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Molten Llama
Sep 20, 2006

hooah posted:

My only concern after reading some reviews is that Epson (and I guess most other printer/ink manufacturers) sets the ink cartridges to read "empty" when they still have a significant amount of ink left. If this is true, can I force the printer to use up most of the ink in the cartridge? If I can't, do 3rd-party ink makers pull this as well?

The truth lies in the middle.

Epson cartridges are overfilled because Epson doesn't want air going through the head. So, yes, there's a small amount of extra ink in the cartridge—but you're getting the ink you actually paid for.

If you want to use up the ink you paid for, you just print until the printer refuses to print. There are a lot (a lot) of nimrods that pull the cartridges as soon as they get a low ink notification, and those people will have a "significant amount of ink left" because the cartridge isn't empty yet. When the cartridge is actually empty, it'll tell you it's empty and won't print until you replace it.

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wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?
Is there any actual way to troubleshoot printing problems on Windows, or is it just a magical black box where print jobs go in and sometimes don't come out with no real logs like it seems?

I'm on a Vista machine right now where every print job to a particular printer (a Konica bizhub 552) just sticks and eventually fails with the useless message "Error - Printing"

I have tried enabling every form of print logging the system offers, but the "PrintService" section in Event Viewer doesn't even show up much less have anything useful.

I can't seem to find any plaintext logs either, so all I know is that the jobs hit the spooler and stop there. Bypassing the spooler just makes the printing application freeze until the job is deleted from the list.


Everything I can find with regards to printer troubleshooting on Windows comes down to cargo cult techniques like restarting the spooler and reinstalling drivers, never does anyone mention any actual ways to determine what in particular is going wrong when it gives me that idiotic error. I have of course done the cargo cult stuff anyways out of frustration, but still no luck.

I'm just looking for a log file where I can look at a failing job, then run one that'll succeed to another printer installed here that works (another Konica C224), and look at the two to see where the difference is to get even the slightest idea of what's to blame here.

Tapedump
Aug 31, 2007
College Slice
Does Windows or the Bizhub show that "Error - Printing" message? I ask because, and total stab in the dark here not really addressing the root of your question..

Any chance that User Authentication is set up on the 552 with the Windows client mis/not configured to use it?

I've seen Bizhubs themselves log an error but find that Windows doesn't think a thing is wrong. Jobs go to the spooler and out, so Windows says, "Welp, good"

Perhaps I'm misreading your problem, though, or am just way off base.

wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?
Windows said "Error-Printing", the bizhub didn't even acknowledge a print job had been sent.

I have managed to resolve that since then, it turned out to be something having crashed in the bizhub itself. It wasn't accepting any print jobs at all, but not providing any errors either.

This site does use the "Account Track" feature, so I did check that first, but it was configured properly. That's what actually fooled me in to thinking the problem was limited to this one client, someone was at the machine itself copying and apparently those also show up as print jobs which get tagged to a user thanks to the account thing, so it looked like other users were printing successfully when they weren't.

Hard power cycling the machine resolved the issue, and left both me and the site administrator angry at Konica for their stupid fake power button on the control panel that seemingly does nothing but turn the display off. He thought he had power cycled the whole machine and had no idea there was a proper physical switch a few feet lower on the machine that actually does something useful.

spog
Aug 7, 2004

It's your own bloody fault.
I have a Brother DCP-J25DW and it works well enough. I have 2 problems:

1) Occasionally, it slows right down (3 mins/per page for a word document). It almost sounds as if the data isn't getting to the printer fast enough as it does a couple of lines, then grinds to a slow halt, before restarting. Is this a known issue (or is my wifi screwed?)

2) A4 photo paper won't feed at all. The feed roller tries to pick it up from the paper tray, gets as far as leaving a roller impression on the leading edge of the paper and gives up. Is this lovely paper, or is there a trick to get it working?

Space Skeleton
Sep 28, 2004

If I'm looking for an all in one B&W/Color/Copy/Scan what is my best bet? Something off here: http://www.brother-usa.com/MFC/Color_Laser_Multifunction/ ? They all seem so similar it's hard to tell what I am looking for in differences.

Cpt.Wacky
Apr 17, 2005

Wee Tinkle Wand posted:

If I'm looking for an all in one B&W/Color/Copy/Scan what is my best bet? Something off here: http://www.brother-usa.com/MFC/Color_Laser_Multifunction/ ? They all seem so similar it's hard to tell what I am looking for in differences.

C = color
D = duplex (printing both sides of the page)
N = network (wired)
W = wireless

They're all color, and all but the lowest model are duplex so you're looking at a choice between wired and wireless and whatever minor differences in specs there are between models. The compare feature should help there. Generally with the larger models you're looking at fast printing, slightly more paper tray capacity, maybe more memory. The other thing to note is the type of toner cartridges used so that you can go check prices and availability.

ante
Apr 9, 2005

SUNSHINE AND RAINBOWS
I care more about the inner workings of printers (for hacking them) than stupid consumer factsheets.


So I've been looking into dye-sublimation printers. The Canon Selphy series seems like the only affordable choice out there, that's cool, I guess.


From what I understand, it runs the sheet through the thermal transfer rollers once for each colour channel, then once more for a resistant coating.

1) What kind of treatment does the paper going in have on it and why? To help adhere? What's the mechanism for adherence?

2) Is the ink water-soluble? Before the coating? After?

3) Is the coating applied the same way as the other inks? But you know, with the thermal head "all on".

4) Even with 600dpi, how do vector drawings look up close? I don't fully understand how "dpi" would manifest in dye-sub.

This is a somewhat unusual set of questions, I know. I'm not crazy, I swear.

Guy Axlerod
Dec 29, 2008
I don't know many specifics about dye sub, but maybe I can give some general background on DPI.

In most printers, DPI comes from two factors:

1. The number of addressable locations in the cross-process direction. This might be the number of dots written by the laser ROS, or number of LEDs in a laser printer, or number of steps in a scanning ink-jet, or number of nozzles in a fixed ink-jet. In the case of dye-sub printer, its the number of discrete heating elements.

2. The process direction resolution is determined by the speed that the paper moves, relative to the rate that new lines are written. A printer can be run at multiple speeds with a speed/DPI trade-off. With a fixed ink-jet printer, there is an optimal rate for ink to be jetted. The different speeds may be sold as different models, or as a switchable option for the customer. For a dye-sub, the writing speed will have to do with how fast the element can heat up and cool down, derated by a factor to prevent it from burning out.
For a scanning ink-jet, the paper stops for each pass. The resolution is again dependent on the spacing of the nozzles. If the lines are interlaced, it also depends on the accuracy of the paper motors. If the paper is not accurately positioned, you'll see patterns in the print, especially in the solid areas.

The printer will have a two dimensional dpi, e.g. 300 x 600. If both are the same then it may be listed as a single number.

ante
Apr 9, 2005

SUNSHINE AND RAINBOWS
Yeah, what I'm asking about DPI isn't how it's calculated or anything, I get all that. It's the implications of printing vector drawings and how sharp you reasonably can expect edges to be.

Like, at 600dpi for an inkjet printer, that would be one dot every 1/600 = 1.67mils. So there's a black dot at 0mils on the grid, and then another black dot at 1.6mils, and nothing in between.

With dye-sub, there's going to be a dot at 0mils, and then assuming no other ink, what happens next? Will it be 50% grey at 0.8mils? Pure white?


This does sound really spergish, I apologize, but I'm trying to figure out what kind of resolution I'll actually need for a high-accuracy application.

Molten Llama
Sep 20, 2006
1. Sublimation paper is coated with proprietary magic. It's the same basic idea as inkjet paper (you need an ink-receptive layer), but designed to capture and retain—for lack of a better term—gaseous solid dye as opposed to pigments suspended in a bunch of glycols that need to flash off. You know the airbrush t-shirt booth at the mall? Same basic idea, but the airbrush is a phase change and the t-shirt is a gaseous-dye-hungry paper coating. It's not adhering to the coating; it's resolidifying inside the coating. It's as with the t-shirt, where the dye isn't just sitting on top of the surface, but being absorbed into the cotton fibers.

2. The Canon ink is somewhat water resistant before coating. The coating renders the deposited ink effectively waterproof. (It's important to note that not all dye sub papers begin with a resin-coated base. The paper may thus not be waterproof. If you soak the prints through from the back, the topcoat's not doing much for you.)

3. In a compact printer, yes. It'll be the last position for each "set" of colors on the ribbon.

4. Dye sub is considered continuous tone, so what you're going to end up with is a bunch of fuzzy, single-color dots that kind of bleed dreamily into each other. (Just like that sweet airbrushed t-shirt!) If the printer driver maps a bunch of pixels to a 50% grey dot, you will get a 50% grey dot. The next dot will be whatever color the printer driver decides that one should be, placed almost immediately next to the first one.

And therein lies the rub. It historically hasn't tended to do well with things like vector graphics; they can be visibly blurry. Dye sub, like JPEG, largely relies on there being somewhere to hide your sins. But at 600 advertised dpi, it may—assuming your source data's bold enough to usefully survive the mapping into dots, and that the feed mechanism's accuracy and precision are good—retain enough detail and use small enough dots not to be an issue for whatever amazing scheme you're cooking up.

TL; DR: Might work. Might not. Test it first or buy somewhere with a liberal return policy.

Edit: Finally! Took me forever to find some, but here are magnified views of (older) dye sub prints. Click to embiggen. Those should be in the neighborhood of 300 dpi.

Molten Llama fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Mar 8, 2014

ante
Apr 9, 2005

SUNSHINE AND RAINBOWS
That's really helpful, thanks.


Do you know how will he inks would stick to a sheet of metal, for example, instead of Canon's voodoo-magic-treated paper?

Molten Llama
Sep 20, 2006
I'd be surprised if you had much of a result with bare metal, but you might get away with an inkjet coating product like inkAID.

A bigger problem (if you're hoping to print directly) is that Canon quit running straight paper paths in the later Selphys. You'd have some serious hacking to do.

Depending on what you're trying to do, two options come to mind:
1. Coat the sheets with inkAID and run them through an inkjet with a straight feed. Current models have no issues with vector detail and the dot pattern's tight enough you can even burn screens and boards with them.
2. Have your prints made—backwards—as heat transfer sheets (either by commercial dye sub or by inkjet). Iron them on.

You might also be able to do a transfer with wintergreen oil, but that's a finesse and grace of God process even on materials where it's known to work well.

kode54
Nov 26, 2007

aka kuroshi
Fun Shoe
I just ordered supplies to refresh and resume using my old Canon Selphy CP-400. I see mentioned above that dye sublimation printers may not handle vector graphics very well, so I am wondering if I'll ever run into that sort of problem with this model.

According to the specifications, it's 300x300 dpi, so it should be okay for at least photographs, but should I not get my hopes up that it can also handle some forms of line art?

Needless filler, I got this camera bundled with a PowerShot A400 back in 2006 as a Christmas present from my parents. I've only ever used it to print three of the five postcard sheets it came with. One of them, a photo to mail to a relative, which unfortunately got a small hair on it before the clear coat was applied. I still have two prints left in the cassette and on that ribbon, assuming the ribbon can still be used after all these years. I did lose the power adapter amongst all my disorganized crap, so I ordered a replacement.

I would also like to know if I can get a replacement drum cleaner insert anywhere, as Canon doesn't seem to have them listed anywhere. It's a plastic insert that fits the shape of the ink cassette and has a small pad that will sweep across either the heat roller or the head or something inside the printer, to clean it. Like the power adapter, it's another component of the printer which I managed to misplace, and I've got too goddamn much crap to look through to find something, especially if it's going to come bundled with the ink and paper kit I just ordered as well.

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)
Do you guys deploy PCL or PS drivers on a windows network?

I need to rip the fiery out of one of our Xerox printers because the drivers are loving garbage and combined with Adobes garbage programming from Reader its causing PDF printing to choke and makes me want to kill someone.

I deploy my printers over Group Policy. Most of the articles say PCL is better for Windows which is our environment. We'r enot a print shop and the Fiery wa sin use by an employee who is now gone and wasn't/won't be replaced.

wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?
I'm not sure why but a lot of software I deal with in medical environments specifies PCL.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


PS vs PCL for me has always been down to what the printer was. When I looked after a fleet of Xerox machines we would always use the PS driver as the machines were fully-loaded so they had the licenses or hardware needed for this to work (Xerox test units). Everything else got PCL drivers.

kode54
Nov 26, 2007

aka kuroshi
Fun Shoe
poo poo. It looks like my Canon Selphy CP400 is busted. It won't feed paper. The cassette lifts the paper just fine, and the rollers spin, but they don't pull the paper in.

EDIT: drat. After enough fiddling with it, it did manage to churn out a nice photo print. Too bad it didn't print borderless. I guess I need to fiddle with my settings more. (Printing from OS X with Gutenprint drivers.)

kode54 fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Mar 15, 2014

Parlett316
Dec 6, 2002

Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton
Fiery drivers can be a goddamn nightmare. I wouldn't let EFI turn you off PS.

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)

Parlett316 posted:

Fiery drivers can be a goddamn nightmare. I wouldn't let EFI turn you off PS.

I'm currently trying to get the lessor to reduce our lease and come remove the goddamn thing. I bypassed it and deployed PCL and now the printer is working great. Never again with that piece of poo poo.

EoRaptor
Sep 13, 2003

by Fluffdaddy

LmaoTheKid posted:

I'm currently trying to get the lessor to reduce our lease and come remove the goddamn thing. I bypassed it and deployed PCL and now the printer is working great. Never again with that piece of poo poo.

It sounds like you solved your problem, but for anyone else suffering with a Fiery RIP, the EFI Printer Delete Utility will become something you need to get familiar with. So many terrible driver issues where the only solution is to delete it and start over.

You can also run the printer in split mode, with people able to print directly to the printer or to the fiery. You'll need another network port and IP address, but your service tech should be able to set it up pretty quickly.

kode54
Nov 26, 2007

aka kuroshi
Fun Shoe
Welp, I solved my Selphy feeding issue by cleaning down the front roller with rubbing alcohol. Yay. That's what I get for leaving the drat thing unused for five plus years, collecting dust on everything including the two remaining bundle postcards, and the demo ribbon drying out.

Parlett316
Dec 6, 2002

Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton
Actually I don't know what is worse. Deploying Fiery drivers or KIP drivers.

photomikey
Dec 30, 2012
I want a color laser printer/scanner/copier. I don't know which to pick. Any suggestions? Small office - 2-3 people. This will be the only printer. Low loads.

Parlett316
Dec 6, 2002

Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton

photomikey posted:

I want a color laser printer/scanner/copier. I don't know which to pick. Any suggestions? Small office - 2-3 people. This will be the only printer. Low loads.

Savin/Ricoh MP C305 might work for you if you have a dealer in your area.

Wrath of the Bitch King
May 11, 2005

Research confirms that black is a color like silver is a color, and that beyond black is clarity.
So right now my organization utilizes Canon MFPs. They're reliable but behind the curve on features and software integration. That and their central management software is total dogshit.

Currently we're going the rounds with various vendors and resellers for other manufacturers that might better suit our needs. Is Xerox still best of breed with regards to central management solutions for a print fleet? Do they support a direct IP printing scheme like Cirrato or are they still geared for a traditional print server setup?

Additionally, we're moving away from analog faxing and will be switching over to SIP trunks for telephony, with a fax server that acts as an intermediary between exchange and the telephony backend. One of the challenges we've run into on the devices is with iFax; the Canon MFPs only support a single e-mail gateway, and the ideal setup on the MFP would be one gateway defined for traditional e-mail/smtp and another gateway for iFax/T37. We have a workaround in place utilizing an Exchange send connector that routes all traffic to the fax server, but this is ugly and prevents our users from simply punching in a number at the device. Does Xerox or any other manufacturer support such a setup? Trying to get this information directly from vendors is like pulling teeth.

Parlett316
Dec 6, 2002

Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton
Good luck on talking to any vendor's tech support. It's impossible to get any kind of information. And were you using Canon's imageWARE EMC?

Wrath of the Bitch King
May 11, 2005

Research confirms that black is a color like silver is a color, and that beyond black is clarity.
Yes. Its garbage. I can elaborate if you need more detail as to why.

It has one of the worst implementations of an IIS driven web GUI I've ever seen.

Parlett316
Dec 6, 2002

Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton

Wrath of the Bitch King posted:

Yes. Its garbage. I can elaborate if you need more detail as to why.

It has one of the worst implementations of an IIS driven web GUI I've ever seen.

If it will help you vent sure. We deployed it in our demo room and found to be cumbersome and not useful for our needs. I think we had one user use it and then promptly ditch it. Other than that, as network MFP's the Imagerunner and the Advance series have been pretty rock solid.

Wrath of the Bitch King
May 11, 2005

Research confirms that black is a color like silver is a color, and that beyond black is clarity.
Nah I'm good, was just going to lay down some information if you were looking to move in that direction.

Cumbersome is a good word for it. The physical hardware is solid but everything else...not so much.

Ernie Muppari
Aug 4, 2012

Keep this up G'Bert, and soon you won't have a pigeon to protect!
'Kay so I'm looking for printer recommendations for a friend.

They're looking for a desktop printer that can do high(ish)-quality photo printing on like, watercolor paper, they've got about $500 that could be spent on this so like, the best anyone can think of for about that much?

5436
Jul 11, 2003

by astral
Looking for a home printer, something that can print photos as well. Lightly used, mostly printing documents here and there. I'd prefer wireless printing or google cloud print. What are some options?

CampingCarl
Apr 28, 2008




My parents have a computer that is on 24/7 just to share a printer to the wireless laptops and does nothing else. To fix this I first looked for a print server but I didn't see any that were compatible with the old all in one printer that wasn't going to cost as much as whole new printer. They would like color, scan, fax, and can be wired network since it would sit next to the router anyway.

I saw this on sale at Newegg but haven't ever used Brother printers. Is this a good deal or are there others I should be looking at?

Parlett316
Dec 6, 2002

Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton
Looks good. Does the whole AirPrint gimmick to so if they have a smart phone and want to print out a picture real quick they have the option. Make sure you default their drivers to black and white to save them cash.

I'm curious if it can scan direct to PDF/JPEG or is it just twain scanning.

McGlockenshire
Dec 16, 2005

GOLLOCKS!

Parlett316 posted:

I'm curious if it can scan direct to PDF/JPEG or is it just twain scanning.

Any of the models that do scan-to-Network/FTP/Email/USB can scan to JPEG or PDF. The specs tab says that this one can do all of those.

Ren and Stimpire
Oct 28, 2013

Fun Shoe
Based on your recommendations I am getting a Brother 2270dw and will add a short review onto the list.

Thanks for the info.

Fakedit: htfu amazon I got papers to write!

Blindeye
Sep 22, 2006

I can't believe I kissed you!
Hey everyone! So I've had a Lexmark Pro205 for almost 5 years now, which is the biggest piece of crap I've ever had but I've kept because it has a 6 year warranty. In that time they've had to replace the printhead 4 times and the entire printer once due to fouling. I think it's because I don't use my printer very often (maybe once a week?).

What I'm looking for is a relative cheap wireless printer/scanner/copier that can print 8 1/2 x 11 photos well enough to frame (which my Lexmark did fine so I imagine I don't need anything special), and that is much more reliable than my previous printer. Preferably I'd like to get an HP or Canon so I can buy ink in bulk from Costco but that's not super important to me.

Any ideas?

Space Gopher
Jul 31, 2006

BLITHERING IDIOT AND HARDCORE DURIAN APOLOGIST. LET ME TELL YOU WHY THIS SHIT DON'T STINK EVEN THOUGH WE ALL KNOW IT DOES BECAUSE I'M SUPER CULTURED.

Blindeye posted:

Hey everyone! So I've had a Lexmark Pro205 for almost 5 years now, which is the biggest piece of crap I've ever had but I've kept because it has a 6 year warranty. In that time they've had to replace the printhead 4 times and the entire printer once due to fouling. I think it's because I don't use my printer very often (maybe once a week?).

What I'm looking for is a relative cheap wireless printer/scanner/copier that can print 8 1/2 x 11 photos well enough to frame (which my Lexmark did fine so I imagine I don't need anything special), and that is much more reliable than my previous printer. Preferably I'd like to get an HP or Canon so I can buy ink in bulk from Costco but that's not super important to me.

Any ideas?

Any inkjet will have serious problems with infrequent use. Ink dries up.

Unless you're printing in huge bulk (to the point where you'd be better off with a pro printer that can take a continuous inking system), or are printing things you'd rather not have photo store employees see, you're probably better off just having Costco or another photo print service do your big prints. They'll do them bigger than a home printer can manage if you want that, the colors and quality from a good shop will be better than anything but a very expensive printer, and when you look at the cost per square inch of good-quality ink and photo paper, it's almost always substantially cheaper.

Pick up a cheap B&W laser to do day-to-day document printing, and you're covered with a machine that won't die from lack of use.

Blindeye
Sep 22, 2006

I can't believe I kissed you!

Space Gopher posted:

Any inkjet will have serious problems with infrequent use. Ink dries up.

Unless you're printing in huge bulk (to the point where you'd be better off with a pro printer that can take a continuous inking system), or are printing things you'd rather not have photo store employees see, you're probably better off just having Costco or another photo print service do your big prints. They'll do them bigger than a home printer can manage if you want that, the colors and quality from a good shop will be better than anything but a very expensive printer, and when you look at the cost per square inch of good-quality ink and photo paper, it's almost always substantially cheaper.

Pick up a cheap B&W laser to do day-to-day document printing, and you're covered with a machine that won't die from lack of use.

I've actually had nothing but bad results from printing services mainly because I shoot in RAW on a DSLR. I edit my own photos in Lightroom and print from there directly, so I often make 3 or 4 different prints per photo before I get the colors I like, plus I have to compress images to jpeg which fucks them up pretty badly if I use a printing service. I don't make bigger than letter-sized photos so I have no need for larger sizes either.

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kode54
Nov 26, 2007

aka kuroshi
Fun Shoe
Print shops to do color prints if you don't print that often? Hmm. Do any of these print shops also print on printable CD-Rs or DVD-Rs? Because that's another use I have for an inkjet. Copying every few months or so as well, as I have a doctor that doesn't like to send duplicate bills when requesting a payment by mail. Otherwise, I'd spring for a color laser with scanning capability, preferably something that can be connected via Ethernet instead of USB, can be printed to from Windows, OS X, or Linux, and can be scanned from using VueScan, which I already have a limited license for that is probably going to expire this year if I don't upgrade it.

If I can convince my dad that a color laser multifunction, or a collection of network connected devices, is better than our existing Epson RX-580, and that we can get CDs printed elsewhere, I can go partially into investing in this. Plus, it could probably result in a better scanner than the power of strobing LEDs.

(Regarding printed CDs, the typical process is that he will record an LP from his old collection, using a USB turntable and Audacity, then split the tracks up from the single recording, save to MP3. Then he'll burn the MP3s to a CD and find some suitable cover art to print onto the CD, which will then have to sit somewhere for 24 hours after printing. Yes, I know, analog to lossy to CD, bad, but I can't really justify him wasting his minimal storage space on FLACs of noisy analog recordings. Hell, I'm not even sure if the ADC in that turntable can be trusted, since its recording volume has to be turned down to 2% for the recordings to be usable, lest they be totally blown out. But that's probably a topic for another subforum.)

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