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I thought EW was rather superfluous but I loved all of Wing and I've seen since I watched it that a lot of folks don't actually like the anime's ending. So I guess I'm in the minority here. Oh well. I do love EW's ending, though. I wish I had saved it but somebody once spliced together both the OVA and movie endings set to White Reflection and it was perfect.
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May 21, 2023 19:43
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The anime's ending is fine but Endless Waltz is just a significantly more concise and coherent conclusion while also being gorgeous and well animated instead of Wing being Wing. It also significantly retools Wufei into a much more interesting character that improves the ending of Wing as a whole.
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May 21, 2023 19:52
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Heero finally having enough and telling Marimaiea "fine, y'all want violence, I'll show you what loving violence does" and then destroying the bunker, his suit, and drat near himself is some extremely good poo poo.
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May 21, 2023 20:07
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I'm definitely in the EW > Wing camp for similar reasons. It's a compact dose of all the stuff there is to like about Wing (sans Treize himself) that doesn't have to deal with all the production issues of the TV series' back half wrt plotting/character writing.Motto posted:Kyoukai Senki's whole issue is existing mainly to develop and maintain human resources for later use on Gundam for organic lack of use for mecha animation skills. Yes, but I'd be fine with them doing that with Gundam subseries like Build, given how AMAIM turned out to be. The new thing being a spinoff with some staff shakeup does give it a bit more promise but I'll wait for it to come out.
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May 21, 2023 20:17
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Is there an SRW game featuring both Wing and 00?
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May 21, 2023 20:25
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Z2 and Z3, Operation Extend, and X-Omega
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May 21, 2023 20:28
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Mind you none of those are in English and Z2 is the only one of them that's any good Endless Waltz is in Alpha Gaiden, W, and X which are all really good and 00's movie is in V which is also really good, all of which are available in English(@G & W being fan translations and V & X being official releases*) *they weren't officially released in the West but since both the PS4 and Switch are region free it's not too hard obtaining copies of the SEA region releases for them(or for T or even 30 if you want the console release for that one)
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May 21, 2023 20:41
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Good soup! posted:What does this even mean lol Arc Hammer posted:It means that a Char kick reference is the death knell of the franchise, or something. Almost exactly the opposite of what Arc posted. It's the repeated use of the same fan favorite characters and ideas to the detriment of any actual growth of the franchise or artistic expression. It's turning a franchise that should be about exploring human connection, environmentalism, and technological development concerning space into a series of comic book like references and repeated scenarios. In Reco Mask is an obvious reference to Char, but he is his own character with unique motives and experiences. Unicorns FF is in universe and out of universe a simulation of Char, his character does not exist as a person in itself but only as an idealized reflection of what "Char" means. With people calling for a remake we aren't even getting a poorly done commentary on what Char is, we're just getting Char again. Except it won't be the Char that the MSG writers came up with, it will be a Char that is filtered through the experience of the post series memetic Char. It's a series of recursive self references, characters who lose any semblance of uniqueness or novelty because they only exist as a reflection of the original. Basically turning Gundam into Late Series Simpsons, where Jokes don't exist, only references to them.
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May 22, 2023 01:56
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Have you seen G-Witch? It's pretty novel. (So were IBO and Re:Rise imo)
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May 22, 2023 02:34
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I like classic Gundam, Tomino, if anything new they make is cool for me that's just a bonus. On Sunrise in general, imagine if they had something as fresh and cool as Cowboy Bebop again today. Or even in that ballpark. I want some more cinematic unexpected and excellent stuff, and ahead of its time striking stuff like Gundam was when it first hit. But it's still fun if there's a solid new thing in a franchise, same with Star Wars, I just look at it as a bonus and don't have super high expectations.
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May 22, 2023 02:41
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Gundam good boomers bad. edit: i should clarify, Gundam good Gaius bad RevolverDivider fucked around with this message at 03:30 on May 22, 2023 |
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May 22, 2023 03:03
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i just want more cool robot explosions that cause characters to die tragically in ways that make me think (about the reality and politics of armed warfare) whether that's constructed from wholecloth original concepts or franchise tropes, i can't say i particularly care one way or the other
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May 22, 2023 03:17
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RevolverDivider posted:Gundam good boomers bad. My parents are boomers, early 60s, they're really cool! Gundam is also cool. Tomino was pushing 40 when Gundam hit, so that's cool, people are cool.
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May 22, 2023 03:23
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Rewatching Wing now and I want Prospera and Treize to be insane together in an SRW game. That's my only Gundam wish outside of a Frozen Teardrop adaption that's good.
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May 22, 2023 05:54
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g witch is real good!!
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May 22, 2023 07:36
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Tulalip Tulips posted:Rewatching Wing now and I want Prospera and Treize to be insane together in an SRW game. That's my only Gundam wish outside of a Frozen Teardrop adaption that's good. put treize in a room with literally anyone from any tv show ever and i am interested in seeing how that plays out
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May 22, 2023 13:25
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Tulalip Tulips posted:Rewatching Wing now and I want Prospera and Treize to be insane together in an SRW game. That's my only Gundam wish outside of a Frozen Teardrop adaption that's good. Put Rau Le Crueset in that room as well and we have something 'cookin.
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May 22, 2023 13:46
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I want a SRW game where Suletta meets Puru
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May 22, 2023 13:57
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i want to see eri and ein have a chat
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May 22, 2023 14:29
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ninjewtsu posted:put treize in a room with literally anyone from any tv show ever and i am interested in seeing how that plays out Trieze would somehow get Columbo to confess to murder.
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May 22, 2023 14:59
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Gripweed posted:I want a SRW game where Suletta meets Puru EVEN SO, I'd want Suletta and Marida to meet up first.
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May 22, 2023 15:36
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El5n dropping by the Cyber Newtype clubhouse
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May 22, 2023 15:43
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Zedd posted:Put Rau Le Crueset in that room as well and we have something 'cookin. It's real hard for me to think of anyone who could match Rau pound-for-pound on the madness chart.
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May 22, 2023 20:51
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Wing still has a high degree of nostalgia value. It was really the first Gundam thing I saw and it will forever hold a special place in my heart as a result. I think it deserves a lot of credit for basically just going bonkers with everything. The hero suit? Yeah we're gonna blow it up in the first 1/3rd of the series. Oh the nice guy? Yeah he won't be a voice of reason instead going criminally insane for a while before we overnight fix that to return the status quo. Who is the villain? Who can say it changes about every 10 episodes or so. What will this heroic pacifist woman do? Buy into a suicide pact with crazy protag who will only wear bike shorts. Really its biggest production drawback is the enormous amount of reused footage for fights. When they want to the choreography can be very slick (basically any Gundam v Gundam sequence; Wing v Tallgeese, Zero v Epyon, Altron v Tallgeese 2) and then to accomodate all the other stuff, enjoy the same exploding Leos for 40 of 50 episodes. Its certainly not the best Gundam, but its got a solid floor for Gundam entertainment. EW has some cool designs and otherwise I find its grounded story to be kinda boring in comparison to the bonkers TV show. The Notorious ZSB fucked around with this message at 21:30 on May 22, 2023 |
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May 22, 2023 21:13
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The Notorious ZSB posted:The hero suit? Yeah we're gonna blow it up in the first 1/3rd of the series. It doesn’t get blown up, its pilot self-destructs it while he’s still standing on it. Absolutely unhinged.
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May 22, 2023 21:18
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2LwpNaZzTA Although my favorite will always be Relena introducing herself to the thin air occupied by Heero many, many seconds before she started speaking, Heero having dashed off to steal an ambulance in the meantime. (and we see him driving the ambulance later) So good. Wing is such a weird series and I think that's a big part of why I love it. I think the dub only adds to this with the strange sort of..."dry(?)" performances from most everyone. Most everyone has this super dramatic weight to everything they say. I duno how to describe it but I can safely say it stands out among every other Gundm dub I've heard, just like Wing in general stands out. You cannot deny it's uniqueness, for better or worse. I guess I love Wing and its dub because of how delightfully straight everything is played. The show takes itself 100% seriously. And while I think there are legitimately interesting ideas and characters in Wing, it's still a goofy fuckin' show so meeting that head-on and never blinking is great.
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May 22, 2023 21:31
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I would say the performances elevate the material from hamfisted and dumb to an extremely fun melodrama
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May 22, 2023 21:33
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Yeah the full sincerity of the hammy Ocean dub makes it very entertaining.
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May 22, 2023 22:09
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i can understand someone not finding the rest of the show terribly appealing but the first 3 episodes are undeniably an insane rollercoaster of melodrama, a true pinnacle of human artistic achievement
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May 22, 2023 22:15
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I like Wing, but I never got what Treize's point was, or what made him so honorable.
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May 22, 2023 23:06
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Treize is the kind of guy who heard Char's ruminations on how minovsky particles and mobile suits have brought back the imagery of knightly duels to warfare and his takeaway is "hell yeah, knights and personal honor is loving awesome!"
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May 22, 2023 23:12
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Treize was basically echoing what was a common opinion in upper class Europe before WW1; a bit of war is good for the soul. People are at their finest on the battlefield, facing down danger with nothing but cold steel and a massive warmachine.
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May 22, 2023 23:25
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Fivemarks posted:I like Wing, but I never got what Treize's point was, or what made him so honorable. Same. Even as a big Wing defender, I've been more than a bit confused by this. Both Treize and Dorothy are very much "war is based" for most of their appearances, then their final goal is to put an end to war. Dorothy I can maybe get, she's traumatized and unhealthy, but Treie is the philosopher so he should have a consistent position. But hey, Treize's response to Wufei traditional "heroic outrage" question of "do you know how many people have died because of you?" is still one of the greatest moments in anime history. A friend of mine a long time ago was talking about some other villain, maybe Dagoth Ur in Morrowind, and saying how refreshing it was to have a villain who didn't just go "who cares!" and laughs evilly. Treize is the same way. His response is so unique and beautiful, one of the legitimately best moments of Wing in terms of writing and voice-acting. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 23:32 on May 22, 2023 |
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May 22, 2023 23:30
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Treize is fascinating cause while he is definitely one of the main antagonists in Wing I really can't call him a villain in the traditional sense
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May 22, 2023 23:40
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at soem point i had a handle on what treize's philosophy was but that has since escaped me he had actual reasoning for liking war, or at least he could build the honorable knight deal from first principals in his ability to articulate the position.
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May 23, 2023 00:13
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Spelling Mitsake posted:Have you seen G-Witch? It's pretty novel. Up to the Investment Party, I found it pretty lethargic and decided to just wait until the whole thing was wrapped before spending any more time on it. Warmachine posted:It's real hard for me to think of anyone who could match Rau pound-for-pound on the madness chart. Crossbone's Big Bad is up there. Having all his people branded, hoarding millions of gallons of water for himself while letting his people nearly die of thirst, sending nuclear equipped Death Angel robots to cleanse the earth of earthlings. Real madlad
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May 23, 2023 00:20
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Gripweed posted:Treize was basically echoing what was a common opinion in upper class Europe before WW1; a bit of war is good for the soul. People are at their finest on the battlefield, facing down danger with nothing but cold steel and a massive warmachine. In the narrow European focus they had a very flimsy point that professional armies of upper class twats prevented the sort of total war of the Napoleonic era, at the same time justifying their existence for about 100 years.
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May 23, 2023 00:23
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War and Pieces posted:In the narrow European focus they had a very flimsy point that professional armies of upper class twats prevented the sort of total war of the Napoleonic era, at the same time justifying their existence for about 100 years. This is not a very accurate picture of Pre WWI armies. Mass Mobilization was the name of the game for every power except the British, and even the core standing army was professional, but not class bound except in the ranks of officers. A large amount of the reason Germany decided to force a war during the crisis is because they understood that any general European war would force them to fight on both fronts, and that the demographic growth of Russia during the period and the supposed reforms following the Russo-Japanese War meant any putting off the war would only result in worse chances of a German victory. Nobody in Germany could have counted on the complete loving incompetence of Russia in the early stage of the war.
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May 23, 2023 00:34
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Gaius Marius posted:This is not a very accurate picture of Pre WWI armies. Mass Mobilization was the name of the game for every power except the British, and even the core standing army was professional, but not class bound except in the ranks of officers. The German plan did rely on relative Russian incompetence. They didn't want to fight on two fronts, so they planned that if they were the ones to start the war they would have a head start on mobilization. It would take the Russians like twice as long as everyone else to get their army ready to go fight, so the Germans could take that time to go beat the French with their clever scheme of using Belgium as a corridor to get in behind where the French expected, and then turn around and face the Russians
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May 23, 2023 00:49
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The German plan relied on them being less quick to mobilize and to move their troops given the lack of railroads and general geography. It did not account for the German army to 6-1 and 10-1 casualties on the Russian army like it did at Tannenberg and Masurian Lake.
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May 23, 2023 00:59
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