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Power of Pecota posted:Well, that knocks Mahiru out of consideration for me - I can't imagine she'd take the photos that close to the timer-planned AC thing, if only because more uncertainty would benefit a murderer. Uh Hanamura was around he popped back up after coming back the from the Kitchen and freaked out about Togami's death. Peko I just Don't see doing the crime. Nagito hase quite a few things that make me suspect him and Kuzuryuu is no were to be found but I believe he was hiding in the bathroom. (Peko could have also gotten into the bathroom in time so quite)
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Feb 27, 2013 06:22
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The knife under being taped under the table just points to the cook, in my mind. I think it was Nagito who planted the knife and orchestrated the blackout because he was the one with the most opportunity to plant a knife in the room. However, I think that somehow the cook found out about Nagito's plan, maybe he secretly saw Nagito plant the knife, and so that's how the cook knew to be waiting under the table with the skewer, our real murder weapon. However, things don't go exactly as planned! The lights go out, as Nagito arranged, but Togami whips out his night vision goggles and sees Nagito making a break for the table. Togami rushes under the table before Nagito can get there and attempts to get the knife so that Nagito can't kill anybody. However, the cook was under the table the whole time, waiting for Nagito (assuming that he knew it was Nagito who planted the knife) or whomever to run for the knife. He then seizes on the chance to kill whomever went for it when he heard them rip the tape off the knife. So the multiple stabs are explicable either by panic or by thoroughness. Either he was scared and kept going or he wanted to be sure he got his target in spite of the darkness. e: Also Hanamura might be freaked out by Togami's death because he expected to kill Nagito. I'd probably freak too if instead of a guy I saw who was obviously planning a murder I wound up killing the one dude on the island who was doing a drat thing to prevent them.
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Feb 27, 2013 06:31
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DaveWoo posted:One more piece of evidence Togami wasn't planning to murder anybody: he was wearing a white suit. I mean, who tries to murder somebody while wearing a white suit? Especially with that little knife. No way he could pull that off unless he is secretly a Super Highschool Level Ninja. Hang on. Since the knife could not of stabbed Togami, it must have somebody elses blood on it. Togami may have used it to slash under the floorboards at the murderer. They would have cuts somewhere on their body. Dean of Swing fucked around with this message at 06:36 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 06:33
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It looks like the point of Gundam losing his earring was so the game could give exposition on how there were floorboards with gaps a skewer could fit through, and he might find the way under the floorboards soon if he's looking for his pin, which will help clear things up. Don't think he actually has any relation to the murder. Assuming the way to under the floorboards is out-of-room, it's probably nobody who was in the actual room, but if there's a way in under the carpet in the room or something, that would both explain why Mikan (Tsukimi? I forget which one we're using) tripping over was a plot point and would make anyone in the room a suspect. Dean of Swing posted:Hang on. Togami does have one wound significantly bigger then the others. Considering what the series has thrown at us before, this could be two different people attempting murder, or Togami finishing himself so that nobody else would have to die after the trials, or any number of things. Dragoon Cody fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 06:36
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One thing to note is that the only person who has spoken with Kuzuryuu lately is Peko. I hesitate to say that she is the murderer this early, but she was absent from the party and is the only person who has really interacted with another person who was absent. That seems terribly suspicious.
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Feb 27, 2013 07:21
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Multiple people posted:Nagito planted the knife, but Hanamura made the kill I thought this was ridiculous at first glance, but it does make a lot of sense. Both of them were away from the group for a long time to do their own thing, which may have crossed in the kitchen/dining area. The bit about Togami seeing Nagito paw for the knife under the tablecloth also makes sense, as does Hanamura getting stabby the moment he hears something above him. Assuming the missing skewer is the murder weapon, Hanamura would have had ample opportunity to hide it. However, the only way Hanamura could have done it is if he had some secret method to get under the cabin quickly, and I haven't seen any secret kitchen passage under the cabin. Maybe he intended to somehow get beneath the cabin earlier and get stabbing, but couldn't find his way in the dark (hence his shock at finding Togami dead under the table). True, Mikan tripping over could indicate a passage underground, but unless Hanamura has his own pair of night vision goggles, I think it's unlikely. But Peko? Not only is she a master swordswoman, but she disappeared right before the party. Perhaps she somehow caught wind of Nagito's plan (maybe the dude likes to monologue when he's alone?), and decided on pretty much the same plan as Hanamura. Hiding under the cabin before the planned blackout, she finds herself with a stroke of luck- Hanamura's hidden skewer. She uses it to implicate the chef (who's freaking out that someone might have done his job for him, but left the evidence behind), but her unfamiliarity with the weapon and Togami's bulk causes her to stab wildly to try ensure she kills the guy.
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Feb 27, 2013 07:21
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Waffleman_ posted:Alright, how the gently caress can this be relevant? The one other thing I haven't noticed anyone mention (apologies if I missed it) is that the knife is pretty clearly a kitchen knife and not (for lack of a better term here) a combat knife. It has a wooden handle with the little hole at the base of the hilt for hanging on a hook instead of a grip more typical of a knife intended for weapon use. Edit: thinking about it, I can't really come up with sound logical reasoning for Nagito to have been a secret co-planner of the party even with him just happening to have the lots made up for cleaning duty; I'm scratching that idea. TheGreatGildersneeze fucked around with this message at 07:35 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 07:24
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I dunno why some people are saying you need Souda's kind of knowledge to cause that black-out. You definitely don't need to know how something works to be able to break it.
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Feb 27, 2013 08:10
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Justin_Brett posted:I dunno why some people are saying you need Souda's kind of knowledge to cause that black-out. You definitely don't need to know how something works to be able to break it. He is the only one who could cause the blackout without some initial trial and error. That doesn't necessarily mean it was him.
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Feb 27, 2013 08:24
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Justin_Brett posted:I dunno why some people are saying you need Souda's kind of knowledge to cause that black-out. You definitely don't need to know how something works to be able to break it. You do need time to test out the conditions for creating a blackout though, which means Nagito and Hanamura are (somehow) even more suspicious now.
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Feb 27, 2013 08:26
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  Thirty degrees Celsius indoors. That's 86 degrees Fahrenheit.Wow, someone really wanted some roast. (Good lord, game. Those "compromising position" CGs had better turn out to be relevant in the trial because this is utterly ridiculous.)
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Feb 27, 2013 08:30
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What is that lower right setting? SMING?
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Feb 27, 2013 08:38
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Krinkle posted:What is that lower right setting? SMING? It's "SWING". The swing setting is how much to the temperature should be allowed to vary. 
Color Printer fucked around with this message at 09:00 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 08:41
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MonsterEnvy posted:Uh Hanamura was around he popped back up after coming back the from the Kitchen and freaked out about Togami's death. Peko I just Don't see doing the crime. Nagito hase quite a few things that make me suspect him and Kuzuryuu is no were to be found but I believe he was hiding in the bathroom. (Peko could have also gotten into the bathroom in time so quite) No, go back and look over the day - when the lights came back on, he wasn't around. After people split up and explored/looked for Togami/found Chiaki and Monomi he was back to freak out at the body's discovery.
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Feb 27, 2013 08:53
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I just saw an episode of Case Closed today where a culprit caused a blackout by setting up all appliances to go off at the same time. Funny how this works out. The killer is probably Nagito though and if not him it's Souda but I don't want it to be Souda as he has tons of potential to be awesome. Also as for Togami's death photo (I'm not sure if this was pointed out already or not) one wound is significantly bigger than the others, I'm guessing he was Skewered before he was stabbed.
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Feb 27, 2013 08:54
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So it seems to me that Togami wasn't trying to kill anyone. The lights went out and he was prepared for it only because he was prepared for any disaster, he got his goggles out and was looking for wrong-doers. Someone else planned the blackout and prepared a glowy knife to easily find, grab and shank someone with. Still not sure how Togami was lured there, why Togami was targeted, or who did it. e: My reasoning is that you don't need glow in the dark paint AND night vision goggles, you'd use one or the other. Powerfrog fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 08:58
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orenronen posted:
 Nagito, what the hell? There's being an astute reader of character, but what the hell about Hinata says that? We know it's the case having had private access to his thoughts, but he hasn't been forthcoming about it to anyone else far as I can see (I did a quick ctrl-f for "Hope's Peak" over the old updates. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here). e: I was going to guess that Togami accidentally knocked Mikan down as he was moving towards the crime-table, but if that happened she should have said so, shouldn't she? Everyone's positioning during the photos suggests that might have been what happened, but if she claims to have been caught by the edge of the carpet and not shoved, maybe not. Other than that, nothing's very different from how I was expecting investigation to go, so I'm itching to investigate some place else. Falls Down Stairs fucked around with this message at 10:10 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 09:59
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We both have special feelings toward Hope's Peak Academy... don't we?
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Assume for a moment, for the sake of argument, that Nagito didn't place the knife under the table while setting up. How, then, did it get there without his knowledge? The most likely answer would seem to be that there is an opening in the floor under the table (probably right under where Togami's now lying), and the killer went under the floor to plant it there in secret. So--now we have the blackout. The killer crawls under the table, knowing that the knife is there. Togami, wearing the night-vision goggles, sees him/her and pursues. The killer, having been warned by Togami's shout, drops through the opening under the floor, leaving the knife. Togami goes under the tablecloth, sees the knife, and while he's distracted, the killer stabs him from below with the skewer. Plausible?
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Feb 27, 2013 10:18
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Dragoon Cody posted:It looks like the point of Gundam losing his earring was so the game could give exposition on how there were floorboards with gaps a skewer could fit through, and he might find the way under the floorboards soon if he's looking for his pin, which will help clear things up. I think this too, but also possibly that there's a fairly wide gap between the floor and the ground, and that the gaps between the boards are not wide enough for a Gundam-sized hand to fit through them. These are all things we may need to wind up knowing. Personally, my money is on either Mikan (who easily could have orchestrated her own fall) or Teruteru (who has a mountain of evidence against him). I do wonder if it's going to turn out that the Mikan evidence bullet will be that she could have seen something while she was falling or on the floor that the others couldn't have seen. Also, a lot of people were calling out the aircon power surge trick (which is really very clever) as needing a certain level of tech smarts, but I actually think it could point to Teruteru as much as anyone else. Anyone who's cooked in a home kitchen in Japan knows how easy it is to knock out the power. At my place, if I run the oven and the stove at the same time and then vacuum, boom.
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Feb 27, 2013 10:24
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So wait...when Nagito said that they needed someone who could hear, who were they talking about?
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Feb 27, 2013 11:22
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Oxygen Deficiency posted:So wait...when Nagito said that they needed someone who could hear, who were they talking about? I was slightly thrown off by this as well, but I think he's either referring to Ibuki (because she's familiar with sound and music) or Owari (because she seems to have good senses in general).
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Feb 27, 2013 11:24
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ApplesandOranges posted:I was slightly thrown off by this as well, but I think he's either referring to Ibuki (because she's familiar with sound and music) or Owari (because she seems to have good senses in general). Yeah, it was like "so we need someone with good hearing eh? Yo, Camera Chick!..."
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Feb 27, 2013 11:36
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Oxygen Deficiency posted:So wait...when Nagito said that they needed someone who could hear, who were they talking about? The only possibility I can think of is Monomi, who says in update 20 that she overheard the students' conversation and that she's vewy proud of her ears. She was outside the lodge, though, so her ears would need to be very good indeed to be of any help.
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Feb 27, 2013 12:41
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Oxygen Deficiency posted:So wait...when Nagito said that they needed someone who could hear, who were they talking about? Didn't Ibuki straight-up say that even if she can't trust her eyes, her ears are still the best around? I distinctly remember this.
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Feb 27, 2013 13:04
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 Hmmmmm... Nagito is already really suspicious, and he looks even more suspicious in this photo. He's standing right near the aircon and not far at all from the lamp end of the table where the knife is stashed, and instead of getting into the party, it looks like he's seriously lingering around that spot. Maybe he was glancing at the timer expecting it to go off soon, wanting to be ready to grab right for the knife as quickly as possible. If Nagito really does turn out to be guilty of either murder or attempted murder, I'm going to go one further and guess that he's the drat mastermind cause his whole story gets more fishy with every update. As the viewers, we know that his SHSL Good Luck story is some kind of bullshit. If he'd really been Naegi all along, he'd have good reason for his bullshit. But the height difference and personality difference suggest that he's not. And he's not only stolen Naegi's SHSL Good Luck act. He's also stolen Naegi's SHSL Hope act. What if this is completely on purpose and he stole his fake anagram name off of Naegi too? He goes on so, so much about hope this and despair that that it feels like another straw-man routine, like Monomi might be. Whether or not it's Nagito though, this murder game so far seems to be designed by someone who must have been familiar with Junko's run. Having school trials to begin with couldn't be a standard part of the SHSL Despair playbook, since Junko's own twin sister wasn't in on that plan beforehand. Monobear's remark about the estranged sister routine might be just an in-joke to us as viewers, or it could be an in-joke the mastermind's making to themselves since they've also watched DR1's reality show all the way through. This would mean they had to know about Togami from the start. This would be reason to target him first. So instead of trying to blackmail people or betray a convenient twin sister, what if this mastermind decided to have things done right by doing it themself? They could get the murder games started while eliminating Togami, thus killing two birds with one stone. And as the one in charge of the elaborate and showy execution devices, the mastermind could easily fake their own death after letting themselves get found guilty. (then if it's Mr. Let's Still Have Hope,Guys! who's found guilty, it would be extra despair-inducing...) Sorry, I know this is way too early to speculate so far, but Nagito is just so drat fishy I can't think about anything else right now. Also, I'm just kind of hoping this is right cause it'll be like my favorite DR1 fanart sort of becoming true: 
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Feb 27, 2013 13:15
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Mahiru's demeanor points to her being indirectly responsible for Togami's death somehow. What if she was actually the one who planted the knife? (likely as a paranoid self-defense measure) And the person Togami was talking to ("Oy, what are you doing? Stop it") was her after she had panicked and went to retrieve the weapon and Togami came to investigate. When and how she would've gotten away with planting the knife I'm not sure, but this scenario just makes the most sense to me.
Bonfiesta fucked around with this message at 19:23 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 13:22
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I wonder - maybe the glow-in-the-dark paint was intended to be a lure, maybe Togami saw it and went under the table. * * * I don't think Hanamura did it, because one of the lines in the blackout was "Huh, it's not just in the kitchen too?" If he was the killer, he'd have to be speaking that from beneath the floorboards. He might be able to get away with that since he's naturally short, someone realizing that the voice was coming from under the floor is not something a clever killer would take a chance on. This floorboard killer is clever. If it was a clever Hanamura, he'd be best to remain silent. On the other hand, Hanamura's line in the scene from when the power was out is odd because when the lights came back on, he was not apparently in the room. Why would he wander back to the kitchen in the dark? Waffleman_ posted:Alright, how the gently caress can this be relevant? OOOOOHHHHHHH...... I know! Assuming we get testimony of the dialogue in the blackout from our musician, It can be used to prove that Hanamura was not in the room despite his line: He never gave a reaction to the embarrassing pose, and he would have for sure. If Hanamura did it, he is wearing a chef's coat, he could have a spare, and the kitchen has water to wash off his hands and face.
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Feb 27, 2013 13:38
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That AC is suspicious as gently caress. Maybe, since the place was under construction, the electrical system wasn't properly set up, and the AC caused the circuit breaker to poo poo itself?
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Feb 27, 2013 14:20
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Or it's just an old decrepit lodge with wiring that can't withstand ten kerbillion cameras and TVs on top of running an AC and basic electricity. Even if the MBTVs are run on a separate grid (which would make sense), this place hasn't been touched for a long-rear end time, so if it's not age its disuse. The kitchen is either run on gas powered appliances, and simply using all the lights plus the AC would kill the juice, or a fully running electric kitchen is sapping so much power merely turning on a fan would bring everything down.
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Feb 27, 2013 14:48
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You guys can keep throwing your theories around - I'm just happy we still get super funky investigation music.
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Feb 27, 2013 14:54
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Ikoroshia
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The only thing about the fanservice shot that could be interpreted as relevant is that Mikan may have been in the path of Togami and him knocking her over at speed plots out a route for him to get to the table. I'd suspect this line is from Mikan:orenronen posted:
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Feb 27, 2013 15:02
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Waaah! Don't step on my feet!
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If Nagito had been in the lodge all day, it's plausible he tried to turn on the AC while he was cleaning, but found that for whatever reason, it tripped the breakers, which gave him the inspiration for a murder plan.
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Feb 27, 2013 15:02
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Southy posted:The only thing about the fanservice shot that could be interpreted as relevant is that Mikan may have been in the path of Togami and him knocking her over at speed plots out a route for him to get to the table. I'd suspect this line is from Mikan: Actully that Line is from Saionji. I recognize her voice.
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Feb 27, 2013 15:49
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Going back to my theory I posted earlier about Togami getting Skewered first. I think the culprit decided to hide the Skewer under the floorboards and when he lifted up the carpet to hide it, it caused Mikan to fall. The reason the knife is there is probably to frame Peko. So my entire theory goes like this. Nagito used his super high school level good luck to get drawn in to prepare for the party (He could have cheated as well but the point is to make it look like it was random) and while preparing for the party he set up the house for a blackout hide a skewer and a knife under the table. After the black out Togami got his night vision goggles out and noticed the glow in the dark paint coming from the table and he went to investigate, it was then that Nagito stabbed him with the skewer and moved his body under the table afterwards he stabbed him again 7 more times with the knife. He then needed to hide the Skewer so he lifted up the carpet causing Mikan to fall and put the Skewer between the gaps in the floorboards. The knife was left intentionally the frame peko.
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Feb 27, 2013 16:05
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In the photos the vast majority of people are enjoying the party, but if the stabs came from underneath that allows everyone in the room to have an alibi. Peko strikes me as being too proud to not use her sword in a direct fashion, but Hanamura would definitely seem stressed enough to attack Togami. Plus he had access to the skewers and knives.
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Feb 27, 2013 16:23
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Rith posted:The only possibility I can think of is Monomi, who says in update 20 that she overheard the students' conversation and that she's vewy proud of her ears. She was outside the lodge, though, so her ears would need to be very good indeed to be of any help. I'm also thinking Monomi is the one referred to. Perhaps she could hear someone crawling around underneath the lodge?
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Feb 27, 2013 17:38
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Yetika posted:
They're on a tropical island. They need the AC mainly to keep the humidity down. Or that's just the last setpoint and whoever set it up knows just switching it on shuts things down. Although I'm not discounting the idea that this was an accidental outage or not done by the perpetrator. I don't see a good reason Chiaki isn't getting more suspicion. "I have to go talk to a magical talking bunny that never gives a straight answer" does not sound like a valid alibi to me. We haven't seen motive, although from DR1 most kills didn't need that pre-trial either. If Togami was killed from underneath, as seems likely, who would have the foresight to secrete themselves down there, or figure such things out, or decide they needed to kill?
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Feb 27, 2013 17:54
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Kangra posted:We haven't seen motive, although from DR1 most kills didn't need that pre-trial either. If Togami was killed from underneath, as seems likely, who would have the foresight to secrete themselves down there, or figure such things out, or decide they needed to kill? Uh probably Nagito since he was the one who spent the whole day there, so he probably had all the time to inspect the place, know where the power circuit was, glue that knife to the table, etc etc Now that I think of it Nagito SHSL Good Luck actually helped him draw the short stick to clean the place  But like you said the biggest problem is the motive really! I can't think of any reason for them to kill eachother without obvious motives like money in DR1.
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Feb 27, 2013 18:02
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The murder weapon was the lamp and the murderer was Varg Vikernes.
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Feb 27, 2013 18:07
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If Togami was stabbed from below, I guess that means whoever was under the floorboards didn't intend to kill him. Maybe they attempted to sneak out and try and kill Pekoyama or Chiaki? It seems like they'd plan for the lights to go out, and plan to go under the table where the knife is... but they probably didn't intend for Togami to don night vision and follow them. So Togami gets his night vision, sees someone under the table, and the person - having been caught - stabs him instead... somehow without getting blood on themselves. Also if there's a blackout and you leave behind your luminous stuff, how do you see to sneak out under the floor, come up through another room and maybe rejoin everyone in the main room without bumping into Souda who's on his way out? (Unless the killer is Souda, of course, but doing all this in the dark is still really difficult, it'd seem.)
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Feb 27, 2013 18:10
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