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friends watch porn posted:What's the best way to get the They See Me Baggin achievement, where you have to get away in an Garage Escape with 8 bags? Nightclub. Keep restarting until you get enough bags of coke and then just hope you get Garage.
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Jul 14, 2014 21:58
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Reith posted:Nightclub. Keep restarting until you get enough bags of coke and then just hope you get Garage. Yeah that makes sense, thanks.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:01
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Oh my god pubbies are the worst. We stealthed Train Heist and I told them like 5 times not to put the turret parts into the boat until we get all the shells over. The first loving thing they do once we get the turret? Throw all three pieces into the boat.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:13
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djw175 posted:We stealthed Train Heist How?  Or was this the stupid glitch way?
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Jul 14, 2014 22:17
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John Murdoch posted:How? Getting lucky mostly. No guards in the compartments and a minimum amount patrolling around. We didn't even mean to stealth it. We just got lucky.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:18
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Wow. That's honestly the first I've heard of it being done (legitimately) post stealth rework. Overkill or something lower?
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Jul 14, 2014 22:33
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John Murdoch posted:Wow. That's honestly the first I've heard of it being done (legitimately) post stealth rework. Overkill or something lower? Of loving course. I'm crazy, not stupid.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:35
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Was just wondering if it was something lower and had fewer guards as a consequence. Maybe they secretly fixed it? :p
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Jul 14, 2014 22:38
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John Murdoch posted:Was just wondering if it was something lower and had fewer guards as a consequence. Maybe they secretly fixed it? :p Probably not. I mean I know there was still a guard wandering around, he just never saw us.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:40
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What did the stealth rework change besides dominating now costing a pager?
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Jul 14, 2014 22:41
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I know there's a real-life reason for it, but the Swedish K not having select fire options bugs me because I put all of my guns on single shot at the start of a heist out of habit.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:41
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Bunleigh posted:What did the stealth rework change besides dominating now costing a pager? They removed Smooth Talker (You can answer pagers #3 and #4.) from Mastermind, replaced it with Spotter, and made everyone able to answer all pagers. They also tweaked the number of guards on a few heists, mainly making Framing Frame day 3 harder and largely un-loving GO Bank. I think there were also some minor changes to detection, and I'm not sure if it was at exactly the same time but they fixed the long standing inverse detection range bug.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:44
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John Murdoch posted:They removed Smooth Talker (You can answer pagers #3 and #4.) from Mastermind, replaced it with Spotter, and made everyone able to answer all pagers. They also tweaked the number of guards on a few heists, mainly making Framing Frame day 3 harder and largely un-loving GO Bank. You forgot the body bags being changed so there was a limited number of them instead of unlimited.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:46
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Plus the body bag asset, yeah.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:48
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Bunleigh posted:What did the stealth rework change besides dominating now costing a pager? They changed around body bags. Used to be you had to ace cleaner to get them, But you had infinite. They also added in random check in guards in old stealth maps. I used to stealth framing frame all the time, because pre changes it was all about killing four guards and dominating the fifth. Basically clearing the place on stealth (like H and T bank still is). Then they went to a new vision of stealth where the goal is to avoid being seen. At first I was pissed about the changes but the maps made post changes (election day, shadow raid) use the system well. The problem is many old maps, again framing frame, weren't well designed layout wise for a non kill everyone form of stealth.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:51
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John Murdoch posted:Plus the body bag asset, yeah. That reminds me, i really want there to be a cable tie asset. You can pick it up at the hardware store on the way to the heist.
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Jul 14, 2014 22:52
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Werix posted:The problem is many old maps, again framing frame, weren't well designed layout wise for a non kill everyone form of stealth. FF is really the worst of all the old maps for it because its a combination of lots of blind corners in the stairwell areas, an open layout with huge amounts of glass that alerts can be called in on if/when it breaks, and a camera system that is hardly useful half of the time (plus you can't kill a camera guard on it to prevent being noticed either).
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Jul 14, 2014 22:56
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It would be cool if they restructured FF for more maneuver room, maybe make a few guards static like SR, and add a reasonably accessible camera room. Also add a more natural stealth->loud fallback, rather than "lose all progress, hold out for 5 minutes of hell".
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Jul 14, 2014 23:05
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They made Nightclub bigger, why not remake Framing Frame? They should have a guard randomly walk off the map from those stairs. A stair master.
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Jul 14, 2014 23:17
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If you gave Ghosts a skill that could auto-spot guards and civilians within 10m of them I imagine you would have substantially fewer problems with stealth maps, especially Framing Frame.
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Jul 14, 2014 23:18
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yeah I should still be able to steal all his gold AND upload all his odd voyeur footage of his own arms deals or whatever, if nothing else. I've stealthed DW Pro framing frame (aka stood around doing gently caress all while someone else did it) and it's incredibly boring. Patience is one thing but it's basically a two-person heist so two people sit around doing nothing and two people do all the work over an excruciatingly long period of time. It's super badly designed with the new stealth for that alone - it's simply not fun to play, nor is it an effective stealth heist when half your team basically stands at the spawn and goes AFK. even the camera guy can basically go afk while putting a weight on the S key and M1. so yeah 4 people in the heist, of which one person is doing anything and the rest are accidentally firing Locos and ruining stealth. Yep, great design 
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Jul 14, 2014 23:18
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The good old days when you could domination blitz a map. Who needed 4 pagers when you could joker all the guards on the map in like a minute?
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Jul 14, 2014 23:25
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The Gate posted:I'd have been fine with GO if the security that shows up wouldn't freak out half a mile down the road from the bank thanks to their telepathy. Seriously, how the gently caress do they know anything is up the instant they hop out of their truck sometimes? That's caused by broken windows. The elevators on Big Bank are also perfectly fair. I don't have any problems with the stealth design on that map.
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Jul 14, 2014 23:48
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Stealthed Firestarter day 2 for the first time by rushing in with a saw and ECM chaining till we got the server and got outta there. With pubbies, no less. 
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Jul 14, 2014 23:52
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On GO Bank I've only had the Gensec guys alert before getting out of their vehicle if someone screwed up and broke a window. But after the Gensec check-in there's eventually a cop check-in, and they don't come by car, they just walk in off the map. For some reason those guys seem a lot more prone to just alerting from nothing, so my group generally treats that call as the "get your poo poo and get out" warning. I understand randomness is generally looked down upon by gamers, but I loving love how much stuff can happen in GO bank compared to the snoozefest of H&T. The other day we got fuckin' blackmailed by the guy from the auto store next door, who said if we didn't throw a bag over the wall he'd narc on us. That's loving awesome!
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Jul 14, 2014 23:56
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I really like Shadow Raid and think it's the only job that's fun to solo when my friends aren't on. It's almost better as a solo map really. You have to tediously haul all that loot out by yourself and usually can't open the vault but you get to take your time and not feel rushed by the poor suckers stuck on camera or mule duty. I wish there were more like it.
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Jul 15, 2014 00:01
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-Zydeco- posted:I finally broke. I can take no more Bain. A lot of these are really appropriate to PD2 situations. I'm going to be really disappointed if this doesn't happen.
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Jul 15, 2014 00:21
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Geight posted:On GO Bank I've only had the Gensec guys alert before getting out of their vehicle if someone screwed up and broke a window. But after the Gensec check-in there's eventually a cop check-in, and they don't come by car, they just walk in off the map. For some reason those guys seem a lot more prone to just alerting from nothing, so my group generally treats that call as the "get your poo poo and get out" warning. Yeah, that's the same thing for me and my friends. And that's why it's poo poo, if that call could only happen after the vault has been opened, that would have been fine. But nope, gotta gently caress up those 5 minutes of waiting with RNG calls. Also it doesn't help it has basically the FF problem of going loud means stopping all progress and switching to entirely new objectives. Because even if there is 1 second on that time lock, GUYS THE THERMAL DRILL, GO GRAB IT. I like maps where you can win if you screw up stealth. Framing Frame day 1 is great, so is Firestarted day 2, cause even when you get detected, with ECM rushing and good coordination, you can still win it. Even Election Day is winnable when stealth goes south, especially day 2. But nope, not on GO gently caress Yourself Bank. Better wait out for 10 minutes while the pilot misses the baloon while cops steal all your cash and a cavalcade of snipers rips you a new anus. Geight posted:I understand randomness is generally looked down upon by gamers, but I loving love how much stuff can happen in GO bank compared to the snoozefest of H&T. The other day we got fuckin' blackmailed by the
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Jul 15, 2014 00:50
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 "My life is suffering."
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Jul 15, 2014 00:58
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What's the general consensus on ECM Feedback?
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Jul 15, 2014 01:17
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It's pretty neat to have, not that useful but who needs 16 ammo bags total and it gives you more utility when things go bad.
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Jul 15, 2014 01:22
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chaos rhames posted:It's pretty neat to have, not that useful but who needs 16 ammo bags total and it gives you more utility when things go bad. The opposite of this. ECM Feedback is a waste of points and a slot that could have ammo or medibags- if you have those, you shouldn't run into a "things go bad" situation that would theoretically merit ECM Feedback.
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Jul 15, 2014 01:23
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Kikas posted:Yeah, that's the same thing for me and my friends. And that's why it's poo poo, if that call could only happen after the vault has been opened, that would have been fine. But nope, gotta gently caress up those 5 minutes of waiting with RNG calls. Also it doesn't help it has basically the FF problem of going loud means stopping all progress and switching to entirely new objectives. Because even if there is 1 second on that time lock, GUYS THE THERMAL DRILL, GO GRAB IT. I like maps where you can win if you screw up stealth. Framing Frame day 1 is great, so is Firestarted day 2, cause even when you get detected, with ECM rushing and good coordination, you can still win it. Even Election Day is winnable when stealth goes south, especially day 2. Magnetic North posted:What's the general consensus on ECM Feedback? Scalding Coffee fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Jul 15, 2014 |
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Jul 15, 2014 01:26
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Magnetic North posted:What's the general consensus on ECM Feedback?
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Jul 15, 2014 01:34
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Drewcifer might be new but he's got a good head on his shoulders and listens well. Good job Drewcifer.
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Jul 15, 2014 01:35
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Magnetic North posted:What's the general consensus on ECM Feedback? If I have a goon who's level 60 and saying he's got ECM Feedback, dodge%, safe-picking, etc., I'm going to tell him to re-spec if he wants me to bring him through Overkill Rats/Watchdogs/other louds, because you're seriously not going to numberfuck the loud game without killing cops, and I don't want to babysit a build without any survivability. This is doubly so if you're very new to the game. In that case, I'd rather have you shooting and at least helping with objectives. If it's a goon who I know is good at the game, I'll let him take whatever he wants as long as he shoots cops, revives teammates, does objectives, all that jazz. Hell, I'll even welcome Feedback on something like Firestarter 2 or other short missions that require a gauntlet run. I will, however be pissed if someone's not shooting cops or not reviving teammates because they picked a build that won't let them stand out in the open for long. I played a match with Skand, Snakes, and KGC-or-something (I'm sorry, I forgot your name, friend) for the first time with any of them the other night, and we got a full cook on Rats done without any problems besides the third guy's connection issues. I seriously forgot how easy this game can be when everyone just picks a weapon build, some survival skills, and general useful skills, and spends the rest of the time shooting cops. We had two Shotgunforcers patrolling the floors, a guy with Aced Inspire, and a guy with a good sniper/close-game build. Nobody was down while a guy with HBV and ECMs was hiding in a corner, no shields made it into the house, and there was never a dozer alive near us for more than a second or two. I've played with groups of guys who hacked themselves every skill who weren't as useful. Plan Z fucked around with this message at 01:54 on Jul 15, 2014 |
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Jul 15, 2014 01:52
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Magnetic North posted:What's the general consensus on ECM Feedback? It's 4 points you are spending on 30-40 seconds of bailout time during a heist that will last 10-20 minutes minimum and you are also taking up an equipment slot that could be filled with something more useful like ammo, health, or C4. And god forbid you ace the skill. If you are getting overrun such that you need feedback to bail you out, you are doing something wrong like: moving out during an assault, not killing enough cops, or playing with pubbies who are doing one of the first two things and won't listen to you yell at them about it. Stealth and Loud gameplay do not mix very well in this game. Like the only way I could see it being worth it is if you have a stealth build and are low enough level that you don't have enough points to climb any other trees and want to play with Scalding Coffee posted:I can bring newbies to Overkill Rats and keep the crew alive until the end with them. Can't do that with ammo bags. Don't carry newbies through heists they aren't ready for with dumb gimmick poo poo like ECM feedback. Carry them through with Ammo, Meds, and Murder otherwise they will never learn the core gameplay mechanic of cop murder and will forever be Bad at Payday 2. Just ask Fat Samurai, while Jerik, Sykic, and I carried him through an Overkill Election day 2b, he learned a valuable lesson about the thermal drill spawn on that map  e: Sykic and I were talking a bit about how we both went through all the Deathwish missions loud for the masks and learned a lot about taking cover and staying alive, efficiently accomplishing objective in between assaults, and buckling down during assaults to kill many mans. Playing on Deathwish will help you demolish Overkill and learn to shoot mans well enough for those triple digit kill counts Alpine keeps posting. Maybe some of you newer guys who are just hitting your level brick wall at 80-90 are in for some Deathwish lobbies 
Fellis fucked around with this message at 02:03 on Jul 15, 2014 |
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Jul 15, 2014 01:54
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I've seen ECM feedback used effectively maybe twice in my time played, both times during an armored transport job.
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Jul 15, 2014 02:00
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Scalding Coffee posted:I can bring newbies to Overkill Rats and keep the crew alive until the end with them. Can't do that with ammo bags. It makes bringing your ECMs with Enforcers viable, since those assholes will ruin stealth. I run Watchdogs with ECMs since everyone else has enough ammo to last three days. Oops, the Inspire guy got knocked out, time to cover his sissy rear end who stays in the back with his pea shooter, yelling at people. Who needs ECMs when we can ram our faces at dozers with our unlimited ammo? I should have stuck with Payday 1, not this sneaking bullshit. This is why I think ECMs should have some kind of combat effect normally, because they become totally useless if things go loud unless you've invested very heavily in the ghost tree. My idea was that they create a temporary pause in the assault wave while they're active, so while it won't stun cops like feedback, it will back some of the heat off for a moment, which could potentially help a ton if timed right (and it would still leave them available to be switched to feedback mode in case you are heavily invested in ghost). I wish there were some concessions given to playing in offline mode to make up for the lack of supplies from the AI. The AI themselves are fine in combat, what with their super health and infinite ammo, but you're at a big disadvantage when trying to do stealth crowd control because of the lack of cable ties and the fact that the AI will only help shout down civilians after an alert (also they can't carry mission supplies so it makes double keycards like shadow raid near impossible). I understand that it's a multiplayer game, but I essentially see offline as a "practice mode" to allow you to retry a lot without worrying about pissing off other players. It would be good if you had some level of AI control where you could at least do something like tell them to pick up or drop/use a bag/object, or tie a civilian, or order them to stay in place rather than follow you. I don't want Rainbow Six level squad control, just the ability to get AI to handle basic tasks that don't actually require critical thought and any player is capable of doing.
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Jul 15, 2014 02:07
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Don't be so angry about something that is available to all classes and requires knowledge on using it correctly. It still requires them to fight above their weight and support each other in dire times. No one has yet to be captured, we did it all as a team. I still never got an answer about what is a gimmick build since everyone can multi-class in whatever they want, then instantly respec. Early game is boring as gently caress without any fun tools. On Overkill, they now know how hard it is and it gets worse from there. They also did their first big score with nothing but their fps skills on something that scares pubbies away because it is too hard to carry newbies.
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Jul 15, 2014 02:14
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