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Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

quote:

Portable591 came out of the closet to say:
LoGH is one of the greatest shows ever and Paul von Oberstein is the greatest character in anime.

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Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Paul von Oberstein is my favorite character. But Oberstein isn't a bastard, nor is he devious or even evil.

He's the ultimate pragmatist (think Jack Bauer from 24, only without the one-man army capability), doing exactly what needs to be done as dictated by the Overall Value Principle in order to assure Reinhard's success. If said action is an unpopular or immoral one, Oberstein will not hesitate to take all the blame himself, regardless of whether he was responsible or not. And Oberstein would give his life for Reinhard's in a heartbeat without hesitation. Go back and watch the first few minutes of episode 26; Oberstein was ready to die in Reinhard's stead right then and there.

All these things he would do without expecting anything in return, not even gratitude (or even acknowledgment) from the people he's doing it for. And this is sort of a spoiler but not really (I'll tag it anyway), but unlike a lot of the other characters, Oberstein doesn't have any ulterior motives or personal ambitions behind his actions. He knows he himself can't lead ("But I have no such talent."), and he really is doing everything for the sake of Reinhard's success. The same cannot be said for even Kircheis.

Paul von Oberstein is more loyal and dedicated than anyone, no matter the personal cost (has no friends or lovers). I've always liked unwaveringly loyal adjutant characters that were that way not out of love but ideology--so more along the lines of Hoji Sadojima, not Riza Hawkeye--and Oberstein is the pinnacle of that. But much like the characters in LoGH, fans of the show almost all either dislike him or "love to hate" him, even though Oberstein's unflinching loyalty to the cause is very much akin to that of The Boss or Revolver Ocelot from Metal Gear Solid, whom fans at the very least respect.

And Kaneto Shiozawa beats out Norio Wakamoto, guys. :hellnaw:

Daryl Surat fucked around with this message at Jul 8, 2005 around 22:36

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

quote:

Fabulous secrets were revealed to me when Man of Wax said:

Whether or done in the name of pragtasim or otherwise, the slaughter of millions of innocents for the political gain of one man is immoral. It really doesn't matter how rational he is, Oberstein clearly holds human life in contempt and deserves to be hated for it.

While I conceded that Oberstein's decision-making process does not consider morality as a factor (so perhaps "amoral" instead of "immoral" would be more appropriate), you're making it sound like he actively ordered the deaths of those people, which isn't the case. There were only two options regarding that war, and neither were good: 1. allow millions to die by refusing to stop an attack by the opposition, thus ending the war sooner due to overwhelming popular support (which for civil wars is important) of the side that DOESN'T obliterate entire planets on the whim of their leader; 2. save those people which would result in the war continuing at its current rate--thus resulting in the deaths of several times more people than that which was saved--with a significant possibility that the wrong side would win. BOTH options are bad, but one is less bad than the other. Those really were the only two options, and the overall value of option number one is greater than that of option two, so that's what Oberstein sided with. That's all it is. It's not a "mwa ha ha, the lives of many are insignificant if it means the furthering of my agenda" mentality like what some of the other faction leaders in the series have.

Oberstein knows that anyone with the degree of power than Reinhard seeks must inevitably be faced with making several such hard decisions. Per his character, Oberstein believes that unlike how it was during the Goldenbaum reign (which he despises), it would be far better to have someone OTHER than the leader make such harsh decisions so as not to adversely affect the leader's decision-making, since once you do one bad thing it becomes easier to do more and more. This is a job that nobody wants, but there are times when it still needs to be done, and so it is that Oberstein takes tasks like this on a regular basis. Informing Annerose at the end of season 1, for one. And though this is debatable, in that same episode when Reinhard says to the effect that "I've already killed so many people so what's the big deal in killing one more family" and Oberstein responds "if that's what you think, then fine," I personally don't think there's some dark Emperor Palpatine "I'm turning you to the Dark Side" intent in the statement. I think Oberstein was slightly let down, because even though he understands it's necessary to have people like him that are willing to do "dirty work" provided it's in the nation's best interests, he'd prefer that the person in charge not be it. This is why he understands the necessity of people like Kircheis or Mariendorf even though they're the opposite of him and never ever agree with his advice.

Episode 36 was just released. Suffice it to say that this matter is not yet resolved in the story.

quote:

Man of Wax spoke heresy against the Builder by saying:
I think comparing him to Hawkeye or Boss Borot is an of the purest reductionism. So much so that the analogy is essentially meaningless. Sure, they're all sidekicks, but that's about it. They have entirely motives and means.

I specifically said the ones that were loyal out of ideology and not love or friendship. The character Hoji in Rurouni Kenshin sides with Shishio because he truly believes Shishio is the one who's going to change the country, to the point where Hoji allows his fingers to be broken and offers his hand in reparation for actions he didn't even commit, because he believes it's better that he take the blame than the leader. That's the kind of loyalty I'm talking about, which is the same degree of loyalty Oberstein has, and it's way more than just being a "sidekick."

Daryl Surat fucked around with this message at Jul 8, 2005 around 22:30

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

quote:

Fabulous secrets were revealed to me when Hokuto said:
I just finished watching the HK subs all the way up to 110.

I don't think I'll ever get to see a show that can top this one. That's really all I can say about it.

What you're feeling right now is pretty much exactly the way I felt after finishing up through 110 back in 1999-2000 or so, even though I had to just trough through the whole thing raw despite not understanding Japanese or being able to know exactly what people's names were on account of the damned hard-coded Chinese subtitles. For what it's worth, I don't think I've seen anything that tops it either, even though I've practically forgotten all but the most major points.

Of course, I still haven't seen all the side stories, of which there's 52 episodes worth. I saw the Golden Wings OAV along with Valley of White Silver, but there's still the other 20 episodes that make up A Hundred Billion Stars, A Hundred Billion Lights (mostly about the Empire; "Valley" is episodes 1-4) and 28 episodes of Spiral Labyrinth (mostly about the Alliance, starting with exactly what happened at El Facile).

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

The good news: all of the LoGH side stories OAVs (including Golden Wings which used the manga character designs and different voice actors) plus the movies have now been Torrented: http://www.boxtorrents.com/download...28319/s.torrent

The bad news: the guy who encoded them forgot to deinterlace them and decided to make them hardsubbed because "MKV files are twice as large!" These are HK subs with what appears to be the same level of quality as the subs in the main series, though the original poster notes that one episode is severely mis-timed. Good thing he didn't use softsubs so someone could fix it, because everyone knows the SRT is an insult to fansubbing!

These side stories chronicle pretty much everything that Yang and Reinhard did prior to the beginning of the series. Even I have only seen the first four episodes of these, but I look forward to seeing things like exactly what happened at El Facile. Plus, I'm pretty sure there's a story all about the Rosenritter! Stop being stuck at 70.9%, stupid Torrent!

Man of Wax posted:

If only Azureus would run without crashing my computer I might try downloading from 44 onward.

I've actually switched to Bitcomet since I got sick and tired of Azureus crashing my computer. It seems much more stable while being a bit more constant in its RAM usage, but I've noticed that I constantly get disconnected from Usenet / AIM / etc while Bitcomet is running. I guess it's preferable to the constant crashes.

Daryl Surat fucked around with this message at Sep 7, 2005 around 22:07

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Episode 60 eh? Oh dear.

This thread is about to E-X-P-L-O-D-E.

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Num Lock posted:

So what does "Piyo-Piyo" mean anyway?

It's the sound that baby chicks make. I guess the English equivalent would be "cheep-cheep."

Num Lock posted:

Link appears to be broken

Use this one.

Daryl Surat posted:

Episode 61. Oh dear.

This thread is about to E-X-P-L-O-D-E.

I AIN'T KIDDING FOLKS

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Specineff posted:

I guess it's my turn to deliver the good news.

http://a.scarywater.net/ca/logh eps...6) .avi.torrent

edit: where is everybody

They've all died or possibly been sucked into the singularity generated by the birth of a new universe since the thread has now officially E-X-P-L-O-D-E...d as of this point in the show. Or maybe they'll wait until the end credits of the NEXT episode. Context shift alert!

Man, LoGH is really one of those shows I'd like to rewatch every few years, but it's so hard to bring myself to do it on my own. The only way I can ever try and manage it is to find some people I personally know and show them the series, but those who aren't bored by it immediately often give up partway around Season 2 on the grounds that "ALL the cool people are in the Empire and the Alliance has like, NOBODY except for like Yang and a few of his friends." It's not like you can tell them they're wrong about that.

EDIT: Hmm. Upon further checking, no threads will E-X-P-L-O-D-E for quite some time yet.

Daryl Surat fucked around with this message at Jan 28, 2006 around 02:38

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Daryl Surat posted:

Episode 60 eh? Oh dear.

This thread is about to E-X-P-L-O-D-E.

Well, now that it's out: for some reason I thought 62 was 82 back when I wrote that.

Note to self: rewatch this entire show.

EDIT: years ago I mentioned this episode to my podcast cohosts as like, the very first thing they knew about the series on the grounds that "nobody's ever going to subtitle this far anyway."

Whatever. Most people I know refuse to watch past episode 26. Actually, that is not true. Most people I show this to refuse to watch past episode 2.

Daryl Surat fucked around with this message at Jul 17, 2006 around 20:07

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Tir McDohl posted:

I was thinking. Really, more people *should* watch Legend of the Galactic Heroes, but I guess it says something when a thread from 2004 only has 20 pages.

What kind of difficulties has anyone here had trying to get friends into this show? For the most part, I've run into the "it looks OLD!!" complaint like 50 times so far.

Certainly, the fact that the show started in the late 80s doesn't help it as far as introducing the series to new fans, but I think the real problem is that every single potential starting point for LoGH is a self-contained space battle. The first movie is more or less a space battle, as is the second movie which in turn is mostly a retelling of the first two episodes. You can watch just those episodes and even both movies, and you'll come off with the impression that the series is entirely space battles conducted by various pairs of guys all saying "move here" or "fire there."

Sure, the space battles are neat, but the actual meat of the series is all the political intrigue and philosophy matters which you don't really get to see until the third episode, and in this day and age, most people give anime one installment to impress them.

Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Honest Ray posted:

So who would you guys say is your favorite Imperial Admiral? I've always been something of a Muller man myself but then again Oberstein is also very awesome.

J.C. PAUL VON OBERSTEIN~! was never an Admiral!

Bittenfeld is my second favorite Imperial Admiral. All the others are tied. Even Mecklinger and his bitch haircut.

Daryl Surat fucked around with this message at Aug 29, 2008 around 05:32

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Daryl Surat
Apr 6, 2002

I don't care what you say about this post, but if anyone steps on my bunion, I'll kill them!

Honest Ray posted:

Oberstein's rank was Fleet Admiral, right? I mean, I know he wasn't out there making miracles happen but he did his thing and that thing was badass.

I know Wikipedia says he was a Fleet Admiral, but I'm pretty sure that's inaccurate. Vice Admiral is closer to what I remember his rank being before officially becoming the HR Director of the Neureich, but I also haven't rewatched this series in a very long time. Generally when someone thinks of "the Imperial Admirals" they think of someone that was in the Admiralty proper with a flagship in command of a fleet.

There is no love in the hood for August Samuel Wahlen. Let's all give Wahlen a hand, guys!

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