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Shine posted:It's a point of contention because the term gets a new meaning every 5 years, making it vague and arbitrary. The better results people attest have more to do with the fact that if their goal is to bulk "clean," then they're likely eating a reasonable surplus with an appropriate macronutrient split, versus downing 5000 calories of whatever per day despite having a 2800/day maintenance. More clarified in terms of his questions: Even though you can get the same number of carbs/calories from a costco muffin, consider instead eating 2-3 bagels. It seems stupid and arbitrary and for some people it definitely might be. I always feel less fat/bloat and out of shape when I'm bulking with less icecresm and more bread. ed: so try it out and see how you feel. Other rules like cardio and cycling calories are much more (solid?) useful than trying to decide which foods are clean and which are dirty
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| # ? Jun 24, 2012 17:02 |
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| # ? May 19, 2013 04:12 |
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Shine posted:Personally, I define "clean" simply as eating a diet that is appropriate for one's goal, which basically comes down to calories and macros. If you're bulking, a standard ketogenic diet wouldn't be clean because it sucks for muscle growth and gym performance (for most), and an "eat everything" diet wouldn't be clean because you'll put on excess fat (unless you are FineX or Dsal or something), so on and so forth.
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| # ? Jun 24, 2012 21:05 |
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E_P posted:That may be how you define it but in bodybuilding bulking clean literally means eating the same things you eat when you cut weight except in excess, IE 3 chicken breasts instead of 1 for lunch. That basically amounts to "X food is clean and Y food is unclean," as foods you avoid while cutting (for whatever reason) will also be avoided while bulking. Tell goons to "bulk clean" like that and they will still avoid certain foods due to fear of inherent fat gain, even though they could bulk and eat those foods just fine if their overall approach is sound. To clarify, my intent isn't to lecture people who've found an approach that works for them (if it's working and you don't hate it, keep doing it, and having seen your TFLC pics you've clearly found an approach that works for you, so cool beans  ), but rather to make a point for beginners/intermediates—who are a considerable (perhaps majority) demographic on this forum—that "clean," and its implied underlying mechanisms, aren't really cut and dry. A person doesn't have to abstain from (to use a classic bb'er example) milk and fruit during a bulk or cut just because that's what many bodybuilders do, unless that is their personal preference. It's the dietary equivalent of "do whatever": focus on the things that matter most, and use whatever approach helps you hit that.We can agree to disagree, though. Just different ways of looking at poo poo.
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| # ? Jun 25, 2012 01:10 |
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Shine posted:Just different ways of looking like poo poo. To keep with the subforum's name 
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| # ? Jun 25, 2012 07:05 |
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Hi I heard this is the place where all the swole bros hang out and talk about getting swole.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 01:00 |
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No comma after "Hi" - user loses posting privileges for 6 hours. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 01:18 |
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NAT KING SWOLE posted:Hi I heard this is the place where all the swole bros hang out and talk about getting swole. Show us your butthole, slut.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 01:32 |
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NAT KING SWOLE posted:Hi I heard this is the place where all the swole bros hang out and talk about getting swole. 5x5 thread is that way!
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 03:56 |
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Shine posted:Personally, I define "clean" simply as eating a diet that is appropriate for one's goal, which basically comes down to calories and macros. If you're bulking, a standard ketogenic diet wouldn't be clean because it sucks for muscle growth and gym performance (for most), and an "eat everything" diet wouldn't be clean because you'll put on excess fat (unless you are FineX or Dsal or something), so on and so forth. I have trouble explaining this as well. If your goal is to gain as much muscle as possible in a certain amount of time, or your have a hard time gaining weight, then eating dirty is fine. It would probably be prohibitively expensive/annoying for most people to eat the number of calories BS/LSV do when bulking 'cleanly.' If your goal is to gain some muscle while avoiding excess fat loss, then you could probably get a suitable number of calories with chicken/rice/yams/whatever without too much effort. Realistically most people's goals would fit under the latter option...but gently caress it, 400 pounds here I come.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 05:19 |
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NAT KING SWOLE posted:Hi I heard this is the place where all the swole bros hang out and talk about getting swole. Only you can save this bodybuilding thread cavefish.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 06:26 |
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Is training to failure advocated in this kind of routine (at least in the last set)? I've seen conflicting opinions regarding training to failure so I don't know what to think.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 17:29 |
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Demented Guy posted:Is training to failure advocated in this kind of routine (at least in the last set)? I've seen conflicting opinions regarding training to failure so I don't know what to think. Yes assuming you're keeping your form intact.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 21:29 |
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Piggles posted:Yes assuming you're keeping your form intact.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 21:53 |
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On things like squats, deadlifts, cleans, etc you should train to technical failure, which is until you're unable to perform the lift properly and/or safely. If you keep going after that you're asking for trouble. And I would never go close to failure on high rep deadlifts anyway because the form breaks down pretty quick. If you're going to do 20 rep squats or something just choose an appropriate weight and make sure you're not compromising your technique. I don't really like going to complete failure on anything unless i'm doing a yates style HIT routine where you do lots of rest pausing and going beyond failure but that requires a good partner and spotter who knows what they're doing. If you want to go to failure on things like curls or cable lifts or machine exercises then go hog wild.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 22:29 |
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NAT KING SWOLE posted:On things like squats, deadlifts, cleans, etc you should train to technical failure, which is until you're unable to perform the lift properly and/or safely. If you keep going after that you're asking for trouble.
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| # ? Jun 26, 2012 22:33 |
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Technical failure is more or less what I meant.
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| # ? Jun 27, 2012 00:30 |
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Guys, I'm really sorry if these have been addressed but I'm only up to page 3 and need to ask a few questions. I chose this program after recently getting back into lifting - had about a 5 month break after bulging a disc. Can't deadlift for a while as I'm still doing rehab to correct that injury, and I liked the look of this program because I had lost a bit of my size, it seemed more "high rep" than "high weight" and also it looks so different than my previous programs that it looked FUN most importantly! Into my 2nd week, and I've got a query. 1) I'm having problems trying to get a good balance... for example, leg day leaves me crippled for 2 days wondering if I'll ever walk again, but after chest day I feel absolutely fine. Same goes for back day (walk in the park!) and arms day (oh dear God will I ever be able to use my tricep again?). I can't increase the weight, because I tried that and was unable to get through the required amount of reps, so instead I just started doing more sets of different exercises - IS THIS OK? For example, on bench day, I started doing decline and BB bench after I'd done my required sets of incline and flat DB bench (and the other exercises too). Thanks in advance  I'm really enjoying such a wide variety of exercises and the lack of deadlifts means my back is pain-free and it might just be in my head but I could almost swear I look a bit better already!
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| # ? Jun 27, 2012 01:31 |
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Butta posted:Guys, I'm really sorry if these have been addressed but I'm only up to page 3 and need to ask a few questions. Keep training with the increased weight until you hit the "required reps" then increase your weight again. You don't want to increase by a lot though as you still want to fall within the 6-12 rep range. As for the soreness thing- you'll get used to it eventually. I just started lifting again after almost a year off and my legs are hosed for days while the rest of my body is recovering fairly quickly but after a few weeks I know my body will start recovering a lot faster. I wouldn't supplement weight with more exercises though because you're just going to overwork yourself.
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| # ? Jun 27, 2012 01:48 |
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Rad - thank you! I'll stick to it and see how I go... hopefully get over my fear of letting YLLS see my body and post a transformation or something.
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| # ? Jun 27, 2012 04:24 |
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wheres the fuckin new thread (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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| # ? Jun 27, 2012 22:27 |
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gently caress u shine enjoyable human being friend of the family (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
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| # ? Jun 28, 2012 00:59 |
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shine dont do anything to fart daddy smooth he is really mad that there is no new BB thread like we all are, as mod you need to get the appropriate people to move forward with making it, its your job mate.
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| # ? Jun 28, 2012 01:01 |
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fart daddy smoofh posted:gently caress u shine enjoyable human being friend of the family Wow fds, you used to be a great fun poster but this.....is one step closer to the edge.
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| # ? Jun 28, 2012 01:01 |
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also since your reading this shine you can make me the featured log for july (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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| # ? Jun 28, 2012 01:02 |
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| # ? May 19, 2013 04:12 |
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Everybody wanna be a bodybuilder, but don't nobody wanna post like an adult.
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| # ? Jun 28, 2012 01:21 |
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