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JerryLee posted:What do you mean it makes no difference? It'd be really weird for it to be impossible to properly thin your (acrylic) paints with water, since that's what basically everybody does. Are you sure you're just adding the water a tiny bit at a time? Like sometimes stirring the paint with a wet brush is the extent of water you want, depending on the original consistency of the paint of course. Basically I mean it seems impossible to dose it right. Could be that I wash my brush too often because I don't want paint drying onto my brush. Would probably help to get an empty dropper bottle for water. Now that I think about it I guess part pf the problem is that when I can actually see that the paint is thinned it's at wash thinness.
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Aug 4, 2014 10:37
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Rinsing the brush ought to be fine, as long as you blot off any huge excess droplets after. I'm going to say that if you're actually adding whole drops from a dropper, you might be going too far right there--thinning the paint really doesn't involve as much as you might think. Try just using a brush that's damp, but without any big globs of water hanging off it, and stir the paint up with that. I mean, it also depends on what volume of paint you're trying to thin. I'm assuming you're only using a few drops of the paint at a time on the palette?
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Aug 4, 2014 10:40
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JerryLee posted:Rinsing the brush ought to be fine, as long as you blot off any huge excess droplets after. I'm going to say that if you're actually adding whole drops from a dropper, you might be going too far right there--thinning the paint really doesn't involve as much as you might think. Try just using a brush that's damp, but without any big globs of water hanging off it, and stir the paint up with that. I guess it could be that I'm too eager to layer stuff before it's dried, making it gunky and me thinking my paint wasn't properly thinned. Maybe I actually thinned enough then, I would usually take like a tiny drop with my brush when I've been using GW paints, since I would always scoop a kinda large blob of it onto my wet palette. I'm actually going to buy the vallejo equivalent of one of my core colours in my scheme, since it's a light colour to be layered over black it's the one where I kind think I'm messing up and making it blobby. The droppers are so much more nice though.
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Aug 4, 2014 10:47
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GW paint tends to be thicker than reaper or vallejo, but it still should be overkill to dribble a bunch of water into it, unless you're trying to work with too much paint at once. What colors are you trying to work with, incidentally? It's my experience that lighter colors/whites are a lot harder to reach that nice spot where it goes on evenly and smooth but isn't so thinned out that it feels watery like a wash.
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Aug 4, 2014 10:55
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Zenithal Priming: Or how to shade + highlight like a BOSS - - - - - Ask yourself a question: Do you like saving tons of time while painting? Do you think its impossible to do highlights and sick nasty shadows on your horde army because "it takes too long"? Do you want an easy way to get good effects with little effort? Are you looking at a quick way to improve your painting? Do you hate layering? Well my friends, Zenithal Priming is your answer for fast, easy, great highlights and shadows. Best of all everybody can do it. I seriously can't think of an easier way to get a good looking army tabletop ready than the 100% BULBASAUR approved Zenthial Priming method. What the hell is Zenital Priming? Zenithal Priming is priming your model with 3 colors instead of just 1. I mean, if you're cash strapped or lazy you can get away with using 2 colors, but 3 gets best results. You'll apply black, grey, and white primers in a way that creates a gradient effect from the shadows to the upper most areas. Then you'll go over it all with a translucent paint that acts like a filter. After that you can paint the rest like normal. What do I need? 
Can you break it down for me?  Here's what I'm going to do:
I primed some spare mans I had lying around with vallejo black primer. This is an airbrush primer that's great right out of the pot, but I still thin about 5:1 (primer:water) to make sure I get very thin layers.  Then I hit the upper 90 degrees of the models with grey primer, thinned as above.  The Zenithal Effect is starting to become apparent- things look different depending on the angle with obvious highlights and shadows taking shape:    The last step is hitting the upper 45 degrees (basically just the very top with a little bit of wobble side to side) with white primer:  Looking good!  I bet it looks like poo poo If you're using an airbrush or spray-on basecoat, then you can just spray over the top with a thin layer:     But I don't have an airbrush or spray-on basecoat! No problem, just use a wash instead. I actually like these results better, since washes will shade the recesses even more (for xxx pro MLG painting you could use BOTH a spray-on paint and wash. Just make sure all the layers are really thin):     But BULBASAUR! My special snowflake color doesn't have a wash! Zenithal Priming is useless for me!!!! Then its time to MAN THE gently caress UP and use your paint as a glaze. Seriously, just thin your paint more than usual with water and add some flow improver/gloss varnish (about 4:1) and you'll get fantastic results:     Ok, I am convinced, but what else can I use Zenithal Priming for? 
BULBASAUR fucked around with this message at 10:59 on Aug 4, 2014 |
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Aug 4, 2014 10:55
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JerryLee posted:GW paint tends to be thicker than reaper or vallejo, but it still should be overkill to dribble a bunch of water into it, unless you're trying to work with too much paint at once. Right now I'm using GW Tallarn Sand for the under armour stuff on my Tau fire warriors. Using army painter matt black primer.
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Aug 4, 2014 11:02
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Urge to buy airbrush... rising.
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Aug 4, 2014 11:31
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BULBASAUR posted:Can you break it down for me? This is the most helpful graphic I've seen on how to do zenithal priming, and your examples are great too. On my site I've done a few step-by-step posts, but I've only shown the follow-up with airbrush. Showing it with a wash/glaze & brush painting is great too, for folks that only have spray cans to work with.
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Aug 4, 2014 11:52
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bokbok posted:Can anyone tell me this guys name? I wanna google finished models. That's the old GW Daemon Prince kit, it's a fun model!
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Aug 4, 2014 11:58
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Dr. Red Ranger posted:So I'm out on clinical rotations now and have more or less time to work on these depending on what my boss wants, but I've been slowly working my way through my Nice work, man. I always really dig your stuff!
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Aug 4, 2014 14:24
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LingcodKilla posted:I've really switched from GW to Vallejo Game paints and I couldnt be happier. Better bottle design was the major reason after losing so much paint to drying out. I think this is the key in paint recommendation. P3, Citadel, and Vallejo all have good paints, but GW has so many problems (intentional?  ) with their jar designs, you're better off with either of the other two. It's pretty sad that I have opened Citadel paints from the late 80's (good God I'm old) that are still just as good as when I bought them, and yet have jars of Citadel paints a couple years old that are factory sealed and completely dried out.The only caveats I have for Vallejo (and I think PP uses the same dropper design) is that I do get pigment gumming up the top of the dropper. I have to pop the top and get in there with a brush end or toothpick and clean it out on a regular basis. I do not store my paints cap side up though, so it's probably just an issue for me. Also, Vallejo paints tend to separate - make sure you shake the hell out of them before use. I tried the "attach the bottle to a drill and spin the gently caress out of it" but that didn't work for me. I may try a rig on an oscillating sander and see if that works...
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Aug 4, 2014 14:44
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Sistergodiva posted:Really informative, thanks! Ok, this is a mistake that I made - matte medium is basically paint without the pigments, if that makes sense. You add it to increase the transparency of your paint, which is great for layering, but it doesn't thin the paint! For that, either use water, or Vallejo does make a Thinner medium which you can use. I've experimented with it a bit but honestly I can't tell any difference between it and what water does. I bought an eyedropper from a drug store to use when adding water to paint to thin it. It makes it way easier to add tiny amounts until you get a consistency you like.
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Aug 4, 2014 14:45
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evenworse username posted:For that, either use water, or Vallejo does make a Thinner medium which you can use. I've experimented with it a bit but honestly I can't tell any difference between it and what water does. I want to say it feels like the vallejo thinner is less likely to separate, and easier to incorporate.
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Aug 4, 2014 14:54
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So I have an airbrush that is a bit gunked up with dried paint because I have been lazy about properly cleaning it when I finish using it. What is the proper solvent to soak all the parts in to get the paint off without harming the airbrush? Could I use turpentine or should I use something weaker?
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Aug 4, 2014 17:33
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Acceptableloss posted:So I have an airbrush that is a bit gunked up with dried paint because I have been lazy about properly cleaning it when I finish using it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1EsQozxEjM
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Aug 4, 2014 18:05
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I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask but here we go. Does anyone know how big the Space Wolves wolf wolves are in relation to the Sabertusks from the Ogre Kingdoms line? How would they look on a cavalry base? How about the Thunderwolf Space Wolves wolf wolf when compared to Ogres themselves? I could probably sculpt them non-cybernetic legs. I'm going for a Kislev theme with my Ogres, and I think wolves would look better to go along with their big furry hats.
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Aug 4, 2014 21:56
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thespaceinvader posted:You know what will help you bypass your fear of doing handpainted lettering? Yeah... I know, you're right. I'm just lazy and don't want to admit it. Getting the yellow on the shoulder pads nice and bright took ages and fixing mistakes'd be a nightmare. Part of me worries that I'll look at the finished miniatures and I'll like everything but my lovely little hand drawn numbers. On that note, the tiny little numbers I ordered arrived and I tried them out on the goblins. They're not perfect (not the orciest of fonts), but they're pretty neat and will at least make for a consistent team. I'll definitely try some hand-drawn tests too but, I dunno, are these alright? 
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Aug 4, 2014 22:09
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Those look awesome, especially as it's raised up from the surface. Feels more orky than decals. v: Totally, if I didn't know they were brass-etch I'd have thought they were sculpted onto the model. ijyt fucked around with this message at 22:30 on Aug 4, 2014 |
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Aug 4, 2014 22:12
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Those look like they were made for that mini to be honest
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Aug 4, 2014 22:15
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Yeah, that looks really orcy, I really love the metal look of them, really makes them look orcy and you don't even think about the font being kinda neat for an orc.
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Aug 4, 2014 22:24
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berzerkmonkey posted:I think this is the key in paint recommendation. P3, Citadel, and Vallejo all have good paints, but GW has so many problems (intentional? I've heard that about the Vallejo dropper bottles, but I have some straight pins (the type with a "head" at one end) that I bought for pinning some things together that were too small for even a paperclip, so I should be able to use one of those to poke and clear the tip on one of the Vallejo bottles. Regarding the Vallejo paints separating, I think I should be able to pry the tip off, and drop in some "agitators" to help mix 'em back up? I have some small lava beads I bought for that purpose to use with the craft paints (I bought those and some 20ml dropper bottles, and just mixed the craft paints up with a 50/50 mix of Future Floor Polish and distilled water), so I would think they'd also work OK for Vallejo's stuff too (plus I still have some empty dropper bottles, so I could probably decant any P3 or GW paints I decided to buy into those too, now I think of it). Sydney Bottocks fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Aug 4, 2014 |
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Aug 4, 2014 22:41
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Sistergodiva posted:Yeah, that looks really orcy, I really love the metal look of them, really makes them look orcy and you don't even think about the font being kinda neat for an orc. It looks like whatever essential human irrigation system they looted for sports equipment was conveniently numbered.
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Aug 4, 2014 23:48
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BULBASAUR posted:Zenithal Priming: Or how to shade + highlight like a BOSS Thanks for this, I'm guessing it really only works for monochromatic models or at 2-3 color models you're only going to paint with glazes?
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Aug 5, 2014 00:22
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BULBASAUR posted:Zenithal Priming: Or how to shade + highlight like a BOSS I use this technique as well, but the issue I run into is that its only good for the primary color, and still end up fiddlying with layering etc on sub components that are different colors. Because we have to use a wash / tint in order to maintain the zenithal highlighting its too messy to do for more than a single base color. Take an Infinity character for example, they are usually multi-colored and have tons of straps, pouches etc. What do you do for these? A full step by step image guide of how you handle this kind of thing would be nice.
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Aug 5, 2014 00:45
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Sydney Bottocks posted:I've heard that about the Vallejo dropper bottles, but I have some straight pins (the type with a "head" at one end) that I bought for pinning some things together that were too small for even a paperclip, so I should be able to use one of those to poke and clear the tip on one of the Vallejo bottles. I've heard of people using agitators, but I haven't been able to find any that I'd put in the bottles. I hear that BBs would work like a charm, but can discolor paint as they oxidize in the bottle. I guess Reaper (?) used to sell little agitator skulls, but I don't think they carry them anymore.
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Aug 5, 2014 00:45
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berzerkmonkey posted:It's not so much that the nozzle clogs (though you get that too) but the pigment collects in the nozzle assembly. Think of it like coring a pineapple - you ca punch out the center, but there is a hell of a lot of stuff remaining. Most BBs I've found cause rust, make sure you get copper coated ones. http://www.amazon.com/Crosman-Copperhead-Copper-Coated-Bottle/dp/B000HKKY7M/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1407196132&sr=8-2&keywords=bbs The problem with something that small is that it will get pulled into the nozzel, but if you tap it on the desk it comes right out.
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Aug 5, 2014 00:48
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berzerkmonkey posted:I've heard of people using agitators, but I haven't been able to find any that I'd put in the bottles. I hear that BBs would work like a charm, but can discolor paint as they oxidize in the bottle. I guess Reaper (?) used to sell little agitator skulls, but I don't think they carry them anymore. These are the lava beads I used in my homebrew craft paint dropper bottles: Real Black Lava Round Beads 6mm / 15.5 Inch Strand I forget where I read about them but it was definitely on a minis-painting related site, I think they may have even been discussing Vallejo's paints specfically. I put one or two in each bottle and have been able to agitate the cheapo craft paints with 'em pretty well. I would think they could do the same for other dropper bottle paints (Vallejo, Reaper, etc.), too.
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Aug 5, 2014 01:22
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LumberingTroll posted:I use this technique as well, but the issue I run into is that its only good for the primary color, and still end up fiddlying with layering etc on sub components that are different colors. Because we have to use a wash / tint in order to maintain the zenithal highlighting its too messy to do for more than a single base color. Nothing says that you have to use the same color glaze across the whole model. Zenithal priming just gives you an easy shortcut to a unified light source. It stops you from doing the whole job with an airbrush, but you're not painting a 200-man blob of space marines up for Infinity. As long as you're careful with your brushwork, you can make basically anything work out correctly with it. Take this epic Krueger model from Hordes that I painted a few years ago now:   Everything except the metals (armor and spear head) was painted using thin glazes over what was frankly a really crappy two color (no grey) zenithal basecoat (my rattlecan primer had some orangepeel problems and I needed him for a tournament, so I ran with it). I did a little bit of additional color work on the face, but nothing major. I think overall this model took me about 2 hours, and he looks better than some of the models I've spent 4+ on. Even if you don't use a lot of glazes, zenithal priming gives you a guide for blocking in highlights and shadows, and further helps you out with that by subtly affecting the general vibrancy of the paint that goes on top of it. Colors applied over white primer are a lot easier to have bright than colors over black primer. An example of that from me would be the epic Borka I painted in June, which again uses a 2-tone rattlecan primer job, but is painted mostly using a combination of wet-blending, two-brush blending, and traditional basecoat, thinned highlight, thinned shade, unifying wash-type painting. 
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Aug 5, 2014 01:24
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Thanks for the kind words paintergoons.Macdeo Lurjtux posted:Thanks for this, I'm guessing it really only works for monochromatic models or at 2-3 color models you're only going to paint with glazes? You get the most striking results on models with a single primary color, but it’s entirely possible to paint several colors if you apply washes and glazes carefully. Bottom line- is more than 40% of your model a single color? Then you can prime Zenithaly to save a bunch of time. LumberingTroll posted:I use this technique as well, but the issue I run into is that its only good for the primary color, and still end up fiddlying with layering etc on sub components that are different colors. Because we have to use a wash / tint in order to maintain the zenithal highlighting its too messy to do for more than a single base color. Agreed- once you have models with lots of contrasting colors (instead of complimentary ones) this technique becomes more time consuming. You still save lots of time on your base coat though, especially if the majority of your theme is one dominant color. The first question I ask is if its ok to use the filter color as the undercoat for some areas. If its a dark color like navy, black, or a complimentary color like yellow onto of a shade of brown the answer is almost always ‘just paint over it’. For complex color schemes like my Iron Warriors, I mask off the areas and spray several times using different colors. Depending on the extent, this can be really time consuming, but still less annoying than layering white/yellow 100 times across 30 models. I’ll do a full on “how I paint using all my crazy techniques” one of these days.
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Aug 5, 2014 01:25
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My wife was taking pictures of food, so I stole some time with a decently sized lightbox and snapped photos of some of my recent desk-painting endeavors:   
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Aug 5, 2014 03:27
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Testing new photo setup with some quick and dirty Cyclops Savages. Edit: more testing. Trollblood Scattergunners + Unit Attachment.      
Fyrbrand fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Aug 5, 2014 |
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Aug 5, 2014 03:32
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moths posted:That's the old GW Daemon Prince kit, it's a fun model! Thank you! I think I've put more time into optimising my setup than actually painting so far. I forgot to pick up a new can of primer tonight so instead I just made a tiny lazy susan to put in my primer box and spray without taping. Way too excited to try it out.
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Aug 5, 2014 06:18
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Rad, not normally a fan of the Spacewolves aesthetic but you've made this look cool as hell baller as always 
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Aug 5, 2014 08:02
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Crossposting from the 40k thread, I wanted to run this idea of mine by folks. Basically, using the body of a Khorne Berserker backpack with the sides of a regular Mk VII backpack to create something that looks plausible as a variant on a Mk IV-V pack. Part of a project to convert some Heresy-ish marines on the cheap. Aside from the minor misalignments and the fuzz I still need to trim away, does it work? Thoughts? Suggestions?
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Aug 5, 2014 08:52
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LumberingTroll posted:Most BBs I've found cause rust, make sure you get copper coated ones.
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Aug 5, 2014 13:43
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Thanks! I even already have simple green.
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Aug 5, 2014 14:42
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Going back to the paint agitator question, I'm starting to wonder if BBs are going to have enough weight to properly agitate the paint. That got me thinking and I came across these on Amazon: Semiprecious stone beads in both 4mm and 6mm size. The hematite beads are the cheapest, at $3.49 for a strand of 65 6mm beads, $4.50 for a strand of 100 4mm beads. I guess the benefits of the stone would be 1) weight; and 2) zero chance of rust or a weird reaction to the paint. I'll have to measure a Vallejo bottle neck to see what size bead I would need to buy.
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Aug 5, 2014 15:21
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Why not just wash off some small driveway gravel? Edit: Aquarium stones are probably better still. moths fucked around with this message at 15:41 on Aug 5, 2014 |
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Aug 5, 2014 15:39
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Or like, just don't be a baby and shake the poo poo out of your paint bottle.
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Aug 5, 2014 15:47
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I use faceted glass beads I got from ebay, a bag of 200 for pretty cheap. Just use whatever you can find, there's no precise exact requirement (except for something that doesn't rust)
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Aug 5, 2014 16:01
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