|
An ex of mine saw the ads for MGS4 Tactical Espionage Action and sent me an MMS of the poster with text that said "this looks like the kind of bullshit you'd like."
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 06:58 |
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2013 04:27 |
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:To be fair, the name "Metal Gear" itself is fairly nonsensical. What do you mean those are the first words that come to mind for a nuclear equipped walking battle tank.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 07:00 |
|
|
Anything sounds right as long as you express it with an interrobang. METAL GEAR!?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 07:26 |
|
|
Walking Nuclear Robot Solidus
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 07:54 |
|
|
J Bjelke-Postersen posted:An ex of mine saw the ads for MGS4 Tactical Espionage Action and sent me an MMS of the poster with text that said "this looks like the kind of bullshit you'd like." Video games are awesome.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 07:55 |
|
|
Metal Gear Solid 2: The game that taught me that a solidus is a thing. More to the topic though - it seems like a lot of those all black videos have conspiracy bullshit hidden in them.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 08:01 |
|
|
Still waiting on a Plasma and Gas Snake.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 08:43 |
|
|
Full Battle Rattle posted:More to the topic though - it seems like a lot of those all black videos have conspiracy bullshit hidden in them. They're not from the official channel though. http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJdu2_Nn_OW7yzwCAKC_maA
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 08:45 |
|
|
S-Alpha posted:Edit: Also, this thing was posted too: This seems promising...who knows morse code?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 09:32 |
|
|
Facepalm Ranger posted:This seems promising...who knows morse code? Again, that's a fake channel.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 09:36 |
|
|
Facepalm Ranger posted:This seems promising...who knows morse code? It says: [DISCLAIMER] Moby Dick Studio and our representatives do not currently operate through any social medias such as Facebook or Twitter, except for YOUTUBE. >> Moby Dick Studio Official Youtube Channel Really though, it's "BOSSISREADY".
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 09:49 |
|
|
The GIG posted:Again, that's a fake channel. 
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 10:43 |
|
|
aniero posted:Can someone remind me: was Paz a psychic or shown to have any "powers"? I thought she was simply a spy for Cipher. All we know of Paz is that she's a trained agent who knows how to pilot complicated machinery, use scuba equipment, and presumed by Big Boss to be efficient with guns. She's never shown to have any real physical prowess, but then again, the whole time she was pretending to be a helpless girl so who knows. I guess in one of the tapes she was fit enough to play soccer with the men of Mother Base. That's about it.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 12:31 |
|
|
I have a dilemma. I seem to have only two options and both are somewhat unpleasant. I would like some input from you, my fellow speculators. --- My situation is this: I have a hypothesis regarding a major event in the series. This hypothesis, if correct, explains an incredible amount of the story. After completing MGS1, MGS2, MGS3, POOPS, MGS4, and MGS:PW, I shared this hypothesis with a friend and they replied "I thought that was obvious." But so had I. However, over the past two years, I've periodically looked into online discussions of the issue at hand to see if anyone had put forth this same hypothesis in a clear way. I have been unable to find any example of the available evidence compiled into a straight-forward claim. As many of you would agree, our toying with wild speculation is half the fun of anticipating a new installment in the series. This creates my dilemma. Remaining silent in regards to a compelling piece of evidence is terribly frustrating. I think others will enjoy discussing these possibilities as we eagerly await the next game. On the other hand, it seems volatile to reveal (even as spoiler text) that piece of evidence to the detectives of the vicious internet meme-machine before the issue is inevitably addressed in-game. It feels like it could be the equivalent of whispering to the person next to you in a theatre while watching The Sixth Sense that you've figured out that "Bruce Willis Is A Ghost" knowing that the person behind you is likely to overhear and shout it to the rest of the audience. Or, like what I'm told I did in my younger days - leaving the theatre after seeing E.T. and saying loudly to my parents as we passed the people waiting in line "It was so sad when E.T. died but then it was happy when he came back to life because Elliott loved him so much!" Another part of the dilemma is that it requires that I make one of two difficult assumptions: if everyone has this thing figured out and has chosen to stay quiet, it assumes that the members of the general population of video gamers on the internet care about preserving the firsthand experience for other gamers. (This assumption relies on the altruism of the internet.) If the reason everyone is quiet about this is that nobody else has figured this out, it assumes I was the only one to put together all the pieces of the puzzle. (This assumption feels uncomfortably egotistical.) Of course, it goes without saying that there is no peace of mind for me in assuming that I'm completely wrong, but the other two assumptions both seem equally unlikely. Because misery loves company, I think that if I knew that I was not alone in my frustration, then I could wait out the looming release of MGS5. I can't imagine that this issue would be left unaddressed for another entire game. However, I also couldn't imagine that so much of the overly-analytical fanbase would be able to play the complete series thus far and not share my hypothesis... so who knows? --- These are my questions: Can speculation be spoiler? Is speculation all in good fun until someone gets it right? Do any of you share this dilemma? Is there anyone else here that is stewing in their conviction that they have solved a mystery of this series yet have decided to keep it to themselves for the sake of the gameplay experience of the general audience? Should I assume that I'm right and keep it discreet so others can figure it out for themselves, or should I get this off my chest and offer the hypothesis up for discussion? --- Thanks for your patience with this wordy post. In short: I have a secret. Do I kill it or spill it?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 13:15 |
|
|
Share it, MGS is such a heavily discussed series that if it was really obvious like you say someone would have discussed it and already said why it's wrong/right.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 13:22 |
|
|
Go for it, it's only going to be using information avaliable to us already. Unless you have an uncle working at Konami.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 13:30 |
|
|
mortalwombat posted:In short: I have a secret. Do I kill it or spill it? You're over-thinking this way too much. Just tell us.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 13:45 |
|
|
I'll edge my bets on this being a new enfant terrible, maybe even a Solidus prototype; and he's having seizures from Big Boss's memories because of shared gene memory.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 14:12 |
|
|
If fan speculation somehow manages to give away a mystery that is the fault of the creator.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 14:33 |
|
|
Man, you hyped the poo poo out of your 'secret'. If it turns out to be bullshit you're going to look pretty dumb.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 15:56 |
|
|
12/12/12 - 12:12 First off, if you haven't played Peace Walker, stop reading this now and go play Peace Walker. Secondly, Kojima said at PAX that the next game will recreate the feelings of MGS1. If you want to feel those feelings again during your gameplay experience of MGS5, stop reading this now and go play MGS1. Thirdly, I apologize for so much spoiler text, but it's the only way. Let's begin. --- What conclusion did you come to when you first heard Peace Walker's "The Phone Call"? People on discussion boards bicker back and forth about who "Unknown" is. Some say it is Miller, and some say it is Ocelot. Nobody seems to have considered they are the same person. SPOILER IMAGE: Did you like my sunglasses? --- TIMELINE: -1943: The Joy and The Sorrow conceive a child. -1944: Normandy, France. Ocelot is born via caesarian section and taken by the Philosophers. -1964: Ocelot meets Big Boss, who says "You're pretty good." before Ocelot passes out after being bested in combat, likely for the first time. -1964: Ocelot has phonecalls with the CIA and KGB. -1964: Ocelot retrieves the KGB half of Legacy from Volgin. -1970: Ocelot works with Gene to frame Big Boss for the San Heironymo Incident. -1970: Ocelot retrieves the CIA half of Legacy from the DCI. -1970: Ocelot has phonecall with Zero. Agrees to form the Patriots on the condition that Big Boss joins them. -1970: Ocelot disappears for ~30 years until he joins FOXHOUND. -1972: L.E.T. Project. Solid and Liquid are born. Big Boss parts ways with Zero. Big Boss now unlikely to join Zero and Ocelot. -1972: Miller joins Big Boss after being bested in combat in Colombia. -1974: Miller tells Big Boss that they can put "all that San Heironymo crap" behind them. -1974: Miller says "No skeletons in my closet." when interrogated by Big Boss on the beach. -1974: Miller says "You always were my..." when interrogated by Big Boss on the beach. -1974: Miller admits to awareness that Paz was working for Cipher(Zero). Omits that he is also working for Cipher(Zero). -1974: Player can earn "WAC Coordinator" Insignia for forming an all-female MSF Team. -1974: Miller has phonecall with Zero. Mentions Langley(CIA), Lubyanka(KGB), and "The Sons"(L.E.T.) and a site near Angola. -1974: Miller completes his mission for Zero and organizes the creation of the original PMC and assembly of 4 AIs with the Rushmore initials. -19xx: Miller joins FOXHOUND. During his career, he mentors and trains Solid Snake. -1999: Miller aids Solid via codec during the Zanzibar mission. -1999: Miller retires to Alaska after a ~30 year career with MSF and FOXHOUND. -2000: Ocelot joins FOXHOUND after a ~30 year hiatus. -2005: Liquid pretends to be Miller to manipulate Solid. -2005: Ocelot's right hand is severed by Frank Jaeger. Cries out "MY HAND!" without his gruff inflection. -2005: Ocelot says to Solid Snake. "Your brother...he's an amazing man." and "He is the one man who could make my dream into a reality..." -2005: The key required by Liquid and Ocelot is three forms of the same key. Cold/Hot/Medium. -2005: Liquid reveals his deception and says the fourth-wall breaking line "Did you like my sunglasses?" -2005: Liquid Snake dies from exposure to the FoxDie virus. -2005: A body is discovered in Miller's home. -2005: Ocelot has phonecall with Solidus. Says "No, sir. My cover is intact. Nobody knows who I really am." -200x: Ocelot has his severed hand replaced with the hand from Liquid's body. The surgery takes place in Lyon, France. -2007: Ocelot's psyche is disturbed by the dead hand of Liquid. Possibly because of a trait inherited from his father, The Sorrow. -2009: Ocelot works with Solidus to frame Solid for the Big Shell Incident. -2009: Ocelot says "I never trust a Frenchman." in response to Solidus talking about the hand transplant surgery in Lyon. -201x: Ocelot removes Liquid's hand and replaces it with a cybernetic one. -201x: Ocelot maintains the illusion of Liquid's control in order to mislead the Patriot AIs. Nanomachines/hypnosis reinforce the act. -2014: Ocelot runs a PMC called Outer Heaven and has a replica Rushmore on their flagship with the Snakes' faces. -2014: The key required by Liquid Ocelot is three forms of the same DNA. Solid/Liquid/Solidus. -2014: Ocelot forms an all-female team on Outer Haven. -2014: Ocelot suppresses the nanomachines that maintain the Liquid persona and prevent his death from FoxDie. -2014: Ocelot kisses Solid on the cheek during a grapple and says "Snake..." -2014: Ocelot tells Solid. "I am Liquid's doppelganger and you are his." -2014: Ocelot fights Solid. Says "You're pretty good." before dying after being bested in combat for the final time. -2014: Big Boss tells Solid "Cats do love to play as snakes." --- Notes: "I am Liquid's doppelganger..." Liquid pretended to be Miller in MGS1 to manipulate Snake, so it's perfectly fitting that Ocelot did it first in PW and will continue to do so in the upcoming MGS5. This idea explains Liquid Ocelot's access to such impressive infrastructure. They built it over the last 30 years. He trained Solid Snake in CQC and survival. He helped Solid Snake take down Big Boss, perhaps reluctantly. Ocelot steps back into his old role just as Sigint and Paramedic are eliminated. Zero can do nothing from his vegetative state, so Ocelot needs only to fool the AIs. He may have been ready to use REX to destroy the orbiting satellite during Shadow Moses. (I have two ideas, depending whether or not Ocelot planned Frank Jaeger's involvement.) I don't want to further convolute this post by discussing my ideas about how the switch took place, but it obviously hinges on the body found in Miller's home in Alaska. What a great coincidence that Shadow Moses and Miller's home are so close... and that FOXHOUND had an agent who could imitate another person right down to the blood... The real question is how far back was this planned? Kojima may have planned this scheme from the beginning, or managed to tie together the loose ends and plot devices in place after the first 2 games. It's a safe assumption that this was in the works at least as far back as the Subsistence re-release of the MSX game Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake. Miller's portrait was modified to strongly resemble Ocelot. Well, that's all I've got to say about that for one post. Thanks for reading. Thoughts? edit: fixed typo/spelling errors and removed Solidus from the 1972 event. mortalwombat fucked around with this message at Dec 13, 2012 around 14:31 |
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 16:12 |
|
|
That is a pretty compelling argument. I suppose MGS5 will try to explain the main gray area in that timeline - what happens after PW and before MG1/2? Where does Ocelot split with Zero and start working off his own program? Another thing - do you think Big Boss knew he was working with Ocelot?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 16:30 |
|
|
I doubt Kojima planned it that far in advance. Besides, BB would have noticed. Then again, he couldn't recognize EVA when she brushed her hair back.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 16:36 |
|
|
Spermando posted:I doubt Kojima planned it that far in advance. Besides, BB would have noticed. Then again, he couldn't recognize EVA when she brushed her hair back. Well to be fair I don't think Big Boss paid that much attention to EVA's face.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 16:40 |
|
|
Good argument, there's enough there that the hypothesis fits, but also enough for it to just be 'Kojima-isms' in the sense that he likes to re-use motifs/ideas/words and it's all just a big coincidence. I really like this idea though, it's definitely a strong argument, nice picture collage too!
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 16:48 |
|
|
I really wish I could say that Ocelot wouldn't do something like that, or Kojima wouldn't write that, but I really can't.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 17:15 |
|
|
Pretty believable speculation! It really sounds like something that would actually happen. I can definitely get behind it since we also know that Ocelot is fairly adept at doing the old Cam Clarke/Liquid/Miller voice, at least in his later years.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 17:23 |
|
|
It definitely holds water man. My only real reservation towards the extended version of your theory is that they use a different voice actor entirely for Kaz in Peace Walker. I could see them recasting it for a significant age jump like with Big Boss at the end of 4, but this would be under 10 years from the first encounter with Big Boss in Peace Walker, and changing voice actors and his entire appearance is difficult but plausible I suppose and it's just the kind of misdirection Kojima would use. But somehow Big Boss not noticing any shared mannerisms or anything makes it super suspect. Kaz doesn't use a revolver at all to my knowledge, and that would be a huge part of his character to put on hold for 30 years. I know Big Boss is no Sherlock, but to miss their similarities if they are prevalent would be a major oversight. Good write up. 50/50 on the odds I think. Lots of supporting evidence for, but also many blatant misdirections/contradictions if we assume it's true. Most of the rest of the events and connections though I think are pretty widely accepted as being how things went down among fans. Especially most of your info on Ocelot's lineage and stuff.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 17:25 |
|
|
It's also worth noting that the one game Ocelot isn't in, Miller is a main character.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 17:50 |
|
|
While I like the theory because it bolsters 4's "Ocelot is the greatest manipulator of all time" angle, there's a few problems. Why would Big Boss completely fail to recognize Ocelot when he showed up as Miller? Ocelot's a pretty memorable guy. Then, during Miller's career with FOXHOUND, Ocelot is supposed to be in Russia, building a Rep as the KGB's master interrogator. Then Solid Snake encounters Ocelot, completely failing to notice that this talky, old-west rear end in a top hat is actually his trusted friend and mentor. Also, Miller's body being discovered. Decoy Octopus was already busy being the corpse of Donald Anderson/SIGINT. I like the theory thematically, it just requires more logical leaps than the ending of MGS4, what with Ocelot being the world's greatest disguise artist without "decoy" in his name, and able to co-locate. On the other hand, the various Snakes can be super-oblivious at times. My personal pet theory about MGS explains all the bosses, and also how Solid and Liquid can be clones of the same guy, but express Dominant/Recessive traits differently. It's an alternate universe where genetics works the same as in X-men. Spontaneous useful/magical mutations just show up and are effective immediately.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 18:47 |
|
|
Didn't the Japanese voice actor for Ocelot die, hence the whole Liquid Ocelot thing? I don't think we're going to see anymore of him.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 19:14 |
|
|
According to this page he's had four different Japanese voice actors and two English (young and old) so I don't think that's the reason.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 19:17 |
|
|
Closet Cyborg posted:Also, Miller's body being discovered. Did you identify the body yourself? Could have been just Ocelot passing along the identity to Liquid. I don't think that "but Snake would have recognized him!" is a compelling argument. The argument itself is that Snake didn't recognize him.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 19:49 |
|
|
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLb6NPKWQ5g Someone edited the cuts in the PP trailer into chronological order. It definitely helps piece together a progression of events.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 20:11 |
|
|
skywalker6705 posted:Kaz doesn't use a revolver at all to my knowledge, and that would be a huge part of his character to put on hold for 30 years. Well he was supposedly faking/mindbending the entire arm possesion era so it's not like he couldn't do it.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 20:12 |
|
|
I kinda hope that mortalwombat's theory isn't true though. Metal Gear has been fun and entertaining for me because the focus has been on the theme of the game (meme/scene/whatever) and the drama and the urgency of the moment ("The Metal Gear is gonna launch!") rather than the complications of the canon itself. Lots of people laugh at PW for the plot being dumb, but I thought that the idea itself of combining the nuclear deterrence theory and Metal Gear with an AI was fun and a even clever, even if the execution was little silly. MGS4 was a game I never really liked because it's focus was just on explaining every issue of the canon and forcing all the characters of the series into it and giving them something to do. None of the characters MGS are too deep and Kojima really can't even write stuff like that (Paz's diary entries in PW are just loving childish and horrible) so every time Kojima makes a game I hope that he is taking it lightly with the soap opera. Crazy and cheesy conspiracy plots with some kind of political intrigue is what Kojima does best and hopefully it's something he sticks with. Not too many games do stuff like that and I've always thought that it's one reason why MGS is so popular. The point of Big Boss and The Boss is that they both are so charismatic leaders that they just attract people to follow them whether they want it or not (which, by the way, is a trait that has to be told to the audience rather than us experiencing it through the actions and behaviour of BB and The Boss. This underlines the fact that Kojima can't write about people with depth) so I think it would be better that BB first gets the attention of Ocelot and then Miller (if they are the same person it just means that BB got only one true follower rather than two, which is a little underwhelming. Even The Boss gets the attention of two, first Snake and then Strangelove who can't get her out of their head). It helps to create the picture of BB being as charismatic as we've been told. I also find it funny that the attraction towards BB and The Boss has gotten more and more sexual as the series goes forward: In MGS3, it's underlined that the relationship between BB and The Boss is something other than sexual (When EVA asks Snake if he lobes The Boss, he answers that it's nothing like that) but in MGS4 Ocelot is pretty gay towards BB and PW has even more that by having Strangelove being extremely attracted towards The Boss and Miller being a little gay towards BB, even though it's being established that he really is an ladies man. Why bother having their leadership skills being something out of this world if it just goes back to regular love? Kinda weird.
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 20:40 |
|
|
Closet Cyborg posted:Also, Miller's body being discovered. Decoy Octopus was already busy being the corpse of Donald Anderson/SIGINT. Just to note - I wonder if maybe it could be explained that the body wasn't Decoy Octopus impersonating him, but rather Octopus having applied his disguise techniques to another person, likely an unwilling one? That could work (and be immensely horrifying at the same time).
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 20:47 |
|
|
Who's to say that there wasn't a body at all, but just Ocelot pulling some strings so his Patriot buddies gave Campbell the call telling him they found Miller's corpse?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 21:00 |
|
|
What in the world is "WAC" supposed to stand for in the insignia you can get for forming an all-female base? Women All-Crew?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 21:23 |
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2013 04:27 |
|
|
Willsun posted:What in the world is "WAC" supposed to stand for in the insignia you can get for forming an all-female base? Women All-Crew?
|
| # ? Dec 12, 2012 21:28 |
|
