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ACanofPepsi posted:I know this is the Eva thread, but could somebody familiar with the series give a one-sentence description of Cowboy Bebop? I'm sort of interested in it but all the descriptions of it are very generic and the name is silly but I've heard it's great. The best.
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Jun 19, 2013 16:59
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I gave Cowboy Bebop a shot a long time ago, but couldn't get into it.
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Jun 19, 2013 17:09
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There's also Outlaw Star, I haven't watched it in a real long time but I remember it being a rip off of Cowboy Bebop. I thought it was alright.
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Jun 19, 2013 17:12
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I'm not as much in love with Cowboy Bebop as most of ADTRW either, but I can't think of a better general-purpose introductory anime. Maybe Jojo's Bizarre Adventure for somebody you already know is a huge nerd, but it takes like four episodes to warm up and you need a certain tolerance for gore. Or a Ghibli film, but that's just cheating. I know a guy who showed a friend of his Evangelion before anything else; I'm torn between envy at not getting to see their reactions, and wanting to call him out for being a dick. 
Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Jun 19, 2013 |
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Jun 19, 2013 17:25
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I'm not as much in love with Cowboy Bebop as most of ADTRW either, but I can't think of a better general-purpose introductory anime. Jojo's Bizarre Adventure comes close, but it takes like four episodes to warm up and you need at least a little tolerance for gore. After watching a couple episodes of Blood-C, and Attack on Titan, i'm all set for gore in anime (keep in mind I rarely ever watch anime). Those two shows are incredibly disturbing. There might be way worst, but for me those are the two big ones i've personally watched that were extremely violent.
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Jun 19, 2013 17:28
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I said come in! posted:After watching a couple episodes of Blood-C, and Attack on Titan, i'm all set for gore in anime (keep in mind I rarely ever watch anime). Those two shows are incredibly disturbing. There might be way worst, but for me those are the two big ones i've personally watched that were extremely violent. It's nowhere near as lurid as Blood-C. Jojo's is pretty violent but it's all very surreal and funny, and mostly restricted to the undead anyways.
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Jun 19, 2013 17:32
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Nate RFB posted:It's not so much the premise of Cowboy Bebop that makes it special but rather the impeccable execution, production values, and style. It's kind of like the Chrono Trigger of anime where a lot of great talent collected briefly to make something wonderful. This is how I'd go about describing it. It is not so much about the premise itself or even about its characters, but because the animation and music are incredible, and a lot of effort went into making even the smallest of details mesh into a greater whole that is oozing with style.
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Jun 19, 2013 17:35
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It's nowhere near as lurid as Blood-C. Jojo's is pretty violent but it's all very surreal and funny, and mostly restricted to the undead anyways. I had a pretty wired start with anime too. First non-Ghibli anime was Redline which my friend wanted me to watch with him. Then because I thought that was pretty cool, he sat me down and I watched Eva 1.0 and 2.0 on his computer. Later on, he convinced me to watch Jormungand and then I went on autopilot from there. As far as Cowboy Beebop goes, I agree that its a fantastic introduction show. Maybe I might have appreciated it more if I saw it earlier on, but it's still a top tier show regardless of what I think of it.
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Jun 19, 2013 17:48
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It's nowhere near as lurid as Blood-C. Jojo's is pretty violent but it's all very surreal and funny, and mostly restricted to the undead anyways. Sooo, kind of like the Hellsing OVAs I've seen, then?
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Jun 19, 2013 17:50
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Wade Wilson posted:Sooo, kind of like the Hellsing OVAs I've seen, then? Nah. Hellsing is overwraught ultra-violence and the author indulging in his fetishes. JJBA is vampires named after hair metal bands arguing about the merits of warrior's honor with a New York City street punk in a universe where every era, from the Victorian age on down, looks inexplicably like the eighties.
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Jun 19, 2013 18:06
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Nah. Hellsing is overwraught ultra-violence and the author indulging in his fetishes. JJBA is vampires named after hair metal bands arguing about the merits of warrior's honor with a New York City street punk in a universe where every era, from the Victorian age on down, looks inexplicably like the eighties. Isn't there something about bread, too?
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Jun 19, 2013 18:06
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If you're looking for gratuitous violence and a good show, definitely try Baccano! (! Is part of the name, which doesn't mean anything) Its has a massive cast of batshit insane bad rear end killers. Every character is interesting and the non chronological storytelling is nearly perfect
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Jun 19, 2013 18:25
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Looking at all these references makes me realize how infrequently I recommend NGE to anyone, which is kind of weird since I'm a huge fan of the series even pre-Rebuild. But I tend to recommend Cowboy Bebop, or Baccano! or TTGL. Which is kind of weird since so much of my enjoyment of TTGL was in being a direct response to NGE and the tone it set for series through out the 90's and early to mid 00's and someone who hasn't seen NGE isn't going to get so much of that.
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Jun 19, 2013 20:48
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ViggyNash posted:If you're looking for gratuitous violence and a good show, definitely try Baccano! (! Is part of the name, which doesn't mean anything) It also has probably the best dub of any anime ever. One of the few where it's definitely better to watch the english dub than the japanese.
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Jun 19, 2013 21:50
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Zahki posted:It also has probably the best dub of any anime ever. One of the few where it's definitely better to watch the english dub than the japanese. I'm bummed that I only found out about that just after watching the show, but it does make sense that a show about American gangsters in the 1930's would have better English VAs than Japanese VAs. I'll have to put that in my things to watch eventually folder.
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Jun 19, 2013 21:58
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HoneyBoy posted:Space cowboy bounty hunting in the future.
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Jun 20, 2013 02:58
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AmiYumi posted:No, skip the first episode - go straight for the second. Episode one tries to establish poo poo and be all serious, while episode two lets you know what you're really in for with Cowboy Bebop. Go back later if you like it. Episode one is one of the best, you are crazy. One of Bebop's strengths is its ability to balance serious drama and comedic adventure.
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Jun 20, 2013 03:03
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AmiYumi posted:No, skip the first episode - go straight for the second. Episode one tries to establish poo poo and be all serious, while episode two lets you know what you're really in for with Cowboy Bebop. Go back later if you like it. Don't actually do this. ^ Also if you're talking about it trying to be serious, there's plenty of moments throughout the show that get quite heavy. Oh and you'd miss out on that sick Asimov fight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bsfmki2KNtA
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Jun 20, 2013 03:18
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Asimov is fuckin great https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd3uVFQX3AY I still remember the adult swim bumps fondly 
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Jun 20, 2013 03:25
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Rerailing the thread a bit... I've kind of given up on trying to explain the 14 years timeskip until Rebuild Final comes along. Even then I'm not expecting much. Personally I've settled on : "There was a clusterfuck between the UN, Nerv, SELEE and Angels." Anyway, after having read the end of the manga, I'm really leaning towards a timeloop of some sort... The direction of Rebuild 3 is really something. There's a lot of visual queues in the way the shots are framed and the visuals are used. For example... The first time Shinji tries to speak with Rei Q, in her quarters, it's all done in shot/reverse-shot. It's a hint that they really, really don't connect. In the middle of the scene, they finally have a shot with both of them in it. It's when Shinji understands that Rei Q wouldn't know what Misato is up to. Shinji's voice also changes to emphasize the framing change. It's funny that Shinji connects, for lack of a better word, with Rei Q on something they know nothing about. Then afterwards it goes back to shot/reverse-shot. Later in the movie, when Shinji has his mental breakdown, he has his back turned to Rei Q when he's talking to her. There's just so much demonstration in the visuals that they don't connect. I love it. Gendo is always in center frame, except when he's with his, more or less, equals (GNR, SELEE and Fuyutsuki). I also noticed he's hovering at SELEE's level when Fuyutsuki shuts down SELEE. Dunno if it means he already integrated/used the Key to the Nebuchadnezzar but there's definitely something there, even if it's just to drill home that he's the equal of SELEE, and thus the "King" when SELEE goes silent. How do you represent the idea of being liberated/free through music ? Motherfucking horses galloping, that's how. That's how you do a montage. And then when Shinji finishes thinking about his music sessions with Kaworu, he's back to depression. It's really the high note of the movie for him. I hope we see the piano again in Rebuild Final. Wille's blue scarves vs. NERV's red logo. Oh, oh, I get it ! They're adversaries right ? The 13th apostle was Judas. He's the one who betrayed Jesus. Kaworu, even more so than in the other versions of NGE, is portrayed as a Jesus/Buddha/Saint figure. Of course the 13th Eva was to be used in a betrayal against Kaworu. Seems obvious in hindsight. One of the things that I would have liked to see are shots ala Citizen Kane of some building always at the same place. And yeah I get that there aren't any buildings left to do that in the first place. In the end, Kaworu's last words are about memes, besides the "I'll see you again". This might be a commentary to the audience here, but I mean really ? That's your last thoughts to Shinji ? Way to drop the ball there Kaworu. How about a message of love to our soon-to-be catatonic protagonist ? Admit it Kaworu, you never loved Shinji. 
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Jun 21, 2013 05:59
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bof_man posted:The 13th apostle was Judas. He's the one who betrayed Jesus. Kaworu, even more so than in the other versions of NGE, is portrayed as a Jesus/Buddha/Saint figure. Of course the 13th Eva was to be used in a betrayal against Kaworu. Seems obvious in hindsight.
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Jun 21, 2013 06:12
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Arujei posted:Err, not so much. Judas was one of the original 12, and after his suicide, the others drew lots for his replacement - Matthias. Since we're quoting Bible verses... Hebrews 3:1 : Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus. I was taught that Judas was the 13th Apostle (and yes, 12th disciple) so I thought it fit.
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Jun 21, 2013 06:23
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bof_man posted:Since we're quoting Bible verses... You were taught wrong, then, Judas was one of the original 12 and Paul/Saul was the 13th (with Matthias replacing Judas, as already mentioned). Also, that verse has gently caress all to do with whether Judas was an apostle or not.
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Jun 21, 2013 11:26
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Wade Wilson posted:You were taught wrong, then, Judas was one of the original 12 and Paul/Saul was the 13th (with Matthias replacing Judas, as already mentioned). Also, that verse has gently caress all to do with whether Judas was an apostle or not. But the verse does have to do with whether Jesus is considered one of the Apostles, which would change the numbering. Granted, outside of that verse I've never seen anyone list Jesus as an Apostle, but I don't think Evangelion is necessarily interested in Christian lore at that level of detail. The word Apostle means someone who goes out, and Jesus was going out from divinity to live with humans? Even come the fourth film we probably won't know exactly why they chose the number 13 for that Eva, but it's fun to think of reasons and the fun thing about interpreting fiction is lots of readings can work, even ones that weren't intended. It's a prime number, and in my opinion prime numbers are better than divisible ones. There are twelve Archons in some Gnostic traditions so it could signify their bro the Demiurge. Although I guess Eva 13 would be the 14th Eva, wouldn't it?
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Jun 21, 2013 16:33
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Wade Wilson posted:You were taught wrong, then,  Abitha Denton posted:but it's fun to think of reasons and the fun thing about interpreting fiction is lots of readings can work, even ones that weren't intended. I understand 13 is a loaded number in many other religions as well and there's other meanings in there, like the Demiurge you mentionned. No wonder Anno seemingly skipped a couple of Evas and went for the full package with Eva-13. And I guess it's no coincidence Kaworu falls to number 13 too. Just to do a small parallel, Bardiel is the 13th Angel in the anime, and there's elements of betrayal about this Angel as well, though I guess not as specific as what happens in Rebuild 3. On another note, did anyone notice how huge Eva-06 is ? Was it that size to being with or was it the corruption from the 12th Angel ?
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Jun 21, 2013 18:30
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Maybe I've watched Evangelion so many times that I'm just seeing it everywhere, but I'm watching The Big O and wowzers I'm seeing a lot of weird parallels and similarities. I mean cripes in this one episode someone literally said to the guy "Then why do you pilot it?"
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Jun 22, 2013 00:46
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The R in R. Dorothy Wainwright stands for Rei.
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Jun 22, 2013 00:58
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I've never seen Big O. I keep meaning to get around to it because I loved the 90s Batman as a kid, but somehow I keep forgetting to queue it up.
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Jun 22, 2013 01:08
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Dred Cosmonaut posted:Episode one is one of the best, you are crazy. One of Bebop's strengths is its ability to balance serious drama and comedic adventure. [Edit: I have never gotten someone interested in Cowboy Bebop by showing them the first episode, BTW. Not once has it worked.]
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Jun 22, 2013 02:53
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Pierson posted:I've never seen Big O. I keep meaning to get around to it because I loved the 90s Batman as a kid, but somehow I keep forgetting to queue it up.  Big O is a really great show, even with the eva-level insane second season. The show is american as hell, it really has a distinctive New York noir/jazz atmosphere that you would be a fool to dislike. Roger smith is Bruce Wayne, there is no other way to describe him, all the characters are great, and don't even get me started on Big O itself  . As you can probably tell I like Big O a lot, please watch it (in english)AmiYumi posted:Y'all are forgetting that episode 2 is "Bad Dog, No Biscuits". Everyone you know is terrible because Asteroid Blues is a loving great episode with everyhting that makes bebop great; space mexico/western style, jeet kun do gun fights, blues/jazz soundtrack totally on point, Spike and Jet playing off each other, humor, the works man. Its a fuckin' great first episode because it showcases nearly everything your gonna get over the next 25 episodes. And Stray dog Strut is a good episode, but its no "Gateway Shuffle" or "Cowboy Funk".
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Jun 22, 2013 03:30
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I just finished watching this show for the first time. I have never been so enraged by a TV show than when they play the it was all a dream in the last episode. Even if baloney pony is awesome. I would watch the wacky high school antics version of Eva in a heartbeat Smoking Crow fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Jun 22, 2013 |
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Jun 22, 2013 03:56
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Big O has an absolutely fan-loving-tastic dub too.
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Jun 22, 2013 04:18
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And a great opening theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8fw51qtTY4
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Jun 22, 2013 04:22
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Smoking Crow posted:I just finished watching this show for the first time. I have never been so enraged by a TV show than when they play the it was all a dream in the last episode. Even if baloney pony is awesome. It's not "all a dream," although there are plenty of other reasons to be mad at the TV ending. (Personally I don't think there are many good ones, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. )Anyways, watch the movie, it overlaps or replaces episodes 25 and 26 depending on who you ask.
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Jun 22, 2013 04:35
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It's not "all a dream," although there are plenty of other reasons to be mad at the TV ending. (Personally I don't think there are many good ones, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. I liked the rest of the ending, it's just my blood pressure spike when Asuka said that she was Shinji's best childhood friend. It just seemed so...anime, you know? I don't think that I would like an action ending to the series, though. It was so not about Gendo's stupid plot that anything with the Angels and SEELE would just destroy the show for me. Smoking Crow fucked around with this message at 04:51 on Jun 22, 2013 |
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Jun 22, 2013 04:40
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Smoking Crow posted:I just finished watching this show for the first time. I have never been so enraged by a TV show than when they play the it was all a dream in the last episode. Even if baloney pony is awesome. Except that wasn't the ending. That was Gainax suddenly becoming assholes and cutting Anno's budget because he refused to continue making the shounen mecha that everyone wanted it to since he had his own idea in mind when he wrote Eva, so he made those last 2 episodes off of bread and water. Just the fact that they had even a modicum of substance is worth praising, but the fact that they actually manage to finish the concept he wanted to create, albeit with relatively mediocre quality, is an homage to how good a director Anno is. It isn't the way he wanted to finish the story, but it did make the point he'd wanted to make.
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Jun 22, 2013 04:57
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Was it "Suddenly Gainax were assholes" or Gainax having no funding since the late 2nd half of the series when their funding was pulled from sponsors?
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Jun 22, 2013 05:55
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Gainax has never been that good at handling money and Anno was a co-founder of Gainax so I don't think it's the former!
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Jun 22, 2013 06:17
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Tae posted:Was it "Suddenly Gainax were assholes" or Gainax having no funding since the late 2nd half of the series when their funding was pulled from sponsors? Money issues, they also ran out of time and also tossed away completed work.
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Jun 22, 2013 06:47
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Srice posted:Gainax has never been that good at handling money and Anno was a co-founder of Gainax so I don't think it's the former! What series besides Eva have they lost work due to money issues? Kare Kano was an issue with the manga author and Gunbuster was done black-and-white on purpose (One animator I talked to said the way Gainax did the last episode was more expensive than what they did in the previous ones).
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Jun 22, 2013 07:33
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