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Yeah I have no problem with some indicator that I'm about to die but Brutal Doom's actually makes it hard to see. e: Dissolution of Eternity is pretty decent so far. both of these expansions are drat good
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Aug 20, 2011 05:55
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Yodzilla posted:Yeah I have no problem with some indicator that I'm about to die but Brutal Doom's actually makes it hard to see. Don't play Real Guns Hardcore then, it transports the strawberry jelly blood effect from Modern Warfare 2 over. 
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Aug 20, 2011 07:04
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Man these Quake expansions really have problems with key events not triggering and doors not opening. I don't remember this ever being a problem with the regular game so I wonder if it's just the mission pack developers not being as familiar with the engine.
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Aug 20, 2011 15:05
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treat posted:As much as I hate regenerating health, I think I hate intrusive bleeding screen effects more. I really hope the next version of Brutal Doom gives players the option of disabling them. I actually like the reloading mechanic for the shotgun but I also would like to see an option to turn it off.
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Aug 20, 2011 15:30
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Yodzilla posted:Yeah I have no problem with some indicator that I'm about to die but Brutal Doom's actually makes it hard to see. It wouldn't be a problem if they reduced it to maybe 1/3 of its current opacity. Same with the monster-blood splattering on your visor effect. Bardeh posted:Thanks for that. I think I might have to give that regenerating health module for Brutal Doom a try, I've got 4 health at the start of this level and it's a bitch with the hitscan enemies. It really does help. It only regenerates you to the point where you can soak up a couple of bullets, anyway, but that's the point. It actually gives you a chance to fight your way out of a mess rather than just being completely hosed. Dominic White fucked around with this message at 15:35 on Aug 20, 2011 |
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Aug 20, 2011 15:32
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What do you guys think of Shadow Warrior? I mean past all of the obnoxious racism and all that. This is probably the one "big" shooter I didn't play as a young person, so it is the one I'm least familiar with. I'm playing it with the HRP on SWP, and the redone textures look fantastic. The models are awful, so disabling them is a really good thing. The original sprites are great looking so gently caress those terrible 3-d models. Anyway, so far I've only played through the shareware episode and have noticed a few things that set it apart from Duke and Blood, blood being my favorite of the build engine games: THE BAD 1) the really, really, really awful humor. This is kind of a precursor to Duke Forever's offensive-to-the-point-of-distracting stuff. 2) the levels - Duke had lots of good, some great ones. Blood had a really solid structure to the levels, and some cool setpieces, like the train and the boats. SW seems to have a problem in being a sort of luminary game right between 2.5d and 3d that makes it very uncomfortable with itself. The levels are thematically unconnected as far as I've seen, and many of them trail on for far too long. Also, there's a lot of nonsense areas, such as the construction site where I wandered around lost for at least twenty minutes. 3) magic hit weapons on enemies - jesus christ this is frustrating THE GOOD 1) Lo Wang's weapons are cool as all hell. The Riot Gun is too slow firing and so kind of sucks, but the rest are just hilariously fun to use. I find myself going back to the katana though, just because it is so satisfying to hack up a room of guys. Also his fists are great too - lots of damage AND makes enemies fly backwards? Hell yes. The only thing is that the melee weapons are so powerful that the ranged ones (minus the missle launcher) feel pretty underwhelming as far as damage goes 2) Enemy design - awesome. The grunts look cool, the ghosts that come out of the suicide guys are cool looking, and they just get better as the episode goes. The detail on them is incredible. 3) Some really great setpieces. I'm thinking of the first level when you blow into the train station or whatever it is, and just start rampaging on the grunts in that final area. Also, the construction site when you first enter and wreck poo poo, although the level quickly goes south. Again, I can't comment on the second episode yet, but I'm looking forward to it although this is by far my least favorite of the main Build games.
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Aug 20, 2011 15:33
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Yeah that sounds pretty spot on in regards to Shadow Warrior, though I haven't played it in years. What mod is this that you're using? I might have to check it out.
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Aug 20, 2011 15:43
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ddraigcymraeg posted:Hehe, yeah I am reading the thread. You can skip past MAP26 by going to the console and typing in 'MAP MAP27', you'll keep online scoring, but your wad score will go back to 0 (this is to stop cheating by simply warping back a level with your score intact etc..). You'll need to just get through it to keep your wad score, unfortunately. Take a look on the automap. http://doom.wikia.com/wiki/MAP20:_Misri_Halek_%28Alien_Vendetta%29 I actually liked this map, it was very pretty and challenging, but it just went on for too long and it kinda slows down to a crawl by the end. Space Kablooey fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Aug 20, 2011 |
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Aug 20, 2011 17:30
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So I got fed up with Dissolution of Eternity and moved on to Quake 2 and I gotta say, stock Quake 2 is loving laughable. I guess since it tries to be more realistic than Quake 1 it ends up dating itself all the more. And the starting pistol has got to be one of the worst weapons in FPS history. Besides being slow, lovely, and ugly it doesn't even shoot where your crosshairs are! I'm restarted with the Ultimate Steam Patch along with installing these high-res textures (which it might be using? idk) and it looks pretty decent. Cranking the water wave height up all the way so they clip through everything is pretty funny.
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Aug 20, 2011 18:13
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THE HORSES rear end posted:I really hope the next version of Brutal Doom gives players the option of disabling them. I also hope the next version of Brutal Doom also gives you an option to revert the spectres to their classic sprites. While it was cool and scary for a little while to spot some red eyes and then frantically try to kill the thing, when a WAD throws 20 at you most of them might as well be truly invisible.
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Aug 20, 2011 18:24
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Yeah, the blaster from Quake 2 was the worst thing. It's also just so much less cool than having a loving shotgun as your base weapon. The Quake expansions are weird. The fact that they were both developed by different groups in parallel makes it extra weird, because there's no continuity in terms of features or weapons or monsters. I think Scourge of Armagon is the better of the two, because they made more substantial additions, and tried to do some pretty wacky poo poo with Quake C or whatever. Lots of crazy traps and bullshit. The alternative ammo types and roided up regular monsters in Dissolution felt kind of lazy.
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Aug 20, 2011 18:25
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Vertigus posted:I also hope the next version of Brutal Doom also gives you an option to revert the spectres to their classic sprites. While it was cool and scary for a little while to spot some red eyes and then frantically try to kill the thing, when a WAD throws 20 at you most of them might as well be truly invisible. Aww I like the new specters. They're actually dangerous now and the eye effect is indeed really cool. Wikipedia Brown posted:Yeah, the blaster from Quake 2 was the worst thing. It's also just so much less cool than having a loving shotgun as your base weapon. At least there's no completely useless axe this time around. Wikipedia Brown posted:The Quake expansions are weird. The fact that they were both developed by different groups in parallel makes it extra weird, because there's no continuity in terms of features or weapons or monsters. I think Scourge of Armagon is the better of the two, because they made more substantial additions, and tried to do some pretty wacky poo poo with Quake C or whatever. Lots of crazy traps and bullshit. I really like the imps from Armagon and while interesting the hammer wasn't all that great. However I loving loved the little horn  that summoned friendly enemies and wished they used it more throughout the expansion. The laser blaster was a sweet addition and the sticky bombs were...alright I guess.As for Dissolution, I actually like the alternate ammo types. The fire nailguns are powerful as hell and the multi-rocket destroys things. But yeah the new enemies are mostly a miss. The cluster-bomb dudes are kinda cool but electric eels are worthless, the flying specters that shoot homing purple spikes are terrible and the fact that they added a new GREEN blob that's basically a one-hit kill is awful. e: oh and just in general, i still think the lightening gun is a really loving boring weapon
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Aug 20, 2011 18:36
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Yodzilla posted:Yeah that sounds pretty spot on in regards to Shadow Warrior, though I haven't played it in years. What mod is this that you're using? I might have to check it out. http://www.jonof.id.au/forum/index.php?topic=1692.0 <---- Is a link to a forum post which has the High-res pack download in the OP. The textures are really, really nice and help it when you jack up the resolution. The new models are just appallingly bad though, but I'm one of those that prefers the sprites on doom and duke to the polygon monstrosities people have made over the years. SWP is the engine I'm using, it's the one linked in the OP. I tried JONOF's engine, but it mysteriously gave me a bunch of white boxes all over the place. SWP has all manner of adjustments you can make from the launcher - resolution, sound options, setting up different graphics filters, stuff like that. Also runs perfectly on windows 7 64bit without any fiddling. Just dump the SW.GRP file into the unzipped SWP directory and you're set. edit: worth noting that the HRP has both high res textures and models and you can disable the models in SWP's loader. edit: just played through the first level again, which has the biggest bullshit enemy ever in an FPS: the shadow ninja guys. This enemy is just a shadow about the same size as the regular grunts. Also, he shoots loving magic missles and fireballs in a big wave that just now took me from 87 health to zero in one hit. Awesome. That said, this game has perfect melee and fist weapons. I don't think it is possible to make those more fun than this game does. Platypus Farm fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Aug 20, 2011 |
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Aug 20, 2011 19:03
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I thought Dissolution biggest weak point was the maps. They felt more like mediocre Doom levels than anything you'd see in Quake. Its especially noticeable when you go straight from Scourge to Dissolution.
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Aug 20, 2011 19:13
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HardDisk posted:Take a look on the automap. By far the worst level in AV. It's a slow, boring slog, a vast pace difference from the rest of AV, and its insane length makes hardcore runs an absolute nightmare. I've attempted this map so many times, only to die a half-hour into it, and I'm so done with it.
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Aug 20, 2011 19:48
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I forgot about all the backtracking in Quake 4. I guess it's kinda neat that they try to make it all feel like one big coherent world but it gets a little annoying and confusing really fast. Also I realize now that I never played Quake 2 online, not once. No idea why but I completely skipped it back in the day.
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Aug 20, 2011 20:55
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I never had a problem with the quake expansions. I was using darkplaces at the time. This was about a year ago. Quake 2 is pretty loving laughable. I mean, the single player campaign isn't terrible, but you have to understand that Q2 was the BEST multiplayer for awhile. The edge is still one of my favorite maps. That is, unless you got sucked into quake fortress. Then, you might not have played anything else. The mod community for q2 could never live up to the q1 community. Also, if anyone hasn't played Travail, it's a semi-recent quake mod. It's also awesome, with excellent map design and music. You need fitzquake to play it, I believe.
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Aug 20, 2011 21:02
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Just beat Quake 2 and I actually liked it more than I remembered back in the day. My favorite part is how you push keyboards into walls to interact with computers. And while I think a lot of it might be because of the engine's age, I really like how most of the enemies just kind of totter around because they're actually bio-mechanical hybrids that are barely functional. Kind of a neat touch. e: man The Reckoning is NOT a good expansion pack. you know how half of Quake 2 was sewer levels? well a good three-quarters of this dumb piece of poo poo are. the enemies get more new weapons than the the player does and the new weapons we are given are loving terrible. railgun enemies around every corner and i just got to the end of the game to find out that for some retarded reason i now have to backtrack across THE ENTIRETY OF THE loving GAME and you're given no indicator of where you're actually supposed to go. when people wax poetic about great gameplay mechanics that first person shooters left behind none of those are here in Quake 2 Yodzilla fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Aug 21, 2011 |
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Aug 21, 2011 00:46
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Kazvall posted:I never had a problem with the quake expansions. I was using darkplaces at the time. This was about a year ago. Quake 2 is pretty loving laughable. I mean, the single player campaign isn't terrible, but you have to understand that Q2 was the BEST multiplayer for awhile. The edge is still one of my favorite maps. There was plenty of mod community for Q2... I'd say way more than Quake 1, actually. There were certainly way more higher production value mods for Q2, obviously. Don't get me wrong... there were lots of great mods for Q1, but there were plenty in Q2, and I certainly played more Q2 mods than I played Q1 (and that's saying something... I played a stupid amount of QWTF for years and years, but not nearly as much as I played Rocket Arena 2). I didn't even know a Fortress game even existed for Quake 2 outside of Weapons Factory (which I thought was awful). Maybe you just picked the wrong mod to get sucked into?
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Aug 21, 2011 05:47
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Essobie posted:There was plenty of mod community for Q2... I'd say way more than Quake 1, actually. There were certainly way more higher production value mods for Q2, obviously. Don't you talk about my nostalgia that way.
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Aug 21, 2011 05:57
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As much as the Quake 2 shows it age, it still plays a hell of a lot better today than Sin does even though they use the same engine. I tried to replay through Sin recently and I don't even know how I beat it when it first came out. Almost all enemies have hit scan weapons which chew you up, while pretty much all of your own guns have piss poor damage. The level designs were sort of impressive back in the day, but now are just confusing. I ended up just using the cheat menu to spawn a helicopter mini-gun with infinite ammo. Even then it was a pain to get through to the end. The only thing still really fun about the game is the first level, which has tons of easter eggs and lets you do fun things like hack into the game villain's bank account and transfer all of her money into your own. I remember this was the level that they used for the game demo so I guess they front loaded it, since after that level there are only a few interesting things to find or do outside of the mission objectives. Vakal fucked around with this message at 06:04 on Aug 21, 2011 |
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Aug 21, 2011 06:01
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Kazvall posted:Don't you talk about my nostalgia that way. Nostalgia compromise position: Quake 1 had the few landmark mods like CTF and Team Fortress that really blew our minds and showed us what was possible. Quake 2 had a fuckload of really well-made mods that exploited the more flexible modding system and larger community. Both mod scenes were awesome in their own ways.
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Aug 21, 2011 07:48
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Yodzilla posted:Just beat Quake 2 and I actually liked it more than I remembered back in the day. My favorite part is how you push keyboards into walls to interact with computers. I liked the "jury-rigged" feel that the Quake 2 enemies had as well. It felt as if the Strogg slapped random body parts onto a basic robot body and called it a day, like with this thing. A modern game with cyborgs that look like the Quake 2 cyborgs instead of the usual clean-looking Borg wannabes would be really cool and unsettling if they got the right designers and animators working on them. And yeah, Reckoning sucks rear end. The beginning part with the cave areas and the stupid-rear end monkeys is the worst part. The level design feels like copy and paste and the monkeys are annoying to kill because your strongest weapon at the time (the Shotgun, which is also slow as gently caress) takes more than one shot to kill, making it feel like its takes forever to clear out a group of them. I don't think there's any reason to use the lovely new weapons, especially once you get the Grenade or Rocket Launcher.
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Aug 21, 2011 09:51
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Wikipedia Brown posted:Nostalgia compromise position: I know, then Half-Life came along and really got some poo poo started. Sometimes I say stuff that is absolute poo poo just to see what spergy fucker like myself will come along to say something funny to me.
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Aug 21, 2011 09:57
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Note that there's a shorter version of Misri Halek in avmovfix.wad. Removes the outside section and should shave off a few minutes.
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Aug 21, 2011 10:49
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Welp just beat Dissolution of Eternity and I'm not afraid to admit that I god-moded the last half of it. So many of Quake's enemies are just unfun bullet sponges and having beasts and knights around every corner and teleporting into every room is just not fun at all. The dragon boss at the end was pretty hilarious. I remember seeing that in a magazine years ago and being pretty amazed. One thing though, it's kinda neat that on the level Blood Sacrifice that if you get killed you wake up somewhere different from where you originally started on a sacrificial alter. That's a cool little touch.
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Aug 21, 2011 15:42
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After more careful consideration (and playing about half of the full version levels) I have determined that Shadow Warrior is so determined to make itself awful that nothing in it can save it from itself. MAIN POINTS: -absolutely horrible level design at every turn -enemies that kill you in one hit, are invisible, and move so loving fast you couldn't kill them even if you noticed them -enemies that take TONS of damage, shoot incredibly fast projectiles, and you often have to fight three or four of them in one tiny space (the orc things) -completely unbalanced weapon loadout: the melee weapons are the strongest ones, but the most useless. Ranged weapons are nearly useless because they are so weak/slow firing/long reloads/ultra limited ammo (guardian head) -inescapable death traps that you WILL die to the first time (whirlpool in level 1) -nonsense levels -zero thematic arc to levels -racism so cartoonish that it would be right at home in a 1940 Disney short featuring cokebottle glasses and beaver-like teeth -racism so un-funny that I muted the sound so lo wang would shut the gently caress up in his FRY LICE accent. I mean, seriously. For a game purported to be an homage to cool kung fu movies from the 70s this really just seems like a bunch of game developers telling you every horrible joke that their grandpas told them about "THE NIPS" and mixing it with comedy on the level of "chinese, japanese, dirty knees, look at these!" or "me chinese, me pray joke, me put pee pee in your coke" So yeah anyway this game is abysmal and beyond saving. Duke is great, Blood is the king of FPSes and this is about as fun as having Shingles.
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Aug 21, 2011 15:44
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Now imagine playing Shadow Warrior using the keyboard only 
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Aug 21, 2011 15:47
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All of you Blood fans are getting an awesome treat this Halloween. 
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Aug 21, 2011 16:22
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Essobie posted:There was plenty of mod community for Q2... I'd say way more than Quake 1, actually. There were certainly way more higher production value mods for Q2, obviously. Replace RA2 with Action Quake 2 and you got me. I spent years playing that mod. Actually even got really close with the AQDT and the people on fear.net too. Too bad that Action Half Life was an abomination and Reaction Quake 3 didn't fair well at all.
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Aug 21, 2011 16:29
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Yodzilla posted:All of you Blood fans are getting an awesome treat this Halloween. I already had one this morning when I realized I'd never played the Cryptic Passages expansion! I only did the first couple levels so far, but they're more of the best parts of blood. Hard as gently caress, but I never feel screwed by the game. It might start sucking later but so far, it is good old blood. What is the surprise!!!!!! If it is a texture reworking as good as Shadow Warrior's, I'll be, literally, a pig in poo poo. Speaking of, Redneck Rampage sucks too.
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Aug 21, 2011 16:46
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Yodzilla posted:All of you Blood fans are getting an awesome treat this Halloween.
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Aug 21, 2011 16:58
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Platypus Farm posted:I already had one this morning when I realized I'd never played the Cryptic Passages expansion! I only did the first couple levels so far, but they're more of the best parts of blood. Hard as gently caress, but I never feel screwed by the game. It might start sucking later but so far, it is good old blood. Cryptic Passage is an excellent expansion and the new levels are pretty boss, especially the opera house. The high-res textures they added look really nice too. You've got to make sure to play it with the CD soundtrack and not the midi one. But no, it's not a Blood retexturing mod or anything like that but it is a lot of fun new content. I think you guys will really enjoy it. Platypus Farm posted:Speaking of, Redneck Rampage sucks too. Excellent soundtrack though.
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Aug 21, 2011 17:08
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Yodzilla posted:Cryptic Passage is an excellent expansion and the new levels are pretty boss, especially the opera house. The high-res textures they added look really nice too. You've got to make sure to play it with the CD soundtrack and not the midi one. I'd rather have that anyway. Blood still looks awesome. How is it that in two days, the sequel to one of my favorite games ever comes out (deus ex) but I am more excited about the re-release of a 12 year old fighting game (sf3) and some new blood maps? At least I'm a cheap date, I guess!
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Aug 21, 2011 17:17
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Platypus Farm posted:I'd rather have that anyway. Blood still looks awesome. Because game development has gone to poo poo?  I mean that's a pretty blanket statement but more and more most studios really seem to lack imagination when it comes to weapon, enemy, and level design.
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Aug 21, 2011 17:30
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Klaus88 posted:Because game development has gone to poo poo? I've been thinking about this for awhile because I will nearly always prefer something from the 90s to something from this century. I'm sure there's some nostalgia in there, but that isn't all of it. Going along with what you say there, I think you're right, but with a twist. These games we talk about all day long and have been playing for fifteen years were a product of a different time, obviously. Reflect on what that means, though. They are from an age where sub-genre was determined based on what engine a game used. So you've got Doom games, Build games, whatever. Even the ones that used modified engines still just modified things that already existed, sometimes heavily yes, but still. You can see this in Blood and SW (GO TO HELL) when you shoot an enemy in front of a wall. Same blood splatter from Duke3d. This doesn't bother anyone at all, it looks cool and shows you that you shot a guy and he took damage. Architecture possibilities are largely the same with some relatively minor changes. Anyway what I'm getting at is that you are right, but it isn't the developers fault really. When you have to spend a month or whatever modeling every single loving gun in a game, you are going to end up without much variety or imagination because anything imaginative would have to be meticulously modeled the same way a regular old M16 would. It would be a whole lot harder, I'm guessing, to model the enemies and guns from Blood than from Modern Warfare 3 since in that game, everyone is just a person with a different set of clothes on, whereas in blood, I can count at least five completely different monster types in just the first level. Think of how astronomically long it would take to make a game with Blood's variety these days.
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Aug 21, 2011 17:39
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Klaus88 posted:Because game development has gone to poo poo? I'm going to derail a bit here, since you're completely right about FPS games. It seems like they've stagnated lately, going all regenerating health and "tactical action" with quicktime events and consoleitis on us. But have a look at Saints Row the Third, even though it's a GTA-like sandbox game with console roots (*GASP* regenerating health and quicktime events) and not an FPS. From playing the previous two Saints Row games I can tell you that Volition loves making over-the-top games and looking at trailers for the new one, it looks even more outrageous. Airstrikes, wrestling moves on innocent pedestrians, VTOL jets with microwave laser and homing missiles, pedestrian-launching cannons and that's just what they've shown in trailers so far. It even has an "awesome button" which you can press to make any ingame action more awesome. I mean, the opening parts of the game has you escaping from a plane where you were held captive by jumping out the rear cargo hatch and diving through falling debris to catch your girlfriend. And then they turn it up to 11. KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Aug 21, 2011 |
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Aug 21, 2011 17:46
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KozmoNaut posted:I'm going to derail a bit here, since you're completely right about FPS games. It seems like they've stagnated lately, going all regenerating health and "tactical action" with quicktime events and consoleitis on us. That's true. However, in my case I just can't stand this kind of thing. To keep talking about Blood, the weapons and enemies in it were really neat, but not self-consciously so far over the top that it was self parody. I guess for me, the Saints Row III example is similar to, say, looking at the movie "Commando" versus one of those schlocky "PARODY MOVIE" movies. Or to say, The Simpsons in 1992 vs Family Guy c. 2010, you know? They are over the top, but in a less wink-and-nod kind of way. Arnold was incredibly hyper-violent and one-liner-witty in Commando, but he didn't deliver a one liner, then look at the camera, throw a missle at the audience, perform a Macho Man elbow drop on an airplane and tell a joke about what he just did and how it breaks the rules of reality. Actually, he kind of did this in Last Action Hero, and we all know how that went.
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Aug 21, 2011 17:54
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Platypus Farm posted:Actually, he kind of did this in Last Action Hero, and we all know how that went. Yeah, I know how it went. It was a good movie. 
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Aug 21, 2011 17:55
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Platypus Farm posted:Actually, he kind of did this in Last Action Hero, and we all know how that went. Watch it, young man. I like that movie. KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Aug 21, 2011 |
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Aug 21, 2011 18:05
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