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Cowcaster posted:To be more specific, the cache is just all the preorder bonuses lumped together. While they were more powerful than the stuff you would normally start out with, they were still balanced to be "starting" weapons and as such get outclassed quickly when you start finding higher tier/unique weapons. The non-weapon bonuses were just like 10 extra stimpacks or similar. Canteen. Canteen makes Hardcore easier because you forget to worry about water.
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Oct 10, 2011 05:44
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How do you buy the Courier's Stash if you already have a pre-order bonus?
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Oct 10, 2011 05:47
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CommanderCoffee posted:Canteen. Canteen makes Hardcore easier because you forget to worry about water. Water is so common I can't imagine it ever being a worry unless you're deathly afraid of having a non-zero amount of radiation.
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Oct 10, 2011 05:47
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SpaceMost posted:One area where FO3 completely dropped the ball was the settlements. People(/I) complain about New Vegas feeling underpopulated, but it's waaay better than FO3 at creating the illusion of "People live here!" For example, one 'town' is literally about three shacks on a destroyed highway overpass. Another is Megaton, a town concept so silly that it's only trumped by a subterranean civilization of orphaned children. Yeah, the settlements in Fallout 3 are kind of insane. There's the town built around an unexploded nuclear bomb, the numerous "settlements" that consist of about six people in heavily damaged houses, the ghoul city set up right near the loving super mutants, the aforementioned "three shacks on a piece of overpass", not to mention the raider camps that seem to be set up along the lines of "okay here's a house with about 1/8th of 1 wall standing and a 200 year old piss stained mattress*, let's burn stuff". The only remotely safe location is Tenpenny Tower, and look how well that turned out. *though arguably everything in Fallout 3 is 200 years old and piss stained
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Oct 10, 2011 05:49
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The best Fallout 3 town is the one that's the nuka-cola fanatic and a single other person living in one shack. Somehow that's enough of a "town" to have its own proper name.
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Oct 10, 2011 05:53
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How can you forget the subways? Those are the best part.
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Oct 10, 2011 05:54
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Bash Ironfist posted:Is courier's cache that good? I don't have that or DM, considering getting one of them later this month. It's two frickin' bucks, and it makes starting new characters a lot less of a pain in the rear end. If you ever plan on making a new character I'd say it's worth it. I just threw it in when I bought GRA and Lonesome Road.
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Oct 10, 2011 05:57
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Chairman Mao posted:Yeah, the settlements in Fallout 3 are kind of insane. There's the town built around an unexploded nuclear bomb, the numerous "settlements" that consist of about six people in heavily damaged houses, the ghoul city set up right near the loving super mutants, the aforementioned "three shacks on a piece of overpass", not to mention the raider camps that seem to be set up along the lines of "okay here's a house with about 1/8th of 1 wall standing and a 200 year old piss stained mattress*, let's burn stuff". It's been canon since Fallout 1 that Super Mutants never give a gently caress about ghouls because they can't be dipped and they're to pathetic to fight back.
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Oct 10, 2011 05:59
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Um the Capital Wasteland super mutants are different from the west coast super mutants because,
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Oct 10, 2011 06:02
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Cowcaster posted:Um the Capital Wasteland super mutants are different from the west coast super mutants because, You can shoot a lot less of one compared to the other in their respective games?
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Oct 10, 2011 06:07
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HoveringCheesecake posted:How can you forget the subways? Those are the best part. Every single station looks exactly the same. Kudos to the designers for accuracy, I guess.
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Oct 10, 2011 06:10
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Starhawk64 posted:Yeah, Courier's Stash is pretty broken because it gives you all those fully repaired weapons and armor. If you don't want to use them, just toss the items off a cliff or something. Or just delete the three files per pre-order bonus so you don't get the ones you don't want in the first place.
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Oct 10, 2011 06:11
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Cowcaster posted:The best Fallout 3 town is the one that's the nuka-cola fanatic and a single other person living in one shack. Somehow that's enough of a "town" to have its own proper name. That was the exact point in FO3 I gave up and just rushed to the endgame. I had been looking and looking for some sort of real town with people in the game, unaware that Megaton and Rivet City were basically it, I see Girdershade off in the distance and start hiking it, and I finally get there and there's a whole 2 NPCs.
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Oct 10, 2011 06:12
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Chairman Mao posted:Yeah, the settlements in Fallout 3 are kind of insane. There's the town built around an unexploded nuclear bomb, the numerous "settlements" that consist of about six people in heavily damaged houses, the ghoul city set up right near the loving super mutants, the aforementioned "three shacks on a piece of overpass", not to mention the raider camps that seem to be set up along the lines of "okay here's a house with about 1/8th of 1 wall standing and a 200 year old piss stained mattress*, let's burn stuff". I am fine with all of these things because when playing a game I don't want every area to be a boring post-apocalyptic townlet with varying levels of how hosed up everything is. I want interesting and sometimes silly things to interact with and gimmick towns fill that niche for me very well.
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Oct 10, 2011 06:13
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Tenpenny Tower is the best because its a colony of people who somehow got rich despite there being no way to make any money in the capital wasteland. and the people do nothing but sit around all day being rich.
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Oct 10, 2011 06:14
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SpaceMost posted:I thought that the designers got lazy or maybe unironically loved Hellgate: London or something, but then actually I visited D.C. and used their subways. Yeah, the stations are pretty accurate, but they sure do get old after the first few you explore. The locations in Fallout 3 that are marked on the map don't really make much sense either. Downtown DC has a bunch of office buildings that are larger than the "towns" that aren't marked on the compass. I'm playing the game again, and I ran into the L.O.B. Enterprises building in Falls Church. It's a 3 story building consisting of 3 separate maps. It even has a neat backstory - but nah, instead, a burnt out building with 2 raiders is a good location to mark on the Pipboy. \/\/\/ And if you do feed it into a blender, you only have one other option for your home base and it's in the middle of nowhere. I hate Megaton, but I saved it just because it was a little closer to DC. reagan fucked around with this message at 06:23 on Oct 10, 2011 |
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Oct 10, 2011 06:18
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Megaton is the best because it's literally a town built around an unexploded nuclear bomb and your first quest is the moral equivalent of "Will I find this cute abandoned puppy a home or will I feed it into a blender?"
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Oct 10, 2011 06:21
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SpaceMost posted:Megaton is the best because it's literally a town built around an unexploded nuclear bomb and your first quest is the moral equivalent of "Will I find this cute abandoned puppy a home or will I feed it into a blender?" Actually it's because it's a town built out of scrap metal within 100 feet of an abandoned town with a bunch of standing buildings
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Oct 10, 2011 06:24
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Scorchy posted:That was the exact point in FO3 I gave up and just rushed to the endgame. I had been looking and looking for some sort of real town with people in the game, unaware that Megaton and Rivet City were basically it, I see Girdershade off in the distance and start hiking it, and I finally get there and there's a whole 2 NPCs. Rivet City is possibly the only settlement in the entire game without huge gaping security holes (bomb in the middle of town (Megaton), door to feral ghouls in the middle of town (Tenpenny Tower), no goddamn walls around the loving town (everywhere else)). Unless I'm remembering this wrong I did a playthrough where I destroyed Megaton, let the ghouls overrun Tenpenny Tower and got a room in Rivet out of sheer spite. Incidentally, what's wrong with Rivet City as far as towns go? You've got a motel, a church, a marketplace, all sorts of stuff, all nicely sealed off behind thick steel walls. Spitting distance from the super mutants but it's the wasteland, what can ya do?
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Oct 10, 2011 06:53
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Rivet City is the most sensible settlement in 3. Nice and safe from enemies and the elements. Vulnerable to someone with a lot of explosives who just wants to blow it up instead of invade but you'd have that problem anywhere.
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Oct 10, 2011 06:58
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Of course you have the dumb issue of something sitting in saltwater for 200 years still being afloat.
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Oct 10, 2011 07:00
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So I love NV. I was doing a energy weapon run(which I scrapped. Not enough variety!) and took bloody mess. I figured that hey, if I don't melt a dude into goo with my plasma rifle, maybe he'll explode into bits. I shot a dude, and scored a critical. He then exploded into bits, which then melted! This is a game where you can make dudes explode, then melt into goo. Best game. 
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Oct 10, 2011 07:01
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Node posted:Do you like me? I am too cheap and lazy to get a good pc to run this game, but that suit almost made me reconsider because I knew that there was more than likely a mod out that removed the suit's constant jabber and med-x dispensing. I had to stop wearing it because I was running out of fixer to cure all my med-x addiction.
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Oct 10, 2011 07:02
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Chairman Mao posted:Rivet City is possibly the only settlement in the entire game without huge gaping security holes (bomb in the middle of town (Megaton), door to feral ghouls in the middle of town (Tenpenny Tower), no goddamn walls around the loving town (everywhere else)). Unless I'm remembering this wrong I did a playthrough where I destroyed Megaton, let the ghouls overrun Tenpenny Tower and got a room in Rivet out of sheer spite. As FO3 location design goes Rivet City was about as good as it gets, but lol it's an aircraft carrier where nobody once considered what happens when the player goes onto/looks at the flight deck. SpaceMost posted:I thought that the designers got lazy or maybe unironically loved Hellgate: London or something, but then actually I visited D.C. and used their subways. The thing is the DC area is full of awesome poo poo that was actually literally built to withstand bombs IRL (albeit maybe not built very well), and Bethsoft is located like fifteen minutes away from town; that they chose for their single identifiable indicator that you were in DC the thing that's pretty much always the same boring poo poo everywhere and still hosed it up is pretty much all that can be said about FO3. Well, two identifiable things, Washington Monument, but let's not go there. Tubgirl Cosplay fucked around with this message at 07:14 on Oct 10, 2011 |
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Oct 10, 2011 07:04
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BigRoman posted:I am too cheap and lazy to get a good pc to run this game, but that suit almost made me reconsider because I knew that there was more than likely a mod out that removed the suit's constant jabber and med-x dispensing. The Sink autodoc will cure addictions.
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Oct 10, 2011 07:09
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Realized "More Where That Came From" was missing something critical (probably because I don't think it's public domain), immediately put this into the game and wasn't sure how I was playing without it: Do not forsake me, oh my darling ...
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Oct 10, 2011 07:13
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New Vegas has all these towns and settlements and people and things going on. Trade disputes and various warring factions fighting for dominance. There's a real sense of human society rebuilding itself. Fallout 3's Capital Wasteland, the entire Capital Wasteland, was a hole. One giant irradiated loving pile of destroyed crap. People lived together in tiny groups in whatever they could find and nobody really knew what the gently caress was going on. 200 years and they'd barely got clean drinking water out there. Sure there were a handful protected cities but most people ended up joining raider gangs to survive. No plants, no trees (well, except you know who), the only living things are starved mutant animals, all the water's poo poo, all the food's completely radioactive, there's no buildings left, nothing but a barren hellscape full of horrible things that wanted to kill you. I mean, I like New Vegas better, there's more variety in the missions and the environments, the characters are for the most part more interesting and the moral choices it has you make are more complex than pet the kitty and give it some milk/gently caress the kitty and cut off its head, but it doesn't quite capture the "oh god everything is hosed we're all hosed everything is dead everyone is dead I'm gonna die out here" vibe that 3 had.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:09
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That's part of why Fallout 3 felt like it was just after the war, not 200 years later. If some of the obviously retarded poo poo like Megaton being next to a bomb instead of in the perfectly good town a hundred feet to the left was eliminated, and the game was set in 2107, the design would've worked better. You can at least blame part of it on DC obviously being nuked more than most places, but even with that it didn't really work.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:16
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^^^ I'm convinced that Bethesda originally developed the game with the premise being 20 years after the war rather than 200, but somewhere along the way a story writer decided that Project Purity needed to take the front stage. Chairman Mao posted:I mean, I like New Vegas better, there's more variety in the missions and the environments, the characters are for the most part more interesting and the moral choices it has you make are more complex than pet the kitty and give it some milk/gently caress the kitty and cut off its head, but it doesn't quite capture the "oh god everything is hosed we're all hosed everything is dead everyone is dead I'm gonna die out here" vibe that 3 had. I agree on this. Fallout 3 had a much more distinct "Society has completely fallen apart and my remaining lifespan outside the vault is probably measured in months." Leaving the Vault in Fallout 3 in particular had a much more "Oh poo poo I'm completely unprepared to survive here" feeling to it, and somewhat ironically I felt more endangered then than I did after getting shot twice in the head. That's really the only major positive thing I can think of for FO3 vs. NV, though.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:17
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I just recently finished Lonesome Road and felt I could read this (and the last) topic again... only to find out I had over two thousand posts to get through... but I'm finally here. The thread title is a vast improvement, by the way. So on the subject of Lonesome Road... It was kind of neat how the enigmatic figure broke down into a rather plausible mess, given what he's been though... but I couldn't help but be kind of disappointed in him. I thought he was asking the right questions... he was asking what made a society. I thought he really might be on to something but... it turns out he was just broken after what happened to the society he appreciated... and we didn't even get to learn what it was about that society that he liked. The whole thing would have been fine if we just knew what Hopeville was founded on... besides nuclear weapons. This disappointment came to a head when I engaged in the final conversation with him, got to the speech check... passed it and... that was it. Just a single simple speech check. It was almost enough for me to give up and write off Lonesome Road as a tragic disappointment, but then I reloaded and tried the other options. Let me tell you, if wanted the real boss battle with Ulysses (and I'm not going to spoiler this because people who haven't played need to know this), you need to find all of his logs, and confront Ulysses with his own words, ignoring the speech check. That conversation was loving awesome. It was a real verbal duel, and what's great is that it was littered with wrong answers. You really needed to think about what you said, or he'd just say, "If that's what you got out of my words, I was right to discard them. Prepare to die." That said, there were quite a few different correct paths through the conversation, and I make no apologies for reloading a bunch of times and finding them all. It's criminal that so much of the absolutely vital content of Ulysses story was hidden away like that. For those who didn't experience it, you had two paths- Honest Hearts, where you could confront him about his experiences influencing the White Legs, or Old World Blues, where you could confront him with his experience of coming face to face with the Gods of the Big Empty. Both conversations are fantastic, and they really let you tear down Ulysses' ideology. ... It would be more impressive if Ulysses' ideology was less messed up than, "gently caress it, I'm nuking them all again. Clean the slate. Worked well the last time." I'd have been a lot happier with him if he were more overtly pro-Legion. And if you don't have all Ulysses logs, confronting him with ED-E's tapes was pretty sweet too, though it was less an argument and more a simple confrontation. You basically just say, "America still existed in the form of the Enclave, and ED-E was its courier. Way to gently caress it up, Ulysses!" which isn't as strong as tearing down his real ideology but much more fun than, "I really mean it! [speech 90]" J Bjelke-Postersen posted:I found it confusing that the White Legs dudes were all tribal and had poor equipment, but they were all armed with loving anti-materiel rifles and riot shotguns. SynthOrange posted:Of course you have the dumb issue of something sitting in saltwater for 200 years still being afloat. Rivet City was also the only place in the whole capital wasteland that produced food- in its hydroponic labs. Yeah. Fallout 3 was dumb. It's sad, but true. At least it was a pretty setting to explore.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:24
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Grand Fromage posted:Rivet City is the most sensible settlement in 3. Nice and safe from enemies and the elements. Vulnerable to someone with a lot of explosives who just wants to blow it up instead of invade but you'd have that problem anywhere. I hated it cause it was claustrophobic but I guess that's intentional.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:26
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Scorchy posted:I hated it cause it was claustrophobic but I guess that's intentional. The level design had issues, it was really easy to get lost. I always ended up walking through the whole drat city by the time I found everything I was looking for. I was just talking about it making sense though.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:33
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Eiba posted:Was it actually floating? I though it was resting on the sea floor and the lower levels were flooded. I may be misremembering... No I'm pretty sure it wasn't floating, seeing as the rear end end of it had broken off. Eiba posted:Yeah. Fallout 3 was ... pretty Well that's a first. Omnicarus posted:I agree on this. Fallout 3 had a much more distinct "Society has completely fallen apart and my remaining lifespan outside the vault is probably measured in months." Leaving the Vault in Fallout 3 in particular had a much more "Oh poo poo I'm completely unprepared to survive here" feeling to it, and somewhat ironically I felt more endangered then than I did after getting shot twice in the head. Yeah, if you were thrown into something like the Mojave Wasteland you wouldn't quite get this whole "I have made a massive and egregious mistake coming here and I really, really wish I was back inside my little tin can inside of a mountain now." feeling that you get from Fallout 3. They really drove home the disparity between the tedious but relatively safe life inside of the vault and the screaming loving nightmare that is the rest of the world.
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Oct 10, 2011 08:42
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Chairman Mao posted:Fallout 3's Capital Wasteland, the entire Capital Wasteland, was a hole. One giant irradiated loving pile of destroyed crap. People lived together in tiny groups in whatever they could find and nobody really knew what the gently caress was going on. 200 years and they'd barely got clean drinking water out there. Sure there were a handful protected cities but most people ended up joining raider gangs to survive. No plants, no trees (well, except you know who), the only living things are starved mutant animals, all the water's poo poo, all the food's completely radioactive, there's no buildings left, nothing but a barren hellscape full of horrible things that wanted to kill you. I agree on this. The weird thing for me though, was that half way through these guys turn up and they have bases and technology and plans and leadership and the game tells me they're the bad guys and railroads me into killing them all to save a shithole where "bustling metropolis" means "three shacks on an overpass".
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Oct 10, 2011 08:54
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Eiba posted:
Lonesome Road poo poo: He kind actually does tell you why he fell in love with the Divide so much (although not directly, you have to read between the lines here), it was because it was a small community in a harsh land that still managed to grow and thrive, with no help at all from either Legion or NCR. Also because it was all on a Military base, Old World America flags were everywhere and that convinced him this could be the next America. Remember, Ulysses had no real love for the Legion, he just ran with them because for one Vulpes would have had him killed otherwise, but mostly because Legion's overall goal was to erase everything but the Legion, and have all of America under one sign again. No NCR, no BoS, Enclave, Kings, Vipers, Jackals, Scorpions, whatever. Just one "tribe" to make America whole again. He made it in the Frumentarri (normally reserved for the more fanatical members of the Legion) because, he just happened to be very very good at what he does. Then Ulysses saw this poo poo hole grow into a thriving town from almost nothing, with no help from NCR or Legion or any gangs, decorated with the sign that brought all of the Old America together as one. It was perfect. This showed him he didn't need the Legion to acomplish what he always wanted to do, bring back Good ol' USA. And then the NCR showed up... then the Legion showed up because the NCR did... then the Courier showed up with a busted up ED-E in a box and a few days later poo poo goes boom.
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Oct 10, 2011 09:10
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Chairman Mao posted:Fallout 3's Capital Wasteland, the entire Capital Wasteland, was a hole. One giant irradiated loving pile of destroyed crap. People lived together in tiny groups in whatever they could find and nobody really knew what the gently caress was going on. 200 years and they'd barely got clean drinking water out there. Sure there were a handful protected cities but most people ended up joining raider gangs to survive. No plants, no trees (well, except you know who), the only living things are starved mutant animals, all the water's poo poo, all the food's completely radioactive, there's no buildings left, nothing but a barren hellscape full of horrible things that wanted to kill you. Trees bit aside this also serves as a perfectly reasonable description of normal pre-apocalyptic Maryland, so I guess they designed better than they thought. Too bad none of it made sense or had any individual character and the whole thing could've been set on Mars if you changed some names around and scratched like two locations. Tubgirl Cosplay fucked around with this message at 09:17 on Oct 10, 2011 |
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Oct 10, 2011 09:13
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I like Fallout 3 a bit more so far (only a bit), because it had more density of interesting places, and interesting layout. In FNV it is possible to wander, go to some edge of the map and find literally nothing. In F3 you'd find something, in FNV - not so much. Sometimes you do, but less frequently. There are story differences which I think people don't appreciate. When you go all-nuclear on the US, you wipe main administrative centers, and most populates areas. I was in all real life places pictured in Fallouts, and seriously I don't have problems with the Capital Wasteland being true wasteland, with radiation everywhere and a scant population, after the war, as it was portrayed in the game, in comparison to much more life in desert wasteland of Mojave. Who would want to wipe a strip of desert? Las Vegas could be blessed with one or two nukes (in real life) or dozens of them (in Fallout universe), but the surrounding area would be affected by fallout only, or maybe some deflected bombs, which is as it was portrayed in the game. Sure, when you go to Washington DC, to the place pointed by GPS, you'll find only slums, but the funny part are not far away, and I'd definitely want to wipe them out. If I was Chinese. So in FNV most water has no radiation, and life is generally easier, par some failed local experiments (cazadores). In Fallout 3 you almost can't find not irradiated water, and life sucks. Except from lack of cazadores, wild life is more dangerous. I remember running away from mirelurks quite far from the water, frantically throwing mines, and even was killed by them once or twice. Lakelurks are so pathetic, I never had to back away. Radscorps tend to keep to their own areas in FNV, where in Fallout 3 they had to be expected almost anywhere. Similarly deathclaws, though with proper gun (a mighty dart gun) they were easy, and there is no equivalent of that gun in FNV. But they keep themselves constrained to two or three places and respawn generally only after fasttravel now. And no mutated bears in most of FNV. In Fallout 3 there are proper towns or settlements, with fortification and more people than three - children town underground? Check. Megaton? (which was so hidden from my sight I've found it only when level 20 or so) Check. Rivet City? Check. Tenpenny? Check. Paradise Falls? Check. Evergreen Mills? Check. I could remember some more, but what's the point. Heck, I could bring even the vault where the game starts, which is more a proper city than anything in FNV. Arefu, the settlement on the highway, is said to have much more people than it had before the player arrives, but it is dangerous around, so it was depopulated, same with other settlements. In FNV there are small settlements, and bigger ones, but most of them are either near the Vegas, under heavy protection from NCR (who came from reborn entities) and securitrons (which were not affected by bombs) or are NCR. Or Legion. Or are not here anymore. NCR is also said to bring peace and security to yet not annexed settlements, like Goodsprings, as Sunny Smiles acknowledges. NCR is not BoS, which has some issues with dealing with civilian populations, and it has been present in the area for years. But most important, the Vegas area had much more base population to begin with, after the Great War. So I think the differences between the games the games are justified.
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Oct 10, 2011 09:15
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Astroturf Man posted:I agree on this. The weird thing for me though, was that half way through these guys turn up and they have bases and technology and plans and leadership and the game tells me they're the bad guys and railroads me into killing them all to save a shithole where "bustling metropolis" means "three shacks on an overpass". Yeah their plans did involve, well let's call a spade a spade, genocide. Edit: Oh yeah, one thing I liked about Fallout 3 is that they actually bothered to put a bunch of crap in your way instead of just plopping down an invisible wall in the middle of a flat piece of land and telling you to go gently caress yourself. You have no idea how much it pissed me off in a huge open ended game that you can play almost any way you can conceive of to scale a mountain and halfway across the flat, barren top of it hit a god drat wall. Chairman Mao fucked around with this message at 09:23 on Oct 10, 2011 |
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Oct 10, 2011 09:17
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Chairman Mao posted:Yeah their plans did involve, well let's call a spade a spade, genocide. I feel like this'd have come across as a bigger issue if you didn't spend the entire first half and most of the second half of the game cheerfully slaughtering the majority population of the Capitol Wasteland yourself. Really it's a heroic battle against efficiency.
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Oct 10, 2011 09:20
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Saiko Kila posted:I remember running away from mirelurks quite far from the water, frantically throwing mines God drat Mirelurks and their heavily armored bodies and tiny tiny heads. Those things were loving made for VATS. Actually, who am I kidding, a lot of Fallout 3 enemies were made for VATS. That's something I think New Vegas improved on a lot, fewer enemies that weren't ridiculously annoying without VATS.
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Oct 10, 2011 09:30
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