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Shinjobi posted:So for my Runemasters and casters in general throughout the series, TEC is more important than the attack stat of the weapon, right? I'm not sure where to find the damage formulas and it's weird keeping this dinky little staff that just happens to have a better TEC stat as I progress. Yes. The attack sat of their weapon only matters if you want them to contribute some damage, but don't want them to spend any TP. TEC is used for Runemaster spells, healing skills, and inflicting ailments and binds. You can just stick a Dagger on them so they'll act faster in battle if you wish.
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Mar 26, 2015 06:20
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Caduceus and Pain Formula are TEC and Attack based but they're extreme outliers. Aside from those the attack doesn't matter for a caster, so give them weapons with bonuses that boost their other stats. For instance, there's a staff in EOU with +20 luck that I've given my Hexer.
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Mar 26, 2015 06:22
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Course, a Hexer can actually do decent damage from the front lines, but that's kind of an edge case for extreme circumstances. Especially with how amazing Conflict/Suicide Word are.
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Mar 26, 2015 06:40
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Dr. Fetus posted:It's not on the same level as the Chemicaless Warped Savior, that's for sure. Hahaha, I gave that a try earlier this week. It didn't go well for me. I can see how to do it and can reasonably consistently get into the open-eye phase of the fight, it's just a matter of putting out enough damage in the short time I can survive after that before it destroys my party. Dr. Fetus posted:Yes. The attack sat of their weapon only matters if you want them to contribute some damage, but don't want them to spend any TP. TEC is used for Runemaster spells, healing skills, and inflicting ailments and binds. You can just stick a Dagger on them so they'll act faster in battle if you wish. Plus, in EO4 high-end daggers tend to have open forge slots while most high-end staves come preloaded with TP and TEC bonuses. ELM forges are better than TP or TEC forges in the late game, so that's another point in daggers' favour.
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Mar 26, 2015 07:08
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Has anyone had any luck with the pain line of spells for Alchemists, by the way?I'm almost done with the true ending for EO3, and I think I need a short break from it before I burn out again so obviously I need to fire up classic mode for EOU instead. EO3 owns, but I need some time to replan and then prep my party for the postgame, instead of the gimmick central team I ran for two routes. I'm a little sad I might not get to take my hype Princess/Shogun into the postgame but I guess she deserves a break while she overlooks new scrubs in training or something.
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Mar 26, 2015 07:18
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Thuryl posted:Hahaha, I gave that a try earlier this week. It didn't go well for me. I can see how to do it and can reasonably consistently get into the open-eye phase of the fight, it's just a matter of putting out enough damage in the short time I can survive after that before it destroys my party. The main strategy I used for that was to use Hood Circle when it opened it's eye, and pray. The elemental attacks are pretty much impossible to survive without a Fortress. If you do have one, eating elemental resistant food, stacking defense buffs, using Weak Shield (Assuming you've set up your party for that), and then defending reduces the damage of a lot of attacks by a ton, but I don't know how effective that is for Chemless WS. SC Bracer posted:Has anyone had any luck with the pain line of spells for Alchemists, by the way?I'm almost done with the true ending for EO3, and I think I need a short break from it before I burn out again so obviously I need to fire up classic mode for EOU instead. EO3 owns, but I need some time to replan and then prep my party for the postgame, instead of the gimmick central team I ran for two routes. I'm a little sad I might not get to take my hype Princess/Shogun into the postgame but I guess she deserves a break while she overlooks new scrubs in training or something. They're bad. You're better off using their more straightforward damage skills. It's one of those weird experimental skills they put in, like the Landsknecht's Chaser skills in EO1.
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Mar 26, 2015 07:30
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Dr. Fetus posted:They're bad. You're better off using their more straightforward damage skills. It's one of those weird experimental skills they put in, like the Landsknecht's Chaser skills in EO1. Oh I know that, but I've played with the standard alchemist for two runs and I thought it might be a silly way to shake things up, along with playing all the classes I haven't touched yet. I'm reasonably sure a Hexer that isn't Arthur stuffed into rags and chained up will carry any team.
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Mar 26, 2015 07:33
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I've played Untold for a while now, just got wrecked by the Ant Queen but should be fine next time when I go there prepared. I'm worried about the Violet Key since I don't have it yet, is it possible to miss it? Also I've skilled all the gathering skills to max and now I hope to get grimoires with gathering so I can reskill to better skills, is this a decent plan? The gunner class is absurd. I had the double strike proc against six dudes, it hit all of them again. And this crazy offense costs no TP.
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Mar 26, 2015 10:45
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I'm fairly certain you get the violet key shortly after Ant Queen, actually! I don't remember 100%.
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Mar 26, 2015 13:28
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SC Bracer posted:a Hexer that isn't Arthur stuffed into rags and chained up  mental imageJust got my first couple Arcanists to level 20, though I'm probably going to rest everyone at 22 and respec. One thing that is annoying is that you can't select any of the Dismiss skills unless a circle is already active, meaning I have exactly zero round one damage besides poison, assuming it lands, for the whole game. 
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Mar 26, 2015 14:23
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This is going to out me as being an old fart but I'm dying for an old school style RPG that plays like the old Might and Magic games (III-VI). PC RPGS in the 80s-90s tended to play like a DnD game ran by a particularly sadistic DM and were filled with gently caress-you traps, hard monsters not gated by anything so you'd almost inevitably run into them and die, and just generally a lot less of the baby poo poo hand-holding and painless close by respawning that modern RPGs do. They were punishing, but they also really made you feel heroic instead of just sucking you off for going through a piss easy on-rails guided tour. There was also a lot more open world exploring and you could even get lost or end up in an area with monsters too high for you, which was scary but also fun and gave the overworld a sense of danger. Is this series for me?
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Mar 26, 2015 14:42
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It's not really like that. Aside from 4 the games don't really have an overworld to explore (and even in 4 it's not an overworld in the traditional sense). The gameplay is all about exploring mazes, but progression is fairly linear. You go down deeper and deeper to harder floors and enemies gradually get more difficult each floor you go down, with bosses at the end of a set of floors and difficulty spikes once you proceed to the next set. The only times you'll actually encounter things much too difficult for you is the occasional optional boss. That said, I'm only talking about the specifics of your requests - in more general terms of being relatively difficult and not hand holding, these games could well be what you're looking for. At the start of each game you're just given a list of classes to pick from and it's up to you to build your own party and customize their skills as they level up. You will likely die a lot, especially in the early parts of the game. Bosses require a decent amount of strategy and preparation to keep from getting steamrolled. So yeah the series could be what you're after. Try one of the demos for EO4 or EOU on the eShop and see if they appeal to you!
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Mar 26, 2015 15:19
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Neutral Zone Trap posted:I'm worried about the Violet Key since I don't have it yet, is it possible to miss it? The Violet Key is on B13, but you have to enter from a staircase in the north part of B14 to get it.
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Mar 26, 2015 15:21
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I think I was using my Dancers wrong. The first half of the fight against the Bloodbear ended up with all but one dancer killed, the second part in the third floor was better once I realized that swapping dancers between turns is a far better strategy. Sure it still took 23 turns to defeat because holy crap I need to upgrade their equipment.
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Mar 26, 2015 16:15
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Regy Rusty posted:It's not really like that. Aside from 4 the games don't really have an overworld to explore (and even in 4 it's not an overworld in the traditional sense). The gameplay is all about exploring mazes, but progression is fairly linear. You go down deeper and deeper to harder floors and enemies gradually get more difficult each floor you go down, with bosses at the end of a set of floors and difficulty spikes once you proceed to the next set. The only times you'll actually encounter things much too difficult for you is the occasional optional boss. No overworld? Aww  Oh well. I just looked up some Youtube gameplay videos and it reminds me less of Might and Magic but more of Anvil of Dawn or Stonekeep, which is still awesome and very similar in looks to most classic computer RPGs from that era. I'll definitely grab the demo at least.
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Mar 26, 2015 16:34
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Cuckoo posted:No overworld? Aww It doesn't have real time combat though, and you have a party of characters. It's really more like a highly-refined anime Wizardry.
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Mar 26, 2015 16:37
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The short form is pretty much "grab the demo for EO4 and see if you like it". It's a legitimately great series, even if it isn't for everyone.
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Mar 26, 2015 16:48
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BattleMaster posted:It doesn't have real time combat though, and you have a party of characters. Yeah, old school Might and Magic was like that with both strategic turn-based combat and a party with skills which is why it came to my head first: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nycA4dop_xI Either way, this series is the closest thing I've seen to any of those games in decades so I'll definitely at least pick up the demo. Thanks for the heads up!
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Mar 26, 2015 17:00
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It's very limited, but the airship in 4 is still the closest thing to classic M&M overworld exploration I've seen. I'd love to be proven wrong since I find it enjoyable but M&M has terrible balance and really boring combat. Cuckoo, you might want to check out M&M X: Legacy if you haven't. It's low budget and poorly put together, but it's still a classic M&M adventure in the style of III-VI.
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Mar 26, 2015 18:48
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Legacy is alright but the balance is as bad as ever. Some of it might be fixable because the game files are easily modded, but I dunno if anybody HAS. It is reasonably fun, but not particularly hard. EO is going to have way better and harder combat, larger dungeons, and real bosses. But the overworld in Legacy is somewhat neat.
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Mar 26, 2015 19:47
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Welp, I got to Wufan. Still not sure what the hell I'm going to do once poison stops being useful.
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Mar 26, 2015 19:58
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theshim posted:Welp, I got to Wufan. Still not sure what the hell I'm going to do once poison stops being useful. Would Rank 3 Venom Trow do more damage than maxed out Poison Circle? I have no idea what you'd do till level 40+ even if it were true.
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Mar 26, 2015 21:31
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Cernunnos posted:Would Rank 3 Venom Trow do more damage than maxed out Poison Circle? It does around 350 damage, so not really.
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Mar 26, 2015 21:32
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Turns out maxed Dismiss Blow deals around 120 damage, closer to 90 to FOEs. ...here's hoping Circle Mastery is really loving strong?
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Mar 26, 2015 21:40
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theshim posted:Turns out maxed Dismiss Blow deals around 120 damage, closer to 90 to FOEs. It only provides a 154% boost to dismiss effects, so that damage would go up to around 184 or 138. I think you're going to need a Runemaster sub.
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Mar 26, 2015 21:45
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Dr. Fetus posted:It only provides a 154% boost to dismiss effects, so that damage would go up to around 184 or 138. I think you're going to need a Runemaster sub. 
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Mar 26, 2015 22:03
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Dr. Fetus posted:It only provides a 154% boost to dismiss effects, so that damage would go up to around 184 or 138. I think you're going to need a Runemaster sub. Wouldn't a 154% boost increase the damage from 120 to ~300?
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Mar 26, 2015 22:18
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It's an increase from 100% which is 120 damage to 154% which is an increase of damage of 54% which is 64 extra damage. Not 154% more damage.
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Mar 26, 2015 22:23
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Whoa, let's not get nuts with the damage here.
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Mar 26, 2015 22:23
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theshim posted:well there's a Once you sub class, you'll have access to the nightseeker's throw skills, which might work really well for you.
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Mar 26, 2015 23:12
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psudonym55 posted:It's an increase from 100% which is 120 damage to 154% which is an increase of damage of 54% which is 64 extra damage. Not 154% more damage. Yeah, that's a 54% damage boost then, not a 154% one.
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Mar 26, 2015 23:22
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   I have unlocked subclassing! Fight literally boiled down to arm bind or die. He's incredibly resistant to it. I think he might have a 30% resistance or lower to it since I could only land it on him once. Head and leg binds were much easier to land. Interesting little quirk about Squall Volley, when one hit crits, the rest of the hits will always crit.
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Mar 26, 2015 23:22
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Well, I, uh, beat the Hollow Queen. Party level of 22, my lowest to date. The one boss that will actually be really easy for this run.
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Mar 26, 2015 23:42
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You're both crazy. But I love you.
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Mar 26, 2015 23:54
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theshim posted:Well, I, uh, beat the Hollow Queen. Party level of 22, my lowest to date. The one boss that will actually be really easy for this run. I can't believe my joke about this was actually correct.  So now that I've completed 3 and 4, I've returned to my EOU story mode file with a renewed determination to 100% it. After firing it up for the first time in a year I noticed a few things - First that I clearly had no idea what the hell I was doing with my party's build. I rested everyone and now have a party that seems much more capable of dishing out huge damage. For a big example, I had put no points in Richochet because I hadn't realized until playing EO4 that multi-hit attacks are generally the best thing against single bosses. I'm also glad that I learned about the item duplication glitch sometime in the past year, because I had exactly one formaldehyde left, and for some reason EOU decided to put the formaldehyde drop item on a difficult to perform conditional drop of one of the more annoying enemies rather than an easily killable FOE in the other two games. So yeah I just cloned a ton of those because gently caress Muskoids. And finally despite my better planning and added knowledge, the final floor of Claret Hollows is still loving brutal because of those god drat red and white blood cells. Anyway hopefully I'll be able to figure out a way to finally beat the Yggdrasil core this time once I finish getting all the drops so I can actually have everyone's best equipment and whatnot.
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Mar 27, 2015 00:56
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Charge Shot or whatever it's called is actually better than Ricochet in pretty much every way for single target elimination. EOU is less about many hits and more about using weird skills to get big hits to hit many times. Well, the strategies that blow up Expert Core in like 4-5 turns at least.
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Mar 27, 2015 01:05
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Well I've maxed that too so I'm good either way. But I mean I also ignored Action Boost last time for Ricky too.
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Mar 27, 2015 01:11
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Regy Rusty posted:And finally despite my better planning and added knowledge, the final floor of Claret Hollows is still loving brutal because of those god drat red and white blood cells. Those guys are really easy to beat once you get a Grimoire Stone with Demon's Beak. Of course, to get that, you have to fight the Depth Dancers, and that's a whole different kind of BS altogether.
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Mar 27, 2015 01:31
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Ugh I know. I just got its conditional (via formaldehyde because gently caress binds) and it was a mess. I'm trying to not have to bother with grimoire grinding and just making do with what I have already. It'll be fine for the rest of the enemies since I already beat everything once, but... well we'll see how the core goes once I've done everything else.
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Mar 27, 2015 01:34
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The main reason Ricochet isn't that good is because it has an accuracy penalty. It's basically a worse version of Squall Volley, and unless you have a Dark Hunter or Hexer, there's no good way to inflict binds. Okay now with both Dendrology and Bracing Walk, Golden Lair's main gimmick is completely trivialized. And I can save my money and supplies for in battle healing. Except now I need to farm up a bunch of Medica IIs.  How long does the maze stay frozen for?
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Mar 27, 2015 02:06
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