case he took useless cards over taking a few solid Green cards, and as posted by someone in the past few days (might have been in the other thread)- green may be the weakest, but its also deep and very easy to get into late if no one is drafting it. Bears/Rhinos/Spiders/Basilisk all can go quite late and you can definitely pick green up as a second color in pack 3 if you've already got an Overrun, know its open, and are currently mono black.
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Aug 18, 2011 14:53
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Also I just want to say that being the weakest color is only really important when you start drafting. Even if it's the weakest theoretically, if you're getting worse cards in other colors passed to you it's still better Also I just slammed a Garruk, raredraft incoming. http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vmqm http://i54.tinypic.com/2cibs7a.png Wezlar fucked around with this message at 21:02 on Aug 18, 2011 |
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Aug 18, 2011 20:41
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Wezlar posted:Also I just want to say that being the weakest color is only really important when you start drafting. Even if it's the weakest theoretically, if you're getting worse cards in other colors passed to you it's still better I think you should consider manacurve more. Green makes you liable to have a zillion 5 mana fatties by default, don't give up good playables for them or you will die with a full hand every time. Also you need more respect for the 3/1 Drake.
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Aug 18, 2011 21:52
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Can someone tell me how I can upload my drafts after I turn on the option in the MTGO client? Because I am poo poo and I am extremely frustrated. I watch all draft videos, I read all draft articles, I draft simulate, but I am still poo poo. I do swiss drafts, i'm still poo poo. I don't know what i'm doing wrong and my last hope is for people here to point it out please edit: Wait I figured it out. This is from my last three drafts: http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vmqp http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vkea http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vkeb Big Sal Graziano fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Aug 18, 2011 |
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Aug 18, 2011 21:55
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Wezlar posted:Also I just want to say that being the weakest color is only really important when you start drafting. Even if it's the weakest theoretically, if you're getting worse cards in other colors passed to you it's still better I think you're sitting on a pretty great deck and it wouldn't surprise me if you kicked rear end but if you're going GB I have no idea why you continue to pass over great flyers -- but especially Aven Fleetwing since you'll be stocking up on Trollhides. It'd also make a strong case for grabbing at least one of the Hunter's Insights that went by you. You've got a Planeswalker that shits monsters everywhere and the ability to have him trigger Overrun or to just cast one from the hand. I think it's absolutely worth giving up a card to be able to windmill slam either of those cards as soon as it pays off.
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Aug 18, 2011 21:57
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Wezlar posted:Also I just want to say that being the weakest color is only really important when you start drafting. Even if it's the weakest theoretically, if you're getting worse cards in other colors passed to you it's still better A little topheavy, but that comes with UG. I think the only differences I would've taken would have been taking the Fleetwing over the Divination early, and the Skyriders late over extra Unsummons. Very nice.
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Aug 18, 2011 22:01
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http://www.raredraft.com/watch?d=2vafh 3-0'd and got a foil dual I can possibly get 2 tickets out of because it's U/B. It wheeled so why not.
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Aug 19, 2011 00:27
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Big Sal Graziano posted:Can someone tell me how I can upload my drafts after I turn on the option in the MTGO client? Because I am poo poo and I am extremely frustrated. I watch all draft videos, I read all draft articles, I draft simulate, but I am still poo poo. I do swiss drafts, i'm still poo poo. I don't know what i'm doing wrong and my last hope is for people here to point it out please You have got to make a decision to stick to your decisions. The first draft was 4 colors in the first 16 picks. It's one thing to think about switching due to bomb-crack with you haven't picked a second color yet, but you're already bouncing between three of them. It's not like the NBA Draft where you take the best available person regardless of your needs. Second draft is the same thing, you're four cards into a U/R plan and here's Gorehorn Minotaurs staring you in the face and you grab Angel. p2p9 (you're still in three colors) and you pass up Mastodon and Arsonist for a card that benefits ONLY white creatures. Draft three you made a plan and stuck to it but unfortunately your plan involved Green.
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Aug 19, 2011 00:41
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Mob posted:Draft three you made a plan and stuck to it but unfortunately your plan involved Green. p1p8 taste of blood  like I am obviously not good (cf. the draft I posted earlier) but that card is not playable, at all
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Aug 19, 2011 01:35
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Earlier today I did my first M12 Swiss since basically the day of release, P1P1 I passed a bunch of the usual removal suspects to take Druidic Satchel because I think it's an amazing card and I wanted the opportunity to play with it. I then got passed Call to the Grave which has awesome synergy w/ Satchel, and then somehow a 3rd or 4th pick Rune-Scarred Demon. Needless to say I was well on the way to crushing the draft, and then my Pack 2 and Pack 3 were almost identical print runs. The rare? Sorin's Vengeance. 2x Sorin's Vengeance is really, really, really absurd. Just now I had the opposite thing happen: P1P1 Arachnus Spinner, forced green extremely hard, and still didn't see a single Web despite grabbing extremely late spiders and growths and such. I feel like complaining about it but I think anyone who opens two Sorin's Vengeance when they are already in Black has little to no ground for complaining.
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Aug 19, 2011 03:34
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Count posted:I think you should consider manacurve more. Green makes you liable to have a zillion 5 mana fatties by default, don't give up good playables for them or you will die with a full hand every time. Also you need more respect for the 3/1 Drake. I like the 3/1 drake but I was wary of it because I wanted to be playing fatties/garruk and it can't block on the ground. Still it might have been the better call. Nehru the Damaja posted:
zerox147o posted:
Again yeah, probably the right calls. Unsummons were basically never what I wanted. I ended up going 1-2, at least I got 11 tix for Garruk I guess haha. I found that I could stall out the games a ton but against decks with removal I couldn't really do anything. Also I had a nuts jade mage draw that just got completely hosed by double blood seeker. Oh well 
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Aug 19, 2011 03:48
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Wezlar posted:I like the 3/1 drake but I was wary of it because I wanted to be playing fatties/garruk and it can't block on the ground. Still it might have been the better call. You don't want to be blocking with a 3/1 flyer anyway. That thing is a glass cannon going over the top as a clock while your fatties clog up the ground. Hunters Insight is amazing. Card draw in G can get ridiculous. Fleetwing is one of the best blue commons and gives people headaches all day, even more so if you have any enchantments or a greatsword. M12 is very, very fast. Don't underestimate bears in this format-- having a steady supply of plays is necessary to make it to your bomb(s)! Your 2/3cc slot should be heavy. Don't be afraid to trade bodies and save your removal for mages, fireslingers, looters, etc.
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Aug 19, 2011 03:56
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I appreciate the tips! Thank you!
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Aug 19, 2011 04:48
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New draft video: http://www.youtube.com/luluscards#p/c/FCC0AA8C4D78CD6C
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Aug 19, 2011 05:36
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I have to say, loading up Channel Fireball just to see another one and out by Ochoa somehow warms my heart. I must be a terrible person.
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Aug 19, 2011 05:40
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Monitor posted:I have to say, loading up Channel Fireball just to see another one and out by Ochoa somehow warms my heart. I must be a terrible person. I think he posts them on purpose, just to troll the watchers. During his last Scars block draft there were multiple people commenting on how he beat them in the finals of a different draft, but he just puts the 0-1 ones on the website.
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Aug 19, 2011 06:22
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Aven Fleetwing is probably the most important blue common in U/G and U/B (though obviously Adept and Looter both have more raw power).
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Aug 19, 2011 06:35
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Edit: Never mind.
CharlieFoxtrot fucked around with this message at 08:51 on Aug 19, 2011 |
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Aug 19, 2011 08:42
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M12 is such a lame format. I dropped roughly 150 rating when it came out, and I still haven't recovered half that after about 30 drafts. Every single draft a round is decided by missing a couple land drops, getting flooded, or getting color screwed. The tempo is just way too unforgiving. Scars block was soooo much better because you didn't just up and die to a curve out. And then there's hexproof. Don't even get me started on hexproof. I just finished a draft where I lost in the 2nd round with a doomblade and 3 incinerates in hand because I was getting beat down by loving aven fleetwings and a greatsword. And that's my 3rd 2nd round defeat in a row, the other two were lost to land screw. I'm so tilted right now if you can't tell.
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Aug 19, 2011 10:00
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Calantus posted:M12 is such a lame format. I dropped roughly 150 rating when it came out, and I still haven't recovered half that after about 30 drafts. Every single draft a round is decided by missing a couple land drops, getting flooded, or getting color screwed. The tempo is just way too unforgiving. Scars block was soooo much better because you didn't just up and die to a curve out. And then there's hexproof. Don't even get me started on hexproof. I just finished a draft where I lost in the 2nd round with a doomblade and 3 incinerates in hand because I was getting beat down by loving aven fleetwings and a greatsword. And that's my 3rd 2nd round defeat in a row, the other two were lost to land screw. Post raredrafts + decklists? Though Fleetwing is pretty much one of the toughest cards for BR to take care of. I think it may be my favorite blue common, that or Aether Adept. Scars block was really, really weird to draft for the whole colorless/phyrexian mana poo poo. Also, quite slow- my heaviest slot was usually the 3-4 drop as opposed to M12's 2 drop.
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Aug 19, 2011 14:14
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I'll probably post a raredraft sometime but I was mostly just ranting after going on tilt. :P
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Aug 19, 2011 15:17
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Calantus posted:I'll probably post a raredraft sometime but I was mostly just ranting after going on tilt. :P
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Aug 19, 2011 15:26
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M12 draft is a nice balance between Zendikar (where your bombs often didn't matter because the format was so fast) and M10/11, where games could slow down often and turn into "who has the better bombs and/or removal?" also unless that is literally the the first M12 draft Ochoa ever did he has got to be trolling us. I think its actually the former, since the black 2/1 flier isn't even the 2nd best card in the pack and theres so many other good cards in the pick 2 that its absurd.
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Aug 19, 2011 16:14
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The format is definitely interesting. It's an aggressive format, but control is very viable, you just have to be careful with your build. Having a curve is very important; you need to be able to drop some bears and make some trades. If you wait until turn 4 or 5 to drop a dude, your opponent is just going to kill it and swing lethal. Child of Night is very strong in this format. Alabaster Mage is way better than people give it credit. I've certainly been blown out by hexproof / Trollhide shenanigans, but typically those decks are terrible, and if they don't draw hexproof dudes + auras in just the right order and ratio, they end up getting destroyed or unable to race you pretty fast. It sucks to lose to a couple good draws from a deck like that, but hey, what's Magic with out some variance?
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Aug 19, 2011 16:17
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Danimo posted:also unless that is literally the the first M12 draft Ochoa ever did he has got to be trolling us. I think its actually the former, since the black 2/1 flier isn't even the 2nd best card in the pack and theres so many other good cards in the pick 2 that its absurd. *opens Jade Mage, picks Devouring Swarm* "I think I'd play green if I got some good cards in it" *gets passed Overrun (and Web and Minotaurs and Ogre and Abolisher and Reinforcements)* ... *picks Duskhunter Bat*
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Aug 19, 2011 18:47
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I think Duskhunter Bat is incredibly overrated. It's not bad or anything, but people seem to see Bloodthirst! and Flying! and their brains go "it's amazing!" when in fact you're reasonably lucky for it to be as good as Pegasus.
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Aug 19, 2011 19:51
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It is still an early drop that can at least deal with Pegasus, so there is that.
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Aug 19, 2011 20:07
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Mornacale posted:I think Duskhunter Bat is incredibly overrated. It's not bad or anything, but people seem to see Bloodthirst! and Flying! and their brains go "it's amazing!" when in fact you're reasonably lucky for it to be as good as Pegasus. Its value depends on what colors you're in. BR, while a great archetype, has very very few flyers. Volcanic Dragon, Devouring Swarm, Drifting Shade, and Duskhunter. Expensive, gimmick, 3 mana pegasus, bloodthirst. Not strong pickings. If you've got some Tormented Souls/Fireslingers and are already in BR, I'd say Duskhunter earns its rating. Otherwise, meh.
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Aug 19, 2011 20:13
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p3p2 (passing fireball for... a third duskhunter bat!) is one of the worst moves I've ever seen in a recorded draft.
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Aug 19, 2011 20:57
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tgijsola posted:p3p2 (passing fireball for... a third duskhunter bat!) is one of the worst moves I've ever seen in a recorded draft. I have a rule of only ever passing Fireball for complete bomb rares in my colors. That said, think long and hard before passing XR spells.
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Aug 19, 2011 21:34
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ScarletBrother posted:I have a rule of only ever passing Fireball for complete bomb rares in my colors. That said, think long and hard before passing XR spells. I recently got passed 4th pick a pack with Fireball + foil Fireball. e; Obviously, I took Jace's Erasure.
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Aug 19, 2011 21:41
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zerox147o posted:I recently got passed 4th pick a pack with Fireball + foil Fireball. So the real question was whether you took the foil one for shinies(!) or the non-foil one for strategery reasons.
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Aug 19, 2011 22:07
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Ackward. What's the pick and why?
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Aug 19, 2011 22:22
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