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Sir Kodiak posted:Nobody is suggesting that the government isn't responsible for creating a number of problems by locking him up. What are you even talking about anymore?
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Aug 21, 2015 01:42
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Drifter posted:What are you even talking about anymore? It's absurd to suggest that the blame for what Scott Lang's daughter went through lies with him instead of the people who unjustly locked him up.
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Aug 21, 2015 01:46
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I thought this article was pretty amusing.
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Aug 21, 2015 01:48
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Pretty much all marvel movies are pro status-quo, all I see them for is visual spectacle on a big screen, not their repugnant politics. Like trans4mers.
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Aug 21, 2015 02:13
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effectual posted:Pretty much all marvel movies are pro status-quo, all I see them for is visual spectacle on a big screen, not their repugnant politics. Like trans4mers. Transformers 4 is interesting because it is conservative, but in a reactionary/revolutionary that I don't like way. Optimus Prime is literally Bin Laden hiding from Robo-Seal Team 6 (except he's a bounty hunter) who's being assisted by the local government.
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Aug 21, 2015 02:16
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effectual posted:Pretty much all marvel movies are pro status-quo, all I see them for is visual spectacle on a big screen, not their repugnant politics. Like trans4mers. Ah, yes, the movies where the stand in for the NSA are revealed to be indistinguishable from nazis and the man who represents the ideal version of America has to destroy the entire organization. Super pro-status quo.
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Aug 21, 2015 03:26
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^And then there's a  monologue at the end where the triple-agent (or whatever she is now) says "we're not good but you need us". GG.computer parts posted:Transformers 4 is interesting because it is conservative, but in a reactionary/revolutionary that I don't like way. Optimus Prime is literally Bin Laden hiding from Robo-Seal Team 6 (except he's a bounty hunter) who's being assisted by the local government. Yeah it's just totally bonkers politically, which is actually cool. But the only reasons I saw it in the first place (never saw the first 3) were Marky Mark and robot trex breathing fire. But now I'm looking forward to the sequel where Prime goes to war with his gods. 
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Aug 21, 2015 03:28
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I love this movie the more I think about it. Which annoys me because obviously I don't want to have a movie taken away from an artistically respected director by a corporate conglomerate be a thing I like. But I am malleable and a bit of a pussy. I love that Hank's daughter refuses to call him dad being a bit of a (quickly admitted) feint as its such a cliche. I love the manager at the ice cream shop taking him in for a bollocking being a double feint, and 'realistic' too. If I employed the obvious whistle blowing julian assange type guy, I'd totally be all love what you do mate, but got a pension to protect here, maybe we could settle on a free drink that you chuck in the bin straight away. I really like what the fella said about the redemptive arc and stuff but it is essential to set Scott (don't like first name terms with fictional characters but) up as the little guy, downtrodden. He literally runs through a room being trodden on as an ex-con. These stories don't really have to be subtle. In fact the koopa kid, I wonder maybe do you not think it not about redemption for paul rudd at all? You (I think) say Paul Rudd doesn't change throughout, which I agree with, but his 'evil' nemesis Stepfather to his daughter has a huge change in heart. The system is mentioned several times in the movie, with often flippant respect (the whole heist crew) about being entered into the system. Well the stepdad is the most emblematic example of the system going to start with (no child support,no party,bullying antman for not'reforming',etc) and then sligthly after he displays the bravery of saying 'gently caress it' I'm going into the burning building because of genuine fear of suffering, he is relentlessly portrayed as heroic. I dunno, but if you align guys like him with antman and all of a sudden the falcon and captain america are too in the afters bit then suddenly Antman is starting to be the redemption of the whole lot of them, given their apparent opposition to Stark in that aftercredits scene. Given that we assume stark has always been hydra (see smg all over the place) and Cross's glib selling to hydra under the weird rebranding attempt of 'they're not what they seemed'. As I said. No idea. edit>> I meant to mention the words 'civil war' but didn't as I'm not very good and like the little guy being the one that finally shows bigger egos the way. maybe. In fact michael douglas also has a (paul rudd inspired) change of heart at the end which leads to a fourth wall breaking 'finally' from the girl about getting to be a hero. Pretty sure we can close this thread. forum. NotJustANumber99 fucked around with this message at 03:43 on Aug 21, 2015 |
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Aug 21, 2015 03:29
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Drifter posted:I thought the movie was kinda weird because Hank Pym was pretty much a bad guy, too, and Scott was manipulated into doing everything. It was pretty weird. This is pretty in-line with Pym's character in the comics, to be fair. The generally agreed upon idea is that he's a mad scientist supervillain trying to be a superhero. What with the whole "I'll show them all!" attitude.
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Aug 21, 2015 04:08
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Classtoise posted:This is pretty in-line with Pym's character in the comics, to be fair. The generally agreed upon idea is that he's a mad scientist supervillain trying to be a superhero. What with the whole "I'll show them all!" attitude. Like the movie universe Iron-man? But it was more with how he was painted in the film, verses his actions and whatnot. He was clearly meant to be a gruff but loveable hero role model.
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Aug 21, 2015 04:16
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effectual posted:^And then there's a Except they don't need them and they don't restart SHIELD because Captain America himself is like "lol no gently caress you, your entire organization was infiltrated by literal nazis and none of you even noticed." And then SHIELD hasn't come back.
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Aug 21, 2015 04:33
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TheJoker138 posted:Except they don't need them and they don't restart SHIELD because Captain America himself is like "lol no gently caress you, your entire organization was infiltrated by literal nazis and none of you even noticed." And then SHIELD hasn't come back. Did you not watch Avengers 2? With the amount of people needed to run and maintain a helicarrier and other functions, SHIELD's back and strong. Or were you being sarcastic?
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Aug 21, 2015 04:39
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Did you watch Agents of SHIELD? That's a one-off thing that was being maintained below the radar in the remnants of SHIELD. It doesn't mean the organization is up and operating at full capacity. All they really have is a handful of agents and bases functional under Coulson.
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Aug 21, 2015 05:23
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Apoplexy posted:Did you watch Agents of SHIELD? That's a one-off thing that was being maintained below the radar in the remnants of SHIELD. It doesn't mean the organization is up and operating at full capacity. All they really have is a handful of agents and bases functional under Coulson. SHIELD's still around, it just has a new name, a new boss (though the main underling is the same), and a new base in upstate New York.
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Aug 21, 2015 05:30
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Apoplexy posted:Did you watch Agents of SHIELD? That's a one-off thing that was being maintained below the radar in the remnants of SHIELD. It doesn't mean the organization is up and operating at full capacity. All they really have is a handful of agents and bases functional under Coulson. lol
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Aug 21, 2015 05:34
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NotJustANumber99 posted:In fact the koopa kid, I wonder maybe do you not think it not about redemption for paul rudd at all? You (I think) say Paul Rudd doesn't change throughout, which I agree with, but his 'evil' nemesis Stepfather to his daughter has a huge change in heart. The system is mentioned several times in the movie, with often flippant respect (the whole heist crew) about being entered into the system. Well the stepdad is the most emblematic example of the system going to start with (no child support,no party,bullying antman for not'reforming',etc) and then sligthly after he displays the bravery of saying 'gently caress it' I'm going into the burning building because of genuine fear of suffering, he is relentlessly portrayed as heroic. Nah, Paul Rudd absolutely changes. He is redeemed for his fault of being an actual good person, on his way to becoming an Avengers-style hero. Dad Cop is being heroic in the same way that Rudd is being heroic, the end of the movie is where their motives and methods finally align. You just shouldn't necessarily equate that heroism with Rudd becoming a better man, just a more acceptable one.
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Aug 21, 2015 05:36
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Natalia's monologue is confusing and badly written compared to everything else in Winter Soldier, but I'm pretty sure her point is supposed to be "I will always have a job because real governments need real professionals to do real intelligence work (implication: running a panopticon on everybody, which is unnecessary anyway because you've already decided who your enemies are, is not real intelligence work)." Unfortunately it clunks and comes across as contradicting the thrust of the film instead of supporting it.
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Aug 21, 2015 05:45
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Apoplexy posted:Did you watch Agents of SHIELD? That's a one-off thing that was being maintained below the radar in the remnants of SHIELD. It doesn't mean the organization is up and operating at full capacity. All they really have is a handful of agents and bases functional under Coulson. This. That wasn't "Hey guys, SHIELD is back!" it was just Fury pulling out a last gambit style thing. SHIELD still ain't around, and what's left isn't operating on nearly the same level. E: Hell, even what they're doing in Avengers 2 is a follow up to Winter Soldier. Instead of being a big military group spying on everyone and trying to attack problems before they start because thought crime, they're coming in to offer aid to a besieged third world country because it's the right thing to do. One of the characters, I think it was Cap, even says "this is what we should be doing," meaning "we should be doing good things instead of being literal nazis." Vince MechMahon fucked around with this message at 05:52 on Aug 21, 2015 |
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Aug 21, 2015 05:49
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Drifter posted:lol Not my fault there's more than just the films.
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Aug 21, 2015 05:52
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Apoplexy posted:Not my fault there's more than just the films. Yeah, citing other movies (that are in the same continuity) to dismiss the events of one, but then refusing to accept people citing the tv show (that is also in the same continuity) to dismiss your dismissal is kinda dumb.
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Aug 21, 2015 05:53
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Haha, I'm sorry. This is a hilarious turn of conversation. It's so surreal to use a medium-low to low rating'd show as some sort of functional binding agent between literal record breaking blockbuster movies. Just because it rains in Podunk, Ohio doesn't exactly mean I'm gonna hear about it Houston, Texas, much less break out an umbrella. Drifter fucked around with this message at 06:01 on Aug 21, 2015 |
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Aug 21, 2015 05:58
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Drifter posted:Haha, I'm sorry. This is a hilarious turn of conversation. It's so surreal to use a medium-low to low rating'd show as some sort of functional binding agent between literal record breaking movies. Reviews and such don't matter. They're in the same continuity. And they directly impact one another, and that's only going to grow with the Inhumans stuff. I'm sorry that a thing you don't like influences some other things and offers evidence against your previous point.
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Aug 21, 2015 06:00
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The Marvel Cinematic Universe is an interesting and novel experiment in the medium, making films of various genres not only coexist but converge and riff on similar themes. Borrowing notions of continuity from the comic books that inspired the project can be a useful critical tool, even if it is unorthodox.
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Aug 21, 2015 06:02
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Drifter posted:Haha, I'm sorry. This is a hilarious turn of conversation. It's so surreal to use a medium-low to low rating'd show as some sort of functional binding agent between literal record breaking blockbuster movies. This season introduced the Inhumans and had a tie in to Age of Ultron
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Aug 21, 2015 06:04
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TheJoker138 posted:they're coming in to offer aid to a besieged third world country because it's the right thing to do. Or because it's their fault that this world country is besieged. They don't get credit for helping in the same way I wouldn't give BP a pat on the back for pitching in to clean up an oil spill.
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Aug 21, 2015 15:11
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Drifter posted:Haha, I'm sorry. This is a hilarious turn of conversation. It's so surreal to use a medium-low to low rating'd show as some sort of functional binding agent between literal record breaking blockbuster movies. lol
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Aug 21, 2015 15:41
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Did they ever explain how Loki's Scepter ended up back on Earth after Thor took it to Asgard at the end of the first Avengers?bobkatt013 posted:This season introduced the Inhumans and had a tie in to Age of Ultron The tie-in was literally a 30 second scene where Coulsen tells Marie Hill that he has a helicarrier in the basement that he hasn't told anyone about and had never been seen or mentioned in the show before. Then he says "I've been saving this if the world needs some avenging" while an ad for Avengers 2 pops up in the bottom corner of the screen.
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Aug 21, 2015 19:45
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Irish Joe posted:Did they ever explain how Loki's Scepter ended up back on Earth after Thor took it to Asgard at the end of the first Avengers? Thor didn't. He only took the cube and Loki. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXPJ6xFvdWk
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Aug 21, 2015 19:48
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Irish Joe posted:Did they ever explain how Loki's Scepter ended up back on Earth after Thor took it to Asgard at the end of the first Avengers? Loki is currently impersonating Odin (seen at the end of Thor 2) so presumably he's working with Hydra and gave them it back. e: Oh, apparently not.
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Aug 21, 2015 19:50
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Was the Sceptre lost in the Battle of New York, or did Hydra moles in SHIELD steal it?
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Aug 21, 2015 20:12
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Tenebrais posted:I wonder if there's an industry of superhero insurance in the MCU. I'm almost positive there is. But that might have been a DC comic I read.
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Aug 21, 2015 22:29
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Tenebrais posted:
Tony Stark apparently cleans it up for free.
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Aug 21, 2015 22:42
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Tenebrais posted:I wonder if there's an industry of superhero insurance in the MCU. Well Damage Control got brought up in Iron Man, so probably.
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Aug 21, 2015 22:50
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Boogaleeboo posted:Well Damage Control got brought up in Iron Man, so probably. That got brought up as a counter to MoS, not as an in-universe world-build.
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Aug 21, 2015 23:28
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Damage Control was in Iron Man 1 roughly a billion movie years before MoS ever came out.
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Aug 22, 2015 03:07
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They evacuated an entire floating city, saved falling people by jumping/flying down after them; the pacing of the film was brought to a halt for however many minutes while they saved all of these people. I simply cannot believe there was no connection to the vehement outcry and complaints against MoS at the time regarding civilian deaths.
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Aug 22, 2015 03:21
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Drifter posted:They evacuated an entire floating city, saved falling people by jumping/flying down after them; the pacing of the film was brought to a halt for however many minutes while they saved all of these people. There was also a scene during the Hulkbuster fight when he saves an elevator full of people and patiently waits while they disembark.
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Aug 22, 2015 03:29
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Drifter posted:They evacuated an entire floating city, saved falling people by jumping/flying down after them; the pacing of the film was brought to a halt for however many minutes while they saved all of these people. Nor can I. It's one of the things that makes the Avengers real heroes while Superman is just a big idiot in a cape smashing things.
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Aug 22, 2015 03:31
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Drifter posted:They evacuated an entire floating city, saved falling people by jumping/flying down after them; the pacing of the film was brought to a halt for however many minutes while they saved all of these people. You can't believe that the bright and flashy heroes in the movie series where violence against civilians has been wildly underplayed since day one would continue to wildly underplay the damage to civilians? Why?
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Aug 22, 2015 03:34
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Boogaleeboo posted:You can't believe that the bright and flashy heroes in the movie series where violence against civilians has been wildly underplayed since day one would continue to wildly underplay the damage to civilians? To the extent that it was. And I'm not talking about damage - because really you'd be hard pressed to find more than one or two instances of more than minor civilian death/damage when the superheroes were near -, I'm talking about the inclusion , the forcing, of the process. computer parts posted:There was also a scene during the Hulkbuster fight when he saves an elevator full of people and patiently waits while they disembark. What a mess that was from the start. Not to mention Tony's safe-bots each scene just standing around murmuring something about there being some danger nearby. In English, no less. They're just talking signposts - absolute worthless. Drifter fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Aug 22, 2015 |
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Aug 22, 2015 03:40
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