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Jmcrofts posted:Just finished up my programming exercise for the job I'm currently applying to. It went great, I passed first try! I'm surprised you didn't give up when you couldn't Google the answer 
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Dec 17, 2012 19:16
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Chasiubao posted:I'm surprised you didn't give up when you couldn't Google the answer Nah I mostly berated the interviewer for JUST WANTING ME TO THINK LIKE THEM.
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Dec 17, 2012 19:19
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A little tip for anyone starting out: Stand up and shake the interviewer's hand when he or she enters or exits the room. The number of grads or intern applicants who don't do this is notably high at my company, and it's a little worrying. It is the easiest thing to get right in terms of showing you are a human being and not some sort of robot everyone would hate to work with.
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Dec 18, 2012 00:30
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Yeah we've straight up declined candidates who while they had the right technical chops, were very laissez-faire about the whole thing. So, in addition to the formalities like shaking hands and dressing nicely, if you're being asked to present something on a whiteboard, don't sit in a chair and kick back and just motion in the general direction of the board. Stand up and talk to your audience as if you were, you know, doing it for a job.
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Dec 18, 2012 00:47
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Draft is incoming. Don't know what the official offer is, but the position is mine.
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Dec 18, 2012 00:59
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No Safe Word posted:dressing nicely And before we end up with another multi-page debate on the subject: just loving ask when scheduling the in-person interview. Some places are expecting a suit, some places are expecting slacks and a button down shirt, some places are expecting a polo shirt and jeans. It never hurts to ask, and when in doubt opt for a suit. I think that covered the entire debate, right guys? 
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Dec 18, 2012 02:14
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gucci void main posted:Draft is incoming. Don't know what the official offer is, but the position is mine. A YOSPOS/CoC success story  ! Congrats.
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Dec 18, 2012 03:44
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Need some advice on baby's first Wordpress freelance. So I scored a pretty big fish, and they want a quote soon, but I just don't know what price to give them. It's a Wordpress re-skin of 9 pages plus an addition of 6 new themed pages. They also want to add a myriad of new plug-ins (I counted around 10 or so), a load test for an anticipated 500,000 monthly page views, some data re-mapping, and site registration that integrates with their e-mail marketing CMS. I usually bill hourly at $35-$45, but don't have a good estimate of the length of the project. I can get a Wordpress site up from nothing to fully functional and looking pretty in 2-ish weeks of full-time dedication at work. So how long would a site like this take to do for you guys?
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Dec 18, 2012 03:58
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I don't really know if this is the right place to ask this, but here it goes: I'm a college junior majoring in CS, and want to get some real-life experience now that I've finished my core/intro courses and am on the verge of choosing a track (Systems, Graphic Design, AI etc.) Internships require a CV, obviously, but what can I write on my resume when I have done nothing but taken classes? Should I just concentrate on taking on a few personal projects until I have something tangible on my list of accomplishments before asking around?
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Dec 18, 2012 04:41
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Ask around anyway! I got an internship with no prior applicable work experience, and my method was mostly "inquire anywhere and everywhere". If you have any projects from class or that you did on your own that you think would show you know your stuff, maybe them or some code samples online somewhere for people to see? I think most colleges give you some free online hosting, mine did. Don't let your inexperience deter you from trying! Jmcrofts fucked around with this message at 04:57 on Dec 18, 2012 |
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Dec 18, 2012 04:54
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UnfurledSails posted:Internships require a CV, obviously, but what can I write on my resume when I have done nothing but taken classes? If any of your classes have had large projects, those can be worth putting on your resume. One of the things that got me my internship and now full-time job offer was the final project for a course I took on parallel computing, where I built a distributed, scalable, elastic web server. Another one was building a fully-functional social networking website for a web applications course. But yeah, personal projects are always good. Don't be afraid to throw yourself out there right now though. Having an internship is an absolute godsend when looking for a full-time job, and out of how ever many nets you cast, you only need one to bring back a fish. And apart from career fairs and the like, you can try talking to your professors and seeing if they have any connections that might be looking for people that your professor can vouch for. That's how I got my internship--my parallel programming professor was friends with a venture capitalist who sent me through to a bunch of his portfolio companies, one of which offered me the internship. In the end, companies are going to realize that when you're looking for your first internship, you don't have any work experience, by definition. So the best you can do in terms of getting practical experience is working on significant projects, either in-class or out. Do that, put them on your resume when you feel like they're complete enough, but until then it can't hurt you to put yourself on the market as you are now.
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Dec 18, 2012 06:39
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Ithaqua posted:And before we end up with another multi-page debate on the subject: just loving ask when scheduling the in-person interview. Some places are expecting a suit, some places are expecting slacks and a button down shirt, some places are expecting a polo shirt and jeans. It never hurts to ask, and when in doubt opt for a suit. Well, you forgot "and some places literally would prefer you come in wearing what you wear every day, so long as it's clean."
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Dec 18, 2012 08:37
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I need your advice, this thread. I've been doing odd freelance jobs and short-term contracting for the past year or so, mostly relatively simple web programming or whipping up a custom GUI for an existing database. It has made me very good at quickly acquiring a working knowledge of new concepts, APIs, languages, etc., and left me with some very glowing testimonials, but none of the problems I've had to solve have been very difficult or impressive. Although I was near the top of my class in college, my experience still leaves me very much at a junior level, keenly aware of all the gaps in my knowledge and all the things I haven't used. I'd like to get a more stable job, though; at the very least, I don't know how much longer I can stand having to search for clients myself, an extremely stressful process that seems highly dependent on luck (I know there is a difference between networking and black magic, but I don't think I could tell you exactly what it is). The problem is, I feel like my fundamentals have atrophied, I have forgotten enough jargon to make me suspect that I will mangle most of what I do think I remember, and I haven't left a single publicly available line of code behind. While I know I'll work through the rust on all of that after a week or three of daily use on a non-toy project, I worry tremendously that my resume and interview performance will be indistinguishable from that of a huckster or common idiot. What can I do to make getting back into the game go smoothly? What's the best way to say "I am trainable?" How should I label the four-column list on my resume with all the technology that I have used enough to comprehend the core concepts and make with them a specific thing that works, but not enough to have attained fluency? What are the polite ways to tell an interviewer "I know what you're talking about but I don't know the name for it," or "I don't recognize the word you have just used but I do know these important things about the context in which you used it?" Bongo Bill fucked around with this message at 11:09 on Dec 18, 2012 |
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Dec 18, 2012 10:41
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Bongo Bill posted:I need your advice, this thread. Everyone says it all the time, but really, get a Github account if you don't have one already and just do some Euler problems or tutorial stuff until the syntax starts to come back to you. If I've learned anything, it's that programming is not like riding a bicycle; you will most likely forget some of the most minor syntactical details in a language/library if you don't use it for a while, and there's nothing necessarily wrong with that because it's almost 2013 now and you can look up any information which you forget. I'm sure you're more than capable of picking those things back up if you've used them before, and it probably won't take as long as you think. I can't stress enough how bad my own account likely is. There's nothing effectively "completed" on there aside from a few individual Euler problems, and even then it's more about the fact that you give enough of a poo poo to try and make some of your code visible, even if it isn't perfect. Anyone who knows what Github is (or Codeplex or some such equivalent) and can push their code to it is already ahead of at least half of other job applicants. Many job postings even state that having one puts you ahead in line. The fact of the matter, too, is that unless you're already well-established, you have to be seen by people with half a brain when it comes to development. For perspective, I'd been varying between Dice, Indeed, Craigslist, and the like for the last six or so months; maybe more, really, looking for some type of entry/junior level environment. In that time, I had a grand total of one interview (through a recruiter) which took an hour each way to get to due to traffic, and the two owners I spoke to hadn't even looked at my resume or any reference materials. The entire thing was a joke. I joined SO Careers maybe five or so weeks ago, and used it in a serious manner (i.e. actively applying to numerous roles) for perhaps a grand total of a week out of that time, and already have a confirmed offer hopefully coming in today. It's simply the best resource I've come across to date because people using it have direct access to your reference work and actually care about said work instead of sounding utterly confused when you say "I have a Github account with code samples you can look at."
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Dec 18, 2012 14:35
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Another venue for people jobhunting- go to user group meetings. Meet other like-minded people, etc, there are people that go to these meetings specifically because they're looking to hire someone interested/experienced in X-technology at the monthly X Meetup.
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Dec 18, 2012 18:10
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Just to give an update on my plight, I got the interview! Final step of the process! Now to spend all winter long celebrating and/or worrying.
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Dec 18, 2012 22:06
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Offer in $45k, 15 paid vacation days, 5 sick days, no health insurance. Get hosed
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Dec 19, 2012 01:09
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gucci void main posted:Offer in  No health insurance? How did you respond? I hope it was by laughing in their face. Seriously that is less than a lot of people make while on co-op in inexpensive cities.
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Dec 19, 2012 01:22
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gucci void main posted:Offer in My god, that's terrible even in the cheapest of living environments. It's borderline insulting.
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Dec 19, 2012 01:26
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Ranma posted:
No Safe Word posted:My god, that's terrible even in the cheapest of living environments. It's borderline insulting. The company "doesn't offer insurance" and I'm going to lose my parents' within a couple of years. I'm debating just countering with 85-90 to compensate for the lack of health insurance and if they don't do it then they can gently caress off. I can find another position here doing what I do now making almost as much as I would there, at a quarter the cost of living. Someone tell me the kindest way that I can do this, if one even exists.
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Dec 19, 2012 01:35
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gucci void main posted:The company "doesn't offer insurance" Haha, what? Why are you applying to this company? gucci void main posted:Someone tell me the kindest way that I can do this, if one even exists. I would honestly not even bother countering with an offer like that unless I really had no other (better) options.
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Dec 19, 2012 01:39
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gucci void main posted:I'm debating just countering with 85-90 to compensate for the lack of health insurance Counter with 90 with health insurance.
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Dec 19, 2012 01:40
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Just got a verbal offer at 8PM from a mid-size software firm right after I submitted my thank you e-mail. The recruiter even mentioned my thank you e-mail as if it was the final trigger. I can't stress enough the importance of sending thank you e-mails and 'asking' for the job at the end of the interview. Especially if you're not a rockstar or anything like myself
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Dec 19, 2012 03:03
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Rurutia posted:I would honestly not even bother countering with an offer like that unless I really had no other (better) options. Yeah. Even if it was a cold day in hell and they actually went along with your counter of $90K, you would still end up working for a company run by a bunch of cheapskates. Also, your coworkers would probably be idiots, because you'd have to be one in order to accept an offer like that.
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Dec 19, 2012 03:27
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gucci void main posted:Offer in Agreeing with everyone else. That's just insulting!
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Dec 19, 2012 04:43
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The only reason they're doing that is because there was some guy straight outta college who looked it over and thought, "yeah, maybe that's what I deserve in compensation", and they're trying to pull another fast one. Don't let them pull that fast one, neither on you nor any future sucker. Counter-offer.
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Dec 19, 2012 04:46
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Sometimes companies just can't really pay that much but $45K is pretty low. Is this a really big company? Otherwise I'm not sure I would counteroffer unless it's for like $65K. If you are really looking for $90K they're probably not going to meet you there.cheese eats mouse posted:Need some advice on baby's first Wordpress freelance. If all you're doing is this it's probably not going to take you more than 2 weeks, I would say 3 weeks give or take for the load testing. But again it's dependent on your actual skill and what they actually mean when they say they want "plug-ins" and "load testing" because it's never what you think it is. PS. I would bill them at $100+/hour
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Dec 19, 2012 04:52
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It's a company which is owned by a parent company and they're billing themselves as a poor startup with limited capital or something, even though they've signed on an incredibly major client to utilize the new product. I sent an email initially asking for $10k more, but sent another saying that, after further consideration, because there are no health benefits or relocation benefits, that I want closer to 80k. No one close to me seems to believe me when I said that they were offering a jokingly low salary, but I don't give a poo poo. I am not giving up my whole life for a salary I can make here cleaning up computers, even if the job experience is good. I just won't be happy trying to pinch pennies every month. The employment is also listed as being At-Will (which scares the poo poo out of me with regards to their attitude) with a 90-day probationary period where they can fire me for any reason. So if I'm earning a pay at what they're offering, if they decide to shitcan me for some inexplicable reason, I'm absolutely hosed because I won't be able to save away that much.
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Dec 19, 2012 05:47
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gucci void main posted:The employment is also listed as being At-Will (which scares the poo poo out of me with regards to their attitude) with a 90-day probationary period where they can fire me for any reason. Well, all employment is at-will. That's not some unusual thing and it's really quite ridiculous when you look at other countries where that's not the legal situation. The "90-day probationary period" is pretty much legally redundant.
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Dec 19, 2012 05:55
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Suspicious Dish posted:The only reason they're doing that is because there was some guy straight outta college who looked it over and thought, "yeah, maybe that's what I deserve in compensation", and they're trying to pull another fast one. I took a job out of college a bit over 5 years ago for $45k, but it came with full benefits and around 60% time to do whatever I wanted.
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Dec 19, 2012 06:29
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I know the "how much are you looking to make" question has been covered, but what about the "what did you make at your last job?" part? The pay at the job I start tomorrow is pretty sorry--although the interviewer was nice enough to admit to it upfront--but I think it will be a good opportunity. But I don't want a future HR person to use it to lowball me. Is a blatant redirect like, "it was along market value," or, "it was fair for entry-level," a good enough answer? Oh, also, I know they don't count for much in Github as a standalone, but since Euler problems came up again: for algorithmic problems like that, is it better to have 'simpler' code that takes more lines but shows the approach to solving things, or is it better to bust out some baller moves like a .map or .inject and wrap it all up in a neat package? Or does it depend on the job and HR won't know the difference anyway so just get some stuff up there that works and be ready to explain it? Sorry, I'm well acquainted with long periods of unemployment and I don't want any more of them after this internship!
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Dec 19, 2012 07:07
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Since this is probably a better place to ask than the Business subforum, what level of annual benefits are you guys getting right now in terms of pension, retirement funds, company shares, stock. I'm trying to gauge what's normal for software these days (please temper your cali/ny anecdotes with reason). Pretty much exited new-grad status, and am looking for creative ways to consider bumping up compensation soon (have other strong offers recently but my company is awesome and I want to make it work). I'm in Canada, so the landscape is probably different in many ways, but in my (not one of the major metros) city, pensions are unheard of, except for government. I don't have RRSP-matching at the moment, but my non-publically traded company gives out a particular dollar-value of shares as a bonus, ballpark $1-5k depending how long you've been here (I don't fully understand how their valuations are determined, plan to cash any bonus I get into RRSPs anyways). $1k for transit and a bunch of other things in that range that aren't really significant in the grand scheme of things. Full family health and dental coverage, I pay 10% of the premium cost (which seems typical for employee to pay, $58/mo). I'm not expecting anyone to be getting pensions (not being in soul-crushing government might be making me miss out on a lot of money... since the salaries there seem to be pretty good pensions aside), but I'm particularly interested in company contributions to retirement funds (IRAs in the states?), or stock and shares you guys are getting. I'm wanting to get into some sort of 5% of salary company-matching RRSP contributions among other things, which seems reasonable. Pweller fucked around with this message at 08:24 on Dec 19, 2012 |
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Dec 19, 2012 07:27
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Sutureself posted:I know the "how much are you looking to make" question has been covered, but what about the "what did you make at your last job?" part?
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Dec 19, 2012 08:34
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shrughes posted:Well, all employment is at-will. That's not some unusual thing and it's really quite ridiculous when you look at other countries where that's not the legal situation. The "90-day probationary period" is pretty much legally redundant. What do you mean? Ridiculous good or ridiculous bad? (I'm from a country with actual labour laws so I might have a different perspective than you)
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Dec 19, 2012 08:51
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gucci void main posted:It's a company which is owned by a parent company and they're billing themselves as a poor startup with limited capital or something, even though they've signed on an incredibly major client to utilize the new product. Poor startups have to give their employees significant equity to make up for the fact that they can't pay market wages. Even if this company went along with your demands for reasonable pay, it will be a lovely place to work, with mostly mediocre to bad co-workers who couldn't get better offers elsewhere.
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Dec 19, 2012 09:31
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Sutureself posted:Oh, also, I know they don't count for much in Github as a standalone, but since Euler problems came up again: for algorithmic problems like that, is it better to have 'simpler' code that takes more lines but shows the approach to solving things, or is it better to bust out some baller moves like a .map or .inject and wrap it all up in a neat package? Or does it depend on the job and HR won't know the difference anyway so just get some stuff up there that works and be ready to explain it? Realistically, I don't think anyone will care much about the content of your Euler solutions. Their best value in job-hunting is that they give you practice solving self-contained coding problems of the type that frequently come up in interviews. If you really want to help yourself out, trying implementing and debugging them on a whiteboard, and only checking your work on a computer after you're convinced it's correct.
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Dec 19, 2012 09:37
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Sutureself posted:I know the "how much are you looking to make" question has been covered, but what about the "what did you make at your last job?" part? The pay at the job I start tomorrow is pretty sorry--although the interviewer was nice enough to admit to it upfront--but I think it will be a good opportunity. But I don't want a future HR person to use it to lowball me. Is a blatant redirect like, "it was along market value," or, "it was fair for entry-level," a good enough answer? quote:Oh, also, I know they don't count for much in Github as a standalone, but since Euler problems came up again: for algorithmic problems like that, is it better to have 'simpler' code that takes more lines but shows the approach to solving things, or is it better to bust out some baller moves like a .map or .inject and wrap it all up in a neat package? Or does it depend on the job and HR won't know the difference anyway so just get some stuff up there that works and be ready to explain it? Write production quality code, which usually means making it as readable as possible. Sometimes that means putting in extra lines, and sometimes that means reducing the number of lines. Make sure you name things properly, that is huge.
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Dec 19, 2012 15:21
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Sutureself posted:Oh, also, I know they don't count for much in Github as a standalone, but since Euler problems came up again: for algorithmic problems like that, is it better to have 'simpler' code that takes more lines but shows the approach to solving things, or is it better to bust out some baller moves like a .map or .inject and wrap it all up in a neat package? Or does it depend on the job and HR won't know the difference anyway so just get some stuff up there that works and be ready to explain it? Make it look like it's written in the language you're using. In the case of Ruby, map and inject aren't "baller moves," they're just the way things are done. The baller move in Ruby would be to write tests first, and have a proper directory layout, Gemfile, etc. In JavaScript, you're probably going to want a memoized for loop instead of anything fancy, because that's what the community has settled on (to the extent that CoffeeScript implements iterators as memoized for loops). HR won't know the difference, but a technical interviewer will, and if the interview's going well they'll be quite interested. Additionally, make sure you know and can refer to your public repos without too much searching. The last interview I did (over Skype) had me linking to particular files and methods while I explained the reasoning and logic of them.
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Dec 19, 2012 15:56
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I got a text message -- which I assume is in response to my counter-offer -- asking me to a call when I get a chance. I'd also like to note that I woke up this morning to the realization that I'm not even being offered a 401k, nor is it even mentioned that I would have such an option after a specific amount of time.
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Dec 19, 2012 16:00
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gucci void main posted:I got a text message -- which I assume is in response to my counter-offer -- asking me to a call when I get a chance. Don't even bother. There's something really wrong with that company -- a text message is in no way an acceptable way of contacting a potential employee. On top of everything else, it's just another really bad sign. Do yourself a favor and tell them to gently caress off (politely).
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Dec 19, 2012 16:12
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