Kajeesus posted:No one is asking you to praise them. Do you believe that Palestinians are uniquely genocidal in nature? Israel understands the importance of public relations, indeed worships at its altar, and Palestine does not. So Palestinians are worse than animals for living without their souls in bondage to spin-doctoring.
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Oct 10, 2015 17:24
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Meanwhile 'Human-Hunting' in Jerusalem, in which extremist Jewish mobs roam the streets, chanting death to Arabs and asking people what time it is so they can see if they spot an Arab accent: http://www.ha-makom.co.il/post/hamaha-manhunt-english Seems like a lot of businesses have to be Arab-free or face repercussions.
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Oct 10, 2015 17:38
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Hong XiuQuan posted:asking people what time it is so they can see if they spot an Arab accent: Judges 12:6 is back in fashion.
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Oct 10, 2015 18:51
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Still thinking about -Troika-'s post from yesterday calling me stupid and the such, of course he didn't bother responding to any of the numerous replies he got but I felt like some fundamental irony was not emphasized enough itt. Only a month ago an ultra orthodox terrorist by the name of Yishai Schlissel went on a stabbing rampage in the Jerusalem gay pride parade, murdering a 16 year old girl and injuring 5 other people. He was not shot. He was tackled by the security forces on the scene, disarmed, and arrested.
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Oct 10, 2015 20:09
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Kim Jong Il posted:It sure would be great if this thread could learn that bad behavior on one side doesn't excuse bad behavior on the other. It's an important point that Palestinians don't seem to realize and/or care how their behavior and rhetoric will be interpreted in the west or Israel, which will exacerbate the eventual response. Glorifying murderers makes you a lot easier to demonize. People in this thread have definitely been discussing Palestinian violence against Israelis, though it's a little less relevant since Israel actually has much more power to escalate the situation (not to mention the fact that Israel created the circumstances leading to the violence in the first place). But I literally don't think I've seen you mention anything other than the crimes of Palestinians a single time. It's like you're some sort of robot programmed to automatically ignore all instances of Israeli violence. To any onlooker, this pretty clearly indicates that there's something hosed up going on with your reasoning that is making you only care about one group of people in this situation. To any reader that isn't staunchly "pro-Israel" to begin with, it's obvious that you have some pretty extreme biases influencing your views. There's simply no other way to explain what you've been saying. This actually applies to most of the "pro-Israel" (for lack of a better term) posters in this thread (and in society as a whole); they literally never say "Israel did a bad thing," despite Israel committing far more crimes than the Palestinians. It's kind of hard to witness and not think "this person is kind of racist." It's directly analogous to every other historical instance where oppressed populations have committed violence against their oppressors. While terrorism and other violence against civilians by the oppressed is never acceptable, what kind of rear end in a top hat focuses 100% on how violent and terrible oppressed populations are?
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Oct 10, 2015 20:52
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I don't see how you look at a bunch of people glorifying an individual knife attack and, at worst, committing themselves to doing the same, and hear "POGROM POGROM" rather than "KNIFE TERRORISM, KNIFE TERRORISM". As emanresu said, a pogrom is usually mass, targeting defenseless civilians, and has state backing or indifference. Palestinians are not in a position to have any of these, as a mass gathering of them leads to an immediate armed response regardless of purpose, they don't usually otherwise have the numbers anyway, and the state would be against their actions. Even if you count PA as their "state", it seems to be entirely on the side of intercepting violence against Jews, and if it didn't, the security situation is such that any pogrom-like attempts would be met with Israeli security forces which are better armed and trained. Meanwhile armed Jewish mobs are, in fact, in a position to commit pogroms, gathering in mass, committing violence against defenseless civilians, and encountering indifference or outright support from the state, and have been doing so for the past couple of years, moreso in the last couple of weeks. In this context, one doesn't need to be an antisemite or a Palestinian lover to look askance at your argument.
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Oct 10, 2015 21:04
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So, after the shootings in Gaza yesterday and the clashes near the fence today (which had Gazans breaching the fence and the IDF killing two 13 year old kids) it seems like Hamas might have taken the bait as apparently several rockets were launched towards Ashkelon and were intercepted. We all remember what this sorta stuff leads to if the IDF chooses to continue escalating poo poo.
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Oct 10, 2015 21:31
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emanresu tnuocca posted:So, after the shootings in Gaza yesterday and the clashes near the fence today (which had Gazans breaching the fence and the IDF killing two 13 year old kids) it seems like Hamas might have taken the bait as apparently several rockets were launched towards Ashdod and were intercepted. Well Gaza is still rubble. If they go in again there's not much left to destroy, it will be carnage. But if they do go in, I hope the IDF pays a very, very dear price. If Hamas could just focus on military targets, opprobrium would evaporate. Nothing shifts Israeli policy more towards peace than a soldier:civilian ratio stacked with soldiers (see 1982). If they just fire rockets willy nilly we'll just see the same cycle.
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Oct 10, 2015 21:34
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A Channel 2 poll just found that 73% of Israeli's disapprove of Netanyahu's performance. 
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Oct 10, 2015 22:27
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I wouldn't be too quick to assume it is Hamas. There are other Islamic groups in Gaza Palestinian Islamic Jihad. On previous occasions Hamas have been drawn into the violence because Hamas got attacked by the IDF after other terrorist groups started firing rockets. Also yeah, I've got to agree. Rockets disproportionately kill civilians by a significant ratio. They should be avoided at all costs. Hell, even if you're a bloodthirsty kill crazy Palestinian terrorists who thirsts for Jewish blood and don't care who gets hurt, rockets are really ineffective. Last time I checked it was about 500 rockets fired per Israeli killed.
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Oct 10, 2015 22:33
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Volkerball posted:A Channel 2 poll just found that 73% of Israeli's disapprove of Netanyahu's performance. The problem with that is most of those 73% want someone who's even more right wing than him.
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Oct 10, 2015 23:08
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Ytlaya posted:People in this thread have definitely been discussing Palestinian violence against Israelis, though it's a little less relevant since Israel actually has much more power to escalate the situation (not to mention the fact that Israel created the circumstances leading to the violence in the first place). But I literally don't think I've seen you mention anything other than the crimes of Palestinians a single time. It's like you're some sort of robot programmed to automatically ignore all instances of Israeli violence. To any onlooker, this pretty clearly indicates that there's something hosed up going on with your reasoning that is making you only care about one group of people in this situation. To any reader that isn't staunchly "pro-Israel" to begin with, it's obvious that you have some pretty extreme biases influencing your views. There's simply no other way to explain what you've been saying. Then what do you say for everyone who only posts anti-Israel posts? Every time Israel does something bad it's already posted here, very few people bother to post the other side. I haven't been excusing the horrible things Israel or Israelis do, but every time the shoe is on the other foot there's a parade of excuses. Absurd Alhazred posted:I don't see how you look at a bunch of people glorifying an individual knife attack and, at worst, committing themselves to doing the same, and hear "POGROM POGROM" rather than "KNIFE TERRORISM, KNIFE TERRORISM". It's a bunch of fanatics whipping themselves into a frenzy to commit far worse crimes. Those fanatics are gearing up to do something absolutely horrific. quote:As emanresu said, a pogrom is usually mass, targeting defenseless civilians, and has state backing or indifference. Palestinians are not in a position to have any of these, as a mass gathering of them leads to an immediate armed response regardless of purpose, they don't usually otherwise have the numbers anyway, and the state would be against their actions. Even if you count PA as their "state", it seems to be entirely on the side of intercepting violence against Jews, and if it didn't, the security situation is such that any pogrom-like attempts would be met with Israeli security forces which are better armed and trained. Abu Mazen incited the latest round of attacks by trying to score points with fear mongering about the Temple Mount to try to misdirect the domestic political pressure against him. So even if his attention was a few Molotov cocktails before his security forces get it under control, he's responsible for what happens as a result. quote:Meanwhile armed Jewish mobs are, in fact, in a position to commit pogroms, gathering in mass, committing violence against defenseless civilians, and encountering indifference or outright support from the state, and have been doing so for the past couple of years, moreso in the last couple of weeks. As sickening as the NRP types are, mass glorification of violence doesn't happen nearly to the same scale. They're still a fringe group in the grand scheme of things, and meanwhile it's loving Fatah that's leading the charge in the latest round of violence.
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Oct 11, 2015 00:41
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Kim Jong Il posted:Then what do you say for everyone who only posts anti-Israel posts? Every time Israel does something bad it's already posted here, very few people bother to post the other side. I haven't been excusing the horrible things Israel or Israelis do, but every time the shoe is on the other foot there's a parade of excuses. Kim Jong Il posted:As sickening as the NRP types are, mass glorification of violence doesn't happen nearly to the same scale. They're still a fringe group in the grand scheme of things, and meanwhile it's loving Fatah that's leading the charge in the latest round of violence. No, KJI, you certainly aren't excusing them at all when the rest of your post immediately turns into "b-b-but the Palestinians are so much WORSE!!!!"
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Oct 11, 2015 00:56
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Remember when, I wanna say the defense minister, got on TV and said the Palestinians are calling down a 'holocaust' upon themselves for...dong things I guess. Anyway here's why Palestine is invoking pogroms because a couple retards said 'yea knifing people is cool'.
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Oct 11, 2015 01:19
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Remind me again kim jong, how many palestinians have been killed in the last 24 hours alone? How many jews have been killed in the same frame of time? please don't accuse me of wanting more jews dead either. one person on each side is already too much. but with that said gently caress every settler in the west bank. Ultramega fucked around with this message at 01:37 on Oct 11, 2015 |
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Oct 11, 2015 01:32
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Israeli strike in Zeitoun. A house collapsed.  1 dead, 3 injured. The woman killed, Noor Hassan, was 5 months pregnant.
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Oct 11, 2015 01:36
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Kim Jong Il posted:As sickening as the NRP types are, mass glorification of violence doesn't happen nearly to the same scale. They're still a fringe group in the grand scheme of things, and meanwhile it's loving Fatah that's leading the charge in the latest round of violence. This is hilarious. You refuse to confirm that Jewish mobs rampaging through the streets demanding 'Death to Arabs' (a distinct minority) instigating and taking part in beatings and shootings, with the tacit support of the Israeli executive screams 'pogrom''; yet you'll leap happily apply hyperbole to a Palestinian funeral. Why do you think that is? Also, do try to answer the question this time, it's been put to you many times. Hong XiuQuan fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Oct 11, 2015 |
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Oct 11, 2015 01:53
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Volkerball posted:Israeli strike in Zeitoun. A house collapsed. They're currently looking for a missing three year old child in the rubble.
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Oct 11, 2015 01:57
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Also, the claims that Abbas is directing this are hilarious. http://www.maannews.com/Content.aspx?id=768091 Maan posted:
Nobody in their right mind things Abbas wants this. He's a stooge.
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Oct 11, 2015 02:00
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Hong XiuQuan posted:They're currently looking for a missing three year old child in the rubble. she didn't make it.
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Oct 11, 2015 03:11
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Kim Jong Il posted:Then what do you say for everyone who only posts anti-Israel posts? Every time Israel does something bad it's already posted here, very few people bother to post the other side. I haven't been excusing the horrible things Israel or Israelis do, but every time the shoe is on the other foot there's a parade of excuses. While some people do just post anti-Israel stuff, it's less offensive (or at least worth less worth replying to) for a few reasons: 1. As I mentioned, Israeli violence is, by its very nature, far more concerning given the fact that Israel has far more power to escalate things and is responsible for creating the environment that causes these crimes to happen in the first place. 2. People who aren't intellectually dishonest do not purposely only respond to the least flattering posts representing an opposing opinion. While there are some good and some bad posters on the "pro-Palestinian" (for lack of a better term) side, literally every single "pro-Israel" poster completely ignores Israeli violence (unless directly prompted to admit it exists). 3. Not necessarily referring to the events of the recent days, but Israel generally causes far more casualties than Palestinians, so it's kind of obvious that they're going to be mentioned more frequently in light of this. There have been multiple discussions in this thread about whether different kinds of Palestinian resistance are worthwhile, with a general consensus that violent resistance isn't useful and is immoral when used against civilians (with the only debate arguably being about whether settlers are valid targets, though most people seem to believe they aren't). But I never - no exaggeration - see the "pro-Israel" side discuss the problems with Israel. Without exception, they always focus solely upon Palestinian crimes. The fact that some bad posters exists does not give you an excuse to also be a bad poster. It's also worth noting that it's one thing to mention instances of Palestinian violence and another to assign a narrative to those instances. If you had just said "Palestinian kills __ people in knife attack" people wouldn't react as poorly, but you instead have been clearly trying to frame events as the beginning of some great crime perpetrated by Palestinians against Israelis, even though the complete opposite is far more likely to occur.
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Oct 11, 2015 04:49
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Ytlaya posted:But I never - no exaggeration - see the "pro-Israel" side discuss the problems with Israel. Then read my post history as I despise Netanyahu, Bennett and his ilk, Shas, and especially the Haredim. Due to the political leanings of this thread, there's a lot more anti-Israel discussion hence that's the part of the debate I'm usually responding to. If a pro-Israel poster says something dumb, they're jumped on instantly before I have a chance to respond. On other forums, I'm a dirty Lapidite that wants to hug Arabs. quote:It's also worth noting that it's one thing to mention instances of Palestinian violence and another to assign a narrative to those instances. If you had just said "Palestinian kills __ people in knife attack" people wouldn't react as poorly, but you instead have been clearly trying to frame events as the beginning of some great crime perpetrated by Palestinians against Israelis, even though the complete opposite is far more likely to occur. This is wrong because mine was a statement about intentionality.
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Oct 11, 2015 05:33
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Kim Jong Il posted:Then read my post history as I despise Netanyahu, Bennett and his ilk, Shas, and especially the Haredim. Due to the political leanings of this thread, there's a lot more anti-Israel discussion hence that's the part of the debate I'm usually responding to. If a pro-Israel poster says something dumb, they're jumped on instantly before I have a chance to respond. On other forums, I'm a dirty Lapidite that wants to hug Arabs. If you sit around waiting for other people to start being reasonable before you start, mirabile dictu, reasonability never loving arises.
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Oct 11, 2015 05:39
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We have our first suicide bomb (attempt) since 2008. A woman drove through a police checkpoint and detonated a car bomb. "Lightly" wounded a police officer, and up til now she has survived, but it doesn't sound like she's in great shape, as you'd expect.
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Oct 11, 2015 05:59
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Volkerball posted:Israeli strike in Zeitoun. A house collapsed. Welp, time for me to take back up drinking. I wonder who's going to die this year. 
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Oct 11, 2015 06:29
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Hitlers Gay Secret posted:Welp, time for me to take back up drinking. Everyone.
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Oct 11, 2015 07:06
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Kim Jong Il posted:Then read my post history as I despise Netanyahu, Bennett and his ilk, Shas, and especially the Haredim. Due to the political leanings of this thread, there's a lot more anti-Israel discussion hence that's the part of the debate I'm usually responding to. If a pro-Israel poster says something dumb, they're jumped on instantly before I have a chance to respond. On other forums, I'm a dirty Lapidite that wants to hug Arabs. I think we can safely assume that you don't give a shy about Palestinian life. You've been offered the chance repeatedly over the last couple of pages to clarify whether you felt certain behaviours, based on your own observations of Palestinians, reminded you of pogroms. You've wilfully ignored them. The adverse inference here is that there's always something to mitigate Jewish Israeli behaviour and always something to make Palestinian behaviour seem far, far worse. That, to me, is racism. You are part of them problem.
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Oct 11, 2015 09:39
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Volkerball posted:she didn't make it. gently caress. That's just utterly awful. That poor family.
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Oct 11, 2015 09:41
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Volkerball posted:We have our first suicide bomb (attempt) since 2008. A woman drove through a police checkpoint and detonated a car bomb. "Lightly" wounded a police officer, and up til now she has survived, but it doesn't sound like she's in great shape, as you'd expect. Apparently might have been an accident http://m.jpost.com/Breaking-News/Pa..._medium=twitter <-- some at claiming failure of an airbag system.
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Oct 11, 2015 09:43
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Kim Jong Il posted:Then what do you say for everyone who only posts anti-Israel posts? Every time Israel does something bad it's already posted here, very few people bother to post the other side. I haven't been excusing the horrible things Israel or Israelis do, but every time the shoe is on the other foot there's a parade of excuses. Do you have any specific posters in mind? I'll gladly expand my position on any specific incidence of Palestinian violence if asked. Naturally I condemn all violence against civilians (including settlers), but I condemn Israeli violence more strongly because it comes from a position of power. Kim Jong Il posted:It's a bunch of fanatics whipping themselves into a frenzy to commit far worse crimes. Those fanatics are gearing up to do something absolutely horrific. People have been asking ever since you posted this if you think this event is uniquely inciting a Pogrom, or if other events could be viewed in the same light. When you ignore a question addressed directly to you by several people, it casts your posting in a pretty bad light..
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Oct 11, 2015 09:53
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Kim Jong Il posted:Then what do you say for everyone who only posts anti-Israel posts? Every time Israel does something bad it's already posted here, very few people bother to post the other side. I haven't been excusing the horrible things Israel or Israelis do, but every time the shoe is on the other foot there's a parade of excuses. Pro-israel posts are a bannable offence according to the secret unwritten rules that the D&D mods follow.
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Oct 11, 2015 10:16
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Jewish lynch mobs attacked a man, the ironic twist this time is that the man was Jewish, apparently he had a beard and maybe he was wearing Jeans and a threadbare t-shirt cause they for some reason jumped to the conclusion he was an arab. It's really quite a problem when half the jews around here are of arabic descent, including members of the lynch squads, I heard people half-jokingly state that people who don't look sufficiently Ashkenazi should shave their beards at these trying times. Or perhaps arabs should just wear some sort of a badge or something that identifies them at all times, maybe a crescent moon worn on their lapels? just a thought idk, after all we don't want more innocent jews being mistaken for violent arabs, that poo poo is just embarrassing. In actual news Netanyahu has found the culprit for the escalation in violence this past week, you guessed it it's MK Zoabi, Netanyahu called the police to open a criminal investigation against Zoabi for alleged incitement, according to Netanyahu: "MK Zoabi in an interview to the official Hamas newsletter has stated the following 'Hundreds of thousands of muslims must ascend to Al Aqsa to stand against the Israeli plot to spill the blood of the (Palestinian) residents of east Jerusalem. Today it is only individuals who act in defiance while it is popular support which is required, and thus we need thousands of our people to come forth and turn these events into a real Intifada'" Netanyahu continues "[Zoabi's Statements] are libelous incitement and a clear call for violence, we will not let this slip under the radar. I have requested the Attorney General to pursuit a criminal investigation against MK Zoabi". He also stated that reservist IDF battalions have been called into service all will be posted all over the place to 'keep the peace'.
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Oct 11, 2015 10:50
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She shouldn't be prosecuted, but that's still disgusting incitement any way you put it, and she remains as much of a demagogue as ever.Hong XiuQuan posted:I think we can safely assume that you don't give a shy about Palestinian life. You've been offered the chance repeatedly over the last couple of pages to clarify whether you felt certain behaviours, based on your own observations of Palestinians, reminded you of pogroms. You've wilfully ignored them. Nope, I responded to why I thought the analogy didn't work. quote:The adverse inference here is that there's always something to mitigate Jewish Israeli behaviour and always something to make Palestinian behaviour seem far, far worse. That, to me, is racism. You are part of them problem. So you're inferring based on something I supposedly didn't say, and meanwhile there's a parade of posters who consistently apologize for Palestinian violence. So to recap, your imaginary fairytale offenses are racism when I haven't invoked race in any respect, the exact same behavior on the other side is not racism, and meanwhile Zoabi engaging in historical denialism is not racism either, got it.
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Oct 11, 2015 16:49
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Kim Jong Il posted:She shouldn't be prosecuted, but that's still disgusting incitement any way you put it, and she remains as much of a demagogue as ever. So she's like every Israeli politician ever, good to know
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Oct 11, 2015 16:53
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Kim Jong Il posted:there's a parade of posters who consistently apologize for Palestinian violence. Post some quotes then. Where are these evil antisemitic posters you keep mentioning?
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Oct 11, 2015 16:56
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Kim Jong Il posted:Nope, I responded to why I thought the analogy didn't work. For those of us with short memories, could you please point to where you've addressed the question: 'why don't Jewish mobs patrolling the streets of Jerusalem, chanting death to Arabs, inciting the beatings and deaths of Arabs, questioning people to see if they can spot Arab accents, leaving shopkeepers alone once they discover they're Hebrew only, all carried out with tacit executive support etc make you think POGROM, POGROM, POGROM?' Kim Jong Il posted:So you're inferring based on something I supposedly didn't say, and meanwhile there's a parade of posters who consistently apologize for Palestinian violence. So to recap, your imaginary fairytale offenses are racism when I haven't invoked race in any respect, the exact same behavior on the other side is not racism, and meanwhile Zoabi engaging in historical denialism is not racism either, got it. Yes an adverse inference is drawn when someone uses silence to evade questions. Can you please tell me where you've shown 'exact same behaviour' from the other side? Are Palestinians roaming the streets of Jerusalem demanding death to the Jews with impunity. Or is it the case that Palestinians who, say, stab Israeli Jewish civilians tend to be (rightly) arrested or, as is increasingly common, extrajudicially executed for even being suspected of wrongdoing?
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Oct 11, 2015 17:25
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Baloogan posted:Pro-israel posts are a bannable offence according to the secret unwritten rules that the D&D mods follow. On the other hand, no they're not.
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Oct 12, 2015 05:32
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http://forums.somethingawful.com/banlist.php?userid=193607 http://forums.somethingawful.com/banlist.php?userid=37552 http://forums.somethingawful.com/banlist.php?userid=184584 http://forums.somethingawful.com/banlist.php?userid=81684 This forum is an echo chamber enforced by the unfair political moderation. Sure you can control this lovely subforum's content but the opinions posted here in no way reflect reality.
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Oct 12, 2015 05:35
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Baloogan posted:http://forums.somethingawful.com/banlist.php?userid=193607 I had to check your post history to see if this was a joke post or not. Avshalom getting probated because he's "pro-Israel" lmao
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Oct 12, 2015 06:05
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Could you please quote the posts they were banned for and explain how they are perfectly reasonable pro-Israel arguments?
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Oct 12, 2015 06:08
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