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JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.

The best advice is to go visit them during the class time you're interested in. Any decent place will be willing to let you watch and talk to you. And if it's not what you're after, they may be able to recommend you a place that will interest you.

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Xguard86
Nov 22, 2004

"You don't understand his pain. Everywhere he goes he sees women working, wearing pants, speaking in gatherings, voting. Surely they will burn in the white hot flames of Hell"

Upper level guys are also very good at forcing you into their pace and game. Since higher level guys are usually older than lower level guys, that generally means slower.

However,I have met a couple bb s, young or very athletic, who will bait scrambles and high speed rolling because they can capitalize on that.

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.

Taratang posted:

Higher belts are going to shut you down regardless, dial it back a notch and you might figure out a thing or two about how they're doing it.

I'm not saying you should never go hard or hesitate in going for subs but if you focus less on proving yourself and more on understanding the positions/transitions you'll see your game come along much more quickly.
Some of the best advice. Keep things slow so you can problem solve and not cover up mistakes. Designate a time at the end of class or one workout a week or whatever for "go time."

One thing I like to do is go very slow and talk out exactly what you are doing. Your partner's job is to do the same and follow along. You'll find a lot of superfluous movement and learn to cut it out. Your partner can also give you great feedback about where your weight is, when he feels vulnerable (and you may not notice it), etc.

I worked out with Henry Akins about a week ago when he was visiting some friends here. We did just that, super slow, and it was a blast and I learned a lot.

JAY ZERO SUM GAME fucked around with this message at May 7, 2012 around 19:57

Lucificate
Jan 4, 2005


whatspeakyou posted:

Are there any goons here who have any experience at the Capitao MMA gym in Fort Walton Beach, Fl? I've pretty much never been in a fight in my life, but picking up either BJJ or Judo as an athletic hobby is something I'd be interested in. Curious how legitimate the classes are and how newbie-friendly the instructors are.

Weird to see this pop up randomly in this thread considering FWB isn't a big town or anything.

I train there and I think another goon or two trains there as well. The BJJ instructors are Danny Ruiz (black belt/de la Riva) and Daniel Silva (black belt/de la Riva/Marcelo Grosso). Danny does MMA as well and heads up MMA instruction. We have many active amateur fighters on the MMA side and regularly compete in local BJJ tournaments. Danny is more about self defense, Daniel more about sport BJJ. they are legitimately skilled and roll with the class regularly. No "untouchable sensei master" stuff.

The BJJ classes and MMA classes are separate. Mostly gi, Fridays no gi. There are separate judo classes and if you intend to advance in belt rank in BJJ they require judo proficiency as well(Blue belt was 10 throws or so). Separate wrestling classes once per week as well run by a guy named Eric Flinchum and he is a beast. Won NAIA 285lb class in 2007. He has only been training here a couple years but tests for his purple belt in a couple months and is phenomenal at BJJ.

Well this is getting detailed. I think its newbie friendly? There are no separate newbie classes but everyone will help you out (while tapping you out). You can come try it out for I think a week and see if you like it. I leave work in an hour to head there myself =)

02-6611-0142-1
Sep 30, 2004



Fitocracy forums posted:

While in theory I know the broad principles according to which the "advanced" biomechanics of some styles (Taiji quan, bagua zhang, xingyi quan, southern mantis, baji quan, bei shaolin quan men's iron palm, etc) work, I do not have first hand knowledge of how each style develops those principles, or of how exactly each style applies them, in a biomechanical sense.

This thread is an open invitation to all CMA stylists who work with such things as neigong and high-level fajing, to describe, in their own words, how their respective styles develop internal skills, what those skills are, how those methods help develop said skills, and how the skills are then used when applied.

Of particular preferences are descriptions made using kinesiological information, physics, and logical explanations, while avoiding literally interpreted analogies, metaphors and woo-woo. Things such as "We train this to relax the lower back musculature without contracting the rest of the abdominal wall" are good, whereas things like "We do not use muscle to move" are not. similarly "This is explained as positively affecting qi flow" is acceptable, more so if you explain how such a position is advantageous in a purely physical sense, but just saying "You do this to stimulate qi flow" will result in me storming off and complaining to my mom, who will write you an angry letter pretending it's from the United Nations.

Proceed.

"I RODE HERE ON A UNICORN FROM ATLANTIS. LET'S DISCUSS THIS RATIONALLY, PEOPLE."

http://www.fitocracy.com/forum/topic/11310/

Gix
May 18, 2008

Hail Eris.
Everything changes.
Keep me in flux.
I am the calm center of Chaos.
All hail Discordia.

I am not going to respond to that post with anything about wearing turtle shells or locking my energy up in chi-spirit-cuffs. I am NOT.

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

He is I, and I am him


Eh, it's a legit if spergy request. As I've said before, there are some legitimate principles behind power generation in CMA. He's looking for an ethnography of the MAs, I guess, with stuff like this:

quote:

"This is explained as positively affecting qi flow" is acceptable
Basically, he's saying: if you know that the martial art is taught with some mystical mumbo jumbo, it's fine to mention that. But only if you back up the actual technique with actual biomechanical arguments.

I'm trying to find a Bajiquan manual where it shows a punch technique where you "uncoil" all your muscles at once.
Here it is:

The left shows the dropping/gravity component of a strike, and the right shows the coordinated uncoiling. There's nothing magical here -- if you sink into the punch and combine your muscle movements, you get power.
Some more of the basic power training methods, but the page is registering some sort of malware in Chrome:
http://crane.50megs.com/index2.html

kimbo305 fucked around with this message at May 8, 2012 around 02:37

Paul Pot
Mar 4, 2010

by Y Kant Ozma Post


sittin in a lunge position just waiting to uncoil myself listening to some wu

Nierbo
Dec 4, 2010

Go for the take him down!

Lets watch a 1994 video of a wing chun guy vs a kickboxer. Is this what point fighting is? Yelling STOP after every major contact?

gimpsuitjones
Mar 27, 2007

What are you lookin at...

No, that's pointless fighting

Greg Jackson
May 2, 2006



The ref is taking a half point for excessive body contact!!

Xguard86
Nov 22, 2004

"You don't understand his pain. Everywhere he goes he sees women working, wearing pants, speaking in gatherings, voting. Surely they will burn in the white hot flames of Hell"

That looks like it was written by a 13 year old. I see what he's trying to do but it's pointless. Without all the inscrutable orient crap, it's all just really basic principles combined with poor training.

Office Sheep
Jan 20, 2007


I tried submission wrestling for the first time last night. It is very different from gi bjj and judo I am used to. I also don't like being neck cranked and that happened. My neck is very sore this morning. I will give it another chance but think I will stick to my pajama sports.

TheKingslayer
Sep 3, 2008

There are no men like me. There's only me.

Lucificate posted:

Weird to see this pop up randomly in this thread considering FWB isn't a big town or anything.

I train there and I think another goon or two trains there as well. The BJJ instructors are Danny Ruiz (black belt/de la Riva) and Daniel Silva (black belt/de la Riva/Marcelo Grosso). Danny does MMA as well and heads up MMA instruction. We have many active amateur fighters on the MMA side and regularly compete in local BJJ tournaments. Danny is more about self defense, Daniel more about sport BJJ. they are legitimately skilled and roll with the class regularly. No "untouchable sensei master" stuff.

The BJJ classes and MMA classes are separate. Mostly gi, Fridays no gi. There are separate judo classes and if you intend to advance in belt rank in BJJ they require judo proficiency as well(Blue belt was 10 throws or so). Separate wrestling classes once per week as well run by a guy named Eric Flinchum and he is a beast. Won NAIA 285lb class in 2007. He has only been training here a couple years but tests for his purple belt in a couple months and is phenomenal at BJJ.

Well this is getting detailed. I think its newbie friendly? There are no separate newbie classes but everyone will help you out (while tapping you out). You can come try it out for I think a week and see if you like it. I leave work in an hour to head there myself =)

Sweet more BJJ goons in the Gulf Coast. I live just over in Mobile and am really considering heading over for the tournament in Pensecola in two weeks. Too bad I'm kind of trash at gi compared to no-gi.

Thoguh
Nov 8, 2002



02-6611-0142-1 posted:

"I RODE HERE ON A UNICORN FROM ATLANTIS. LET'S DISCUSS THIS RATIONALLY, PEOPLE."

http://www.fitocracy.com/forum/topic/11310/

Fitocracy is awesome. Their forums though are only worth checking out for comedy. Especially the MA subforum.

The Martial Arts Goons group is up to around 85 people, I think. It is cool to see everyone's workouts and it makes me feel bad any time I miss a practice and can't log it.

Drewjitsu
Sep 2, 2007

Muay Thai is great but Buttscoot-Shin-to-Balls Style is undeniably better.


Office Sheep posted:

I tried submission wrestling for the first time last night. It is very different from gi bjj and judo I am used to. I also don't like being neck cranked and that happened. My neck is very sore this morning. I will give it another chance but think I will stick to my pajama sports.

Stick with the no-gi stuff! Neck cranks will dissappear as you get better, because people realize they're stupid, and in the case of can openers, you can armbar the poo poo out of people as they do them.

No-gi is much more flow-y than Gi BJJ. Stick with it, and I hope you'll love it like I do!

attackmole
Dec 15, 2007


I'm thinking about hanging up a heavy bag in my basement, but I ain't much of a DIY guy. How the hell do you mount one of those things? I've looked at free-standing bags, but I like the hanging ones way better than wavemasters and stuff like that.

Greg Jackson
May 2, 2006



attackmole posted:

I'm thinking about hanging up a heavy bag in my basement, but I ain't much of a DIY guy. How the hell do you mount one of those things? I've looked at free-standing bags, but I like the hanging ones way better than wavemasters and stuff like that.

This thing, I guess you drill it into a stud and it swivels. You want to put one of those heavy duty springs on the chain between the bag and the mount so that it doesn't get shocked as much.

attackmole
Dec 15, 2007


Cool, thanks. I'll take a look around and see what could work. I was talking about it with my coach today and he was kinda pushing me towards getting a free standing one, or at least one that hangs from a stand because apparently they can be super noisy if you jack em straight into a ceiling which might not be the greatest while I still live with my folks. Also he's paranoid cause he beat the hell out of his old one and it ripped the rafter down with it after a year or so, but I ain't putting it past him that he might have hosed up the setup for it.


I know a wavemaster would be the easiest option, but I like my bags to have some resistance to em.

Greg Jackson
May 2, 2006



Well if you're in the basement it's probably a better idea to use the stand because then all the noise gets transferred into the floor rather than the ceiling, which will be heard by your parents upstairs.

gimpsuitjones
Mar 27, 2007

What are you lookin at...

I hate bags on stands. Bolt it to the ceiling.

the yellow dart
Jul 19, 2004

King of rings, armlocks, hugs, and our hearts

whatspeakyou posted:

Are there any goons here who have any experience at the Capitao MMA gym in Fort Walton Beach, Fl? I've pretty much never been in a fight in my life, but picking up either BJJ or Judo as an athletic hobby is something I'd be interested in. Curious how legitimate the classes are and how newbie-friendly the instructors are.

Instructors are pretty cool, dudes are pretty cool, I'm pretty cool, and the school is a pretty good time. If you like BJJ, MMA, or Judo you'll find a niche here. Good mix of military and non-military, but no weirdness regardless. Danny and Daniel are great instructors, and over the past 2 years I've been there we have begun to get a great mix of blue/purple/brown belts that we didn't have previous. It's a great gym with a real friendly atmosphere where you become part of the family.

Edit: BJJ is at 6 PM every Monday (gi), Wednesday (gi), and Friday (no-gi), 10 AM on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday (all gi), judo at 6 PM on Tuesday and Thursday, with MMA at 7:30 on Tuesday, Wednesday, Friday, and MMA training/free roll beginning at 11 AM on Saturday. Come on in and we'll choke you...from the Internet!

the yellow dart fucked around with this message at May 9, 2012 around 02:54

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

He is I, and I am him


My friend in Brooklyn marveled that his old apt had a heavy bag in the gym, and that no one has been bothering him about using it late at night. I said it's probably cuz no one wants to bother the guy hitting the heavy bag.

KingColliwog
May 15, 2003

Let's go droogs

Haven't posted here in a while. Anyone else has trouble doing judo/whatever martial arts they do during the summer? My regular club is affiliated with the university and we don't have classes during the summer. The vast majority of judo club in my area just don't give classes during the summer. There's only one club, but it's further away and I can only go 1x a week. So I basically try to focus on conditionning during the summer. What about you guys? Do you just train the same way all year long?

Currently working on my drop Seoi, getting great results and I love how well it combines with my other techniques (Ko uchi Gari mainly).
Also trying to come up with a strategy for people who are going backward all the time, what do you do against them? I can sometime get them with my Ko Uchi, but if they manage to stay far away I have a lot of trouble doing anything.

Bohemian Nights
Jul 14, 2006

We uninspired
We unadmired
And tired and sick
of being sick and tired

Yeah, I've noticed the trends of clubs shutting down in the summer. I live in a student town, so it happens here too since a lot of the people who train either go home or go on vacation- but we usually keep training with a skeleton crew anyway. Thankfully, there are a couple of dedicated fightnerds in my club who'll even be training on the day before Christmas (and so far, I've been one of them).

I haven't been using a cup in forever, but last night while training I tapped myself out by taking someone's back. Anyone considered going eunuch to deal with this problem once and for all?

Also, speaking of punching bags, my roomie has set up the most hand-made speedbag in our living room. It could only be more orkish if it had spikes on it.
From the top down, it's a bit of curtain rope holding up a hoodie containing an american football, that's attached to the strap of an old camera bag, grounded on a 8kg kettlebell. It works surprisingly well!


Sorry about the lovely cellphone pic quality and the mess. And.. please don't tell anyone how I live.

Kekekela
Oct 28, 2004


I got cracked in the nose really hard with an accidental elbow Monday night while sparring, and my nose got pretty swollen up yesterday. I just woke up this morning after taking last night off, and I've got a black eye to go with the swollen nose...is this kind of delayed reaction common or do I need to look into alternate theories as to how I got a shiner in my sleep?

Taratang
Sep 4, 2002

Grand Master

That's not unusual after being smacked in the nose.

Guilty
May 3, 2003
I AM IN A DIFFICULT AND UNENVIABLE SITUATION AND I AM WORKING IT OUT THROUGH HONEST AND OPEN COMMUNICATION


Kekekela posted:

I got cracked in the nose really hard with an accidental elbow Monday night while sparring, and my nose got pretty swollen up yesterday. I just woke up this morning after taking last night off, and I've got a black eye to go with the swollen nose...is this kind of delayed reaction common or do I need to look into alternate theories as to how I got a shiner in my sleep?

Blood flow got hosed up, might want to get it checked out

Xguard86
Nov 22, 2004

"You don't understand his pain. Everywhere he goes he sees women working, wearing pants, speaking in gatherings, voting. Surely they will burn in the white hot flames of Hell"

It's normal for that kind of delay. The blood drains to under your eyes but it can take time for it to get there.

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.

KingColliwog posted:

Currently working on my drop Seoi, getting great results and I love how well it combines with my other techniques (Ko uchi Gari mainly).
Also trying to come up with a strategy for people who are going backward all the time, what do you do against them? I can sometime get them with my Ko Uchi, but if they manage to stay far away I have a lot of trouble doing anything.
I was working on something like this last night. I'm not sure how this will translate to writing, but here goes.

If I'm attacking with kouchigari, I have to go all out. When the foot I want of uke's is forward, I drive with my back foot, focusing on pushing my hips in as close to him as possible and keeping posture best I can. Usually my hips end up low, close to his knees. My forward, reaping foot then does a motion a lot like a side fall, taking away that leg of uke's (keep your foot low to the ground, pinky toe dragging). I drive my HIPS through his; so my leg is taking away his base, my hips are driving down through his. Pushing with your arms will gently caress this up, as you'll push back and give him time/reason to step with his other foot. Focusing on his hips and dropping down will negate that.

I think about making a circle: my forward reaping foot comes straight toward me, my hips go forward and down. If you're going down to the ground with him, tuck that head.

When you do this, if you shoot your attacking foot in very deep and he steps out of it, bring your other foot up and you're in a good spot for hip throw of your choice, and drop seoinage would work. What I've found is that I actually end up throwing it off of the other side of his hip, which sucks (for him).

You may end up having to learn to do kouchigari on your non dominant side, too. All ashiwaza should be learned this way, in my opinion.

Nierbo
Dec 4, 2010

Go for the take him down!

Wow I'm an idiot. I thought he meant drop seoi first and then ko uchi

Bangkero
Dec 28, 2005

I baptize thee
not in the name of the father
but in the name of the devil.


attackmole posted:

Cool, thanks. I'll take a look around and see what could work. I was talking about it with my coach today and he was kinda pushing me towards getting a free standing one, or at least one that hangs from a stand because apparently they can be super noisy if you jack em straight into a ceiling which might not be the greatest while I still live with my folks. Also he's paranoid cause he beat the hell out of his old one and it ripped the rafter down with it after a year or so, but I ain't putting it past him that he might have hosed up the setup for it.


I know a wavemaster would be the easiest option, but I like my bags to have some resistance to em.
I dabble in some woodworking as a hobby and was debating on putting up a heavy bag in my condo. I was thinking of putting up a beam similar to this (but longer): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rMj...feature=related

Do you have an unfinished basement? It would be easier to reinforce the ceiling stud with wood blocks if you're worried about the shaking the house. You can also lay down a rubber mat between the stud and the swivel/eye bolt and use rubber washers with the screws to keep vibration down.

Here's another option: http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f67/t...-review-458691/

rhazes
Dec 17, 2006
Midas!

mewse posted:

This thing, I guess you drill it into a stud and it swivels. You want to put one of those heavy duty springs on the chain between the bag and the mount so that it doesn't get shocked as much.

I have this mounted onto a beam in my garage, unfortunately with a 6" MT banana bag, so no clearance for a spring. I replaced the nuts and bolts with much larger ones (cost me maybe $5) to improve the strength and used LockTite to prevent them from unwinding... but it works fantastic.. some noise in the rest of the house though (or so I'm told ). I don't imagine it'll fall down or break my house.. and besides, I'm (only?) 70kg.

I'll take a pic later, actually, I guess I should share with you guys something of note.

whatspeakyou
Mar 3, 2010

no fucks given.


the yellow dart posted:

Instructors are pretty cool, dudes are pretty cool, I'm pretty cool, and the school is a pretty good time. If you like BJJ, MMA, or Judo you'll find a niche here. Good mix of military and non-military, but no weirdness regardless. Danny and Daniel are great instructors, and over the past 2 years I've been there we have begun to get a great mix of blue/purple/brown belts that we didn't have previous. It's a great gym with a real friendly atmosphere where you become part of the family.

Edit: BJJ is at 6 PM every Monday (gi), Wednesday (gi), and Friday (no-gi), 10 AM on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday (all gi), judo at 6 PM on Tuesday and Thursday, with MMA at 7:30 on Tuesday, Wednesday, Friday, and MMA training/free roll beginning at 11 AM on Saturday. Come on in and we'll choke you...from the Internet!

Once I get back from my trip in the beginning of June, I think I'll check it out. It's been in the back of my mind for months but I've never pulled the trigger. I think Goons have sold me, especially if the atmosphere is as good as you guys describe. Thanks!

CivilDisobedience
Dec 27, 2008


JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

I was working on something like this last night. I'm not sure how this will translate to writing, but here goes.

I'm confused! It sounds like you're talking about following up a ko uchi makikomi http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmJpLabg6Xk with a hip throw, but that doesn't make sense. Of course, it's standard practice to go back and forth between ko uchi gari and ippon seoinage since the defense to one is the opening for the other, but when it comes to their sacrifice variations, drop seoi and kouchi makikomi, you shouldn't be able to follow up immediately because you've already 'sacrificed' your balance during your entry. What holds you up while you bring your back foot forward to fit in for the hip throw after they step your ko uchi? Are you posting with your ko ouchi-ing leg or hanging on their lapels or something to keep from falling over? Also, you caution that pushing with your arms is a mistake, but generally kouchi involves a ton of arm action, since you have to 'turn the steering wheel right' to keep their weight on the stepping foot. I wonder if you might be just making a deep penetration step to position yourself for the drop seoi and calling it a ko uchi?

E: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyQp...feature=related First clip in this is the only exception I can think of to the "can't follow up a drop seoi" rule, but that's not a genuine attempt at drop seoi, so it's a wash

CivilDisobedience fucked around with this message at May 9, 2012 around 20:09

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.

I am not just positioning myself for seoinage. I want that kocuhigari, but if uke reacts well enough that it's going to be too much work, seoinage is probably a good option. There are a lot of things that live off a failure of advancing kouchigari.

Should uke step out of the kouchigari before you begin the kake part of the throw, you place your weight on that foot then you bring your other up to prepare for the hip throw. This is possible because you're shooting in with your foot low to the ground, not way up by the knee. The driving with the hip happens as you reap with the foot (and that driving is the kake). If you've begun to reap his foot (dragging your little toe, hooked behind his ankle), you've only done it because he has not been able to step out. You'll know if you have the throw BEFORE you begin the reap. The huge part of this is that if he is even remotely successful at avoiding the beginning of the kouchigari, gently caress it and move on.

Your video shows a great kouchimakikomi. If Hiraoka had not been able to get his foot behind uke's, then he could have moved on to what we're talking about here and pulled his foot/hip up for the shoulder throw. He had options before he actually reaped (not necessary though, of course).

I'm generally cautioning against pushing with your hands. What Hiraoka does is great, he does more of popping uke's arms up to get his head under (your head can be over, too, though) and a moment of kuzushi. Hands can be more useful with kouchigari if uke is advancing. Do not use uke as support.

This kouchigari doesn't HAVE to end in makikomi, but it's a likely outcome in competition. If you're working in some sort of sacrifice of your own balance to that degree before kake... I would advise not doing that.

CivilDisobedience
Dec 27, 2008


Ah, that clarified for me, thanks. Sounds like you do the Koga-style advancing kouchi/seoi. I usually do more of a lateral kuzushi for that combo, like Bridge in this vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCxfdhqYljU Get the opponent rocking back and forth with the 'conductor' motion, opposing their natural walking rhythm, and then throw when they sync up with you. I feel like the real advantage of this method over the advancing version is that the opponent has a harder time countering- they have to read your intention and anticipate instead of just being able to react and try to keep distance between their hips and yours.

CivilDisobedience fucked around with this message at May 10, 2012 around 01:22

Christoff
Jun 18, 2004
I WILL NEVER BE A MARINE NO MATTER HOW MUCH THE GREEN WEENIE VIOLATES ME

Anone have any experience with this? Doc at work says its a Calcified Hematoma. Probably shoot an X-ray here soon.

I got it when I first started Muay Thai about 2-3 months ago. I got an elbow I think in that area and then it bruised up pretty good. Didn't help that I was beating on it after that. I only do MT 1-2 times a week at the most. And have had extended breaks, like 2-3 weeks from it. I try to avoid hitting it and I massage it a lot. It's pretty solid. Of course after a session it'll flare up then the swelling slowly goes down but I always have the lump. I really don't want to stop training. It doesn't impede anything that area is just a little more painful on contact.



niethan
Nov 22, 2005

Don't be scared, homie!


Yeah you just get that poo poo from kicking peoples legs. It shrinks down a bit and hardens out and stops hurting. Give it a couple of weeks to do that though. Put some anti-inflammatory cream on it

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Ligur
Sep 6, 2000

You just don't
understand
how the society goes around!


KingColliwog posted:

What about you guys? Do you just train the same way all year long?

My club is open 4 days a week. A lot of people stop training (indoors) between june-august and take long vacations so it makes sense to run fewer classes.

However we're one of the few clubs that have, say, boxing during summer which means we get a little drift from other clubs which close up.

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