Paradox Grand Strategy: From the Carnival of Lust to the Enlightened Times

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Paradox Grand Strategy: From the Carnival of Lust to the Enlightened Times

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Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

GrossMurpel posted:

You can't start crises as a GP but you can definitely start them against a GP (Ottoman Macedonia, anyone?)
You have to actually have a core, you likely only have Scandinavian cores in Finland.

I checked and they're Swedish

# ? Aug 2, 2014 15:59

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# ? May 10, 2024 10:45

fuck off Batman: Oct 14, 2013; Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah!

GrossMurpel posted:

You can't start crises as a GP but you can definitely start them against a GP (Ottoman Macedonia, anyone?)
You have to actually have a core, you likely only have Scandinavian cores in Finland.

Most of the games Russia is #2 or #3 GP so they have a large bonus against flashpoint development. Practically, they can never have a crisis inside their border if they keep their high ranking. Ottos are mostly #8 or secondary so they are crisis central.

Even so, I think Slime Bro can't even put a national focus to create a flashpoint tension in Finland. Either he is a Great Power, Russia is too strong or he can't because of Finland's cores (it's been a while so I forgot all the requirements).

# ? Aug 2, 2014 17:00

uPen: Jan 25, 2010; Zu Rodina!

Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:

I checked and they're Swedish

iirc you can't use NF to generate crisis points when any GP is at war.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 17:22

Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

Disco Infiva posted:

Most of the games Russia is #2 or #3 GP so they have a large bonus against flashpoint development. Practically, they can never have a crisis inside their border if they keep their high ranking. Ottos are mostly #8 or secondary so they are crisis central.

Even so, I think Slime Bro can't even put a national focus to create a flashpoint tension in Finland. Either he is a Great Power, Russia is too strong or he can't because of Finland's cores (it's been a while so I forgot all the requirements).

I tried it before I was a Great Power and still wasn't able too, and I think Finland has 3 cores from what I'm seeing in the game: Finland, Sweden and Russia. I suspect it's that (1) one of the GPs is at war (maybe the Netherlands crisis?) or (2) Russia is just too powerful. If it's 2, that feels pretty lame.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 18:07

Chickpea Roar: Jan 11, 2006; Merdre!

I tried it it my game and I could put a NF on northern Finland, but not on Southern Finland. I took Northern Finland to get a border with Southern Finland, but I still couldn't. The only difference I can see is that Sweden doesn't have a core on one of Southern Finland's provinces.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 19:54

DStecks: Feb 6, 2012

Seems to me that having Solider pops of a non-accepted culture is something you shouldn't even be able to do.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 20:47

Raskolnikov38: Mar 3, 2007; We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold

DStecks posted:

Seems to me that having Solider pops of a non-accepted culture is something you shouldn't even be able to do.

But that happened all the time during the vicky time frame, the sepoys for example.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 21:01

Kavak: Aug 23, 2009

The Irish in Great Britain, Poles in Russia, Bretons in France- there are tons of examples of soldiers being called up from second-class citizens.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 21:07

DStecks: Feb 6, 2012

Raskolnikov38 posted:

But that happened all the time during the vicky time frame, the sepoys for example.

That's a good point, but more of an edge case than a real example: colonial armies in lightly-colonized regions. I guess that would be more a failure of the "accepted cultures" mechanic to capture that nuance; since while they may not have been "accepted" by the ruling group, they were the majority in the region.

It just feels like population control via army recruitment is something that should have some kind of disincentive attached to it.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 21:09

Drone: Aug 22, 2003; Incredible machine

DStecks posted:

It just feels like population control via army recruitment is something that should have some kind of disincentive attached to it.

A sense of ethics?

I mean on the other side of that coin, you really shouldn't be able to murder your wife and children in CK2 either, but that's core gameplay there.

I'm not advocating for simulated pixelpeople Paradox game genocide.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 21:13

Communist Zombie: Nov 1, 2011

bUm posted:

On a somewhat related note (also from pages ago): it boggles my mind that people try to mod HoI to post-WWII instead of V2, which is the naturally most analogous to modern times. It seems like updating the tech trees (changing Industrialization to Modernization), adding more economic/geopolitical actions that could levee conflict without hot war, and modest other adjustments would go very far towards modelling the Cold War through today far better than anything HoI could do.

Speaking of Cold War mods for V2, are there any good ones out there?

The only up to date one Ive been able to find is kinda the 'Victoria Ultimate Mod Rebooted', it has a 1946 start scenario.
Any here ever try it? Is it any good?

Communist Zombie fucked around with this message at 01:37 on Aug 3, 2014

# ? Aug 2, 2014 21:18

Patter Song: Mar 26, 2010; Hereby it is manifest that during the time men live without a common power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called war; and such a war as is of every man against every man.; Fun Shoe

DStecks posted:

Seems to me that having Solider pops of a non-accepted culture is something you shouldn't even be able to do.

Croatia was still technically a march with mandatory military service for the Austrian Empire until 1848. There were tons of Irish at every level in the British military. Cossacks were practically a military caste in the Russian Empire. The French army had vast, vast numbers of West African soldiers in World War I. I don't think these are edge cases, they're a fundamental aspect of how the period worked in multinational empires.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 21:31

burnishedfume: Mar 8, 2011; You really are a louse...

It depends on the nation we're talking about how much sense it would make; on the one hand, things like Russia recruiting Polish soldiers, even if Russia has a citizenship policy that makes Poles second class citizens did totally happen in great enough numbers that it really can't be excluded, but on the other hand, the CSA recruiting African-Americans as soldiers shouldn't be possible outside of a decision to maybe create a couple of units. Granted it already can't really happen because the number of free African-Americans in the south tends to be so low there aren't even 1000 free African-American to make soldiers anyway, but you can theoretically have an independent CSA with legal slavery and African-American soldiers if you win the war and wait long enough.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 22:44

A Buttery Pastry: Sep 4, 2011; Delicious and Informative!

A simple solution could be to make it so militancy among non-accepted soldier pops (or possibly their culture in general?) increases dramatically the greater proportion of your total forces they represent? Maybe even just generally, so if there are more non-accepted culture regiments than regiments of your accepted cultures, they all start to gain militancy, even if they individually can't match your accepted culture regiments.

Not sure exactly where the balance should be, but I think it makes a certain kind of sense.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 22:57

Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

DrProsek posted:

It depends on the nation we're talking about how much sense it would make; on the one hand, things like Russia recruiting Polish soldiers, even if Russia has a citizenship policy that makes Poles second class citizens did totally happen in great enough numbers that it really can't be excluded, but on the other hand, the CSA recruiting African-Americans as soldiers shouldn't be possible outside of a decision to maybe create a couple of units. Granted it already can't really happen because the number of free African-Americans in the south tends to be so low there aren't even 1000 free African-American to make soldiers anyway, but you can theoretically have an independent CSA with legal slavery and African-American soldiers if you win the war and wait long enough.

Since I'm still pretty new to V2, how would you do this? It seems like you generally control your soldier selection at the province level, so unless you segregate out our provinces pretty meticulously that's going to be tough when the vast majority of your African Americans are, presumably, slaves working in the same province as their owners?

I guess to me it seems like such a difficult to master mechanic at this point that I'm not sure it's worth the effort to model even more around.

# ? Aug 2, 2014 23:25

bUm: Jan 11, 2011

A Buttery Pastry posted:

The real pros leave their defense to the non-accepted peoples within their borders, so as to inexorably shift the demographic balance of your territories in your favor with each war you fight.

A valid point.

It does depend on the value they bring though; I'd be more hesitant to ~~genocide~~ conscript colonies with valuable RGOs (tropical wood, etc.) or states with industry filled with non-accepted culture just on the principle of it taking time to recover.

DStecks posted:

It just feels like population control via army recruitment is something that should have some kind of disincentive attached to it.

There are a couple, but they're fairly minor.

Doesn't seem like it'd be difficult to marginalize such a strategy with a minor tweak or two.

# ? Aug 3, 2014 00:03

unicr0n: Sep 8, 2003

Drone posted:

NNM (and PDM, but you shouldn't play with PDM) makes the game for South America even better...

Any particular reason why you'd recommend NNM over PDM?

# ? Aug 3, 2014 14:09

A Buttery Pastry: Sep 4, 2011; Delicious and Informative!

unicr0n posted:

Any particular reason why you'd recommend NNM over PDM?

As I recall, PDM makes a lot of weird changes to the game, based largely on how the modders believe the game should work and not how it actually functions. They might(?) have fixed some of the issues later, but still, willfully ignoring how the game is actually programmed in favor of how you think it should be is probably not the best approach to modding.

# ? Aug 3, 2014 14:24

Drone: Aug 22, 2003; Incredible machine

A Buttery Pastry posted:

As I recall, PDM makes a lot of weird changes to the game, based largely on how the modders believe the game should work and not how it actually functions. They might(?) have fixed some of the issues later, but still, willfully ignoring how the game is actually programmed in favor of how you think it should be is probably not the best approach to modding.

That, and PDM makes the game run incredibly slowly come around 1870.

# ? Aug 3, 2014 14:58

Rumda: Nov 4, 2009; Moth Lesbian Comrade

unicr0n posted:

Any particular reason why you'd recommend NNM over PDM?

Like people have said NNM is PDM with the crap sliced out.

# ? Aug 3, 2014 17:53

Agean90: Jun 28, 2008

Rumda posted:

Like people have said NNM is PDM with the crap sliced out.

Still not enough though. Cant I just have more nations and events without the changing national values thing?

# ? Aug 3, 2014 19:37

Patter Song: Mar 26, 2010; Hereby it is manifest that during the time men live without a common power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called war; and such a war as is of every man against every man.; Fun Shoe

I dislike a lot of NNM's nation name changing, tbh.

# ? Aug 3, 2014 19:43

burnishedfume: Mar 8, 2011; You really are a louse...

Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:

Since I'm still pretty new to V2, how would you do this? It seems like you generally control your soldier selection at the province level, so unless you segregate out our provinces pretty meticulously that's going to be tough when the vast majority of your African Americans are, presumably, slaves working in the same province as their owners?

I guess to me it seems like such a difficult to master mechanic at this point that I'm not sure it's worth the effort to model even more around.

Basically, like you'd imagine, African American soldiers are really hard to make in a CSA with slavery. The only way you can really do it is to have a lot of free African-Americans already in the south, plop down a Promote Soldiers NF, set military spending to max, and just hope a bunch of African Americans really want to enlist in the CSA's army. And the only ways I can think to do that without banning slavery is:

1) Before the war, close all factories in the north and open up new ones in the south. Free African-Americans (and Yankees) will have to move south for work, once you get like 50,000 free African Americans in Virginia or something, it shouldn't be too hard to get 1,000 African Americans together to form a regiment once you place down a Promote Soldiers NF

2) Win the war as the CSA and just wait a long rear end time. Like, by the 1920s the natural rate of slaves promoting from slaves might give you enough free African American pops in Georgia to make 3000 dudes.

As you can imagine, neither solution will lead to too many African American regiments for the CSA so you can't enter wacky scenarios of an entirely African American army defending the CSA from Yankee forces, but if you do option 1 you might be able to get a good 15,000 man stack of African American soldiers fighting for the CSA in the Civil War.

# ? Aug 3, 2014 23:50

unicr0n: Sep 8, 2003

Agean90 posted:

Still not enough though. Cant I just have more nations and events without the changing national values thing?

Patter Song posted:

I dislike a lot of NNM's nation name changing, tbh.

Sounds like I should still with Vanilla then.

# ? Aug 4, 2014 00:29

Blarghalt: May 19, 2010

Is there any particular mod for V2 that fixes the problem of the entire world running out of cement circa 1900 or so?

# ? Aug 4, 2014 00:35

Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

Blarghalt posted:

Is there any particular mod for V2 that fixes the problem of the entire world running out of cement circa 1900 or so?

You can run out of resources? Was that even a concern (from a global perspective) in that period?

# ? Aug 4, 2014 00:52

Blarghalt: May 19, 2010

Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:

You can run out of resources? Was that even a concern (from a global perspective) in that period?

Not so much run out, but by 1900 what always happens to me is that nobody is producing enough cement, so production of new factories and the like grinds to a halt.

# ? Aug 4, 2014 00:59

ThatBasqueGuy: Feb 14, 2013; someone introduce jojo to lazyb

Blarghalt posted:

Not so much run out, but by 1900 what always happens to me is that nobody is producing enough cement, so production of new factories and the like grinds to a halt.

Sounds like a market opportunity to me

# ? Aug 4, 2014 02:18

Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

Blarghalt posted:

Not so much run out, but by 1900 what always happens to me is that nobody is producing enough cement, so production of new factories and the like grinds to a halt.

Is there a way to tell if it' just that concrete's demand is continually increasing and the factories can't keep up, or does production drop off as capitalists try to replace the low margin concrete factories with higher end goods (I have no idea if the AI is that smart)?

# ? Aug 4, 2014 04:01

uPen: Jan 25, 2010; Zu Rodina!

Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:

Is there a way to tell if it' just that concrete's demand is continually increasing and the factories can't keep up, or does production drop off as capitalists try to replace the low margin concrete factories with higher end goods (I have no idea if the AI is that smart)?

Britain/France/Germany loses a major war and collapses into permanent revolutions and effectively stops producing anything. This has a catastrophic effect on the world market as whatever good(s) they produced the majority of simply stops existing.

# ? Aug 4, 2014 04:03

Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

uPen posted:

Britain/France/Germany loses a major war and collapses into permanent revolutions and effectively stops producing anything. This has a catastrophic effect on the world market as whatever good(s) they produced the majority of simply stops existing.

Oh well, that too

(sorry he said 1900 so I assumed it was before WWI)

# ? Aug 4, 2014 04:09

Fidel Cuckstro: Jul 2, 2007

Sorry for the double-post, but I think I figured out the Sweden/Finland crisis issue I brought up a page ago or so.

Looking at the province info, I see that Viipuri (#339, the border province to Russia in the state of southern Finland) only has cores of Finland and Russia, and not Sweden. I suspect missing the Sweden core could be causing the problem with calling a crisis in southern Finland. I'll play around and test when I have a chance.

edit- also none of then have a core of Scandinavia, which seems wrong.

Fidel Cuckstro fucked around with this message at 04:35 on Aug 4, 2014

# ? Aug 4, 2014 04:28

Nut to Butt: Apr 13, 2009; by FactsAreUseless

i usually play with the gsg mod, but i think cultural union cores dont show up until you form the union

# ? Aug 4, 2014 06:17

Yaoi Gagarin: Feb 20, 2014

When you form Scandinavia as Sweden you'll keep your old cores on top of the new ones you get.

# ? Aug 4, 2014 06:23

GrossMurpel: Apr 8, 2011

Drink Cheerwine posted:

i usually play with the gsg mod, but i think cultural union cores dont show up until you form the union

They show up as claims or whatever (yellow stripes instead of green ones).

# ? Aug 4, 2014 11:05

podcat: Jun 21, 2012

Blarghalt posted:

Is there any particular mod for V2 that fixes the problem of the entire world running out of cement circa 1900 or so?

Build a cement factory and become rich?

# ? Aug 4, 2014 14:33

Nothingtoseehere: Nov 11, 2010

Can anyone link or write up a quick event I can fire to remove USA cores from the CSA? It someone won the Civil war in 1861 in this game and I want to give it a chance.

# ? Aug 4, 2014 14:39

Drone: Aug 22, 2003; Incredible machine

nothing to seehere posted:

Can anyone link or write up a quick event I can fire to remove USA cores from the CSA? It someone won the Civil war in 1861 in this game and I want to give it a chance.

I don't have my PC with V2 on it in front of me right now, but you should be able to look through the USA events. There should be an event already that the AI is presented with in the event of a CSA victory (or, more often, white peace) in the Civil War: one choice calls for the country to be reunited and keeps the USA cores on the South, while the other allows the US to decide to revoke its own cores on the South and accept a divided nation. There should be a way to alter the event so that the AI will pursue the latter option 90% of the time or what have you.

I'm on my way home from work now and can check in a little while for a more exact how-to.

# ? Aug 4, 2014 14:48

Count Thrashula: Jun 1, 2003; Death is nothing compared to vindication.; Buglord

So I know that theoretically you can play a single game that spans CK2 -> EU4 -> V2 -> HOI3, but is there a game to fill the gap between 1821 (EU4) and 1836 (V2), or a game to continue after 1948 (HOI3)?

# ? Aug 4, 2014 14:52

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# ? May 10, 2024 10:45

Enjoy: Apr 18, 2009

code:

country_event = {
	id = 19999
	title = "Independence"
	desc = "Down south in Dixie"
	
	
	trigger = {
		tag = CSA
		war = no
	}
	
	fire_only_once = yes
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 1
	}
	
	option = {
		name = "Hurrah"
		all_core = {
			limit = { owned_by = CSA }
			remove_core = USA
		}
	}
}

Enjoy fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Aug 4, 2014

# ? Aug 4, 2014 14:54

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