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World Famous Whore posted:I done switched to a +6 GSC of Crushing so it doesn't matter anymore anyways. I don't know if I am going to convert it to the Holy weapon or one of my other many GSC I have sitting in my Lair storage and keep it for non evil creatures. I know you're dead, so it doesn't matter, but I would usually do all of Vaults, Slime, and Zot (at least to 4) before switching away from Oka (or Trog). Most of Zot isn't actually undead or demonic, so you'll get more out of finesse/heroism and a non-holy weapon than you would from TSO or Zin (I suppose aliches would be the biggest exception).
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Feb 25, 2015 00:58
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LorrdErnie posted:
code:
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Feb 25, 2015 01:15
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quote:The +12 lajatang of Shame {slice, rElec rPois rN+ Dex+5 Stlth-} NaFE of Chei. This is in a shop. No other good artefact weapons yet, but I'm only d:10 or so, haven't Laired yet. Should I train staves for this eventually?
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Feb 25, 2015 02:00
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LogicNinja posted:NaFE of Chei. This is in a shop. No other good artefact weapons yet, but I'm only d:10 or so, haven't Laired yet. Should I train staves for this eventually? How much does it cost? If it's affordable: yes
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Feb 25, 2015 02:09
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LogicNinja posted:NaFE of Chei. This is in a shop. No other good artefact weapons yet, but I'm only d:10 or so, haven't Laired yet. Should I train staves for this eventually? That is insanely, absurdly good. For the love of Chei yes. Its not like reaching mindelay with a lajatang is even hard.
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Feb 25, 2015 02:11
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Arrhythmia posted:How much does it cost? If it's affordable:
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Feb 25, 2015 02:12
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14.
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Feb 25, 2015 02:12
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Never mind, died due to cheimoving!
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Feb 25, 2015 02:20
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LorrdErnie posted:Edit: Nevermind I died because I forgot about step from time... LogicNinja posted:Never mind, died due to cheimoving! 
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Feb 25, 2015 02:58
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I just encountered this. The ~4 walls next to me are metal while the rest is stone. Is this a hidden vault or a level generation bug? LogicNinja posted:Never mind, died due to cheimoving! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJxCdh1Ps48
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Feb 25, 2015 03:02
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Well, there appears to be only one set of stairs down. Try going up some other stairs on D:3, see where you end up.
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Feb 25, 2015 03:04
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Tarezax posted:Well, there appears to be only one set of stairs down. Try going up some other stairs on D:3, see where you end up. Yeah I realized that after I posted, derp. Turns out it was just an altar room, the rest of the level was normal aside from being disconnected. To note: the one stairway to D:3 way a trap door. Thought I might be walking into a special setpiece ambush.
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Feb 25, 2015 03:08
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At first I thought "nah, I'll ditch Ash for Zin or TSO for endgame" and then I tried abyss scumming with Ash and oh my god.
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Feb 25, 2015 03:11
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Ash is a fantastic postgame god so I don't know why you'd ditch them regardless.
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Feb 25, 2015 05:21
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Yet another orc warrior on d:3, I guess this is just a regular thing now?
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Feb 25, 2015 05:42
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LogicNinja posted:Yet another orc warrior on d:3, I guess this is just a regular thing now? checking the numbers, looks like it's about as common as it's been since... 0.6 or so a pretty consistent ~6.5% of orc warrior deaths are on d:3
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Feb 25, 2015 05:58
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PleasingFungus posted:checking the numbers, looks like it's about as common as it's been since... 0.6 or so ...well, huh, the more you know. Seems a mite early, is all.
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Feb 25, 2015 06:12
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Meunkin posted:At first I thought "nah, I'll ditch Ash for Zin or TSO for endgame" and then I tried abyss scumming with Ash and oh my god. This is WRONG and SUB-OPTIMAL but I like doing it sometimes
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Feb 25, 2015 06:26
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killing a d:2 orc warrior with a cehu was very satisfying
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Feb 25, 2015 06:44
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IronicDongz posted:Ash is a fantastic postgame god so I don't know why you'd ditch them regardless. I really like the heals-on-kill and rN+++ from TSO for tomb and the mutation resist/emergency escape of Zin for everything else, they make up for my lovely play and tendency to get myself killed in endgame. I've got 27 in most relevant skills so I don't really need the skill boosts anymore. This is fun, though, I'm taking on Hell for the first time without Zin (well, once I had an OP demonspawn of mak but that doesn't even count), and it's terrifying. Hell effects do things?! It's nervewracking as hell and great.
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Feb 25, 2015 06:44
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LogicNinja posted:...well, huh, the more you know. You can at least run from an orc warrior as most races. It could be something like a pack of killer bees instead which is going to kill basically everyone that doesn't have a tp scroll identified.
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Feb 25, 2015 07:04
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Yea, gently caress killer bees. Fast, small and poisonous. Only thing missing is distortion I guess.
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Feb 25, 2015 11:30
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FR: Abyss bees
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Feb 25, 2015 11:52
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FR: Caustic Bees
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Feb 25, 2015 12:11
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FR: Beehive traps, like shadow traps but summons only bees.
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Feb 25, 2015 12:37
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Does holy damage deal equal damage to demonspawn as undead characters? I just had a demonspawn take over 200 damage in one turn in a zig when two pearl dragons both breathed on him at the same time. I survived, barely, and because it was only z: 15 or so, everything died from one singularity and tornado before I could take any more damage. I was in lichform because I figured it wouldn't have mattered anyway. Would changing to statue form have removed my holy vulnerability? I assume not, but since I'm tempted to go for multiple zigs with this character, since he's a demonspawn of Chei with orange crystal plate and all my favorite mutations (monstrous with nightstalker, magic shield and augmentation), I want to know if there's a way I can not die instantly if another holy pan level shows up. By the way, the new reaper tile is amazing!
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Feb 25, 2015 12:40
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I'm playing Chei worshippers 24/7 right now and I have no idea why people are apparently now swinging back to "Chei is actually secretly good and OP!", not being able to simply walk away from things is a giant disadvantage. He does allow you to do silly stuff though, kind of like how just about all your early game spells get Max Power as soon as you hit 6* piety. The one thing that you really need to remember as Chei is that if you ever run out of MP and don't have powerful consumables, you're probably pretty screwed. Internet Kraken posted:Summoner is probably one of the worst starting backgrounds though regardless of race. Its workable but you'd be better off going with any other magic background and just branching into summoning. Relying on summoning a quokka to not die to a hobgoblin on D:1 is not fun. Anyone who wants to play a game where Summoning plays a decent role, try Wizard (Summon pImps) and Ice Elementalist (Ice Beasts) instead. They're simultaneously much stronger and less tedious than trying to start a Summoner. It's a background that should really be looked at... along with Air Elementalist. Though I don't think they will.
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Feb 25, 2015 14:31
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Yes holy deals as much damage to demon as it does to undead.
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Feb 25, 2015 14:34
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I don't think Chei is OP at all, though I don't think he's that bad, either. Except from when you start worshiping him until mid-lair, during which time he's every bit as bad as people typically say. By the time you've got a decent skill set going, you shouldn't need to walk away from most encounters and when you do, Chei gives you good tools for escape. I think Araganzar quoted someone else as saying that Chei makes strong characters stronger and I think that's very true. If you just can't pull together the stuff you need to get ahead of the curve, Chei will probably kill you, or at least make you miserable until you die of boredom and frustration. But if you'd already be doing quite well without a god at all, Chei will make you more powerful than most other gods would. Chei does play quite differently from other gods, and that's part of what makes him so interesting. Shields, for example, are probably a very good idea for Chei characters compared to worshipers of other gods because first, you have a lot of damage even with one handed weapons because of the stat boosts; second, you get a lot more defense from your shield than other characters would, again because of high stats; third, because defense is much more important for characters that have to either fight surrounded, or take twice the number of attacks per move while retreating to safer terrain. I've only won four games with Chei and am in extended with my 5th (who is an absurdly powerful, unstoppable monster who could only ever die in a ziggurat: ridiculous defense, ridiculous melee, crazy MP regen and max power on all spells), and I'm only starting to get the hang of how to use the god. But regardless of how good he actually is, casting powerful magic in heavy armor while hitting like a truck is lots of fun and usually only Chei characters can manage it.
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Feb 25, 2015 15:30
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Feb 25, 2015 16:34
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Davzz posted:I'm playing Chei worshippers 24/7 right now and I have no idea why people are apparently now swinging back to "Chei is actually secretly good and OP!", not being able to simply walk away from things is a giant disadvantage. It sounds like you're playing a lot of blaster casters of Chei, which seems like a difficult start. When you see an enemy, a Chei worshiper basically can make a couple of moves for tactical positioning, and then has to be ready to fight everything that is coming. That doesn't mesh well with a blaster caster style, because casters, especially early game casters, can only fight as long as they have MP. In big fights, they rely on either kiting/pillar dancing enemies to recover MP, or running up stairs to recover MP. As you point out, that's basically not possible with Chei, and Chei doesn't really do anything to mitigate the need for this type of play. Melee/ranged weapon characters, on the other hand, are generally more capable of just standing and fighting. A melee character never runs out of swings of her weapon, and while a ranged fighter may run out of ammo, it's not the same as a caster, because a ranged character doesn't rely on retreating to recharge ammo. The main reason melee/ranged characters want to run is because they can't withstand the damage they are taking, and Chei helps mitigate that through high AC/EV/SH and high damage output. The fact is, once you get some piety built up, a Chei melee dude can generally just tab through everything. Since you have to retreat less, you can rely more on slouch and step from time to deal with those situations in which you otherwise would have to retreat. Then, once you have good armour, dodging, and weapon skills, you hybridize into a heavy armour caster and become nearly indestructible (especially if you can get some kind of escape like cBlink up). Of course, the early game, where you get penalized with almost no benefit, is brutal, which is why Chei may be one of the only Gods worth going Monk for. Fake E: There are some type of MP efficient casters hybrids that Chei can be good with early, like skalds, transmuters, and hybrid Ice Elementalists. Real E: Also, Chei can be a great "teaching" God, because he helps you focus on the importance of considering every move and always having an escape, rather than just running straight into packs of enemies. Not My Leg fucked around with this message at 19:33 on Feb 25, 2015 |
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Feb 25, 2015 19:27
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Not My Leg posted:Real E: Also, Chei can be a great "teaching" God, because he helps you focus on the importance of considering every move and always having an escape, rather than just running straight into packs of enemies. Playing Trolls of Chei made me a better crawler, because it weaned me off of otab.
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Feb 25, 2015 19:49
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The trick to early Chei is learning to love Bend Time. You can still kite when enemys are Slow!
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Feb 25, 2015 20:25
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SirSamVimes posted:The trick to early Chei is learning to love Bend Time. You can still kite when enemys are Slow! Just train Invocations AND Dodging on top of all your other skills, NBD! :P
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Feb 25, 2015 20:50
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Jyppe posted:Yea, gently caress killer bees. Fast, small and poisonous. Only thing missing is distortion I guess. They're a fantastic justification for having toxic radiance in your spellbook though. gently caress alla youse -rPois suckers.
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Feb 25, 2015 20:57
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I once unironically suggested phase bees with distortion melee and the ability to fly through walls so they could swarm you even in corridors 
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Feb 25, 2015 23:10
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megane posted:I once unironically suggested phase bees with distortion melee and the ability to fly through walls so they could swarm you even in corridors That would be sweet in the Abyss.
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Feb 25, 2015 23:11
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It'd be neat to have a shrike/bee variant in abyss (probably starting in Abyss:2 so you don't see them until you're trying to get the rune). Giving them distortion melee is thematically appropriate and not as much of a gently caress you as it would be anywhere else besides abyss.
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Feb 25, 2015 23:13
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If it were up to me I'd take out banishing and focus on making Abyss a branch that's challenging and interesting in its own right rather than Green Day's Boulevard of Broken Dreams/insufferable slogfest. A bunch of weird monsters that do stuff completely different from the rest of the game would be perfect.
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Feb 25, 2015 23:21
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LogicNinja posted:Just train Invocations AND Dodging on top of all your other skills, NBD! :P You only need a couple of points in Inv to reliably slow pretty much every pre-lair threat, and most of the during-lair threats. Bend Time is good.
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Feb 25, 2015 23:25
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