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Moola posted:Yeah maybe, they seem kinda like the wow community that bitches and whines whenever anything that was previously difficult is nerfed. I don't know of any dark souls community outside of this thread, but I'm not seeing that kind of overreaction to the nerf. Removing tracking completely seems excessive, I guess we'll see when more people here see it in action. I like having a few moments of fuckoff-difficulty. It makes for memorable moments and something to talk about. The magicians in Amana it didn't feel unfair to me. Dinobutts in dks1 is an example of something that was complete bullshit and just poor design. I'm glad they nerfed the dinobutts in dks1.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:27
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edit: Oops, I'm wrong. Never mind.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:29
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PerOlus posted:I don't know of any dark souls community outside of this thread, but I'm not seeing that kind of overreaction to the nerf. What were the Dinobuts in DKS1? I played that game end to end a few times I have no idea what you could be talking about.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:29
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Aramoro posted:What were the Dinobuts in DKS1? I played that game end to end a few times I have no idea what you could be talking about. If you played through the non-shortcut version of Lost Izalith, and honestly shame on you for doing that, you'd encounter what looked like the back halves of dinosaurs stomping around.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:31
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Aramoro posted:What were the Dinobuts in DKS1? I played that game end to end a few times I have no idea what you could be talking about. Those big leggy motherfuckers in front of Izalith standing in the lava. They were patched to make them less aggro happy.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:32
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Aramoro posted:What were the Dinobuts in DKS1? I played that game end to end a few times I have no idea what you could be talking about. In Lost Izalith. "Bounding demons" is the scientific name. They had a huge aggro range when the game first came out and you'd pretty much aggro the entire level dodging to keep one from jumping on you. I don't think they re-spawned though so I don't remember it being that bad.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:32
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Aramoro posted:What were the Dinobuts in DKS1? I played that game end to end a few times I have no idea what you could be talking about. Lost Izalith had an area that was basically a giagantic open field filled with lava and populated by gigantic lower-halves of dinosaur skeletons. The bloom from the lava made it impossible to see, and the giant dinosaurs were basically impossible to take on in single-combat, so you either cheezed it with arrows or just booked it.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:33
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Tokyo Sex Whale posted:In Lost Izalith. "Bounding demons" is the scientific name. They had a huge aggro range when the game first came out and you'd pretty much aggro the entire level dodging to keep one from jumping on you. I don't think they re-spawned though so I don't remember it being that bad. Wasn't that part of the patch as well? They were godawful.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:33
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HellCopter posted:Lost Izalith had an area that was basically a giagantic open field filled with lava and populated by gigantic lower-halves of dinosaur skeletons. The bloom from the lava made it impossible to see, and the giant dinosaurs were basically impossible to take on in single-combat, so you either cheezed it with arrows or just booked it. I remember playing on an old, lovely TV for a while that had hosed up orange contrast and it bled reds everywhere. That entire area was just one giant mass of blinding blob of orange 
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Apr 11, 2014 16:35
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As much as I would like for newcomers in Amanda to suffer as I suffered, the nerf is needed and welcome. The tracking and range on that magic was loving absurd, and the level is dangerous enough without having to plink at those mages every time you see a white speck on the horizon.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:35
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Lotish posted:Never seen the belly flop, but getting boxed in by other players has happened to me a few times on a few fights. I think one time I went after Smelter I got his attention, was circling to avoid his overhead swing, and the other player came around the other direction and stopped my roll with his body at just the wrong moment so I ate the full hit. 
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Apr 11, 2014 16:37
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Oxxidation posted:As much as I would like for newcomers in Amanda to suffer as I suffered, the nerf is needed and welcome. The tracking and range on that magic was loving absurd, and the level is dangerous enough without having to plink at those mages every time you see a white speck on the horizon. Yeah, that range, that lock-on, that swamp, that firing speed, those other enemies, that slow water and that (admittedly potential) damage? Something needed to be changed there, I think. It got kind of tedious with all factors to consider; not really a challenge, just boring.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:44
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Re: NG+ Tseldora's surprise: Will the damage done to Freja carry over to the actual boss fight? Because that'd be awesome. I Speared about half her health away right there. I knew it was coming, I'd read spoilers about it, it still made me jump.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:51
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ChibiSoma posted:Re: NG+ Tseldora's surprise: Will the damage done to Freja carry over to the actual boss fight? Because that'd be awesome. I Speared about half her health away right there. I knew it was coming, I'd read spoilers about it, it still made me jump. Yes, it lowers her health permanently. Enjoy a half as tough Freja.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:53
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Barudak posted:If you played through the non-shortcut version of Lost Izalith, and honestly shame on you for doing that, you'd encounter what looked like the back halves of dinosaurs stomping around. Ah I didn't know much about that really, I shot them all from miles away whenever I saw them so they never really did anything to me. Not like the Titanite Daemon on the short cut, he hosed me up repeatedly.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:53
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I tried Shrine of Amana post-patch and... I'm not seeing what's the huge deal? The spells are slightly easier to avoid, but will still hit you in a lot of the same occasions you'd be hit before (you weren't being careful/didn't notice/locked yourself in an animation while a caster had noticed you) and still do the same amount of damage 
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Apr 11, 2014 17:02
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Okay, lore talk. The Dark Soul is some corrupting thing from the abyss that got split into many tiny pieces called Humanity. The Cursed Undeads are driven to reap the world collecting souls, until they burn out and go hollow. The things called 'Humanity' are closely linked with the undead curse - they're like fuel that keeps the Undead 'alive' and killing poo poo/harvesting souls for longer. The net effect of this is that a bunch of undeads will start getting violent and collecting souls of most nearby humans, animals, and other undeads. Since more soul = more power, there's an inherent clustering, snowballing effect where souls will get concentrated in the biggest couple badasses in the region. And then, the last man standing, the toughest, souliest, giantest level 999 guy around, will eventually go hollow. The Abyss's impulse is just to drain poo poo. Put out fires, put out lives, leave dark and hollow emptiness behind. The undeads serve that purpose in a similar way that a wildfire can clear out land. The Dark Soul, and its pieces, are an agent(s) that do it consciously. In DS1, Artorias was possessed by a piece of the dark soul, and got all gross and abyssified. This is weird - when the Abyss kills someone, it usually leaves an emptied-out husk. New Londo didn't have a horde of abyss-possessed zombies, it just had a huge pile of lifedrained out bodies. I don't think Artorias was ever defeated, I think he won against whatever horrors he faced. I think he beat enough abyss minions and humanity ghosts, and collected enough Dark Soul stuff that it became a part of him, then took over. In DS2, the final boss is an incarnation of a dark soul piece, like Manus was. She shows up, says the PC is 'worthy,' and then starts fighting. But she's weak and slow as hell. She's a total pushover - of course you can kick her rear end and eat her soul. She knows this. Maybe she isn't trying to beat you - maybe she's just trying to bait you into killing and harvesting her. Then, once you get a belly-full of Dark Soul, you become the next dark champion in line, and all of those millions+ of soulbux and 'great souls' you've collected are committed to the abyss. Beating and integrating Nashandra is the 'bad ending' this time around. There's no world to save and no grand prize besides an empty throne in a dead kingdom, there's no reason at all to fight her besides sheer 'Want' for more soulbux and higher levels. The 'good ending' is deciding to quit on your ever-escalating rampage for more souls, enjoying your pile of millions and not going hollow for a very long time. Majula is kind of a nice place, right? StringOfLetters fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Apr 11, 2014 |
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Apr 11, 2014 17:03
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StringOfLetters posted:Okay, lore talk. I'm pretty sure the final boss is easy because most of the bosses are. Honestly, it's a Souls tradition to have an easy final boss by this point. I think you're reading too much into an easy fight.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:06
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Flytrap posted:I'm pretty sure the final boss is easy because most of the bosses are. Honestly, it's a Souls tradition to have an easy final boss by this point. I think you're reading too much into an easy fight. I dunno, Demon's Souls' final boss was easy, and that was entirely on purpose. There's precedent at least.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:15
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HellCopter posted:I dunno, Demon's Souls' final boss was easy, and that was entirely on purpose. There's precedent at least. Are you talking about the proper Allant fight or Catdog Allant? Because the latter isn't a fight at all and is just sort of there. Old King Allant is a pretty drat good final boss in every way.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:18
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Tracula posted:Are you talking about the proper Allant fight or Catdog Allant? Because the latter isn't a fight at all and is just sort of there. Old King Allant is a pretty drat good final boss in every way. The latter is technically the final bossfight though. False King Allant is boss of 1-4, True King Allant is the final boss of the Nexus.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:19
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Barudak posted:The latter is technically the final bossfight though. False King Allant is boss of 1-4, True King Allant is the final boss of the Nexus. Ehh. True King Allant is technically the final boss I know but you can really just walk in there, close your eyes and mash R1 a few times and win. Bed of Chaos is more of a boss than he is. If you're going to compare actual final fights it's better to use the False King and hold him up against Gwyn and Nashandra The changes to DSII got posted to the official facebook fan page. The amount of  there is already hilarious.https://www.facebook.com/darksouls/photos/a.123871221019264.23050.119869331419453/640567839349597/?type=1
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Apr 11, 2014 17:25
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 Thank you, Karasu Nazo Saix, for your valuable opinion on the video game Dark 2.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:28
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People need to stop saying 'it's a souls tradition'. The end boss of Dark Souls 2 is easily the easiest end boss of the series. I guess Gwyn isn't very hard when you learn his attack patterns and parrying, but the first time against him he has some nasty attacks that will surprise you. All Nashandra has is easy to dodge, telegraphed attacks. Literally killed her on my first try, and I suck!
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Apr 11, 2014 17:30
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Moola posted:People need to stop saying 'it's a souls tradition'. The end boss of Dark Souls 2 is easily the easiest end boss of the series. Kings Field Final Bosses after Guyra were pretty easy too but thats mostly because you could pause the game and heal to full between each attack it made while backpedaling away from its paltry melee. The final boss of DS2 is just a pushover, even if you do it the tough way as a back to back bossfight.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:32
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Not that Facebook comments have ever been a bastion of reason, but Dark Souls posted about the 1.03 patch and the DS Elitists have come out in force about making the game too easy for casuls.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:32
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So the spells in Amana no longer home? That's stupid as poo poo; it was what made the area a ton of fun, because you had to be constantly on the move and using the pillars that are there to block some of the shots.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:36
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Barudak posted:The latter is technically the final bossfight though. False King Allant is boss of 1-4, True King Allant is the final boss of the Nexus. Yes, reminder that you can actually make storm king or the maiden Astra the 'final boss' since all it takes to get to false king is beating an arch demon. You can walk up and take him down anytime after beating dragon God. Dark souls, both bosses have to be beaten to cue the credits. Real king has to be beaten to cue credits. Hence, real king is final boss. False king is the spiritual final boss but it's not the actual final boss.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:37
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It must get pretty tiresome as a game developer hearing the vocal minority yell and pitch a fit about whatever changes you make to your game. Hopefully enough people start or finish playing the game because of the nerfs or other changes (cough Drangleic Castle gate cough) to make up for it.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:37
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So where on earth do I go to avoid the Ancient Dragon's flying AOE attack?
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Apr 11, 2014 18:12
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Those are glitches, though. The gate in Drangleic Castle not opening is something that's not supposed to happen. Shrine of Amana, though? Totally manageable. The homing shots were no problem once you learnt to deal with them: use pillars, be careful to have enough stamina for dodging left (walking might be smarter than running), stay on the lookout for sudden drops... The only problem with that zone was the dodgy level geometry, which meant you sometimes were blocked by barely visible stairs underwater that you normally could walk over, and the ridiculous aggro range of the mages. It DID add a sense of urgency when you take on two mages, and suddenly a third one from a million miles away jumps from the bushes, but it was also kinda bullshit. Note that there is only ONE place where this is a problem: the islands right before the third bonfire. There's four mages, and if you melee the second one, all four might aggro you. This is BAD design - based on their distance to each other, two should aggro you at the same time, not more. It's the only instance, though. Seriously, just reduce the aggro range of those two mages only, and the single most frustrating part of the level would be completely defused. Removing the homing capabilities makes it boring. It's like the Anor Londo archers all over again. They even moved the archers in later patches so that the second one CAN'T attack you while you deal with the first one! 
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Apr 11, 2014 18:12
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Leyburn posted:So where on earth do I go to avoid the Ancient Dragon's flying AOE attack? Run, run run. In a straight line, away from him. If you started early enough you will survive.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:15
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Dark Chasm is like all the little things I don't like in this game, condensed in to this tiny area of awfulness. Thank god it's entirely ignorable unless I decide I really want the All Hexes trophy for some reason.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:18
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Shrine of Amana was the only (non-boss) place I died more than once or twice so I am glad to see they've completely stripped the area of any difficulty whatsoever.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:18
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I'm trying to bait red invaders to level up the Way of the Blue, but so far after 30 minutes and three invasions it's not going so hot.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:20
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Leyburn posted:So where on earth do I go to avoid the Ancient Dragon's flying AOE attack? As soon as he takes off, start sprinting towards his big dangling tail. If he turns, turn with him. And strip your armor off if you haven't already, it will not protect you. Bigass Moth posted:I'm trying to bait red invaders to level up the Way of the Blue, but so far after 30 minutes and three invasions it's not going so hot. The Red Blood rear end in a top hat covenant guy sells a ring that makes you a higher priority to be invaded. Pretty sure it works even if you are not still in their covenant. And there's a gnarled crow-person finger bone in the Undead Crypt - using it resets your invadable delay, so you can get dudes coming after you right after another. Invasions seem to be pretty frequent in the Huntman's copse woodsy area, but ymmv. StringOfLetters fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Apr 11, 2014 |
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Apr 11, 2014 18:20
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Torquemadras posted:It's like the Anor Londo archers all over again. They even moved the archers in later patches so that the second one CAN'T attack you while you deal with the first one! I never knew that was a change. That's a pretty dumb change, shame I never got to go through that. If we're lucky maybe they'll reverse this nerf and give them a more sensible one. I still don't get the Lost Giant nerf tho; despite all the idiots here defending it I've never even seen people complaining about it or mentioning "fault hitboxes" prior to the patch notes being translated, which makes me wonder why they decided to nerf it.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:20
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StringOfLetters posted:As soon as he takes off, start sprinting towards his big dangling tail. If he turns, turn with him. And strip your armor off if you haven't already, it will not protect you. To add on this if his tail ever goes over the arena boundaries for you go the opposite direction, the distance should help.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:22
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StringOfLetters posted:In DS2, the final boss is an incarnation of a dark soul piece, like Manus was. She shows up, says the PC is 'worthy,' and then starts fighting. But she's weak and slow as hell. She's a total pushover - of course you can kick her rear end and eat her soul. She knows this. Maybe she isn't trying to beat you - maybe she's just trying to bait you into killing and harvesting her. Then, once you get a belly-full of Dark Soul, you become the next dark champion in line, and all of those millions+ of soulbux and 'great souls' you've collected are committed to the abyss. Beating and integrating Nashandra is the 'bad ending' this time around. There's no world to save and no grand prize besides an empty throne in a dead kingdom, there's no reason at all to fight her besides sheer 'Want' for more soulbux and higher levels. The 'good ending' is deciding to quit on your ever-escalating rampage for more souls, enjoying your pile of millions and not going hollow for a very long time. Majula is kind of a nice place, right? I interpret things differently, but going off what you said, the "good" ending is just forestalling the inevitable, because that's exactly what Vendrick tried to do and now another chosen undead is here to do the job. He could have assumed the throne but locked himself away in the Undead Crypt instead. Then you take the ring he was trying to hide away and face the same choice: Assume the throne or don't. But not assuming the throne doesn't stop or fix the problem and doesn't stop someone else dropping into the Betwixt and coming to get you and ultimately doing what you didn't. So going with that, ultimately Nashandra's victory, post-humous or otherwise, is complete.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:24
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One final question before I duck out of this thread completely til PC release. I know it's sort of kind of implied by the sequel number, but is the story here tied in any major way with that of DS1? More especially, with the DS1 DLC? I never actually started the DLC or know anything about it, wondering if I should try to do that in the couple weeks left until release.
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