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Eonwe posted:I feel like working in their office is probably a pretty great experience. It seems like anytime anyone has an idea they try it out. I don't know why I was so impressed by that area on their housing plot that was like a testing ground / trial for the telegraph system. Its a fun little mini game with no real pressure from party members and it seems like a fairly tough tutorial to get people better at using the telegraph system. I hope they give us a lot of options for that slot. Being able to spawn in a hologram of a boss you have killed and have it do all the telegraph attacks so you can practice outside of dungeons/raids would be a welcome feature imo. Or perhaps a scaling difficulty system that just spam you with telegraphs until you get hit and give you a score based on time spent in there. The possibilities are endless!
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Sep 2, 2013 18:49
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Having an unfairly difficult telegraph machine in the home instance could be fun, where you could practice without the pressure of wiping the raid on you. I feel like there is a lot of potential minigame things that could be done.
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Sep 2, 2013 19:00
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New webcomic posted today! http://www.wildstar-online.com/en/media/comics/mystery-mayhem-001.php
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Sep 6, 2013 23:42
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Photobucket killed the OP. This game looked great at PAX. I was signing up for their beta and won a GeForce GTX 660 TI in some weird little spin the wheel app at the end of the signup. Nerolus fucked around with this message at 06:01 on Sep 10, 2013 |
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Sep 10, 2013 05:58
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Apparently, they are playing with the idea that during (certain) weekends, there will be no limit on how many people you can bring into a raid instance meaning you can end up with hundreds of people in the same instance. These raids will also have special loot and will hopefully be available for testing during BETA. Another thing that was mentioned was that not only raidbosses, but also 5-man bosses will have a rare drop that let you summon that boss as a guardian in your warplot.
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Sep 10, 2013 11:26
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Uhrm posted:Apparently, they are playing with the idea that during (certain) weekends, there will be no limit on how many people you can bring into a raid instance meaning you can end up with hundreds of people in the same instance. These raids will also have special loot and will hopefully be available for testing during BETA. The ability for griefing and/or hijinks with this is amazing and despite all the reservations I have about the game, I would put up with it just to see what goons can do with these things. 
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Sep 10, 2013 17:15
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Warplots sound like the coolest drat thing and I really wish they would talk about them more. A home base for the guild from which they can go out and sack other guilds bases? That sounds awesome.
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Sep 10, 2013 18:53
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So we have some info about the amount of instanced PvE content. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6YAGWFwQko At the end of the interview Frost mentions that the game is slated to launch with four dungeons and two raids. This seems to be freaking awful nerds out something fierce. Keep in mind that not only is raid content randomized week to week, each dungeon has multiple modes and difficulties, each with varying tiers of additional rewards based on your success. 
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Sep 10, 2013 19:41
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Three leveling dungeons, one end game one. One 20 man raid, one 40. Super curious on their gear progression struction, and how much longevity they're going to milk outta that.
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Sep 10, 2013 20:46
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Carbon Deity, so you are telling me that no amount of content will make the raiding elite happy and that perhaps it is a mistake to cater to such a grognardy crowd? Color me surprised.
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Sep 10, 2013 21:02
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Eonwe posted:Carbon Deity, so you are telling me that no amount of content will make the raiding elite happy and that perhaps it is a mistake to cater to such a grognardy crowd? Color me surprised. Personally I'm passing on Wildstar until it goes F2P. According to my mmo longevity formula that should be about thirty seconds after launch.
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Sep 10, 2013 21:39
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Didn't they claim they were allocating around half their development resources towards endgame content? Even with the difficulty variances and randomizing elements, 2 raids at launch seems really lackluster considering how much they were promising in regards to endgame.
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Sep 10, 2013 21:39
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Three leveling dungeons? What? How many levels are in this game again?
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Sep 10, 2013 23:36
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50 levels, but since all dungeons have "level cap difficulty", why bother tuning all of them for people still leveling? Besides, there should be tons of stuff to do in the open world. Also, do you really want the same leveling experience as in WoW where you grind 1-89 in dungeons?
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Sep 10, 2013 23:51
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Variety is the spice of life. While I complained about the requirement of forced grouping in leveling content in the FF14 thread, it would be nice to have dungeons as options for when you want to do group stuff. For me it boils down to choice, I want the final in say what content I want to consume in an mmo in order to progress.
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Sep 10, 2013 23:58
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The guy said something about "adventures" that were a type of levelling group content.
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Sep 11, 2013 01:18
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Dracula Factory posted:The guy said something about "adventures" that were a type of levelling group content. Yeah, this'll become clearer once we officially "announce" Adventures, but the true number of group instanced content is much more than 3. More like 10 plus raids.
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Sep 11, 2013 03:04
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Pryce posted:Yeah, this'll become clearer once we officially "announce" Adventures, but the true number of group instanced content is much more than 3. More like 10 plus raids. Is the same dungeon but with harder hitting/beefier mobs or a timer really unique content?
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Sep 11, 2013 05:55
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Uhrm posted:50 levels, but since all dungeons have "level cap difficulty", why bother tuning all of them for people still leveling? Besides, there should be tons of stuff to do in the open world. Also, do you really want the same leveling experience as in WoW where you grind 1-89 in dungeons? I really don't understand why reusing leveling dungeons at max level isn't the MMO standard yet. For the low price of re-balancing and -itemizing the dungeons you could get a ton of "new" content. I have the same problem with FF14. That game has 12 leveling dungeons, with relatively small effort they could add an rear end-ton of max-level content (the lack of which a lot of people are already complaining about).
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Sep 11, 2013 07:33
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Double Bill posted:I really don't understand why reusing leveling dungeons at max level isn't the MMO standard yet. For the low price of re-balancing and -itemizing the dungeons you could get a ton of "new" content. I'd rather they spend time honing gameplay and polishing the UI than cramming weak, watered down content in for launch (looking at you FFXIV). There will plenty to keep people occupied while they level, and they have already stated that they are going to release content monthly. Even with a relatively small dungeon selection at launch, it seems like WSO has more to do than most MMOs hands down.
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Sep 11, 2013 13:34
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Carbon Deity posted:I'd rather they spend time honing gameplay and polishing the UI than cramming weak, watered down content in for launch (looking at you FFXIV). There will plenty to keep people occupied while they level, and they have already stated that they are going to release content monthly. Even with a relatively small dungeon selection at launch, it seems like WSO has more to do than most MMOs hands down. But isn't this this the same promise that is made before every MMO Launch?
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Sep 11, 2013 13:52
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BexGu posted:But isn't this this the same promise that is made before every MMO Launch? Content schedule? Monthly content doesn't seem far fetched at all. GW2 is deploying bimonthly content and they have a really small dev team. Maybe I'm drinking the Kool-Aid by letting myself get excited over an upcoming MMO, but WS seems to have the right stuff. The last one I got hyped over was GW2 and they're going strong and still growing their player base a year after launch.
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Sep 11, 2013 14:09
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That is true, but it took GW2 about a year to finally get the bi-monthly stuff out with fun and interesting content. And the first part of the Living Story was HORRIBLE. I would not expect anything new really for the first month or so that is not already in the game at release. While the team might have some plans for the first months all the DEV resources are going to go to fixing bugs and server issues. BexGu fucked around with this message at 14:23 on Sep 11, 2013 |
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Sep 11, 2013 14:20
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Uhrm posted:Also, do you really want the same leveling experience as in WoW where you grind 1-89 in dungeons? I prefer to grind different dungeons to max level then grind quest so yes? Having only 4 leveling dungeons does suck pretty hard.
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Sep 11, 2013 16:54
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Zasraik posted:Is the same dungeon but with harder hitting/beefier mobs or a timer really unique content? Totally different content. Think "Choose-Your-Own-Adventure" (HAHAHA GET IT?!?!?!?), where the group gets to choose which paths through the instance they want to take, and therefore which content they want to experience (more combat? Less combat? More puzzles? Less rescue/escorts?). It's actually tough to explain without showing it; I had to play through one myself to fully understand what we were doing with it.
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Sep 11, 2013 17:33
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I only ask that you guys implement it well, instead of the half assed way Anet did it with GW2. Their dungeons were and still are a huge mess of unbalanced, unfun things.
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Sep 11, 2013 17:39
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Lyer posted:I only ask that you guys implement it well, instead of the half assed way Anet did it with GW2. Their dungeons were and still are a huge mess of unbalanced, unfun things. Pretty much this. If the dungeons are unfun, pointless, and generally suck, I couldn't care less if there are fifty of them at launch. If we're talking about an MMO with real lasting appeal I'd much rather them get the mechanics right at launch and build on top of that instead of stacking poo poo to the ceiling.
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Sep 11, 2013 18:28
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Lyer posted:I only ask that you guys implement it well, instead of the half assed way Anet did it with GW2. Their dungeons were and still are a huge mess of unbalanced, unfun things. I don't think GW2 will ever get it right because it not using the traditional Tri-Force (Tank, Heals, DPS). WS is keeping that so I think the implementation will be ok.
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Sep 12, 2013 03:45
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Mosthated posted:I don't think GW2 will ever get it right because it not using the traditional Tri-Force (Tank, Heals, DPS). WS is keeping that so I think the implementation will be ok. The traditional trinity was tank heal and crowd control, dps were second class citizens like they deserve.
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Sep 12, 2013 03:47
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malhavok posted:The traditional trinity was tank heal and crowd control, dps were second class citizens like they deserve. DPS replaced crowd control like ten years ago due to games making CC roles pointless and introducing DPS checks that were guaranteed failure if the check wasn't passed. Which sucks, since the reliance on DPS output as a fight tuning metric has caused shitloads of other problems, but such is life.
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Sep 12, 2013 04:35
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Flarestar posted:DPS replaced crowd control like ten years ago due to games making CC roles pointless and introducing DPS checks that were guaranteed failure if the check wasn't passed. Which sucks, since the reliance on DPS output as a fight tuning metric has caused shitloads of other problems, but such is life. I don't see how a system that force dps to carry their own weight is a bad idea. Having to endure a 30 minutes + bossfight that should be over in 5 because 50% of the raid (or more) decide to play badly belongs to vanilla WoW, not a modern MMO. Besides, nearly every encounter that require some coordination has some sort of tank/healer check mechanic so why should dps get away with not having to pay attention when it's already the easiest role to fill in a group? Edit: I'd like to know what these problems you talk about are.
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Sep 12, 2013 10:44
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Mosthated posted:I don't think GW2 will ever get it right because it not using the traditional Tri-Force (Tank, Heals, DPS). WS is keeping that so I think the implementation will be ok. This has nothing to do with why some of GW2's dungeons are not fun. The main problems with their dungeons have been that too many bosses are huge sacks of HP, a lot of the telegraphs suck assuming they exist at all, and too many mechanics are boring. Today, this is not always the case. Some of the dungeons have been given a lot of love since launch and I enjoy them now, but overall there is still a lot to be desired. Wildstar at least looks like they got the telegraph thing down and assigning appropriate HP to bosses is easy enough to do. What is a complete mystery to us right now is how much fun the bosses and even the trash are to fight. If they screw that last part up then they will feel pretty much how GW2's dungeons feel. They need to focus heavily on keeping boss mechanics fresh, interesting, and something that isn't overly difficult but where most people are expected to die a few times as they learn how to deal with each encounter. Xavier434 fucked around with this message at 13:57 on Sep 12, 2013 |
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Sep 12, 2013 13:25
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Flarestar posted:DPS replaced crowd control like ten years ago due to games making CC roles pointless and introducing DPS checks that were guaranteed failure if the check wasn't passed. Which sucks, since the reliance on DPS output as a fight tuning metric has caused shitloads of other problems, but such is life. Not to mention, at least to me, I find that boring as gently caress. Not that games haven't screwed up healing/tanking as well. Even EQ quickly botched it with CH, until things devolved into CH chains. The grouping experience was always fun though I thought. WoW had tanks that would die in a single GCD too at one point, which sucked. Uhrm posted:I don't see how a system that force dps to carry their own weight is a bad idea. Having to endure a 30 minutes + bossfight that should be over in 5 because 50% of the raid (or more) decide to play badly belongs to vanilla WoW, not a modern MMO. Besides, nearly every encounter that require some coordination has some sort of tank/healer check mechanic so why should dps get away with not having to pay attention when it's already the easiest role to fill in a group? Like anything, it can be done good and bad - and usually done bad. DPS checks lead to a lot of dumb design like "At 5 minutes it just kills everyone". I know it's a game, but "in the game world"....why wouldn't he just do that to start with? I think soft enrages are a good way to do it though (like, the room is filling with gas or it's flooding or something). But I think the biggest problem is that it tends to attract players that don't want to deal with group mechanics, which is pretty much the entire problem with WoW and WoW clone games. Ones who don't dodge the floor, or whatever. Who think it's okay for them to take avoidable damage because it's the healers job to heal, right? After all, how can they meet that DPS check if they have to move out of the red circle? It just becomes kind of more an attitude thing that the game attracts. Which, as I say over and over, is usually solved with joining a good guild that works together as a team. The pug experience is gonna suck though.
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Sep 12, 2013 13:40
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Uhrm posted:I don't see how a system that force dps to carry their own weight is a bad idea. Having to endure a 30 minutes + bossfight that should be over in 5 because 50% of the raid (or more) decide to play badly belongs to vanilla WoW, not a modern MMO. Besides, nearly every encounter that require some coordination has some sort of tank/healer check mechanic so why should dps get away with not having to pay attention when it's already the easiest role to fill in a group? * DPS pass/fail checks encourage incredibly lazy encounter design <-- the biggest problem, first and foremost. * It inherently promotes a level of elitism in the population, which usually gets inflated well beyond what's actually required to do the fight. That will happen anyway to some extent, but putting the check on DPS in particular tends to leave a lot more people out in the cold just by the nature of there always being more DPS-oriented players than anything else. * It puts an absurd emphasis on min-maxing. Rift was a great example of this, some of the fights were tuned so tightly with DPS requirements that despite the flexibility of the Soul system, in general you had one, maybe two builds per class that could put out of the necessary damage to beat the DPS check. * Leads to one button macro spamming, either in game or through keyboard/software/whatever. I could probably keep going, but those four are problems enough in their own right. Basically, there are much better ways to promote player involvement that don't involve making bosses a big brick of hp that will outright destroy you if you don't chip it away before x seconds have passed.
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Sep 12, 2013 14:45
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Flarestar posted:* DPS pass/fail checks encourage incredibly lazy encounter design <-- the biggest problem, first and foremost. 1. The main reason why WoW started doing enrage-timers/dps checks in the first place was to stop people from running with raid compositions that had mostly healers. If you don't have enough tanks, healers/dps dies. If you don't have enough healers, tanks/dps dies. If you don't have enough dps, the fight just took longer. 2. While I do see your point about elitism, that's still no excuse why endgame/elder game content should give you free pixels regardless of how you gear and/or spec your character. If you want to run with a non-cookiecutter spec, there's nothing stopping you from doing that (I was playing as a mutilate rogue for the whole duration of TBC), but if you can carry your own weight, then noone has the right to laugh at your spec. 3. Same answer as 2, but I'll add this: If an encounter requires X people to run with dispels/purges/interrupts would you still be annoyed for not being able to put the abilities you want on your bar or would you adapt? 4. Sure, one-button-macros is just as fun as playing a shadowbolt warlock back in the day, but who actually want to go back to that?
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Sep 12, 2013 15:13
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In a game that is emphasizing action combat and telegraphed attacks, I certainly hope that the WoW style holy trinity is not too heavily emphasized. The entire point of a combat system like that is to provide a higher level of strategy and skill based combat with a lower emphasis on RNG. DPS checks shouldn't exist. Bringing a ton of healers should either be a recipe for failure or just not desirable at all. Your gear and build should help on a case by case basis, but it should not be nearly as important as how well you actually execute your skills (not to be confused with mindlessly repeating some rotation). What should matter is that if the group successfully utilizes a strategy that includes responding well to telegraphs then they should win. A huge part of what makes this fun is also enemy AI. If the boss is sitting there primarily just bashing away at a tank while periodically tossing out some sort of AoE on the rest of the raid then that is going to be pretty boring. If the enemies stick to you like glue like WoW instead of positioning themselves and moving around strategically kind of like TERA then that is boring too. That works out okay with a tab targeted GCD based combat system. It is completely self defeating in a good action combat game because it sucks all of the fun out it.
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Sep 12, 2013 15:22
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DPS is a dumb role. Every class should be either tank, heal or CC. And all classes should roughly output the same damage. And enemies including bosses should hit hard and go down fast.
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Sep 12, 2013 15:48
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Xavier434 posted:DPS checks shouldn't exist. Bringing a ton of healers should either be a recipe for failure or just not desirable at all. I'm curious, how would you design a 40 man encounter that I can't just bring 30 healers and 10 tanks for that ensures that the boss will die even if it takes an hour to kill him. What mechanics do you add that makes bringing a ton of healers a recipe for disaster that doesn't include any kind of a DPS check? There was a reason WoW added these types of mechanics, it was because guilds would bring 30 healers if it meant they would be guaranteed to kill the boss and get their purple pixels. Now you can say that if they want to play like that it should be allowed but then you kill any form of serious progression/races that a lot of people enjoy.
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Sep 12, 2013 17:59
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Rylek posted:I'm curious, how would you design a 40 man encounter that I can't just bring 30 healers and 10 tanks for that ensures that the boss will die even if it takes an hour to kill him. What mechanics do you add that makes bringing a ton of healers a recipe for disaster that doesn't include any kind of a DPS check? I'm very big on the less guided / more sandbox style of play. If some group wants to be idiots and take 2 hours to kill a boss? Have fun, idiots. I don't even like fixed raid sizes. What's interesting about a boss that can only be killed in one exact way with one exact group composition with everyone in the exact same item level of gear? Variety is the spice of life, all that. And even with that...you can make mechanics that aren't as blatant as a hard enrage timer that would make "bring 50 healers" not fix everything. And "serious progression / competition" in PVE is still just something that I find incomprehensible. I mean, I "get it" I guess, I just find it pointless. My Shiny Staff Of Shining is no less awesome because other people have it. Play the game for yourself and your guild, not for whatever everyone else is doing.
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Sep 12, 2013 18:08
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Rylek posted:I'm curious, how would you design a 40 man encounter that I can't just bring 30 healers and 10 tanks for that ensures that the boss will die even if it takes an hour to kill him. What mechanics do you add that makes bringing a ton of healers a recipe for disaster that doesn't include any kind of a DPS check? To do this right means reducing the role and power that healing plays in the game overall. Make it something that can help and is fun to include as a part of your strategy, but never something that is absolutely necessary. This is effectively a shift in the balance of power of the game. That power/role shifts from healing and on to other aspects like responding properly to telegraphed attacks, movement and positioning, CD/Resource management, etc. In some cases, you can even have encounters that could be won without anyone ever actually firing off a heal thanks to how well they managed to avoid attacks along with their damage output, but doing so should be exceedingly difficult and not expected. The point is that it is possible if you and your team is good enough which is something that is pretty darn awesome when it comes to skill based progression in any game. Also, I think competition in PvE is generally unhealthy and undesirable for the majority of people. I say that because whenever MMOs do more to reduce PvE competition between players the greater the praise usually ends up for those aspects of the game. Xavier434 fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Sep 12, 2013 |
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Sep 12, 2013 18:10
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