|
Perestroika posted:More annoyingly, (for me anyways) why doesn't Zion have a huge-rear end EMP generator with a shielded power supply set to fire every ten seconds? They had to rely on one ship miraculously making it back and use its EMP to save the day. Why hasn't anybody thought of taking this wonderweapon (against which the machines have no defense at all) that they install in literally every ship they make and put one to defend, I don't know, literally the only city they have? poo poo, with enough EMPs they could take the fight to machine city.
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 00:02
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 06:24 |
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:poo poo, with enough EMPs they could take the fight to machine city. Too bad they never thought to do that during the war. e: but they did nuke the city a bunch of times so you'd think the EMP from that would have solved things. Der Luftwaffle has a new favorite as of 00:27 on Nov 21, 2011 |
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 00:25
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:How come in the 1st Matrix the machine sentinels are hugely threatening enemies which the humans have no counter for except the EMP, which is portrayed as a last ditch thing. In the sequels however all the ships have machine guns where they just mow down thousands of the sentinels. What gives? Yes, this. It's even specifically stated in the first movie: "It's our only weapon against them." Third movie: "Oh yeah, other than guns. Guns work too, I guess." Also, the mechs were really dumb. Go stick a guy in a walking tank with guns on it, and build it as an open frame exoskeleton so that the soft meat body serves as armor to protect all that steel. Good idea. Unrelated: Watched _Ronin_ on teevee today. Generally a good movie, amazing car chases. But this bit always, always, always bugs the living poo poo out of me: quote:DeNiro: Fucker sprayed this bullet with Teflon. He was trying to stamp me "paid in full." TEFLON DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY. You can't just spray it on something, and it has absolutely nothing to do with armor-piercing capabilities of bullets. For a movie that takes great pains to get guns right, this bit right here is akin to saying "He put a black magic curse on this bullet, that's why it went through my vest."
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 00:28
|
|
|
Perestroika posted:(against which the machines have no defense at all) Have the machines not invented Faraday cages? (Actually, I'm not sure if a Faraday cage would block out an EMP, but I think it would.)
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 00:40
|
|
|
Phanatic posted:Also, the mechs were really dumb. Go stick a guy in a walking tank with guns on it, and build it as an open frame exoskeleton so that the soft meat body serves as armor to protect all that steel. Good idea. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 00:55
|
|
|
I think part of the deal is that the humans of Zion aren't building those ships or EMPs. They are leftovers that they practically worship 40k style. Doesn't the old guy tell Neo that they don't even really understand how the water reclamation unit works? The fact that they didn't permanently leave one ship with an EMP in Zion is another issue, but they were shortsighted and thought they wouldn't be found, and that doesn't sound too far fetched.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 00:57
|
|
|
Trent posted:I think part of the deal is that the humans of Zion aren't building those ships or EMPs. They are leftovers that they practically worship 40k style. Doesn't the old guy tell Neo that they don't even really understand how the water reclamation unit works? Pretty much this. That's why everyone was in such a panic when they found out "Oh poo poo  the machines are drilling towards Zion   ", Zion being underground and 'unknown' (for a given amount of unknown, since the machines had destroyed it a dozen times before) was more or less it's only real defense. Didn't Morpheus and the crew on The Hammer catch a ton of poo poo for setting off that EMP inside Zion, anyway? Turns out they didn't shield their stuff! 
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 01:10
|
|
|
I always have a hard time seeing mankind as the good guys in the Matrix, hell, it's even hard to see them as a different type of grey in a "everyone is bad" kind of way. They're clearly hyper-agressive creatures bent on killing everything they find dangerous (even themselves) while the machines seem to be cloned right out of St.Gabriel himself. Even when they have the opportunity to wipe out humanity they elaborate a complex life support system for all of mankind to exist in peace and even when they leave this system they let them live in a "hidden" colony, not bothering them as long as they don't push their buttons too much. Of cource mankind simply refuses all this and blows everything to hell just because.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 01:17
|
|
|
Suddenly the Matrix talk reminds me of an episode of the original Star Trek, where they find a planet where everyone's peaceful and ruled by a 'God' that turns out to be a machine. Then they blow it up and are like "Okay, you're all free now!" In fact, I swear I recall more than one episode that was basically like that. Edit: VVVV Looking at about 90% of the internet, maybe they had a point.. Midnight Raider has a new favorite as of 02:27 on Nov 21, 2011 |
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 01:38
|
|
|
Midnight Raider posted:Suddenly the Matrix talk reminds me of an episode of the original Star Trek, where they find a planet where everyone's peaceful and ruled by a 'God' that turns out to be a machine. Then they blow it up and are like "Okay, you're all free now!" Star Trek, particularly TOS, is violently anti-technology. Every second episode is about the dangers of taking technology too far and playing god. And there's a constant theme of "No technology will ever be a match for human ingenuity!" and how reliance on technology makes you weak and stupid.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 01:51
|
|
|
BastardAus posted:I guess it's pretty petty it is but the animation sequence in Superman 2 where Zod and his crew escape from the Phantom Zone was utterly cheap and unbelievable and annoyed me every time I saw it. When I was six. Are you actually saying a CGI technique from the 80s looks fake? 
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 09:56
|
|
|
At the end of Contact, when everyone is giving Jodie Foster poo poo about making it all up, why didn't they just send another person through the machine immediately to verify her story? Isn't that the most scientifically rigorous thing to do? I'm sure the Japanese that built the second machine would jump at the chance to put one of their own scientists through.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 11:08
|
|
|
God Mode posted:At the end of Contact, when everyone is giving Jodie Foster poo poo about making it all up, why didn't they just send another person through the machine immediately to verify her story? Isn't that the most scientifically rigorous thing to do? They didn't because as far as they're concerned, she just dropped straight through the machine without ever going anywhere. What they saw was her pod just dropping right through and splashing into the water; Everything that happened inside and everything she witnessed, only she saw and knew about. The aliens made sure of that. They even point this out in the movie  I think you missed that bit. They didn't send anyone after her because after she went, the machine wouldn't turn on again. I think.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 11:45
|
|
|
Malachite_Dragon posted:Everything that happened inside and everything she witnessed, only she saw and knew about. The aliens made sure of that. They even point this out in the movie I know to everyone else it looked like it didn't work and she had no proof whatsoever. Although I didn't recall the bit about the machine not working a second time. That would explain it quite easily.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 12:05
|
|
|
God Mode posted:I know to everyone else it looked like it didn't work and she had no proof whatsoever. I may be mixing that last bit up with the book; In the book, the machine never turned on again and the instant her pod went through, the signal that they got the plans from in the first place shut off. Which, given how vast space is and how long it's supposed to take waves to travel from one place to another... 
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 12:19
|
|
|
The book also sent 5 people through, and instead of no one believing them, they just never let them talk about it, if I remember correctly. Five people was probably too impersonal for a film.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 12:55
|
|
|
Plus at the very end of the movie, its all wrapped up in a bow with the bit about the video recorder.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 14:31
|
|
|
sirbeefalot posted:Plus at the very end of the movie, its all wrapped up in a bow with the bit about the video recorder. The fact that it recorded static isn't what interests me. What interests me is that it recorded 18 hours of it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 15:43
|
|
|
U.T. Raptor posted:The anime Blue Gender is really bad about this too. They're fighting giant insects that tear through humans like paper with mechs that have open cockpits This was so that they could hop out of the mechs really quickly. With all that shameless, impersonal loving going on, it was important to be able to get your freak on as fast as possible, and sealed cockpits just get in the way. Speaking of aliens and sex, during the climax of The Astronaut's Wife, we learn that the spooky electricity alien can hop from person to person. Why not just do this to Charlize Theron right when she gets pregnant? Seems like a good way of making sure the twins are safe until they're born. Another irritating moment during that film is Depp's line "...your vagina..." It was so awkward as to be cringe-inducing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 15:48
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:How come in the 1st Matrix the machine sentinels are hugely threatening enemies which the humans have no counter for except the EMP, which is portrayed as a last ditch thing. In the sequels however all the ships have machine guns where they just mow down thousands of the sentinels. What gives? Agents aren't the only ones who can "upgrade"  Come to think of it, the scene with the upgraded Agents at the beginning of Matrix 2 annoyed me a lot. So this is the reason Neo doesn't simply 1-hit these guys out of existence? They "upgraded"? And this somehow negates his God-powers to the point where he has to deal with them in hand-to-hand combat? Which just makes me think: If Neo can stop bullets with his mind, why can't he stop Agents with his mind?
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 16:57
|
|
|
Mans posted:The girl in Cliffhanger gave me a huge amount of nerves. How the hell can you let yourself be capture by someone piloting an helicopter? Yeah he drawed a pistol, so what? Was he going to chase you and shoot you down? Just turn around and go take a stroll, the dude would be helpless! Not only this, but you can't hold a pistol and fly a helicopter at the same time!
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 17:12
|
|
|
Grendels Dad posted:Agents aren't the only ones who can "upgrade" I've always thought about it this way--Neo's raison d'etre is to counteract Smith. When Smith gets fired, he goes rogue and begins evolving on his own. Neo keeps parity with Smith, improving along with him, rather than the legit agents. Neo is the chosen one and all, but given enough time, I bet the machines would've figured out how to take him down (without resorting to cooperating with him in order to see the dichotomy arrive at its inevitable end). Also, the machines have a pretty big advantage that gets even bigger every time Neo pulls some hocus pocus poo poo in the matrix--they can see exactly what he's doing. Any time Neo does anything in the matrix, they can analyze how he's bending the rules of the simulation and upgrade their software to combat his meddling. GOTTA STAY FAI has a new favorite as of 17:19 on Nov 21, 2011 |
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 17:15
|
|
|
GOTTA STAY FAI posted:Any time Neo does anything in the matrix, they can analyze how he's bending the rules of the simulation and upgrade their software to combat his meddling. But that would directly contradict what we were told about the Agents and the Chosen One in the first movie, i.e. that the former, while enjoying a lot of leeway in that regard, are still bound to the laws of physics while the latter can break those laws and defeat the Agents that way. I don't get how upgrading would change anything for the Agents and Neo because the main difference between them is that the Agents' powers have a ceiling defined by laws of nature or what have you, while Neo's powers are supposedly limitless. As the movies play out, Morpheus tells Neo that he'll become a god. Then Matrix Reloaded shows us that godhood mostly consists of kicking things really really fast.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 17:23
|
|
|
Grendels Dad posted:But that would directly contradict what we were told about the Agents and the Chosen One in the first movie, i.e. that the former, while enjoying a lot of leeway in that regard, are still bound to the laws of physics while the latter can break those laws and defeat the Agents that way. Well, from a filmmaker's standpoint, Neo couldn't very well start the second film at level 255 with maxed-out stats, infinite bullet-time, god mode, noclip, etc. The machines learning and making Agents better over time is (at least in my eyes) an okay way to keep things exciting while not gimping the main character too much. They could've pulled a Metroid and had him lose his powers, spending the whole movie slowly getting them back, right? When I watch the films, in order to not get too irritated by the inconsistencies, I treat the first one as its own standalone title and 2 and 3 as if 1 never existed (that doesn't stop them from being overall bad movies with some (admittedly good) action scenes, though!) Here's an irrationally irritating moment that doesn't involve The Matrix: In The Jackal, the titular character is shown practicing and timing the application process (and removal) of a water-soluble white paint that he intends to use to disguise his van. He paints the van and later is being pursued by baddies that want what's inside. Every drat time I see him hose off the fake paint, I hope the bad guys will just walk by the now not-white van, but the paint washing down the drain tips a bad guy off  you're the best assassin in the world goddamnit how did you forget to clean that poo poo up
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 17:47
|
|
|
God Mode posted:At the end of Contact, when everyone is giving Jodie Foster poo poo about making it all up, why didn't they just send another person through the machine immediately to verify her story? Isn't that the most scientifically rigorous thing to do? I think it was due to the fact that a multi trillion project that have failed and public view on it was probably on the rocks after that. Didn't the North American one get blown up by a terrorist? How did the terrorist get there in the first palce?
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 17:54
|
|
|
Supeerme posted:I think it was due to the fact that a multi trillion project that have failed and public view on it was probably on the rocks after that. Didn't the North American one get blown up by a terrorist? How did the terrorist get there in the first palce? He's Jake Busey. Dude can go wherever he wants.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 17:56
|
|
|
Grendels Dad posted:But that would directly contradict what we were told about the Agents and the Chosen One in the first movie, i.e. that the former, while enjoying a lot of leeway in that regard, are still bound to the laws of physics while the latter can break those laws and defeat the Agents that way. They are not bound by the laws of Physics (which would be something beyond their control), but are instead bound by the laws they wrote for themselves. They simply rewrite the base code to say that X is now possible within the framework of the code. I imagine that changing the laws of the Matrix makes it break down somewhat, or at least make certain things more likely/possible. That could potentially explain why Smith was able to grow stronger and take over as well. It also explains how Morpheous was able to fight an upgraded agent. It ALSO explains why the agents were not already upgraded before the first Matrix movie. The reason the machines would have done it was to counteract Neo, who was not bound by the rules of the Matrix anymore. Leaving the agents bound to a lower level was a losing prospect, even if removing the barriers made things harder in general.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 18:00
|
|
|
You also have to remember who says all the "You can become God" poo poo to Neo. It's Morpheus. The Oracle herself said that he believes in the concept of The One to a fault. While everyone else, including Neo, sees the limitations in him Morpheus still walks around thinking that the guy could turn everything in the Matrix into cookies if he wanted to. The Oracle knows Neo is important and powerful, the Agents are afraid of him, the Merovingian concedes he has some skill with dicking around the Matrix's code, but only Morpheus and the other faithful(Kid, the people asking to watch over their family members) think he is literally God. Wishmaster So the Djinn is about to get his third wish, freeing him to destroy the world, and the heroine Negates the movie by wishing the guy that let the Djinn out wasn't drunk that day. But to this point we've seen the Djinn twist even positive responses to questions into an excuse to gently caress up someone's life. Why didn't he just say okay, he was bombed out on opiates instead/had the shakes from detoxing?
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 22:09
|
|
|
The Duke of Ben posted:
This was another very stupid thing. The climax of the first film was Neo's transcendence of the boundaries of the system which contained him. He becomes qualitatively different from the forces opposing him; not just a little bit faster or stronger or more determined, but a different type of being altogether. The Agents can no longer stand against him because they are still bound by the system which allows them to exist, but Neo is not. So the notion that they can simply "upgrade," and once again fight him on a basis of parity is an undoing of that climactic realization. They're *still* bound by the system, but they can rewrite the system in order to engage in some needlessly drawn-out kung-fu scenes? Then who gives a poo poo if he's The One or not? The fact that Neo starts off the second movie by exchanging kicks and punches with the Agents is the first sign that the story was going off the rails. They couldn't figure out how to give Neo meaningful obstacles given his knowledge, so they had to regress him, un-transcend him, to throw the same old villains at him. Smith's different, but Smith was totally wasted, story-wise.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 22:10
|
|
|
That's my biggest gripe with the Matrix sequels. They just went off the rails concerning what they'd already established. Morpheus said that The One could rewrite the Matrix as he saw fit. He was a god - what The One willed, happened. Neo didn't gain powers to fly and stop bullets. He flew because he willed it, he stopped bullets because he didn't want to be shot. Then the sequels never really go beyond that. Being The One basically meant you got Super-Kung Fu, Bullet Stopping and Flight powers. Nothing else about bending the Matrix to his will. Instead, Neo flies and punches things. Yes, a movie about a guy who could simply will agents out of existence or teleport instead of fly would take all the suspense out of the movie, but my irrationally irritating gripe is that Morpheus was completely full of poo poo. The One just had a few extra powers over normal Matrix goers.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 22:27
|
|
|
Trent posted:I think part of the deal is that the humans of Zion aren't building those ships or EMPs. They are leftovers that they practically worship 40k style. Doesn't the old guy tell Neo that they don't even really understand how the water reclamation unit works? The councillor guy says that he specifically has no idea how the water recycling machine works, not that humanity has forgotten technology altogether. GOTTA STAY FAI posted:I've always thought about it this way--Neo's raison d'etre is to counteract Smith. When Smith gets fired, he goes rogue and begins evolving on his own. Neo keeps parity with Smith, improving along with him, rather than the legit agents. Neo is the chosen one and all, but given enough time, I bet the machines would've figured out how to take him down (without resorting to cooperating with him in order to see the dichotomy arrive at its inevitable end). Also, the machines have a pretty big advantage that gets even bigger every time Neo pulls some hocus pocus poo poo in the matrix--they can see exactly what he's doing. Any time Neo does anything in the matrix, they can analyze how he's bending the rules of the simulation and upgrade their software to combat his meddling. When you really think about it the machines don't just have an advantage, they're orchestrating the whole thing up to a point. Zion and The One only exist because machines need them to maintain the Matrix. They already know how Neo can bend the rules because there were 5 other "Ones" before him and possibly designed him to be the way he is (I don't think the movie was too clear on that last point though). It isn't really until the end of Reloaded when he refuses to serve his ultimate purpose that he becomes more of a wild card in the system rather than being part of it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 22:30
|
|
|
The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Post Your Favorite (or Request) > The Irrationally Irritating Matrix Moments Thread
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 22:54
|
|
|
Some Kind of Wonderful and The Breakfast Club: Why won't you clean your earrings? Please? I can kind of understand that in SKoW, they're new earrings and that Amanda Jones had only been wearing them for a few hours before Watts sticks them in her ears. But, in TBC, those are Claire's (possibly crusty) old diamonds. I guess Bender could have cleaned it between the janitor's closet and the field, but we'll never know because there's no earrings cam to tell the story. Also, lots of movies: Is there some reason you feel the need to shoe-horn in a complete song with lip syncing and choreography? Chick flicks are the most guilty of doing this badly. What am I supposed to be feeling during this? Because I mostly only feel really badly for the actors. Save this poo poo for the end credits.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 23:09
|
|
|
Yeah. Take a page from Dreamworks and end every movie with a dance party!
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2011 23:48
|
|
|
The forced slow motion jokes in Kung Fu Panda 2 make me want to hurt people. It's like every time the action gets a bit boring or it hasn't been funny for a while some loving twat decided to slow the action down and have Po say something rrrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllllllllllly slooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwllllllllllllly looooooooooooooooooool because that is A Hilarious Joke that will rescue whatever poo poo you've storyboarded.
|
|
#
?
Nov 22, 2011 00:03
|
|
|
Not mine, but a radio jockey was gushing about Breaking Dawn, how the romance was so tense and everything was beautiful, and all the movies have been....and then there's a pause where another dj asked her if the werewolf dude ever moved on, because gently caress man, the girl you want is loving married now. And the first dj says yeah, and there is a very awkward explanation of the werewolf soul-bonding to the newborn baby Bella just had. The newborn baby will be his new wife, as soon as she comes of age. She has no choice in the matter. And the djs pretty much laughed down the rest of the review. Even the Twilight fan said that was the breaking point for her: she loved how beautiful (and sparkly!) the vampires were and how awesome Bella was and the romance and what killed the entire series for her was trying to swallow a teenager imprinting on a baby his ex just gave birth to. And my mom still watches Once Upon A Time. Again, if the good guys make a deal and decide to break it, no big whoop. They made a promise, took an oath, and decided later to gently caress it. If a bad guy does it, then he is Super Bad. The heroes just changed their minds! And again I have a hard time seeing how the modern world is a curse of a place compared to a fantasy realm where magic exists, people can turn you to loving stone, goblins can take children, etc. No no no, OUR world is the horrible one. It's like sitting down and realizing living at Hogwarts would really be Hell. When there's potions to let people look like you or anyone else, potions to make you fall in love with someone, potions to kill your loving soul, and the rewards for living in this place include doing some magic yourself and having house trolls slave for you, I'd prefer our magicless world. At the very least roofies don't make you think you're loving your dream lover rather than the stalker down the street.
|
|
#
?
Nov 22, 2011 03:28
|
|
|
There's a great bit in "Wizard People, Dear Reader" (comedian Brad Neely's commentary track for the first Harry Potter movie) where he talks about just how annoying Hogwarts would be because of those loving stairs that are constantly moving around.
|
|
#
?
Nov 22, 2011 04:56
|
|
|
Cowslips Warren posted:Not mine, but a radio jockey was gushing about Breaking Dawn, how the romance was so tense and everything was beautiful, and all the movies have been....and then there's a pause where another dj asked her if the werewolf dude ever moved on, because gently caress man, the girl you want is loving married now. And the first dj says yeah, and there is a very awkward explanation of the werewolf soul-bonding to the newborn baby Bella just had. I already hate myself a little for defending anything Twilight-related here, but the whole "imprinting" thing isn't an arranged marriage. She does have a choice in the matter and nobody is going to force the girl to marry anyone. Of course this is a cheesy, lovely romance series so the idea is that imprinting is this mystical bond that affects her too, so when the time comes she'll want to be with him just as much as he wants to be with her. Which I guess is still a loss of free will depending on how you look at it. Of course that doesn't take away the incredibly creepy "in love with a newborn" part or the obvious attempt to make it somehow OK with the convenient accelerated aging thing. Personally I thought the stupidest part of it all was the way it was kind of implied that the only reason he was even interested in Bella throughout the earlier parts of the story was because of her future daughter. So apparently it was more like "in love with an egg cell in my friend's ovary." 
|
|
#
?
Nov 22, 2011 06:21
|
|
|
So what would've happened if the baby was a boy?
|
|
#
?
Nov 22, 2011 06:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 06:24 |
|
|
zyang31 posted:So what would've happened if the baby was a boy? You're already putting more thought into the story than the author did. Like I said, it was just kind of implied and I can't remember the exact quote that made me think that. So it's always possible I misinterpreted, but it sounds just dumb enough to be what Stephenie Meyer intended.
|
|
#
?
Nov 22, 2011 06:54
|
|