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ThisQuietReverie posted:They're emulated slavishly because they are all redone by the same guys who did the original. Doesn't mean they can't fall into that trap. I mean, if you want to make a game that's 'exactly Homeworld, but with modern resolutions and improved sound', there's nothing wrong with that. But you shouldn't be talking about 15 years of advances while you're doing it. Then again, the cutscenes are really the least important part of the package--which is why it's worrisome that it's the only part they're showing off.
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Oct 29, 2014 20:30
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fezball posted:Also, for the missing field frigate overlay try caps lock. Thank you. FredMSloniker posted:Doesn't mean they can't fall into that trap. I mean, if you want to make a game that's 'exactly Homeworld, but with modern resolutions and improved sound', there's nothing wrong with that. But you shouldn't be talking about 15 years of advances while you're doing it. I know! Just show off the HD model of the Mothership in all her glorious beauty, maybe the Great Nebula in the background and watch the pre-orders roll in!
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Oct 29, 2014 21:06
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That was a nice video. The Kushan support frigate looks much better than the Taaidan support frigate.
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Oct 29, 2014 21:21
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Loxbourne posted:There's a special fighter type we haven't seen yet that's optimised for defence. It's excellent for protecting resource operations, and also has a very quick build time enabling you to scramble them quickly when you see a raid coming.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:01
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anilEhilated posted:Actually, I'm fairly sure he can build Defenders by now and they were at least mentioned, if not shown off. They're pretty good, although nowhere as broken as in the release version where they were capable of tearing frigates apart. Correct, and also Defenders are slllllow. They're one of the few strikecraft I like in a wall or sphere formation, but even in a claw or x they're very open to being ripped apart by capital ships compared to the others. I didn't use them, but Light Corvettes are actually very useful in the early game since they are low on the tech pool, very quick for the corvette class and have enough armor to absorb early fighter attacks long enough to rip them to shreds. Krumbsthumbs fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Oct 29, 2014 |
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Oct 29, 2014 22:05
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 Defenders are built next mission.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:58
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This might have gotten patched out but back when i played if you hyperspace a support frigate in that brief moment that strike craft were docked with it the would be taken along for the ride.
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Oct 30, 2014 01:58
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I'm not sure which support frigate design I like better, the Kushan's floating gas station or the Taiidan's miniature aircraft carrier. The Kushan one does look a little derpier though. Speaking of support frigates, it might be a good idea to build as many as possible before you start going capture crazy, especially in the upcoming missions in the nebula. Turns out there's a cap for building frigates, but not for capturing as I discovered the hard way. I didn't need those badass looking Assault Frigates anyway, game. EDIT: It does, but there aren't any Support Frigate analogs in the higher ship classes. Repair corvettes are kind of a joke. v wafflemoose fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Oct 30, 2014 |
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Oct 30, 2014 03:02
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Starhawk64 posted:Speaking of support frigates, it might be a good idea to build as many as possible before you start going capture crazy. Turns out there's a cap for building frigates, but not for capturing.
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Oct 30, 2014 03:04
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cokerpilot posted:This might have gotten patched out but back when i played if you hyperspace a support frigate in that brief moment that strike craft were docked with it the would be taken along for the ride. I seem to remember strike craft spontaneously combusting if they're caught too close to a warping capital ship. Maybe that was how it got patched Carbolic Smokeball fucked around with this message at 04:26 on Oct 30, 2014 |
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Oct 30, 2014 03:14
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berryjon posted:
I don't think there's another way to do it, really. The next few missions, if someone hasn't guessed, are INSANE and its tough to communicate how brutal they are on a first time play. Your first clue they might be a little troubling, maybe, is the Bentusi giving you the most cryptic hint ever, and realistically there's no way you're going to have your force set for it, so it's just half an hour of frantic damage control and cold sweat as you hang on for dear life. A seriously high watermark for the genre, let alone the game.
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Oct 30, 2014 07:15
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Willie Tomg posted:I don't think there's another way to do it, really. There is a way, though it is probably suboptimal, but if you get past the hump, you can regroup and restructure your fleet to something less specialized. It involves, basically, lots and lot of bombers, and prescient knowledge of what the mission will throw at you and what the triggers are though. That's how I beat it, without abusing the salvage corvettes (as I hadn't clued in to just how much you could steal yet), after my first few tries ended in glorious death.
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Oct 30, 2014 09:05
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I tried a google search for the unit caps but failed. Can someone show me what was the intended upper limit for all ship classes without abusing salvaging like a obsessive-compulsive kleptomaniac?
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Oct 30, 2014 13:54
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It's a long time since I've played Homeworld first-hand but these are the limits I remember: Frigate-class: 18 Destroyer-class: 6 Carrier: 4 Cruiser: 3
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Oct 30, 2014 14:00
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Actually you can get through the first few missions without losing a single ship, using no more salvaging than that required by the mission objectives. How? Heavy corvettes placed in a Wall formation then set to Aggressive, you back them up with repair corvettes then later support frigates to constantly fix them. The combination of aggressive and wall means they remain in a tight enough block to be constantly fixed while the Aggressive setting boosts their firepower, their 'Charged Burst Attack' starts to immediately explode entire fighter formations once you have enough of them and they are fully capable of melting frigates. You then do pretty much the same thing on a larger scale with capital ships once you have those, though assault frigates vs ion frigates are perhaps better off going into sphere formation along with some micro management, they can consistently maneuver outside of the ion frigate's fire. I know I have managed to get through to about mission... 10 I think it was without losing a ship or salvaging? Needless to say this involved never using fighters though so not as much fun as it sounds.
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Oct 30, 2014 14:04
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Mission 07 - The Garden of Kadesh Kid gloves are off people, but on the great side, we get one of the greatest units in the game!
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Oct 31, 2014 16:19
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Kadesh! These two missions are brutal, will kick a new player's rear end in multiple ways and I absolutely love them. The atmosphere is eerie, you're fighting an enemy you don't know anything about and the Swarmers have you on desperate defense the whole time because even if you figure out their weakness you still have to deal with them for at least a minute. One thing I really like is how in the opening shots, you always see the Mothership from a closeup and it does a great job misleading you in of how big the whole thing really is. You start off thinking it's some kind of a probe, then you get the shot of it launching strike craft by the dozens along with frigates and you know you're in deep poo poo now. And they still haven't brought along their deadliest unit yet... Looking at the parting shot of your entire fleet, I can't help thinking "morituri te salutant". edit: A tiny bit that kinda bothers me with the subtitles, you seem to be mixing up "lose" and "loose" a lot. Just nitpicking. anilEhilated fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Oct 31, 2014 |
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Oct 31, 2014 16:42
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With the benefit of experience I generally send the ions after the fuel ships. Destroyers have a bit more range so it's easier to avoid the ramming.
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Oct 31, 2014 17:16
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That was definitely one of the more hairer missions in the game. So you aren't going to steal all of that one particularly overpowered ship that shows up in the next mission? 
wafflemoose fucked around with this message at 17:44 on Oct 31, 2014 |
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Oct 31, 2014 17:37
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These two missions are great. I would love to play a Kadeshi faction, with fuel pods, swarmers, the amazing mothership and the other ship we will see next mission.
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Oct 31, 2014 17:42
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I think I was wincing the entire time the Kadesh introduction was going on because I saw your salvage corvettes just sitting there out in the open and I knew exactly where the swarmers were going. The only part about Multi-Gun Corvettes that I don't like is how they nearly obsolete your Heavy Corvettes in one fell swoop. Sure, they have weak guns, but the 6 guns with tracking allows them to still put up some heavy damage against anything smaller than a Destroyer. Also, those suckers are fast for Corvettes.
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Oct 31, 2014 17:50
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I love the Kushan multi-gun corvettes, but I honestly always felt like their Taiidan mirror unit looks goofy as hell.
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Oct 31, 2014 17:53
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Krumbsthumbs posted:The only part about Multi-Gun Corvettes that I don't like is how they nearly obsolete your Heavy Corvettes in one fell swoop. Sure, they have weak guns, but the 6 guns with tracking allows them to still put up some heavy damage against anything smaller than a Destroyer. Also, those suckers are fast for Corvettes. PurpleXVI posted:I love the Kushan multi-gun corvettes, but I honestly always felt like their Taiidan mirror unit looks goofy as hell. anilEhilated fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Oct 31, 2014 |
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Oct 31, 2014 17:54
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The Turanic Ion Array Frigates did their most useful thing yet blowing up on a mothership, and it looks like they actually bothered to fire at it a few times first. Good for them. Shame about the other ones I guess, but it couldn't have happened at a better time.
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Oct 31, 2014 17:56
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anilEhilated posted:Yup. I think the game could've benefited from either sticking a plasma bomb launcher on the heavies to differentiate them more - as it is, both light and heavy corvettes are pretty much obsolete and the one we have yet to see is pretty much useless. Corvette class essentially boils down to salvagers and multigunners, which is a drat shame. Heavies actually have a special "Z" attack which is a sort of shrapnel blast in front of them. It does some serious damage to targets right in front of them but it hits friends and foe alike. You have to use X or Wall for it not to blow up your own Heavies. Also, the range on it is rather small and it is really hard getting that tasty group of strike craft into the right spot to use the shredding attack. Also yea, the Ion Arrays exploding is really good because they are so goddamned slow. They'll slow down your wall formations to a crawl.
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Oct 31, 2014 18:00
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anilEhilated posted:Yup. I think the game could've benefited from either sticking a plasma bomb launcher on the heavies to differentiate them more - as it is, both light and heavy corvettes are pretty much obsolete and the one we have yet to see is pretty much useless. Corvette class essentially boils down to salvagers and multigunners, which is a drat shame.
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Oct 31, 2014 18:10
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Krumbsthumbs posted:Heavies actually have a special "Z" attack which is a sort of shrapnel blast in front of them. It does some serious damage to targets right in front of them but it hits friends and foe alike. You have to use X or Wall for it not to blow up your own Heavies. Also, the range on it is rather small and it is really hard getting that tasty group of strike craft into the right spot to use the shredding attack.
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Oct 31, 2014 18:12
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Multi gun corvette are honestly kind of mediocre compared to heavies, they are superior against fighters who spread out instead of clumping for charged burst attacks and do have speed but they are pretty much inferior against other corvettes or vs capital ships. I used to play a lot of Homeworld multiplayer and frankly never bothered to make them, light corvette were vital for rushing out to the first engagement but after that the meta was very much to transition to heavies. Interestingly though scouts are actually the better anti fighter option over interceptors, interceptors have the advantage of being able to hurt larger ships a lot faster so they are more flexible but scouts just outmaneuver them in a dog fight, absent big rigid formations they tend to win an even numbers engagement. On th subject of the LP though are you going to try capturing any significant number of swarmers? If you nail the refuel pods you can scoop them up and they are very effective but I always found the micromanagent required to be a pain.
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Oct 31, 2014 18:20
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Add me to list of people who digged HW1/Cata but loving hated HW2 which dropped that interesting story/setting for dumb messianic prophecy in space bullshit.
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Oct 31, 2014 18:32
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anilEhilated posted:Kadesh! These two missions are brutal, will kick a new player's rear end in multiple ways and I absolutely love them. The atmosphere is eerie, you're fighting an enemy you don't know anything about and the Swarmers have you on desperate defense the whole time because even if you figure out their weakness you still have to deal with them for at least a minute. So many people saying this! I never had a problem with this mission, and going through on my no-salvaging run at the moment I'm still not (well, my one and only destroyer ramming the Kadeshi mothership required a restart, but that wasn't a problem with the mission being difficult as such). Is this correlated with people who used interceptors too much, I wonder? Scouts on Evasive tie Swarmers up neatly, and Attack Bombers shred fuel pods like anything; that hardly matters, though, since most of the Swarmers barely survive to refuel when they're being chased by squadrons of Scouts as they withdraw... Of course, if you've salvaged practically everything you're probably facing twice as many swarmers as I would do and there's no way your outnumbered strike craft will hold them off since, if you've salvaged everything, you're probably more interested in capital ships than maintaining 50 or so strike craft anyway... edit: then again, I thought Homeworld 2's dynamic difficulty represented a nice challenge. Maybe I just assess difficulty differently to most people... Ilanin fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Oct 31, 2014 |
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Oct 31, 2014 19:33
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One thing I always used to do that I haven't seen you pull off yet is to position the camera directly behind the Mothership when jumping out. If you get the distance right, the blue field fills the screen just in time for the "fade to blue" end of mission animation to hit. Otherwise it bugs me that your screen turns blue when there's no warp field nearby!
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Oct 31, 2014 19:38
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I love capturing those Fuel Transports, they're all worth about 300RU and I always manage to capture at least 12 of them on this map which is a huge boost if you are running low on cash.
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Oct 31, 2014 20:13
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My strategy for those missions was to tie up the swarmers with strike craft, corvettes, and assault frigates with backup from support frigates while the salvage corvettes ran off with the fuel pods and a certain enemy ship that's coming up in the next mission, 300RU per fuel pod is almost half a Collector's load, and you want as many of the other particular ship. The ion frigates and destroyers focused on the enemy mothership. With careful micromanagement and keeping your capital ships moving the mothership shouldn't be able to ram any of them. I did run into some problems using this strategy though. The salvage corvettes seem to get confused if there's a carrier near by the mothership, and refuse to release their captured ships. I don't know if this is a bug or not. I've also noticed that I've had Resource Collecters vanish in between missions if I had a carrier follow them for resource gathering. Are Carriers bugged? wafflemoose fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Oct 31, 2014 |
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Oct 31, 2014 21:13
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Starhawk64 posted:So you aren't going to steal all of that one particularly overpowered ship that shows up in the next mission? You'll see. I don't capture Swarmers next mission. It's just too hairy for the longest time to risk the Salvage Corvettes. Although I did find out that if there are enough Swarmers in spot when they are docked to a Kadeshii Mothership or a Fuel Pod when it blows up, then they will stay behind - overlapping each other and making the whole pile unsalvagable.
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Nov 1, 2014 00:29
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I seem to recall the garden presenting a good challenge. The game does lend you a hand though. New tech you discover is almost always useful in completing the mission it becomes available for research in. I also seem to recall this area was incredibly resource rich? And a mistake I made the first few times I played through was not hanging around to harvest everything.
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Nov 1, 2014 03:32
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I think I got past the Garden of Kadesh once in my life and failed many many more times. You make it look so easy.
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Nov 1, 2014 04:31
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Starhawk64 posted:
Back when I used to play in... 1998 I think.. I found out the hard way as well.. There was this one mission with a huge ball of frigates around an objective. I'd go close with 2 carriers loaded with salvage frigates (or whatever they were called at the time) and capture as much as I can. By the time 1/4 of the frigate ball was captured, (hours had passed) the ball was slowly moving away from the objective (always found that weird). I eventually got bored, finished the mission and tried to warp out... The game would crash. At first I assumed there was a bug that stopped me from completing the mission. Maybe a year or so later, I did the same thing and the same problem occured. I sold a bunch of the frigates (fucktons of minerals came my way) and managed to move on to the next mission. But yea, there was a hard cap on the amount of ships you can have.. Kinda sad really. But probably necessary
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Nov 1, 2014 05:09
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One thing I remember about oversalvaging is that the game slows to a crawl trying to render everything on screen all at once regardless of how powerful your PC was. Age of Empires 2 was the same way during 4v4 200 pop matches before the HD remix (or maybe it's the same, I haven't played AoE2 HD 1000 pop matches)
Carbolic Smokeball fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Nov 1, 2014 |
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Nov 1, 2014 05:26
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Dalael posted:Back when I used to play in... 1998 I think.. I found out the hard way as well.. There was this one mission with a huge ball of frigates around an objective. I'd go close with 2 carriers loaded with salvage frigates (or whatever they were called at the time) and capture as much as I can. I had the sphere slowly relocated after a certain point as well. I think the cause is that after you get close enough to the objective to trigger a certain cutscene, the point or object that the sphere formation is centered on changes location. It is a bit of a problem since the new location actually moves some of the frigates outside the boundary of the map.
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Nov 1, 2014 09:59
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Dalael posted:Back when I used to play in... 1998 I think.. But the game's from 1999!  The music in the Garden's odd. It works perfectly as a mood setter, but is not particularly impactful while fighting the Kadeshi.
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Nov 1, 2014 10:48
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