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cinci zoo sniper posted:Okay then white people are racist against white people, gotcha. I just love quoting this: Ben Franklin posted:Which leads me to add one Remark: That the Number of purely white People in the World is proportionably very small. All Africa is black or tawny. Asia chiefly tawny. America (exclusive of the new Comers) wholly so. And in Europe, the Spaniards, Italians, French, Russians and Swedes, are generally of what we call a swarthy Complexion; as are the Germans also, the Saxons only excepted, who with the English, make the principal Body of White People on the Face of the Earth. I could wish their Numbers were increased. And while we are, as I may call it, Scouring our Planet, by clearing America of Woods, and so making this Side of our Globe reflect a brighter Light to the Eyes of Inhabitants in Mars or Venus, why should we in the Sight of Superior Beings, darken its People? why increase the Sons of Africa, by Planting them in America, where we have so fair an Opportunity, by excluding all Blacks and Tawneys, of increasing the lovely White and Red? It's as beautiful as that John Calhoun speech that establishes that the USA should not annex Mexico because it's full of mixed-bloods. Anyway, racism is always about something else than biological race, because there's only one extant biological race of humans (h. sapiens sapiens is its name). Racism is always about other differences -- language, religion, city vs. countryside, etc. Cat Mattress fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Sep 21, 2016 |
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Sep 21, 2016 21:36
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Good to see someone calling out those swarthy Swedes
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Sep 21, 2016 21:51
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Cat Mattress posted:I just love quoting this: Either way I don't care much about proper nomenclature for racism et al, it just seems unnecessary to lump all of it under one term that inherently is inaccurate to begin with, and had rather firmly retained meaning of 'hating people of different skin colour' since forever.
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Sep 21, 2016 21:56
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Discendo Vox posted:That's a form of racism. Radovan wasn't convicted of national cleansing. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Sep 21, 2016 |
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Sep 21, 2016 22:02
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Russia is unlikely to invade Sweden unless there is a general war in the region. But think of this: you have this neighbour that you have no actual quarrels with, but you know he's an rear end in a top hat anyway. Then one day you surprise him trespassing on your property, looking over the fence between you and another neighbour - one who you know is this shirtless rear end in a top hat's nemesis. When you confront him, he walks away and yells "I never was there!" At the very least you're going to install some cameras to your frontyard after that. Probably barbed wire as well.AceRimmer posted:What's the usual garrison that these 150 troops are being added to? Doesn't seem like much for such a large island if it's just them. There's been no permanent garrison force since 2005 if I'm correct, all there was between then and now was a reservist outfit - which couldn't actively keep an eye out, but back then it wasn't deemed necessary. Note that Sweden probably still isn't expecting a Russian naval infantry brigade to land on the beaches next week, at least for now they just seem to want to have some troops stationed there to secure restricted military areas and send a message because Russians have been all over the place and generally insufferable lately. Or... they are expecting something but they can't allocate more than that because Swedish armed forces is underbudgeted nowadays, so they just left a tripwire. 
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Sep 21, 2016 22:20
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orcane posted:They're pretty much all isolationists with authoritarian tendencies, yeah. Put up border walls/fences, down with foreigners, down with everything supranational, down with EU and US influence, they're not our dads! Seems to me like Putin's plan is: 1) Be as aggressive as possible without provoking an actual war with NATO. Blame your aggression on Russian fears of NATO expansion. 2) NATO is forced to respond. Putin is supporting political groups that would like to see it and the EU weakened. He's creating tension and working to undermine unity within the EU and NATO so they'll break. Serious question for Eastern European goons, if NATO and the EU ceased to exist tomorrow, who do you think would intervene if Russia invaded the Baltics? Maybe it's little green men staging a coup and referendum like in Crimea and not an open war. If Trump wins the election I could see in a decade or so the US reducing its involvement in NATO to the point it's fatally weakened, or outright leaving it. A Trump victory would give Putin far more ability to propagandize and meddle in American politics, combine that with continued involvement in overseas conflicts and I think you could very plausibly produce a much more isolationist, NATO-skeptic America. Of course, I also think Clinton is hawkish enough (and won't tolerate Putin's bullshit) that her administration might strengthen US involvement in NATO, leading to a military buildup in Eastern Europe, arms race, and second cold war. (Trump isn't going to win but if you have relatives who are US citizens, remind them how much Trump has been sucking on Putin's dick) Edit: Putin is bluffing and hoping the US/NATO/EU will fold. Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Sep 21, 2016 |
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Sep 21, 2016 22:23
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If I was Putin I'd be doing exactly what he'd doing. Constantly bother and attack your enemies, do everything you can, no matter how petty and silly, to ferment disharmony amongst the enemy alliance. There are enough useful idiots in the US and Europe to possibly break up or weaken NATO or the EU in the long term. Maybe it's a small chance, but why not try to push that along? Fund right wing movements in those countries, hell fund left wing groups too if they're anti-US and anti-nato and love Russia. Just stir the pot, troll, and even actually go to war here and there if you know no one will really fight back. If there was no NATO Putin would absolutely be doing non-stop EU4 style fabricate claims then annex over and over until eastern europe was painted his colour and he was satisfied that his borders were pretty.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:21
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Religious identity defined Balkans. You were Muslim, Orthodox or Catholic - not Bosnian, Serb or Croat. Nations and nationalism came much later.cinci zoo sniper posted:Either way I don't care much about proper nomenclature for racism et al, it just seems unnecessary to lump all of it under one term that inherently is inaccurate to begin with, and had rather firmly retained meaning of 'hating people of different skin colour' since forever. I agree. The definition of racism seems to be extending indefinitely, for no good reason. Cat Mattress posted:Anyway, racism is always about something else than biological race, because there's only one extant biological race of humans (h. sapiens sapiens is its name). Racism is always about other differences -- language, religion, city vs. countryside, etc. Except that it's not because biological differences do exist and racists do focus on them. I don't understand how you don't acknowledge that while claiming (apparently) that calling someone a hick is racist.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:23
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Pellisworth posted:Serious question for Eastern European goons, if NATO and the EU ceased to exist tomorrow, who do you think would intervene if Russia invaded the Baltics? Maybe it's little green men staging a coup and referendum like in Crimea and not an open war. Something like Crimea can only happen with decade worth of fostered animosity towards government and preexisting case for territorial independence (see also South Ossetia in the Georgian conflict of 2008). Russian communities in, say, Estonia, don't have enough power and don't suffer enough discrimination to warrant a Polite Men visit. So I don't think that the Crimean scenario is possible even under President Trump turning NATO into a racket operation. In such case, Russia would just widen its sphere of influence over Baltics with its usual political bullying.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:28
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Baronjutter posted:If I was Putin I'd be doing exactly what he'd doing. Constantly bother and attack your enemies, do everything you can, no matter how petty and silly, to ferment disharmony amongst the enemy alliance. There are enough useful idiots in the US and Europe to possibly break up or weaken NATO or the EU in the long term. Maybe it's a small chance, but why not try to push that along? Fund right wing movements in those countries, hell fund left wing groups too if they're anti-US and anti-nato and love Russia. Just stir the pot, troll, and even actually go to war here and there if you know no one will really fight back. Thing is, being that much of a pest has got to be expensive. Either you properly equip the gear your people drag into these missions, which costs money, or you outfit them with car GPS and lose a fighter plane from time to time, which costs even more money.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:33
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BTW, this is a couple weeks old but it gives you how much Putin's Russia has left to live: an chart on the remaining cash reserves, directly from the Russian Minister of Finance and the International Institute of Finance. http://www.businessinsider.com/iif-report-on-russias-economy-and-fx-reserves-2016-9  If oil was at $50/bbl, they're projections would come out the end of the year with $20 billion dollars. But oil has been around $46/bbl, so it looks like they will have between $10-$15 billion dollars and completely exhausted by May 2017. This is barring a Trump presidency that eliminates sanctions.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:41
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Isn't that just the IMF reserve? Russia's other reserves are pretty extensive and flexible.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:49
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As someone who doesn't know much about this stuff: what happens if the reserves run out?
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Sep 21, 2016 23:51
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Doctor Malaver posted:Except that it's not because biological differences do exist and racists do focus on them. I don't understand how you don't acknowledge that while claiming (apparently) that calling someone a hick is racist. Yes, the Swedes are indeed swarthy instead of white. About the hicks part: have you heard about Rwanda? Originally there were no real difference between Hutu and Tutsi, and a rich enough Hutu was deemed to be a Tutsi.
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Sep 21, 2016 23:56
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Pellisworth posted:Seems to me like Putin's plan is: Crimea happened for very obvious reasons, namely securing the port. This thread has constantly missed this basic point and it causes a lot of silly tclancy posting. fatherboxx posted:Something like Crimea can only happen with decade worth of fostered animosity towards government and preexisting case for territorial independence (see also South Ossetia in the Georgian conflict of 2008). Russian communities in, say, Estonia, don't have enough power and don't suffer enough discrimination to warrant a Polite Men visit. This guy gets it.
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Sep 22, 2016 00:10
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Cat Mattress posted:Yes, the Swedes are indeed swarthy instead of white. That Ben Franklin thought Swedes were swarthy doesn't prove your point in any way. If anything it goes against it because you brought up an example of a famous and influential person who was concerned with differences in complexion. Groups of people hate and kill each other for variety of reasons. I'm sure you can come up with plenty of examples but it again doesn't prove your claim that "racism is always about something else than biological race". Always? C'mon.
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Sep 22, 2016 00:28
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Doctor Malaver posted:That Ben Franklin thought Swedes were swarthy doesn't prove your point in any way. If anything it goes against it because you brought up an example of a famous and influential person who was concerned with differences in complexion. "biological race" isn't a thing in humans. Race is a social construct. It's always a social construct.
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Sep 22, 2016 00:34
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Discendo Vox posted:Racism.  Whoops, guess you're right.
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Sep 22, 2016 02:35
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This was posted elsewhere
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Sep 22, 2016 03:26
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Long setup but good punchline
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Sep 22, 2016 04:00
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Radio Prune posted:As someone who doesn't know much about this stuff: what happens if the reserves run out?
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Sep 22, 2016 05:17
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The Russian security services re-consolidation plan seems to have generated no major comment--every outlet that's covering it just seems to be saying something to the effect of "well, the KGB was broken up in the 90s, a lot of the offspring were in limbo for a while, and now they're being brought back into the fold under a new agency that's essentially the KGB save a shift two letters down the alphabet for the first character." Not at all inaccurate, but I guess it means there's lot's of space to promote whoever the gently caress you want to head of new First Chief Directorate-a-like departments over whoever was resting on their laurels in the dustbins of the SVR.
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Sep 22, 2016 05:57
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StandardVC10 posted:Yes! Whiteness is super loving arbitrary. Here in the United States Italians weren't white, until they were. The only ones operating with arbitrary categories of "whiteness" or "blackness" are americans, cause they're all racist. Everyone else looks at non-arbitrary ethnicity and religion, not just skin color.
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Sep 22, 2016 07:30
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Radio Prune posted:As someone who doesn't know much about this stuff: what happens if the reserves run out? In an import oriented country, a lack of Forex reserves could lead to a transactional barrier to foreign trade during times of crisis. As far as Russia is concerned, the reserves running out would prevent them from smoothing out sudden changes to rouble exchange rates.
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Sep 22, 2016 07:41
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Doctor Malaver posted:Religious identity defined Balkans. You were Muslim, Orthodox or Catholic - not Bosnian, Serb or Croat. Nations and nationalism came much later.
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Sep 22, 2016 07:57
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One of the candidates (from the far right party) in Estonian presidential elections went full Trump and claimed ("relying on certain information, but not saying which") that in Estonia there is a 5th column of 5,000 well trained young Russian men who train in paintball clubs, hunting clubs, airsoft events, sports shooting clubs and are ready to mobilize at any moment. He has very little chances to win. I feel touched by his claims because I also play airsoft, and also in games organized by the Russian community. Granted, there might be some folks with more than dubious views, but I would be very surprised if they numbered even as much as 20. jonnypeh fucked around with this message at 13:32 on Sep 22, 2016 |
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Sep 22, 2016 13:27
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So, the Supreme Court of  sustained the rejection of financial statements of Nowoczesna and Razem. In effect, Nowoczesna is losing 75% of its subvention (circa PLN 4.6 mn) and Razem gets slapped for 40k out of its 3.18 mn.[insert joke about Zandberg and 75% tax for the richest] [insert joke about businessman Petru being unable to fill out a tax form, complete with a blue border and a meercat] edit: moon language source for the interested. Lichtenstein fucked around with this message at 14:59 on Sep 22, 2016 |
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Sep 22, 2016 14:51
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What's the deal with some new anti-abortion law in the Sejm I saw some reports of? Ukraine news: Supreme Judiciary Council refuses to fire its member accused of taking a half-million dollar brie, asks General Prosecutor's office for more evidence. Prosecutor's office is also asking the parliament to strip the community MP Skorik, who used to be Odessa regional governor. Laughably, he is claiming not to be a flight risk.
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Sep 22, 2016 15:08
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jonnypeh posted:One of the candidates (from the far right party) in Estonian presidential elections went full Trump and claimed ("relying on certain information, but not saying which") that in Estonia there is a 5th column of 5,000 well trained young Russian men who train in paintball clubs, hunting clubs, airsoft events, sports shooting clubs and are ready to mobilize at any moment. Few weeks ago a group of Russian paintball players were detained by Latvian State Security police (DP) for questioning. Apparently they were wearing Russian-like uniform replicas that scared the locals and some guys had been previously marked by DP as "vocally supporting Russian aggressive military actions". Nothing directly threatening, but it would not surprise me if there was some kind of organized force behind these war-game activities.
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Sep 22, 2016 15:18
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OddObserver posted:What's the deal with some new anti-abortion law in the Sejm I saw some reports of? The same full abortion ban goons were bitching about a few months ago, just finally made its way to parliamentary voting. It (protesting) honestly gained a bit more traction than I expected, though I sadly expect it to be more of a flavor of the month thing. Then again we just had a Nowoczesna-PO twitter war on whether Donald Tusk was or was not a homophobe, so maybe things are changing in this country.
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Sep 22, 2016 15:19
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OddObserver posted:Ukraine news: Supreme Judiciary Council refuses to fire its member accused of taking a half-million dollar brie, asks General Prosecutor's office for more evidence. That must be some *amazing* cheese.
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Sep 22, 2016 15:35
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Rust Martialis posted:That must be some *amazing* cheese. I can't even imagine a half million dollar cheese. How the gently caress is a cheese worth more than all dwellings I've ever lived in COMBINED?!
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Sep 22, 2016 15:41
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I'm assuming it was a large amount, like a van load of cheese. Here in Canada cheese smuggling is actually a big deal because Canada has insane cheese protectionism. The mafia in some places found it safer/more profitable to smuggle cheese rather than drugs, which they then sell to restaurants and food supply places. The price difference between what you pay in the US vs Canada for the same imported cheese is that much to make it viable for a large black market on cheese to exist.
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Sep 22, 2016 16:50
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It's almost as if the brie was actually a bribe of some kind,.
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Sep 22, 2016 17:13
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Can't spell bribe without brie! My friend is in Sejm right now, posting about the downfall of the last vestiges of a secular society. We're gonna have it like so: if abortions were illegal only criminals would have abortions.
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Sep 22, 2016 17:25
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Pierogi posted:Can't spell bribe without brie! The only way to stop a bad guy with an abortion is to have a good guy with an abortion.
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Sep 22, 2016 17:49
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Young Freud posted:BTW, this is a couple weeks old but it gives you how much Putin's Russia has left to live: an chart on the remaining cash reserves, directly from the Russian Minister of Finance and the International Institute of Finance. Yeah, the url of that article is misleading, it is talking about primarily the budget reserve not FX reserves. The FX reserves are the actual issue but they are fairly stable, while the much smaller budget reserve (there to cushion the budget during a recession) is running out due to Russia running a 3% budget deficit. Supposedly, the solution is probably going to be higher taxes on Russia's energy industry to stabilize the budget, but we will see.
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Sep 22, 2016 18:26
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Pierogi posted:My friend is in Sejm right now, posting about the downfall of the last vestiges of a secular society. We're gonna have it like so: if abortions were illegal only criminals would have abortions.
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Sep 22, 2016 20:31
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Baronjutter posted:I'm assuming it was a large amount, like a van load of cheese. Here in Canada cheese smuggling is actually a big deal because Canada has insane cheese protectionism. The mafia in some places found it safer/more profitable to smuggle cheese rather than drugs, which they then sell to restaurants and food supply places. The price difference between what you pay in the US vs Canada for the same imported cheese is that much to make it viable for a large black market on cheese to exist. Yeah in the sketchier parts the grocery stores have the cheese section locked down like smokes/razors and in the sketchier bars crackheads will try and sell you pounds of cheeses they've lifted. The rumour a few years ago was that Fresh Slice dollar pizza was able to grow so fast and so cheaply was because he was sourcing g cheese almost exclusively through crackhead theft.
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Sep 22, 2016 21:45
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Scaramouche posted:Yeah in the sketchier parts the grocery stores have the cheese section locked down like smokes/razors and in the sketchier bars crackheads will try and sell you pounds of cheeses they've lifted. The rumour a few years ago was that Fresh Slice dollar pizza was able to grow so fast and so cheaply was because he was sourcing g cheese almost exclusively through crackhead theft. I can't tell if you're playing along with a joke or if Canada really has cheese crime. Edit: Oh my God it's real.
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