Atheism does not make you clever

The Something Awful Forums > Archives > General Bullshit > Atheism does not make you clever

TacticalUrbanHomo: Aug 17, 2011; by Lowtax

there is no One True God

if there was, wouldn't it be one of the gods who has existed since at least the beginning of history, and not some god who is a relatively new invention, IE the Jew god?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 11:17

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# ? May 8, 2024 05:08

les fleurs du mall: Jun 30, 2014; by LadyAmbien

Lol this thread still exists

# ? Aug 25, 2014 12:39

readingatwork: Jan 8, 2009; Hello Fatty!; Fun Shoe

Quickscope420dad posted:

Lol this thread still exists

Prove it.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 15:31

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Torka posted:

I hate the new atheists for spreading the idea that atheism is good news

it sucks that there's no god, I wish there was

Moridin920 posted:

if there was a god it'd be a massive rear end in a top hat

only if nothing were different/changed by the existence of a god, which is like, kinda the whole basis of that problem of evil thing

# ? Aug 25, 2014 16:15

Starving Autist: Oct 20, 2007; by Ralp

Kyrie eleison posted:

no. this is wrong. this translation myth is wrong. stop repeating it

Kyrie eleison posted:

in the OT it is taught the dead go to Sheol which is the realm of the dead, under the earth, but it's just meant to be a metaphor for death and non-existence. it is translated as Hades in the septuagint, KJV translates it as Hell but this is inaccurate because it is not the christian concept of hell (eternal fire).

guys stop saying the bible is translated inaccurately! by the way, the bible was translated inaccurately!

# ? Aug 25, 2014 16:35

Robo Reagan: Feb 12, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

rezatahs posted:

tl;dr

# ? Aug 25, 2014 16:36

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Sheol is totally a metaphor. That's why the witch of Endor can summon the shades of dead people from it. Because that's totally something you can do with a metaphor.

The thread title is wrong.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 16:37

Who What Now: Sep 10, 2006; by Azathoth

Ableist Kinkshamer posted:

guys stop saying the bible is translated inaccurately! by the way, the bible was translated inaccurately!

Expecting Kyrie to know what he's talking about is like expecting a Down's syndrome kid to understand nuclear physics.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 16:41

Kyrie eleison: Jan 26, 2013; by Ralp

Ableist Kinkshamer posted:

guys stop saying the bible is translated inaccurately! by the way, the bible was translated inaccurately!

no, there is a common and oft-repeated myth stated that the bible has been translated many times throughout history and that the original text has been lost or corrupted due to this constant re-translation, which is wrong. some people seem to even believe that new english bibles are translated from the KJV. in reality, all bibles today come only from the hebrew Masoretic text of the OT, the greek translation of the OT (the septuagint), and the original greek text of the NT. ancient manuscripts do disagree on some things (e.g. 616 vs 666), but none of them are due to translation so much as scribal error or intentional changes. aside for that, obviously the bible faces the same localization issues as any other book does.

the KJV has translation errors mainly because it was made hundreds of years ago. it was an impressive translation for its time, and is quoted everywhere, but it simply contains errors.

Cardiovorax posted:

Sheol is totally a metaphor. That's why the witch of Endor can summon the shades of dead people from it. Because that's totally something you can do with a metaphor.

The thread title is wrong.

try reading into what that means, the shades of dead people. anyway sheol is often treated as a place where you simply stop existing and cannot do anything, i remember

Unlike this world, Sheol is devoid of love, hate, envy, work, thought, knowledge, and wisdom ( Ecclesiastes 9:6 Ecclesiastes 9:10 ). Descriptions are bleak: There is no light ( Job 10:21-22 ; 17:13 ; Psalms 88:6 Psalms 88:12 ; 143:3 ), no remembrance ( Psalm 6:5 ; 88:12 ; Eccl 9:5 ), no praise of God ( Psalm 6:5 ; 30:9 ; 88:10-12 ; 115:17 ; Isa 38:18 )in fact, no sound at all ( Psalm 94:17 ; 115:17 ). Its inhabitants are weak, trembling shades ( Job 26:5 ; Psalm 88:10-12 ; Isa 14:9-10 ) who can never hope to escape from its gates ( Job 10:21 ; 17:13-16 ; Isa 38:10 ). Sheol is like a ravenous beast that swallows the living without being sated ( Prov 1:12 ; 27:20 ; Isa 5:14 ). Some thought the dead were cut off from God ( Psalm 88:3-5 ; Isa 38:11 ); while others believed that God's presence reached even to Sheol ( Psalm 139:8 ).

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:11

Starving Autist: Oct 20, 2007; by Ralp

Kyrie eleison posted:

no, there is a common and oft-repeated myth stated that the bible has been translated many times throughout history and that the original text has been lost or corrupted due to this constant re-translation, which is wrong. some people seem to even believe that new english bibles are translated from the KJV. in reality, all bibles today come only from the hebrew Masoretic text of the OT, the greek translation of the OT (the septuagint), and the original greek text of the NT. ancient manuscripts do disagree on some things (e.g. 616 vs 666), but none of them are due to translation so much as scribal error or intentional changes. aside for that, obviously the bible faces the same localization issues as any other book does.

good thing that all that stuff was written down immediately after it happened and not like, 50 to 100 years later. obviously it's a completely accurate eyewitness account, so it's not like translation errors even matter. just believe!

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:19

Torka: Jan 5, 2008

sometimes I prefer the kjv version of a passage just because it sounds more poetic

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:25

Who What Now: Sep 10, 2006; by Azathoth

Ableist Kinkshamer posted:

good thing that all that stuff was written down immediately after it happened and not like, 50 to 100 years later. obviously it's a completely accurate eyewitness account, so it's not like translation errors even matter. just believe!

And don't forget all the extra biblical accounts such as

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:25

the worst thing is: Oct 3, 2013; by FactsAreUseless

A family member of mine wrote a huge book on the Gospel of Thomas, and his basic point was that it can be dated earlier than the Synoptic Gospels and likely served as the original material for them. He's backed that up in a lot of ways, it's a 1400 page manuscript. But it goes into other stuff too.

So it is possible Christianity in written form did get started soon after Jesus's death and not 150 years later with Paul. It just did not look very much like what was later determined canon at the Council of Nicea. The Gospel of Thomas is more personal and human, albeit cryptic with Jesus teaching about the kingdom of heaven yet at the same time saying "I am not your teacher".

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:25

the worst thing is: Oct 3, 2013; by FactsAreUseless

Also read the book "James, brother of jesus" for history on the early struggle between the James brand of Christianity and Paul's.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:27

Starving Autist: Oct 20, 2007; by Ralp

Tautologicus posted:

Also read the book "James, brother of jesus" for history on the early struggle between the James brand of Christianity and Paul's.

i would rather read fallout equestria

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:28

Contra Calculus: Nov 6, 2009; Gravy Boat 2k

Wow, I was originally a conservative Christian that joined the SomethingAwful forums to spread the word of Jesus Christ but all the posts in this thread convinced me that my beliefs might be wrong!!!

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:29

the worst thing is: Oct 3, 2013; by FactsAreUseless

Ableist Kinkshamer posted:

i would rather read fallout equestria

And shitpost on the internet, sounds like the dream.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:29

nomadologique: Mar 9, 2011; DUNK A DILL PICKLE REALDO

Torka posted:

sometimes I prefer the kjv version of a passage just because it sounds more poetic

kjv is preferable to everything else because if you are going to read something like the bible you should be reading the most beautiful version possible, not mundane bullshit

unless of course you lol believe it has something to do with god

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:45

nomadologique: Mar 9, 2011; DUNK A DILL PICKLE REALDO

Tautologicus posted:

A family member of mine wrote a huge book on the Gospel of Thomas, and his basic point was that it can be dated earlier than the Synoptic Gospels and likely served as the original material for them. He's backed that up in a lot of ways, it's a 1400 page manuscript. But it goes into other stuff too.

So it is possible Christianity in written form did get started soon after Jesus's death and not 150 years later with Paul. It just did not look very much like what was later determined canon at the Council of Nicea. The Gospel of Thomas is more personal and human, albeit cryptic with Jesus teaching about the kingdom of heaven yet at the same time saying "I am not your teacher".

the first pauline epistle is dated ~52ad, 20 years after jesus

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:48

Happy Hedonist: Jan 18, 2009

quote:

I have met many brave men and women, morally superior to myself, whose courage in adversity derives from their faith. But whenever they have chosen to speak or write about it, I have found myself appalled by the instant decline of their intellectual and moral standards. They want god on their side and believe they are doing his work�what is this, even at its very best, but an extreme form of solipsism? They proceed from conclusion to evidence; our greatest resource is the mind, and the mind is not well-trained by being taught to assume what has to be proved.

This arrogance and illogic is inseparable even from the meekest and most altruistic religious affirmations. A true believer must believe that he or she is here for a purpose and is an object of real interest to a Supreme Being; he or she must also claim to have at least an inkling of what that Supreme Being desires. I have been called arrogant myself in my time, and hope to earn the title again, but to claim that I am privy to the secrets of the universe and its creator�that�s beyond my conceit. I therefore have no choice but to find something suspect even in the humblest believer, let alone in the great law-givers and edict-makers of whose �flock� (and what a revealing word that is) they form a part.

quote:

The foundation of irreligious criticism is: Man makes religion, religion does not make man. Religion is, indeed, the self-consciousness and self-esteem of man who has either not yet won through to himself, or has already lost himself again. But man is no abstract being squatting outside the world. Man is the world of man � state, society. This state and this society produce religion, which is an inverted consciousness of the world, because they are an inverted world. Religion is the general theory of this world, its encyclopaedic compendium, its logic in popular form, its spiritual point d�honneur, its enthusiasm, its moral sanction, its solemn complement, and its universal basis of consolation and justification. It is the fantastic realization of the human essence since the human essence has not acquired any true reality. The struggle against religion is, therefore, indirectly the struggle against that world whose spiritual aroma is religion.

Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.

The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo.

Criticism has plucked the imaginary flowers on the chain not in order that man shall continue to bear that chain without fantasy or consolation, but so that he shall throw off the chain and pluck the living flower. The criticism of religion disillusions man, so that he will think, act, and fashion his reality like a man who has discarded his illusions and regained his senses, so that he will move around himself as his own true Sun. Religion is only the illusory Sun which revolves around man as long as he does not revolve around himself.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 17:54

Contra Calculus: Nov 6, 2009; Gravy Boat 2k

I too remember when I thought Christopher Hitchens and Karl Marx were insightful people and not just as insane and horrible as everything they condemned

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:07

TOILETLORD: Nov 13, 2012; by XyloJW

bet OP feels clever after 200 pages of this poo poo.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:07

Kyrie eleison: Jan 26, 2013; by Ralp

religion is an interpretation of our existential situation. it is a positive/constructive possibility. a religious person is simply someone who prefers to keep this possibility open. a religious person has hope in a positive outcome. the atheist chooses despair and prefers despair.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:08

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Kyrie eleison posted:

religion is an interpretation of our existential situation. it is a positive/constructive possibility. a religious person is simply someone who prefers to keep this possibility open. a religious person has hope in a positive outcome. the atheist chooses despair and prefers despair.

you, personally, are the strongest argument against the absurd beauty of religious faith in this thread

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:10

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

you, personally, are the strongest argument against the absurd beauty of religious faith in every thread

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:12

nomadologique: Mar 9, 2011; DUNK A DILL PICKLE REALDO

Kyrie eleison posted:

religion is an interpretation of our existential situation. it is a positive/constructive possibility. a religious person is simply someone who prefers to keep this possibility open. a religious person has hope in a positive outcome. the atheist chooses despair and prefers despair.

lol

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:31

a hole-y ghost: May 10, 2010

hm. misread the thread title as autism does not make you clever and was going to disagree but nvm....

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:33

Stoatbringer: Sep 15, 2004; naw, you love it you little ho-bot

Kyrie eleison posted:

the atheist chooses despair and prefers despair.

What about bald people?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:33

MotherFuckingT-REX: Feb 8, 2011; I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT
I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT I WANNA THROW IT

Cardiovorax posted:

Sheol is totally a metaphor. That's why the witch of Endor can summon the shades of dead people from it. Because that's totally something you can do with a metaphor.

The thread title is wrong.

oh has the thread moved on to starwars eu already?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:47

Miltank: Dec 27, 2009; by XyloJW

a hole-y ghost posted:

hm. misread the thread title as autism does not make you clever and was going to disagree but nvm....

your in luck because such a thread exists

# ? Aug 25, 2014 18:54

Who What Now: Sep 10, 2006; by Azathoth

Kyrie eleison posted:

religion is an interpretation of our existential situation. it is a positive/constructive possibility. a religious person is simply someone who prefers to keep this possibility open. a religious person has hope in a positive outcome. the atheist chooses despair and prefers despair.

Your life is meaningless. Embrace the darkness.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 19:02

the worst thing is: Oct 3, 2013; by FactsAreUseless

nomadologique posted:

the first pauline epistle is dated ~52ad, 20 years after jesus

Yea i knew i was getting something wrong. Anyway the Gospel of Thomas was contemporary to that time and widely quoted, even in Egypt and Syria.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 21:37

Maoist Pussy: Feb 12, 2014; by Lowtax

Kyrie eleison posted:

Powerball is an interpretation of our existential situation. it is a positive/constructive possibility. a lottery player is simply someone who prefers to keep this possibility open. a lottery player has hope in a positive outcome. the dude who buys a pack of Parliaments and some rubbers chooses despair and prefers despair.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 21:53

Ocean Book: Sep 27, 2010; - hi

god bless all you crazy bastards

# ? Aug 25, 2014 21:58

Kyrie eleison: Jan 26, 2013; by Ralp

parliament is for hipster

# ? Aug 25, 2014 22:03

America Inc.: Nov 22, 2013; I plan to live forever, of course, but barring that I'd settle for a couple thousand years. Even 500 would be pretty nice.

Kyrie eleison posted:

religion is an interpretation of our existential situation. it is a positive/constructive possibility. a religious person is simply someone who prefers to keep this possibility open. a religious person has hope in a positive outcome. the atheist chooses despair and prefers despair.

What is there to despair? According to scientific observations, we live in an infinite universe which itself is probably one among an infinity of universes.
Everything that can be imagined and more happens somewhere, maybe even if you're so inclined, life after death or reincarnation.
If humanity destroys itself there will be other intelligent life to carry on.
There is a freedom gained by being a speck.

America Inc. fucked around with this message at 22:14 on Aug 25, 2014

# ? Aug 25, 2014 22:09

Blahsmack: Oct 25, 2003

religious gamblers fallacy?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 22:13

Narciss: Nov 29, 2004; by Cowcaster

a hole-y ghost posted:

hm. misread the thread title as autism does not make you clever and was going to disagree but nvm....

Autism and Atheism; This thread makes methinks that there isn't much of a difference. :mmmhmm:

# ? Aug 25, 2014 22:15

America Inc.: Nov 22, 2013; I plan to live forever, of course, but barring that I'd settle for a couple thousand years. Even 500 would be pretty nice.

Blahsmack posted:

religious gamblers fallacy?

No, I don't think that's what it is, but I would certainly concede that hope for reincarnation is a slim one at that. Either way I don't see why life after death is necessary to lead a happy life.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 22:20

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# ? May 8, 2024 05:08

Maoist Pussy: Feb 12, 2014; by Lowtax

Negative Entropy posted:

No, I don't think that's what it is, but I would certainly concede that hope for reincarnation is a slim one at that. Either way I don't see why life after death is necessary to lead a happy life.

Well, religioners are usually gay virgins and old ladies, aka the "nothing to lose" category

# ? Aug 25, 2014 22:23

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