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Tighclops posted:There was no part of Andromeda that was better than BSG or nearly any other show. No part.
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Aug 16, 2016 21:35
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Where's Cleopatra 2525 stack up, or for that matter Homeboys From Outer Space?
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Aug 16, 2016 23:05
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Below Lexx, above Tripping The Rift (everything is above Tripping The Rift.)
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Aug 17, 2016 00:06
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Other than Zathras, Zathras was the best character in Babylon 5
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Aug 17, 2016 00:09
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You know what just struck me? Nobody in the show ever calls Martians "Dusters".
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Aug 17, 2016 06:07
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Also nobody calls people Mooninites
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Aug 17, 2016 06:10
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bitprophet posted:I still recommend B5 to people today but I generously lather on the obligatory caveats about basically everything you mentioned. If someone somehow hasn't seen it & thinks they have a good tolerance for poor aging, by all means I'm gonna tell them to check it out and/or lend them my DVDs. Something that new watchers of Bab5 should be aware of is the preferred viewing order. You have a few movies (and Crusade, but apparently that is some dire poo poo) that slot in at certain points, as well as a few episodes that should be watched in a different order for more impact. And speaking of Blake's 7, does it go down in history as the only TV show where the hero is sentenced to prison for molesting children? NmareBfly posted:Below Lexx, above Tripping The Rift (everything is above Tripping The Rift.) Well, the series that spun-off from the original Tripping the Rift short. Because that was great.
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Aug 17, 2016 09:21
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Gromit posted:Something that new watchers of Bab5 should be aware of is the preferred viewing order. You have a few movies (and Crusade, but apparently that is some dire poo poo) that slot in at certain points, as well as a few episodes that should be watched in a different order for more impact. Link to this?
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Aug 17, 2016 09:51
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Agronox posted:Also, Sinclair > Sheridan come at me bro
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Aug 17, 2016 10:13
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Gromit posted:Something that new watchers of Bab5 should be aware of is the preferred viewing order. You have a few movies (and Crusade, but apparently that is some dire poo poo) that slot in at certain points, as well as a few episodes that should be watched in a different order for more impact. Which episodes should be watched in a different order? That's a new one to me. Start with the pilot, work your way through the various seasons in order. Watch In The Beginning after Season 4. Watch Thirdspace about mid Season-4. Feel free to ignore the other movies.
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Aug 17, 2016 10:28
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Milky Moor posted:Which episodes should be watched in a different order? That's a new one to me. http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/countries/master/eplist.html This is the 20+ year old master episode guide and viewing list.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:53
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Grand Fromage posted:This just sounds like you haven't watched much. The worst episode of BSG is better than most TV sci-fi ever filmed. The goon revisionist hyperbole about BSG is nuts. As the show progressed it became more and more of a muddled mess and ending was pure undiluted cat poo poo. There is nothing revisionist about that, it was pretty much my opinion when it aired. It's worse exactly because of how high it fell from, it was really really good for like two and half seasons. Then the fact that the writers didn't have any plan whatsoever began creeping in more and more.
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Aug 17, 2016 15:20
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koreban posted:http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/countries/master/eplist.html What're the differences though? I mean, just looking at the Season 1 episode list, it's breaking up what's probably the strongest part of the season (Voice in the Wilderness through to Chrysalis) with TKO and Legacies. Actually, I'm really curious so I'm looking into this. Okay, so, Legacies has something that needs Babylon Squared to have happened before. No information on the TKO switch that I can find. The Season 2 switch (of Soul Mates and Race Through Dark Places) there works because Talia's arc makes much more sense. The Season 3 switches don't seem to matter at all. None in Season 4, which isn't surprising. Season 5... I think Day of the Dead works much better as episode 8 than 12. It doesn't seem right to set it after The Ragged Edge, it seems like it'd break things up too much, and I can't seem to find the reasoning why it was shuffled.
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Aug 17, 2016 15:31
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Grand Fromage posted:That's fine, but there was a whole lot of love during the show that has turned into retroactive "worst show ever" stuff. It's a pattern, I've rarely seen a show that doesn't abruptly get legions of hate on the internet around season three. It's like clockwork. I don't get it. DarkCrawler posted:As the show progressed it became more and more of a muddled mess and ending was pure undiluted cat poo poo. There is nothing revisionist about that, it was pretty much my opinion when it aired. It's worse exactly because of how high it fell from, it was really really good for like two and half seasons. Then the fact that the writers didn't have any plan whatsoever began creeping in more and more. The later seasons are carried so much by the acting, the score and some amazing scenes. So many of the principal cast turn in amazing performances. BSG had some truly dire episodes. The Woman King - a climactic episode for a cut subplot. Black Market - the episode that gives Lee a wife that not a single character ever mentioned before or talks about later. All those episodes in Season 2 that make use of disjointed time sequencing. Hero - some maudlin drama about how Adama might have been responsible for the attack on the Colonies. I'm sure there's more.
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Aug 17, 2016 15:44
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Milky Moor posted:What're the differences though? Some of that comes down to filming/production order. They aired episodes out of order, which had weird knock on story arc effects. Others are one-off episodes that just "feel" better by nerds who had far more time to put into worrying about this stuff than I did for the last 20 years. That lurker's guide site has been up since the mid-90s and at this point I'm willing to just accept it canonically. I've watched the series in the airing/DVD order and again in the lurker's order and tbh, I just watch in the lurker's order for continuity sake now.
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Aug 17, 2016 16:48
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I don't think it matters much for B5 but Crusade was aired entirely out of order. Movies you can watch after. In the Beginning is great and you must watch, the rest are up to you. Thirdspace is okay I guess? Don't watch Legend of the Rangers unless you're planning to MST3K it with friends. One of the Lost Tales episodes is decent.
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Aug 17, 2016 16:52
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I thought all the Lost Tales were pretty good, but that might be the nostalgia speaking. Crusade however, a bit poo poo, even with nostalgia.
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Aug 17, 2016 16:54
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I'm watching B5 for the first time, only just watched Mind War from season 1 last night. Should I continue with the disc order or use the Lurker's Guide? I watched The Gathering first but not In The Beginning. I'll save that for after season 4.
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Aug 18, 2016 03:10
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Hedrigall posted:I'm watching B5 for the first time, only just watched Mind War from season 1 last night. Should I continue with the disc order or use the Lurker's Guide? Disc order is fine.
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Aug 18, 2016 03:55
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Yep. DO NOT watch In the Beginning until much later. Don't skip episodes, they all contribute something to the overall plot.
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Aug 18, 2016 04:00
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B5 is amazing and BSG is amazing. As SciFi TV fans we really don't have much to choose from as 'best'. I also hate the revisionist bullshit that BSG sucks. I swear it is mostly due to the fact that SciFi fans don't like the idea of religious aspects being in their SciFi shows which BSG was very heavy with at the end. S3E4 is the peak of SciFi on television in my opinion. Nothing has even come close to that episode since... and I just realized that was almost 10 years ago. gently caress.
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Aug 18, 2016 04:49
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Honestly, it was never the religious stuff that got to me. I checked out near the end of Season 2 (specifically after the reveal that Lee had been seeing that random woman the whole time, apparently). The writing seemed to be getting more gimmicky and repetitive and I was already really, really sick of the "everyone's a Cylon!" poo poo. Really though, I think it was the characters that killed it for me. I couldn't stand Starbuck being an irresponsible jerk but getting away with it because she was just such a badass she could do anything, Lee Adama was painfully dull, the hallucinatory blond in the red dress kept showing up to grind the plot to a halt, and the general frothy angstiness of the whole thing really started getting to me. I suppose I partly stopped because I'd heard the fan consensus that it just got worse from there and I'll probably finish the series to see for myself one of these years, but as much as I loved the first ten episodes or so, I'm sadly not that invested in finding out how the story ends.
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Aug 18, 2016 05:37
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insider posted:I also hate the revisionist bullshit that BSG sucks. My suspicion is that it's similar to any other situation where early potential (or pre-release hype, which is the most common manifestation) doesn't fully pan out. The show was on what seemed like a mind-blowingly good trajectory the first few seasons, then lost steam to a degree / became uneven, and had a generally disappointing/unfulfilling ending. Most people (or at least...most goons  ) over-correct, and turn "show did not maintain its awesomesauce 100% of run" into "RARGH! WORST SHOW EVER!! SURE GLAD I WASN'T SUPER INTO IT BEFORE!!! THEN I'D LOOK STUPID!!!!"
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Aug 18, 2016 05:41
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I think there's also the fact that most people are not professional critics. We'll know intuitively that "I don't like this/it's bad now," but we won't necessarily know why so we'll tend to latch onto whatever element sticks out, whether or not it's really the biggest issue.
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Aug 18, 2016 05:52
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I thought the show was great for much of its run. There are several episodes that I still think are among the best in the genre. The characters were engaging and well-developed, and there were interesting plot hooks all over the place. Weird choices like "The Woman King" aside, most of the problems cropped up when it came time to start actually resolving those plots. As I understand it, the writers were mostly winging it, and I think it really showed in how things wrapped up. My disappointment in the show is "revisionist" only insofar as it's hard to find the breadcrumbs interesting when I know they don't lead anywhere.
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Aug 18, 2016 06:10
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Fatdama was the peak of BSG.
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Aug 18, 2016 06:16
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It probably doesn't help that BSG's last major release was The Plan. With the exception of Bear's score and the sequence of the Cylons hitting the Colonies, it was a complete mess.
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Aug 18, 2016 06:45
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Milky Moor posted:It probably doesn't help that BSG's last major release was The Plan. With the exception of Bear's score and the sequence of the Cylons hitting the Colonies, it was a complete mess. Wasn't that also the one that had Tigh at a bar going "YEAAAH!"? I remember liking that bit. I thought Blood & Chrome was decent for what it was. Pompous Rhombus fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Aug 18, 2016 |
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Aug 18, 2016 07:00
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koreban posted:http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/countries/master/eplist.html The order I have is a "fixed" version of that with some extra comments about some decisions - some of the lurker choices were altered or reverted. A friend of mine just watched the whole lot a couple of months ago and made some revisions. But in the end it is all just some guy's opinion, so you might as well do whatever you want.
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Aug 18, 2016 07:13
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Gromit posted:The order I have is a "fixed" version of that with some extra comments about some decisions - some of the lurker choices were altered or reverted. A friend of mine just watched the whole lot a couple of months ago and made some revisions. Sure. In the end, you start with In the Beginning/Midnight on the Firing Line and end with Sleeping in Light/Deconstruction of Falling Stars, so what's between is subjective. I followed the Lurker's Guide from back when it was hosted on angelfire or ferocities or whatever, so I'm somewhat partial to their order personally, and having seen the newsgroup posts for decades as nerds argued over it, I pretty well took it as the best that the biggest B5 nerds on the Internet could come up with.
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Aug 18, 2016 07:41
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Tigh was awesome, XO of my heart 
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Aug 18, 2016 07:51
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Well, there's this version of the order which keeps In the Beginning until pretty much the very end, presumably to keep the mystery of season one alive.
jng2058 fucked around with this message at 07:57 on Aug 18, 2016 |
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Aug 18, 2016 07:55
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Here's the Babylon 5 viewing order stuff I was given, "improved" from the original lurker choices:quote:Season 1 I haven't watched this show since it was on TV back in the mid 90s, but hope to marathon a bunch of it at some point to see how well it has held up.
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Aug 18, 2016 08:19
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Agronox posted:Also, Sinclair > Sheridan come at me bro Sinclair and Talia Winters always struck me as film noir characters.
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Aug 18, 2016 09:33
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Pompous Rhombus posted:Wasn't that also the one that had Tigh at a bar going "YEAAAH!"? I remember liking that bit. It was total poo poo and I regret watching it.
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Aug 18, 2016 15:19
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The soundtrack was rad, though.
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Aug 18, 2016 20:01
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Tighclops posted:The soundtrack was rad, though. It also had zoom in on the cock
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Aug 19, 2016 00:58
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Milky Moor posted:Start with the pilot, work your way through the various seasons in order. Watch In The Beginning after Season 4. Watch Thirdspace about mid Season-4. Feel free to ignore the other movies. This reminds me that I need to read Abaddon's Gate before the show starts up again. The first couple were great but I got a few chapters into the third and found I didn't really care about anything that was happening.
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Aug 19, 2016 04:15
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Uh...did you just dis TOS?
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Aug 19, 2016 04:27
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tooterfish posted:Uh...did you just dis TOS? Ah, I meant the "modern ones". TOS is great fun but I haven't seen the entire run. DS9/Voyager have zero redeeming features and are basically trash - Enterprise, while still not being very good, is better than either. DS9 is basically Sliders quality SciFi.
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Aug 19, 2016 04:36
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