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Bashez posted:How is it dumb? I didn't say anything was over/under powered. It's incredibly hard to balance an ability that can be completely negated by your opponent being perceptive. There's these wonderful things called Telegraphs, which are a pretty big deal in Wildstar's combat. They pretty much have this exact effect on every class, and every ability. There's an argument to be had about reaction time and such, but that's there with stealth too. Really, grass movement and other clues fit in pretty much perfectly with Carbine's attitude towards combat so far, so I'm not surprised at all to hear them say that. We'll have to wait for the livestream to get more specifics.
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Nov 27, 2013 08:03
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Onean posted:There's these wonderful things called Telegraphs, which are a pretty big deal in Wildstar's combat. They pretty much have this exact effect on every class, and every ability. There's an argument to be had about reaction time and such, but that's there with stealth too. Really, grass movement and other clues fit in pretty much perfectly with Carbine's attitude towards combat so far, so I'm not surprised at all to hear them say that. We'll have to wait for the livestream to get more specifics. You can see it in the Stalker video. It looks obvious enough to not miss if you're paying attention to it. We'll have to see how it works out but stealth typically isn't like other abilities. It typically has way more power to it. They do say you can stealth in combat so it may just not have that high of a power curve at which point having people be able to see through stealth isn't that big of a deal. It may even be the case that there's not much they can do about it. They could also have serious pvp take place in hard bottom areas where stealth isn't given away by grass. You know a game is in pre release hype stage when I rightly point out that there's going to be a massive skill disparity that could drastically alter a class defining ability. I'm also preparing to be totally underwhelmed by the telegraph system in the game given that there's an auto aim feature.
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Nov 27, 2013 08:56
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The Wildstar beta signup confirmation mails got to be the most horrific thing ever: - You see something from ncsoft in your inbox - Attention granted - Read the subject "The Wildstar Beta needs you!" - Excitment rises, heart starts beating faster - CLICK FASTER YOU loving MOUSE, OPEN IT! - First words are "Welcome to..." - OMG!!! OMFG!!!! - Keep on reading, heart is going crazy - "...As soon as you get selected..." SERIOUSLY!?!?!? 
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Nov 27, 2013 14:04
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re Stalker perception: there is a popular experiment in which a person is told to watch a video of a basketball being passed back and forth between players with white shirts and black shirts, and then to keep count of how many times the ball goes between players with white shirts. One version is here: https://youtube.com/watch?v=IGQmdoK_ZfY (it's a very popular experiment, so there's a ton of versions). Basically, it's an experiment that shows how fickle our awareness is. If you're not looking for something, even if it would be quite possible to pick out under normal circumstances, that concentration on something else will ruin your ability to see it.
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Nov 27, 2013 14:05
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Bashez posted:I'm also preparing to be totally underwhelmed by the telegraph system in the game given that there's an auto aim feature. This comment is confusing to me, or at least I don't fully understand it. You're saying that you're prepared to be completely underwhelmed by a combat system that makes you stay engaged? I think autoaim would be a terrible idea just like an auto attack would be a terrible idea.
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Nov 27, 2013 14:36
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realbrickwall posted:re Stalker perception: there is a popular experiment in which a person is told to watch a video of a basketball being passed back and forth between players with white shirts and black shirts, and then to keep count of how many times the ball goes between players with white shirts. One version is here: https://youtube.com/watch?v=IGQmdoK_ZfY (it's a very popular experiment, so there's a ton of versions). Basically, it's an experiment that shows how fickle our awareness is. If you're not looking for something, even if it would be quite possible to pick out under normal circumstances, that concentration on something else will ruin your ability to see it. I think this has even more relevancy in a game like Wildstar. This (at least in theory) isn't supposed to be like a typical MMO where you plant your butt down in front of your enemy and trade auto attacks till one of you die. There's an expectation to be dodge, rolling, moving and using AoE abilities. With that constant movement, actually seeing the grass move will be difficult unless it's something you've constantly got in teh back of your mind and are always on the watch out for. Granted it's hard to comment on these mechanics since so few of us have actually seen them in use.
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Nov 27, 2013 14:41
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Bashez posted:You can see it in the Stalker video. It looks obvious enough to not miss if you're paying attention to it. (Note, I'm not in the beta so all of this is based off of the Devspeaks and livestreams.) There's some difference, sure, but not as much as I think you're making it to be. Sure, a Stalker can come up behind you, stun you (which you can button mash to easily halve, if not quarter, the duration) and wail on you. If they do it again, the base duration will be shorter due to diminishing returns so it isn't worth spamming. If you see them coming, you can react and, since most abilities shown so far aren't reliant on having a target selected you can still pretty easily get an attack or two off on the Stalker. It will also be a little harder for them to get away from you since they're slowed due to stealth. Hit them with a tether, stun or knockdown/back and get your pounding on. Then there's telegraphs. Sure, you can dish out a bunch of damage, but as soon as that other person gets in to gear, they'll be dodging and moving around with telegraphs to tell them pretty easily where they can't go. So far most cast and instant player abilities don't move with their targets, so once they move out they're safe and that ability is no longer doing any damage. Only channeling abilities would possibly move with the target with auto-aim, and you're stuck doing that one thing unless you decide you need to do something else and cancel it. Grass isn't the only thing to watch for for stealth, the main difference they mentioned was a distortion effect that becomes more visible the closer a Stalker gets to you. Auto-aiming won't remove the telegraph, that'll still be there unless Carbine is incredibly stupid. It will probably tighten you're reaction time, so you'll have to doge closer to when the spell casts rather than dodging early and relying on your target to not readjust, but you should be doing that already. Channeled abilities would maybe be the only thing that would be majorly affected by auto-aim, but if you're really worried about it you can interrupt it. If you don't have an interrupt during PvP, then you might be doing something wrong. Korlac posted:This comment is confusing to me, or at least I don't fully understand it. You're saying that you're prepared to be completely underwhelmed by a combat system that makes you stay engaged? I think autoaim would be a terrible idea just like an auto attack would be a terrible idea. It's something they mentioned off-hand in response to one of the questions during the Esper livestream. I can't find you a time code right now, but I want to say it was during the dungeon run. It just allows you to select a target and will cast your attacks centered on their position when you cast it. It won't allow you to lead your target, won't make you adjust to hit multiple targets unless they're in the perfect spot, and it won't make stationary attacks mobile so they'll still just dodge or run out of them. Like I mentioned above, I think channeled abilities would be the only ones to actually majorly benefit from it, and it would be an option that someone who has some kind of disability or other problem that causes an issue with twitch aiming could use to still enjoy the game on at least some level. Couple edits for clarity. Onean fucked around with this message at 16:33 on Nov 27, 2013 |
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Nov 27, 2013 14:44
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If you're not prepared to be completely underwhelmed by every aspect of this game (or any MMO for that matter), you probably shouldn't be playing MMOs. Truth be told I haven't logged into my beta account for a while now because once the ooooh shiny mentality wore off I got bored. Granted I lasted longer than let's say TESO (4 hours or so) 
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Nov 27, 2013 16:27
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Bashez posted:How is it dumb? I didn't say anything was over/under powered. It's incredibly hard to balance an ability that can be completely negated by your opponent being perceptive. There's a reason why human rogues got so popular in wow. The easiest way to balance this is to make the from stealth abilities mediocre so getting the drop on people isn't make or break. It's dumb because your post essentially said "this is bad because people who are bad at this game aren't going to have a chance against people who are good at this game". While I am by no means good at video games, I expect someone who plays the game better than I to beat me.
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Nov 27, 2013 16:36
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Doh004 posted:It's dumb because your post essentially said "this is bad because people who are bad at this game aren't going to have a chance against people who are good at this game". While I am by no means good at video games, I expect someone who plays the game better than I to beat me. Stealth is a mechanic that is more frustrating for lower level players and not higher. Adding the counterplay to be specifically utilized by better players and not worse players not only makes stealth a worse mechanic (as a user) at higher levels, but it doesn't solve the issue of why people hate stealth: they're bad. The better way to fix the issue is to make it so you have to be a lot better as a player to utilize stealth well, rather than put the burden on the person who is frustrated by stealth existing. Of course, that's a very, very broad generalization and since I have no idea how stealth works down to the fine tuning level, I'm just agreeing with the philosophy. anime was right fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Nov 27, 2013 |
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Nov 27, 2013 16:41
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Game isn't even released and we're already complaining about ~stealth mechanics~ 
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Nov 27, 2013 17:02
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Stanley Pain posted:Game isn't even released and we're already complaining about ~stealth mechanics~ And casual vs hardcore. People worried about getting jumped should probably roll on a PvE server.
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Nov 27, 2013 17:14
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Aexo posted:And casual vs hardcore. And I'm spent.... 
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Nov 27, 2013 17:23
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Those are a lot of really long posts about things that might not even exist. Calm down, people. Why can't we just talk about all the heads we're gonna hang on our walls in our sweet flying houses and our awesome hamster ball mounts?
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Nov 27, 2013 17:54
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Bauxite posted:Those are a lot of really long posts about things that might not even exist. Calm down, people. Why can't we just talk about all the heads we're gonna hang on our walls in our sweet flying houses and our awesome hamster ball mounts? This game is going to attract those people, better just prepare for it now. The people who will theorycraft and sperg about something not even out yet, or the ones who think casuals don't deserve anything and raiders are better in every way, we've gone full circle in this thread alone. When you have a 2014 MMO that caters to 40 man raiders, some weird and annoying poo poo is going to crop up.
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Nov 27, 2013 18:07
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CLAM DOWN posted:This game is going to attract those people, better just prepare for it now. The people who will theorycraft and sperg about something not even out yet, or the ones who think casuals don't deserve anything and raiders are better in every way, we've gone full circle in this thread alone. When you have a 2014 MMO that caters to 40 man raiders, some weird and annoying poo poo is going to crop up. I mostly want to kick Chuas and play a rockperson with a big sword, but when you talk about game design there's a beast within me that gets unleashed...
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Nov 27, 2013 18:13
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Waterbed posted:I mostly want to kick Chuas and play a rockperson with a big sword, but when you talk about game design there's a beast within me that gets unleashed... I know. 
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Nov 27, 2013 18:17
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Korlac posted:This comment is confusing to me, or at least I don't fully understand it. You're saying that you're prepared to be completely underwhelmed by a combat system that makes you stay engaged? I think autoaim would be a terrible idea just like an auto attack would be a terrible idea. They have auto aim in game. I thought I saw it being used in one of the livestreams but I'm not sure anymore. Doh004 posted:It's dumb because your post essentially said "this is bad because people who are bad at this game aren't going to have a chance against people who are good at this game". While I am by no means good at video games, I expect someone who plays the game better than I to beat me. That's not what my post says at all.
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Nov 27, 2013 20:12
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Vax posted:The Wildstar beta signup confirmation mails got to be the most horrific thing ever: Hmmm. So I had gotten into the Stress Test (couldn't participate due to real life things going on) and at the beginning of November did the process they required for merging the Wildstar account with the NCSoft account. Since I hadn't gotten any e-mails following the Winter Beta Survey one from November 1st, this post made me decide to do the beta sign-up and it let me (and correspondingly gave me a sign-up confirmation e-mail). Now I'm all paranoid that their account merge thing screwed up and I might not even get access as having been a stress tester since it let me sign-up through the NCSoft thing when I'd been signed up for much, much longer through the Wildstar-specific one. Hopefully my concerns are unfounded, but hearing of others getting "reminder" e-mails that they signed up when I haven't (not even getting promo stuff about the class unveils) has me worried.
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Nov 27, 2013 23:20
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Korlac posted:This comment is confusing to me, or at least I don't fully understand it. You're saying that you're prepared to be completely underwhelmed by a combat system that makes you stay engaged? I think autoaim would be a terrible idea just like an auto attack would be a terrible idea. Autoaim is in for healers who want to lock aim on a target - at least, they referenced this specifically in one of the livestreams. It also prevents them from fiddling and finessing their heals to one side or the other to catch more people, so that's a limitation. I assume this is somehow also true for dps targets, although it might not be.
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Nov 27, 2013 23:22
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feedtheid posted:Autoaim is in for healers who want to lock aim on a target - at least, they referenced this specifically in one of the livestreams. It also prevents them from fiddling and finessing their heals to one side or the other to catch more people, so that's a limitation. I assume this is somehow also true for dps targets, although it might not be. Actually, the guy specifically mentions both healing and damage while kind of explaining auto-aim. Edit: Since I'm not scrambling at the end of my shift, I found the mention in the livestream, 26 minutes in to the second part of the Esper stream. Onean fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Nov 27, 2013 |
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Nov 27, 2013 23:28
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bUm posted:Hmmm. So I had gotten into the Stress Test (couldn't participate due to real life things going on) and at the beginning of November did the process they required for merging the Wildstar account with the NCSoft account. Since I hadn't gotten any e-mails following the Winter Beta Survey one from November 1st, this post made me decide to do the beta sign-up and it let me (and correspondingly gave me a sign-up confirmation e-mail). Now I'm all paranoid that their account merge thing screwed up and I might not even get access as having been a stress tester since it let me sign-up through the NCSoft thing when I'd been signed up for much, much longer through the Wildstar-specific one. There was never any actual "merge". The whole "get your accounts ready" thing was purely forum-side; it was the only way we could let you keep your old forum name and posts once logins switched over to use the NCSOFT account system. The worst possible situation for someone who didn't follow the directions properly is that the forums will create them a "new" forum account rather than find the old one, and even that we can fix through Support if you contact us. TL;DR You didn't screw up your account, the "merge" was purely forum-side. We still have your email address on file for when we invite the stressers back. Sorry that our emails suck at being delivered, getting that fixed is a high priority for us right now. STL;SDR You're good.
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Nov 28, 2013 01:54
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I thought that the shock-pad healers were only a rumor, now that I know they exist there's no way ill play anything else. Maybe they run around really fast and do high single-target healing from melee range? Whatever they do, the concept alone is enough to get me to play one.
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Nov 28, 2013 02:46
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I'm getting more and more and more bored with WoW. ESO was awful. I never expected it to be good but I figured my love of TES was worth giving it a shot. LOTRO's classes feel lackluster and boring. I want to get into Tera but everyone tells me not to until the next big patch. I want to play an MMO - I CRAVE a new world to explore and enjoy. I want to spend hours reading lore in (and out) of the game. But none of the MMOs out there right now interest me. Most I've played and dropped, a couple simply look too 'meh' to me to want to bother downloading and trying. Wildstar, you're my greatest hope for a fun new MMO. I'm nuts for tradeskills and crafting and especially player housing (I subbed for 3 years to SWG just for the player housing alone), the art style looks incredible, the classes revealed thus far seem interesting enough and the races are awesome. I love huge raids and fights and so far I haven't seen a single thing about the game that makes me feel like it won't be incredible. If I had an ounce of artistic skill I'd be creating fanart and poo poo like crazy desperately trying to impress the devs enough that they might consider giving me a beta invite. Have there been any rumors, hints, slips, leaks, or ANYTHING else about an open beta or at least about a mass-invite stress test or anything of the sort? I'm dying here waiting for more information about it. khy fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Nov 28, 2013 |
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Nov 28, 2013 09:04
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khy posted:I'm getting more and more and more bored with WoW. With the amount of interest in the game I doubt they even need a long open beta to sell the game, every stream has 10k + people and thats on a Saturday night. I imagine they will have some kind of head start for people that preorder and I believe if you really want to play the game sometime in december you will probably be able to get a key for the stress tests and stuff. I'm in the same boat as you I'm really looking forward to this MMO I'm really hoping it isnt another disappointment like KOTOR
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Nov 28, 2013 10:53
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I believe their Twitter said to expect an open beta about a month before they launch.
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Nov 28, 2013 15:09
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Stealthers are always broken for a while, either underpowered by design or overpowered because players figure out optimal ways of using them. There will be plenty of goons stalkers I'm sure of it.
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Nov 28, 2013 16:08
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I've been listening to a lot of the WildStar music recently, and it's pretty sweet. You can check out a couple of the tracks https://soundcloud.com/inhisgroove on this SoundCloud. I especially suggest 'Systematic Domination' and 'Saving the Universe ... Destroying One Giant Robot At A Time'. The music is almost kind of like Star Wars meets Pirates of the Carribean with Donkey Kong Country-ish music here and there, sometimes a little bit of Banjo-Kazooie. I typically only give tracks in MMOs (or games in general) a single listen before turning on my own music over it, but WildStar's amazing.
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Nov 28, 2013 16:59
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I've been listening to what has been released of the soundtrack so far as well, and there's some amazing variety. Cold Science of Supremacy is my favorite so far for being purely badass music as well as reminding me of the tiberian sun soundtrack.
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Nov 28, 2013 17:57
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khy posted:I'm getting more and more and more bored with WoW. Maplestory is always there Also guild wars 2 is great, and the secret world could tide you over till wildstar.
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Nov 28, 2013 18:18
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So I played the beta months ago and quit before I got out of the starting area. Even with the more active combat, it just felt so like WoW that I couldn't stand it. (Mind you, I don't think WoW is atrociously bad, I just played it for so long I'm burnt out on it.) Has anything changed or do the areas after the tutorial zone drastically improve?
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Nov 29, 2013 22:12
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Harabeck posted:So I played the beta months ago and quit before I got out of the starting area. Even with the more active combat, it just felt so like WoW that I couldn't stand it. (Mind you, I don't think WoW is atrociously bad, I just played it for so long I'm burnt out on it.) So you quit before you left the starting area, and that's what you're basing your opinion of the entire game (in beta) on. Go watch all the devspeaks on youtube and livestrams on twitch.
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Nov 29, 2013 22:15
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Loose Ifer posted:So you quit before you left the starting area, and that's what you're basing your opinion of the entire game (in beta) on.
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Nov 29, 2013 22:30
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a cat on an apple posted:I've been listening to a lot of the WildStar music recently, and it's pretty sweet. You can check out a couple of the tracks https://soundcloud.com/inhisgroove on this SoundCloud. I especially suggest 'Systematic Domination' and 'Saving the Universe ... Destroying One Giant Robot At A Time'. The music is almost kind of like Star Wars meets Pirates of the Carribean with Donkey Kong Country-ish music here and there, sometimes a little bit of Banjo-Kazooie. I typically only give tracks in MMOs (or games in general) a single listen before turning on my own music over it, but WildStar's amazing. War Will Come is my favorite so far. Some seriously great orchestral stuff in this soundtrack.
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Nov 29, 2013 22:30
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Korak posted:Stealthers are always broken for a while, either underpowered by design or overpowered because players figure out optimal ways of using them. There will be plenty of goons stalkers I'm sure of it. Like there aren't already?  Harabeck posted:So I played the beta months ago and quit before I got out of the starting area. Even with the more active combat, it just felt so like WoW that I couldn't stand it. (Mind you, I don't think WoW is atrociously bad, I just played it for so long I'm burnt out on it.) The last closed beta really left me cold and made me skeptical of the game, but I've been having a lot of fun in the current beta. It's still lacking a lot of polish, but they've made massive improvements to it over the last few months.
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Nov 29, 2013 22:41
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Harabeck posted:I feel my question is itself an admission of incomplete knowledge. Before I go spend hours watching streams, I just want to know if the majority of PvE content is kill X critters or activate Y mcguffins like the starting area was when I played it. If you're completely burnt out on that kind of game Wildstar is probably not for you. It's just a very good one of those games.
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Nov 29, 2013 22:56
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Harabeck posted:I feel my question is itself an admission of incomplete knowledge. Before I go spend hours watching streams, I just want to know if the majority of PvE content is kill X critters or activate Y mcguffins like the starting area was when I played it. From what I've read in terms of beta feedback, questing is really varied and fun. From this article: quote:But Jeremy said Carbine’s also actively tracking engagement with WildStar, or rather “Is the game sticking with people?” as any company would do during beta. How many people make it through that tutorial into the massive open world and key levels of the game? How many come back for more? To get through the main tutorial for a first time player, it’ll probably take a user between two and four hours, and most likely two or more play sessions. If the game can hold them and keep them coming through that, that’s a good sign. Most players, especially in beta, don’t stick to a product like that. That poke their heads in, look around, and decide pretty quickly if the game’s their cup of tea or not.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:12
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Check your inboxes
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Dec 3, 2013 05:14
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I was so ready to write up a cocktease post, but it appears I have gotten lucky 
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Dec 3, 2013 07:48
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Still nada. Sad day indeed.
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Dec 3, 2013 07:52
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