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Can you send non-candid snaps of your cock and balls? Asking for a friend.Spangly A posted:Julie Burchill is like a caricature of what MRA's think feminists are. I dunno. Sociopaths are superficially charismatic.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:11
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Isn't the sociopath thing a myth? I've only known one, from before he was diagnosed as ASPD, and he always seemed creepy and off to me. Of course, with literally the smallest sample size possible that might not hold up in general.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:18
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Quite possibly, I'm just making a joke at Burchill's expense. v vProbably more like sociopaths can be (and those are the ones that get into government and industry).
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Sep 27, 2014 21:21
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Example of pretty good nationalism: The SNP and scots who wanted Yes to win. That's not so hard, Red Vadul, I don't see what your problem is. Scots thread leaking, on the other hand, IS terrible. I can't really see how we're supposed to be Better Together, tbh.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:30
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KazigluBey posted:Scots thread leaking, on the other hand, IS terrible. I can't really see how we're supposed to be Better Together, tbh. Clearly we need to have a poll on the new UKMT 
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Sep 27, 2014 21:37
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Extreme0 posted:Clearly we need to have a poll on the new UKMT UKMT federalism now, with devolved posting rights and a written constitution
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Sep 27, 2014 21:38
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The Scotland thread got closed so this thread is the appropriate place to post Scottishly. Anyway, towards the end the independent thread was nothing but unionists being smug about the result.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:40
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KazigluBey posted:Example of pretty good nationalism: The SNP and scots who wanted Yes to win. That's not so hard, Red Vadul, I don't see what your problem is. The SNP supporters keep claiming they're not an homogenous group. Are you saying this is false?
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Sep 27, 2014 21:41
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All nationalism is bad because it assumes that borders are magical. We can't fix Britain but we can fix Scotland because leftism can somehow exist north of this invisible boundary. Too bad Carlisle and your incompatible alien culture. American exceptionalism is horrible but they do have 15 carrier battle groups to back it up. What does Scottish exceptionalism have to show? A lost vote for independence and a resurgent Tory party. Well done you useless turds.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:42
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Regarde Aduck posted:What does Scottish exceptionalism have to show? A can of Special Brew and a dog on a string. No but really though, they do have an exceptionally low life expectancy. Which is the silver lining to Coohoolin.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:44
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KazigluBey posted:Example of pretty good nationalism: The SNP and scots who wanted Yes to win. That's not so hard, Red Vadul, I don't see what your problem is. I suppose at the heart of it I'm just confused. London and the Southeast keeping as much money as they can and looking solely to their own interests is very bad and detrimental to the poorer regions of the UK but Scotland keeping as much money as they can and looking solely to their own interests is very good, it is still viewed as detrimental to the poorer regions of the UK but I think it is now meant to be a good thing? Perhaps the poorer rUK regions are meant to bootstraps? As a left wing person I view the benefit of all as the key goal and given Nationalism privileges a minority over the rest I view that as bad. Certainly the status quo often causes left wing groups to work within nations but surely pushing to create and strengthen national divisions is just making problems worse, even if you claim to be creating divisions for a left wing cause?
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Sep 27, 2014 21:52
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Spooky Hyena posted:Isn't the sociopath thing a myth? I've only known one, from before he was diagnosed as ASPD, and he always seemed creepy and off to me. Of course, with literally the smallest sample size possible that might not hold up in general. I've met a few, some were really unpleasant to be around. Not dangerous but drat, societal norms really were something that happened to other people. Those were confirmed. I've got a friend who we all strongly suspect is one of the charming elf-people but he could be a narcissist too. He just doesn't act like a human should, and despite all the charm and twinkly eyes in the world he's an incredible bastard when he thinks nobody is paying attention. So yeah, it's a myth. The biotruthy reasoning behind it is that given what is considered to be an inability to internalise social norms, they consciously act on them in order to fit in. It's true that narcissists and other undefined personality disorders are more likely to be in a FTSE chair than a prison, but there's other reasons for that. But then it's all biotruths because we barely recognise the term in the UK. ASPD is kinda-sorta a different thing and people with that illness are loving difficult, and I spend my weekdays doing PDT with Borderline patients. The only place I've seen any reference to Socio/Psychopaths is in a specific section of the mental health act that deals with the indefinite detention of a patient suspected of being a permanent possible threat to society and habitual non-compulsive liar.
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Sep 27, 2014 21:52
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ReV VAdAUL posted:I suppose at the heart of it I'm just confused. London and the Southeast keeping as much money as they can and looking solely to their own interests is very bad and detrimental to the poorer regions of the UK but Scotland keeping as much money as they can and looking solely to their own interests is very good, it is still viewed as detrimental to the poorer regions of the UK but I think it is now meant to be a good thing? Perhaps the poorer rUK regions are meant to bootstraps? Devolution doesn't have to gently caress over the poorer rUK regions, it's London's thievery that's the issue. Scotland won't be taking an unfair share away with them. They will, however, be creating excuses that the tories can use. My argument would be why bother with the symptoms when we should find a way to treat the cause?
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Sep 27, 2014 21:55
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Spangly A posted:Devolution doesn't have to gently caress over the poorer rUK regions, it's London's thievery that's the issue. Scotland won't be taking an unfair share away with them. They will, however, be creating excuses that the tories can use. Because nationalism creates the scapegoat of the other being the problem. Let us imagine that Yes won: The rUK regions are suffering because "Scotland hosed them over", iScotland is struggling to deliver what was promised because "England is holding up its side of the bargain". Those rich enough and splitting off and forming their own enclaves no more confronts the problems of the global economy than living in a gated community fixes problems in an unequal city. Even when No won we're still getting Cameron pushing the "English votes for English issues" card which bolsters the right at everyone else's expense. Also the concept of a fair share is intriguing to me, do people who live near oil or who happen to live on very fertile land or the like simply deserve a better standard of living than those who don't? Everyone in the UK/EU/World is being hosed over by a tiny minority of the global population who have no loyalty to any one nation and many of whom don't even call a single nation home. Dividing up and focusing on parochial issues weakens what little ability to oppose them there is.
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Sep 27, 2014 22:06
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So what do you suggest if the power structures that the status quo keeps in place are so phenomenally bad? Like, I heard many people on the Yes side talking about how they saw an independent Scotland setting a left-wing example, and being a good neighbour and what not. I haven't really seen much in the way of actual believable plans for how to fix these issues without "creating more borders to divide the working class".
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Sep 27, 2014 22:11
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Acaila posted:So what do you suggest if the power structures that the status quo keeps in place are so phenomenally bad? A newly created nation of 8 million people which would've been heavily dependent on borrowing and would have been no more of a left wing model than the Scandinavian states that are now rapidly neo-liberalising would not have provided any kind of left wing model for others to follow. It was a reassuring lie, "sure I'm moving to a gated community but maybe it will inspire the poorer parts of town to live better somehow?" Heck there was no concrete plan to make iScotland a left wing model, the best I could get out of left wing Yes supporters was that it would create "opportunities" and the small c conservative Yes campaign of "just like now but better" didn't betray a strong hunger for a dramatic shift to the left among the wider Scottish population. I don't have a magic solution for the status quo but it is clear nationalism doesn't offer any solution at all.
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Sep 27, 2014 22:19
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Regarde Aduck posted:All nationalism is bad because it assumes that borders are magical. We can't fix Britain but we can fix Scotland because leftism can somehow exist north of this invisible boundary. Too bad Carlisle and your incompatible alien culture. You know, instead of whining how about we are excluding you and leaving you to your terrible southern neighbours. How about everyone in the north of England actually start loving doing something about it instead of complaining like we should be accountable for your poo poo. Regarde Aduck posted:A lost vote for independence and a resurgent Tory party. Well done you useless turds. A lost vote for indy and a resurgent tory party - "You are turds". A win vote for indy and leaving north of england to the tories - "You are traitors". Regarde Aduck logic - hosed if we do, hosed if we don't. 
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Sep 27, 2014 22:40
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Please, an appeal to my fellow Scots, dont talk about Indy Scotland here for the time being. Its not worth the headache and poo poo posting that ensues. Its clear it really upsets the people south of the border for some reason, not even Better Together winning seems to of helped. Its not like they need to be persuaded to vote Yes since they didnt and wont get a vote on the matter anyway.
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Sep 27, 2014 22:44
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Touchdown Boy posted:Please, an appeal to my fellow Scots, dont talk about Indy Scotland here for the time being. Its not worth the headache and poo poo posting that ensues. Its clear it really upsets the people south of the border for some reason, not even Better Together winning seems to of helped. Its not like they need to be persuaded to vote Yes since they didnt and wont get a vote on the matter anyway. Why was the creation of a seperate Scotpol thread a bad thing again? Because it made UKMT actually have something to talk about rather then a marxist circlejerk? Well they have something to talk about now!
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Sep 27, 2014 22:47
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Actually there's no real marxchat in this thread anymore.  The most anyone says is that globalised capitalism or neoliberalism does bad things and none of the parties in Westminster are going to stop it. I guess the class basis of sandwiches might count.
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Sep 27, 2014 22:53
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namesake posted:Actually there's no real marxchat in this thread anymore. Eh true...Let me amend that then. "neoLiberialism and capitalism hating circlejerk." namesake posted:I guess the class basis of sandwiches might count. I eat my sandwiches with nothing but bread.
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Sep 27, 2014 22:56
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ReV VAdAUL posted:A newly created nation of 8 million people which would've been heavily dependent on borrowing and would have been no more of a left wing model than the Scandinavian states that are now rapidly neo-liberalising would not have provided any kind of left wing model for others to follow. It was a reassuring lie, "sure I'm moving to a gated community but maybe it will inspire the poorer parts of town to live better somehow?" So you don't have a plan to make it better, you just don't want it to get worse, right? That's fair enough, but I don't believe in supporting the status quo because it could be worse. I liked the analogy of a great young speaker I heard, which was that you don't stay on a sinking ship for fear the lifeboats might not work. There are no certainties in politics, but I think the track record of Holyrood to date, particularly when compared with Westminster over the same period, has shown where the political priorities of Scotland lie. Also, I can do Scottish nationalism and Marxism!  Twice the annoying subjects at the same low price!
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Sep 27, 2014 22:59
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UKIP-sponsored polling of a few now-'marginal' seats that were once Tory/Labour strongholds: http://survation.com/new-constituency-polling-for-alan-bown/ Boston & Skegness (Tory majority of 28% in 2010): UKIP 46 (+36), Con 26 (-23), Lab 21 (nc), LD 2 (-13) North Thanet (Tory majority of 26% in 2010): Con 33 (-19), UKIP 32 (+25), Lab 24 (+2), LD 6 (-13) Rotherham (Labour majority of 28% in 2010): Lab 48 (+4), UKIP 37 (+31), Con 6 (-11), LD 4 (-12) Those are some tasty chunks being torn out of previously comfortable Tory majorities. By contrast, for all Nige's bluster, it doesn't look as though UKIP's got much pull on the core Labour vote even in a constituency where the party's name is rightly being dragged through the mud at present. Also, some kind of anthropomorphised toad-thing talking about said polling results: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnKCg7q4iYQ He's a bit overly full of himself when he says that UKIP has the capability to win "virtually anywhere" - more realistically, it has the potential to win in 'safe' Conservative seats that have large numbers of Maggie's working class Tories and bugger all money. LemonDrizzle fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Sep 27, 2014 |
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Sep 27, 2014 22:59
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Extreme0 posted:How about everyone in the north of England actually start loving doing something about it instead of complaining like we should be accountable for your poo poo. Oh, like you failed to do. Nice sentiment by the way. Very progressive.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:00
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:Oh, like you failed to do. Here is the difference though. We tried and are still doing something about it. I'm still waiting for the north of England to do something with the possible same efforts that the indyref campaigning did instead of doing nothing and complain about how the tories are loving them over. Rapey Joe Stalin posted:Nice sentiment by the way. Very progressive. Thank you, It's a nice way of saying 'do something' rather then complain on a internet forum.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:09
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Extreme0 posted:I'm still waiting for the north of England to do something with the possible same efforts that the indyref campaigning did instead of doing nothing and complain about how the tories are loving them over. Feel free to give us your suggestions  .
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Sep 27, 2014 23:11
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Jesus Christ could the lot of you stop with the whinging and squabbling. And at least seperatists have the excuse of a stinging defeat, unionists ITT are some of the sorest winners I've ever seen.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:18
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Praseodymi posted:Feel free to give us your suggestions My suggestion is this. Create a terrorist group called the "Northern English Goon Army" and Bomb London. If that fails then complain on the internet how it didn't work.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:21
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So the only way to make a more equal society is literal terrorism?
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Sep 27, 2014 23:23
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Praseodymi posted:So the only way to make a more equal society is literal terrorism? Worked for the ANC and the IRA.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:31
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Peel posted:Jesus Christ could the lot of you stop with the whinging and squabbling. It's nothing to do with winning or losing anything. It's to do with the feeling of betrayal engendered by people deciding that me, mine, and everyone else who differs from them only by living on the other side of an imaginary line should be thrown to the wolves because we are Other. Is that seriously a hard concept to grasp? That if you try to take the lifeboats and leave everyone else behind because they have a different accent, then you might foster just a little bit of resentment?
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Sep 27, 2014 23:31
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:It's nothing to do with winning or losing anything. It's to do with the feeling of betrayal engendered by people deciding that me, mine, and everyone else who differs from them only by living on the other side of an imaginary line should be thrown to the wolves. The Scottish independence campaign was one of the most ethnically or whatever inclusive movements we've ever seen, this harping on about how it's nasty Jocks who hate English people is completely untrue and getting incredibly tedious. For gently caress's sakes the immigration policies we were after would have even made it easier for you to immigrate than it is for foreigners to come into the UK as it is now.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:34
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marktheando posted:Anyway, the independent thread was nothing but unionists being smug. Fixed that for you, chief. Containment has dropped, and now we must all suffer, Together. Are we Better as such, though?
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Sep 27, 2014 23:35
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:Is that seriously a hard concept to grasp? That if you try to take the lifeboats and leave everyone else behind because they have a different accent, then you might foster just a little bit of resentment?
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Sep 27, 2014 23:37
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Extreme0 posted:Here is the difference though. yeah why doesn't the north bootstraps themselves up like I did!!!!! Can we please move on from Scottish independence and focus on the new hot issue, the creation of the Sovereign Republic of Cornwall??
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Sep 27, 2014 23:40
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Farecoal posted:yeah why doesn't the north bootstraps themselves up like I did!!!!! That's makes sense. If you're trying to fix inequality, might as well start with the poorest region (in England).
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Sep 27, 2014 23:42
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:It's nothing to do with winning or losing anything. It's to do with the feeling of betrayal engendered by people deciding that me, mine, and everyone else who differs from them only by living on the other side of an imaginary line should be thrown to the wolves because we are Other. Eh, I didn't see any man the borders types campaigning for independence, and personally I'd love for everyone in Britain who preferred the Scottish situation to theirs to move in. It wouldn't be easily avoidable anyway, setting up a new government is something that needs a lot of manpower to make happen. I think you've just equated seperatism with isolationism, which it isn't. Anyway, it didn't happen so get over it.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:43
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Praseodymi posted:So the only way to make a more equal society is literal terrorism?  Sometimes the smallest step is the hardest but I'm sure if you try really hard, amazing things can happen. Rapey Joe Stalin posted:It's nothing to do with winning or losing anything. It's to do with the feeling of betrayal engendered by people deciding that me, mine, and everyone else who differs from them only by living on the other side of an imaginary line should be thrown to the wolves. It's like talking off a man in a wheelchair about to commit suicide on a steep cliff. You might inspire hope for the guy but he will no doubt die anyways. Also if I were too leave you to die when I took the lifeboat, it isn't because of your accent but rather the act of survival. I would kick a Scot out just like anyone else if it means I get to live. Such is the way of life eh? KazigluBey posted:Fixed that for you, chief. Containment has dropped, and now we must all suffer, Together. Are we Better as such, though? Suffer Together, like a big family hugging each other with barbed wire around open wounds. We may suffer horrible conditions but as long as we love each other then that's what counts! Farecoal posted:yeah why doesn't the north bootstraps themselves up like I did!!!!! Because they are too pessimistic about it so they don't bother doing it anyways. Farecoal posted:Can we please move on from Scottish independence and focus on the new hot issue, the creation of the Sovereign Republic of Cornwall?? But what currency would it use!?! What are you going too use so you can fund your republic! There is too much uncertainty and that's why we should vote to stay apart of the Authoritarian State of Wales.
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Sep 27, 2014 23:48
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dadrips posted:Scottish independence isn't about deserting the people of the UK, just its government. I might be more inclined to see it that way if I had seen anything approaching a valid and coherent argument for why they had to do it and how it would make things better. Instead all I got from it was "exactly the same but without the English, and better because of magic and a lack of the England holding us back." The experience for me was a weird one in which I was left feeling confused, betrayed, and rejected by my own countrymen. I don't think it is surprising that it leaves a bitterness towards the people who, even after the Scottish people rejected it, are still going on about independence. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Sep 27, 2014 |
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Sep 27, 2014 23:51
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If I had a pound for every (usually Northern) friend that told me "Can I move to Scotland after independence?" I would be receiving a Tory tax cut. My boyfriend often comments on how we should move the border to include the North, but we're not, under any circumstances, taking Middlesborough! Rapey Joe - Sorry, but I don't see you as a countryman. Doesn't mean I hate you, just that I identify as Scottish not British. This was something that came out in the campaign from Darling and co. Independence = English are foreigners. Foreigners = BAD, so if independence gives us more foreigners, independence = bad! Also, for the "still going on about it" stuff, did the entire Labour party disband after it lost the last election? Why do you expect people to suddenly abandon their most fervent political beliefs because they lost a single election? (even without factoring the "whole establishment against us" chip on the shoulder)
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Sep 27, 2014 23:59
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