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I designed a new type of explosive trap that doesn't destroy itself (so it can be reused): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcak6Vaqyp8 Also, here're a couple more piston/redstone bugs, for those who use the stuff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCjtkSEuDVM
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Jan 30, 2012 02:49
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rubbe posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTitnuShWdU What was the music in this? It's going to drive me insane for ages if I don't figure out what it is. Was it from one of the Dreamcast Sonic games? E: VVV Thanks, knew I wasn't going mad! Waldorf Sixpence fucked around with this message at 03:36 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 02:57
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D34THROW posted:If I had a decent tileset, I think I could actually get into DF. The control scheme for DF is god awful.
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Jan 30, 2012 03:13
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Waldorf Sixpence posted:What was the music in this? It's going to drive me insane for ages if I don't figure out what it is. Was it from one of the Dreamcast Sonic games? It's the music from the fight with Chaos 6 in Sonic Adventure, so yeah, Dreamcast sonic game.
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Jan 30, 2012 03:18
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ARTS and Warcrafts posted:The control scheme for DF is god awful. Bad control schemes I can deal with. Used to play Knights of the Old Republic once in a while, and that control scheme was...horrendous, to say the least. Hard-to-decipher ASCII interfaces are beyond tolerance for me.
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Jan 30, 2012 05:19
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D34THROW posted:Bad control schemes I can deal with. Used to play Knights of the Old Republic once in a while, and that control scheme was...horrendous, to say the least. Hard-to-decipher ASCII interfaces are beyond tolerance for me. Yeah, that's not really comparible to how bad Dwarf Fortress' control scheme is. Here's the control list. You will need to memorize and use every single one of those controls to be able to play. Most menus don't allow for mouse controls. It is a game for masochists and cryptographers. Miijhal fucked around with this message at 07:35 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 07:32
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Miijhal posted:Yeah, that's not really comparible to how bad Dwarf Fortress' control scheme is. Here's the control list. You will need to memorize and use every single one of those controls to be able to play. Most menus don't allow for mouse controls. It is a game for masochists and cryptographers. "Most" meaning 99% of the menus don't have mouse controls. Do any? Does the mouse do anything at all in the game? It seems like every year I hear about some third party interface add-on application or something and they all seem to go nowhere. I really want to play DF, but I don't want to wrestle with the interface.
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Jan 30, 2012 07:37
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:"Most" meaning 99% of the menus don't have mouse controls. Do any? Does the mouse do anything at all in the game? The mouse can be used to move around the cursor, and sometimes it'll let you select designations, but it's very spotty in where it can be used or not and it ends up having to be another thing to memorise. The big third-party addon that keeps getting brought up is Stonesense, which adds a good visualisation, but unfortunately doesn't replace the interface. There's no reasonable API to hook into the menus and it's not written in a decompilable language like Java so what you can do is... limited.
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Jan 30, 2012 08:01
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Miijhal posted:Yeah, that's not really comparible to how bad Dwarf Fortress' control scheme is. Here's the control list. You will need to memorize and use every single one of those controls to be able to play. Most menus don't allow for mouse controls. It is a game for masochists and cryptographers. I think I've played combat flight simulators with different control schemes for each flyable plane that didn't have that many buttons to push. Skilled and passionate DF players now amaze me.
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Jan 30, 2012 08:21
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Miijhal posted:Yeah, that's not really comparible to how bad Dwarf Fortress' control scheme is. Here's the control list. You will need to memorize and use every single one of those controls to be able to play. Most menus don't allow for mouse controls. It is a game for masochists and cryptographers. This is not true, you don't really need to remember anything of that, just where are the things you want to do, where is the menu of the workshops and buildings, where is the menu to designate or build things, and all the keys you need are there. It's true that the control scheme and the ui of DF is an horrible nightmare but i play DF and have made LP's of it and probably i only know the 5-10 most basics keys and only because you use them constantly. Now less DF derail and more little and pretty houses:      Estel fucked around with this message at 12:02 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 11:43
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Minecraft: Dwarf Fortress Appreciation Station
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Jan 30, 2012 11:45
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Estel posted:This is not true, you don't really need to remember anything of that, just where are the things you want to do, where is the menu of the workshops and buildings, where is the menu to designate or build things, and all the keys you need are there.
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Jan 30, 2012 11:47
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Estel posted:Now less DF derail and more little and pretty houses:
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Jan 30, 2012 12:03
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Raskolnikov posted:I like it but I wonder what it would look like sphax128 on.      Don't know why the grass has that color.
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Jan 30, 2012 12:24
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You're in a swamp biome.
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Jan 30, 2012 13:00
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That's the colour grass turns in Sphax in a swamp biome. For some reason, the particular shade of green that that pack uses reacts really badly with the swamp recolouring and just looks dead. Given my house is in the middle of a swamp, it turned me quite off the pack until Optifine added the option to remove the swamp recolouring.
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Jan 30, 2012 13:00
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Lately I have this problem when using a higher res texture pack with mc patcher where random blocks have the texture stretched off the edge of the tile with random other textures on top of it. I googled a bit but couldn't find anyone else with a similar issue. Tried deleting the bin folder, forcing an update, fiddling with the patcher settings but no luck so far. Anyone know a what is causing it? I narrowed it down to something with the patcher maybe as it looks fine if I play unpatched with a higher res pack just with the normal graphical problem from doing that.
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Jan 30, 2012 13:04
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It's true... this island is really a swamp.  The island is full of crocodiles 
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Jan 30, 2012 13:15
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...Minecraft has crocodiles? Oh... Mo' Creatures?
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Jan 30, 2012 13:31
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I miss playing MC. Unless someone releases a rewrite done in a real language in the next couple of weeks I'm stuck. My netbook hasn't run it acceptably since maybe beta 1.7 and the desktop doesn't work to well without a functional motherboard. drat slow postage. I tried Terraria and it doesn't fill the MC hole 
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Jan 30, 2012 13:38
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Java is a real language. The problem is that Notch isn't a real programmer. Have you tried installing OptiFine? That's what made it playable on the Atom/Ion nettop I have running my media center.
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Jan 30, 2012 13:58
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Try running it in Linux with OpenJDK.
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Jan 30, 2012 14:59
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Estel posted:It's true... What seed / coords is that, it looks like the perfect kind of island for me.
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Jan 30, 2012 17:40
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thelightguy posted:Java is a real language. The problem is that Notch isn't a real programmer. Thank you for pointing out OptiFine, the game is actually playable on my netbook now once the chunk I'm in loads. It's better than nothing at least! Are there any other FPS increasing tricks beyond just setting everything to the minimum settings?
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Jan 30, 2012 18:15
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It's funny that "framerate" is one of the biggest problems in a game where all of the textures are in a 32kb PNG file, the world and collision is all cube-based, and there are usually a dozen maximum enemies at any given time. My laptop should run this poo poo at 2000fps.
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Jan 30, 2012 18:24
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Bellend Sebastian posted:What seed / coords is that, it looks like the perfect kind of island for me. Seed: 67263629 You spawn on this island but here are the coords: X:-93,6 Y: 65,6 Z: 213
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Jan 30, 2012 18:49
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Estel posted:Seed: 67263629 Thanks, spawned right on it. This is perfect. 
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Jan 30, 2012 19:10
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Notch's current project?
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Jan 30, 2012 20:23
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EDIT: ^^^^^^ This is perfect. Polo-Rican posted:It's funny that "framerate" is one of the biggest problems in a game where all of the textures are in a 32kb PNG file, the world and collision is all cube-based, and there are usually a dozen maximum enemies at any given time. My laptop should run this poo poo at 2000fps. I don't know how this didn't raise any red flags earlier in development. Or right before launch, actually.
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Jan 30, 2012 20:25
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HardDisk posted:I don't know how this didn't raise any red flags earlier in development. Or right before launch, actually. "It's a beta! They're making a lot of new features. And sure, they've sold a lot of copies, but that means they can afford to hire some *top* talent!" "It's a... well poo poo."
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Jan 30, 2012 21:02
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Spectral Werewolf posted:Notch's current project? Replace water with money
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Jan 30, 2012 21:03
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Polo-Rican posted:It's funny that "framerate" is one of the biggest problems in a game where all of the textures are in a 32kb PNG file, the world and collision is all cube-based, and there are usually a dozen maximum enemies at any given time. My laptop should run this poo poo at 2000fps. If you couldn't freely change the landscape at any time, it would in fact run really well. But you can so it can never run as well as anything with immutable enviroments.
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Jan 30, 2012 21:13
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Install Gentoo posted:If you couldn't freely change the landscape at any time, it would in fact run really well. But you can so it can never run as well as anything with immutable enviroments. Can anyone explain, in non-programmer terms, why this makes such a difference? I don't understand why the game would run that much different. I mean, for the most part, the player is the only one changing the landscape? It's not like there's erosion or something constantly altering the landscape without the player being involved.
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Jan 30, 2012 21:14
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Install Gentoo posted:If you couldn't freely change the landscape at any time, it would in fact run really well. But you can so it can never run as well as anything with immutable enviroments. I'm not sure how true this is. Firstly, "immutable environments" is kind of a stretch when all we're talking about is breaking 1x1x1 meter cubes. It's not like the game should need to calculate any sort of physics or anything on each block. And even if the game is, for some reason, grinding math for every single block on every single frame, wouldn't it be easy-ish to write a script so that math is only executed on blocks within a certain radius of the active players?
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Jan 30, 2012 21:26
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Shnakepup posted:Can anyone explain, in non-programmer terms, why this makes such a difference? I don't understand why the game would run that much different. I mean, for the most part, the player is the only one changing the landscape? It's not like there's erosion or something constantly altering the landscape without the player being involved. Imagine a brick wall. In a normal game that wall is one piece, with a brick texture on it. In Minecraft, every brick is its own object, with its own texture. In the first case, you've got one set of data to describe the whole wall. In Minecraft you have the same amount of data for every single brick in the wall.
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Jan 30, 2012 21:26
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Polo-Rican posted:I'm not sure how true this is. Firstly, "immutable environments" is kind of a stretch when all we're talking about is breaking 1x1x1 meter cubes. It's not like the game should need to calculate any sort of physics or anything on each block. It's not a stretch at all, if the environment never changed, all the collision data, and lighting, and such as you're going about could be pre-calculated and things would run faster. It makes no difference that they're 1 meter cubes, it only matters that every cube can be changed, and changing the size or shape would just change how much extra processing power is required. They already do that and it's still running slow for you isn't it?
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Jan 30, 2012 21:32
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The Yellow Ant posted:Imagine a brick wall. In a normal game that wall is one piece, with a brick texture on it. In Minecraft, every brick is its own object, with its own texture. Imagine that brick wall has an open door in it. In a normal game, that door is a portal that defines the boundary between this room and that room. If the portal isn't visible, that room doesn't have to be drawn at all. In Minecraft, you're in one infinite room and there are no portals you can use to make that decision. Imagine that door-free brick wall again. In a real game, the player can't ever get behind that wall. The wall doesn't have a back and there's nothing at all behind it. In Minecraft, the world goes on forever and there's never not something behind something else. pseudorandom name fucked around with this message at 21:35 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 21:32
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Shnakepup posted:Can anyone explain, in non-programmer terms, why this makes such a difference? I don't understand why the game would run that much different. I mean, for the most part, the player is the only one changing the landscape? It's not like there's erosion or something constantly altering the landscape without the player being involved. I'll have a stab at it, as a programmer I'm corrupted. There are a few reasons that MC is slow besides being poorly programmed and in java. Imagine you are in your favourite FPS. Ever seen through the landscape for whatever reason? Your world is a wafer thin artifice. The game only needs to check dynamic objects like you, other players, random crap etc. against each other and this landscape. It's a bit more complex with the newer games with destructible terrain but forget them for now. In MC your world is not a shell. It's a world full of an utterly insane amount of cubes. These cubes are in a sense new world voxels except they aren't stored in a nice static immutable CPU non-intensive pre calculated tree. They are held in a massive chunk of memory. A voxel is like a 3D pixel, dig? It's an atom. The smallest component in the MC world. We have all these cubes on cubes, 128 (I think?) deep and shooting off as far as your render distance goes. That is a lot of cubes that the computer needs to remember and keep track of. It also needs to work out which ones are visible to the player and render accordingly, and recalculate the lighting whenever conditions change. I believe there is also a "tick" where all the loaded blocks are scanned. If there wasn't lighting wouldn't update, lava and water wouldn't flow, and redstone wouldn't work. The whole system is brute forced in MC. It takes a lot of resources to manipulate all that crap. Did I mention that air is also all blocks? i can go into other reasons but that's a good start and I have to go now. Just quickly, Optifine didn't really help me. I tried it a few days ago. I also haven't found much difference between Sun Java in Win7 starter and OpenJDK in linux. Yes my netbook dual boots, and Windows is really only there for the very occasional game and because my netbook came with it.
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Jan 30, 2012 21:33
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The Yellow Ant posted:Imagine a brick wall. In a normal game that wall is one piece, with a brick texture on it. In Minecraft, every brick is its own object, with its own texture. This is the annoying thing about having Notch at the helm. I do a bit of programming but I'm not a programming genius by any means. And even at my level I see a lot of workarounds that would dramatically raise performance. It wouldn't be too hard to write a script that searches for adjacent blocks of the same type and replaces them temporarily with larger objects. To use your brick wall as an example—imagine a 9x9 brick wall. The script would quickly spot that these 81 brick blocks are all of the same type, and it would replace the 81 bricks with a single 9x9 brick wall that looks identical. The player wouldn't notice, but the game engine would go from grinding 81 separate objects to 1. And if you used this same method for every block in the world, yeah, you probably could cut the number of objects by 80% or more. And it would probably only add like 7 seconds to the initial world generation time. Then, if the player started to whack a 9x9 brick wall, the engine would swap out the 9x9 object for 81 individual bricks. Once the brick was broken, the system would again scan for chunks of blocks and replace. This is basically a very, very simplified version of how jpeg compression works. edit: I edited my post while you were typing yours. The process I described could totally occur during world generation. The result would be a world that looks and acts identical to a minecraft world but is composed of many, many, many, many fewer active objects. vvv Polo-Rican fucked around with this message at 21:40 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 21:34
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Polo-Rican posted:This is the annoying thing about having Notch at the helm. I do a bit of programming but I'm not a programming genius by any means. And even at my level I see a lot of workarounds that would dramatically raise performance. That script you propose wouldn't actually fix stuff going slow though. You're introducing an extra routine that needs to run for every render cycle and needs to check everything to make sure it can be jammed into an object and needs to handle you leaving an area and going somewhere else etc. In fact, it would probably make the game run worse if it already runs bad for you. Polo-Rican posted:I edited my post while you were typing yours. The process I described could totally occur during world generation. The result would be a world that looks and acts identical to a minecraft world but is composed of many, many, many, many fewer active objects. Except that wouldn't make anything faster. And everything would have to be broken back to regualr minecraft blocks again as soon as you did anything to them. IF all you do in Minecraft is wander around and don't modify the environment it would MAYBE run faster using that but it can't help if you change things. Nintendo Kid fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 21:38
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