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Steve French
Sep 8, 2003

senrath posted:

You could just, y'know, watch the embedded video.

Ah, so yes, I was missing something. Like flash, probably. (I saved the link on my commute this morning to watch at work, and there was no embedded video visible on my work machine)

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Plorkyeran
Mar 22, 2007

To Escape The Shackles Of The Old Forums, We Must Reject The Tribal Negativity He Endorsed
Somehow I have a feeling that paying 50-100% more than Google (while the conspiracy to suppress wages was still in effect) and being able to extend a job offer in less time than it takes Google to reply to an internal referral played bigger roles in getting high-quality candidates than anything else.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:

Eh...I've seen and experienced very major issues with Facebook's hiring practices.

I've just never complained because I still hold out hope of Facebook someday deciding I was a false negative.

Oh sure, I have too; it's definitely imperfect. I don't think I'd trade for the practices anywhere else I've worked, though, even the places where I set those practices.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

Plorkyeran posted:

Somehow I have a feeling that paying 50-100% more than Google (while the conspiracy to suppress wages was still in effect) and being able to extend a job offer in less time than it takes Google to reply to an internal referral played bigger roles in getting high-quality candidates than anything else.

Don't want to go into too much detail about comp strategy, but I don't think I've ever encountered a case where we were offering that sort of premium, though if you include equity then the math is impossible. Google generally has a reputation for offering the top cash in the valley over the last ~4-5 years, and I haven't seen evidence to the contrary.

Not that engineers at either company have cause for comp complaint either way; it's fantasy land these days.

Doctor w-rw-rw-
Jun 24, 2008

Subjunctive posted:

Don't want to go into too much detail about comp strategy, but I don't think I've ever encountered a case where we were offering that sort of premium, though if you include equity then the math is impossible. Google generally has a reputation for offering the top cash in the valley over the last ~4-5 years, and I haven't seen evidence to the contrary.

Not that engineers at either company have cause for comp complaint either way; it's fantasy land these days.

This was mostly during the poaching days of 2010, if memory serves. Before your time at Facebook; after my first time*. I don't recall any specific details, but I do know that Facebook was targeting key hires from Google with very lucrative packages, leading Google to start offering much better packages to retain employees.

* It's entirely possible that my information from this time is incorrect, but I don't think it is.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:

This was mostly during the poaching days of 2010, if memory serves. Before your time at Facebook; after my first time*. I don't recall any specific details, but I do know that Facebook was targeting key hires from Google with very lucrative packages, leading Google to start offering much better packages to retain employees.

* It's entirely possible that my information from this time is incorrect, but I don't think it is.

Oh, duh, sorry. I was thinking of the two-competing-offers case, not the poaching case. Yeah, that was a weird time, Google was making similarly outsized offers to my team at Mozilla in that era as well. (Unsolicited offer letters, no interview. Loco.) I don't understand why Google would ever have let itself be outspent on comp, though, given their war chest. Sort of weird.

Workaday Wizard
Oct 23, 2009

by Pragmatica
How much we're talking about here?

Skiant
Mar 10, 2013
code:
if (dates) {
  if (dates.length > 0) {
   $scope.madForm.datePicker.$setValidity('valid', true);
  } else {
   $scope.madForm.datePicker.$setValidity('valid', false);
  }
}

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Subjunctive posted:

Not that engineers at either company have cause for comp complaint either way; it's fantasy land these days.
This is a terrible line of thinking. Especially in light of documented wage fixing.

Volmarias
Dec 31, 2002

EMAIL... THE INTERNET... SEARCH ENGINES...

JawnV6 posted:

This is a terrible line of thinking. Especially in light of documented wage fixing.

Having waffles for breakfast nearly every morning, an in-building coffee shop with baristas who do pour overs, a competent help desk, the assumption that a new coworker will be competent, HR and legal departments with a sense of humor and proportion, and generally being treated as a grown up is pretty nice. You can take the mercenary BFC approach of "more money = always more better" but I'm extremely happy at Google, even though someplace like Bloomberg would probably pay much better.

The salary fixing thing is an issue, but there are reasons to work somewhere that aren't just financial.

hobbesmaster
Jan 28, 2008

Just imagine how much more ridiculous those benefits would be if your employer was a member of an illegal cartel.

Volmarias
Dec 31, 2002

EMAIL... THE INTERNET... SEARCH ENGINES...

hobbesmaster posted:

Just imagine how much more ridiculous those benefits would be if your employer was a member of an illegal cartel.

Hey, if I could trust Pablo not to put the payload up his nose, I would appreciate that in the guy who hired him.

The point I'm making is that I'm still happy working there instead of a place that might pay more, because there are intangible benefits, not that I want my salary suppressed because I'm a big dumb fanboy.

Blotto Skorzany
Nov 7, 2008

He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

Volmarias posted:

The salary fixing thing is an issue, but there are reasons to work somewhere that aren't just financial.

Jawn is a startup employee so he probably knows that...

substitute
Aug 30, 2003

you for my mum

Skiant posted:

code:
if (dates) {
  if (dates.length > 0) {
   $scope.madForm.datePicker.$setValidity('valid', true);
  } else {
   $scope.madForm.datePicker.$setValidity('valid', false);
  }
}

This is from a PUA website, right?

Harik
Sep 9, 2001

From the hard streets of Moscow
First dog to touch the stars


Plaster Town Cop

Skiant posted:

code:
if (dates) {
  if (dates.length > 0) {
   $scope.madForm.datePicker.$setValidity('valid', true);
  } else {
   $scope.madForm.datePicker.$setValidity('valid', false);
  }
}

That's a good combination of "I know you have to check a pointer before you dereference it" and "I have no idea that shortcut logic operators exist."

Paul MaudDib
May 3, 2006

TEAM NVIDIA:
FORUM POLICE



quote:

If we now divide the number of comments in a subreddit containing a chosen word by the overall subreddit comment count (and multiply by 10000 to have a nice integer value), we get more ... well, diagrams.

https://github.com/Dobiasd/programming-language-subreddits-and-their-choice-of-words

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

JawnV6 posted:

This is a terrible line of thinking. Especially in light of documented wage fixing.

Well, there was no wage fixing at my company, but mostly when I compare my compensation (well beyond salary) to that awarded to others who work as hard as I do for at least as much social gain, it's hard to feel too hard-done-by. I'm crazy lucky.

down with slavery
Dec 23, 2013
STOP QUOTING MY POSTS SO PEOPLE THAT AREN'T IDIOTS DON'T HAVE TO READ MY FUCKING TERRIBLE OPINIONS THANKS

Looks like an inverted chart of "what programming language should I choose first" answers

Hughlander
May 11, 2005

down with slavery posted:

Looks like an inverted chart of "what programming language should I choose first" answers

Does that mean you want to work in Visual Basic and mathematica?

Zopotantor
Feb 24, 2013

...und ist er drin dann lassen wir ihn niemals wieder raus...

down with slavery posted:

Looks like an inverted chart of "what programming language should I choose first" answers
No, that's this one:

:rock:Lisp:rock:

Chill Callahan
Nov 14, 2012

Volmarias posted:

Having waffles for breakfast nearly every morning, an in-building coffee shop with baristas who do pour overs, a competent help desk, the assumption that a new coworker will be competent, HR and legal departments with a sense of humor and proportion, and generally being treated as a grown up is pretty nice. You can take the mercenary BFC approach of "more money = always more better" but I'm extremely happy at Google, even though someplace like Bloomberg would probably pay much better.

The salary fixing thing is an issue, but there are reasons to work somewhere that aren't just financial.

You left out the freaking slide and ball pit!

Beef
Jul 26, 2004

I'm surprised by the helpful part, does it also match unhelpful? :v:

ShadowHawk
Jun 25, 2000

CERTIFIED PRE OWNED TESLA OWNER

Beef posted:

I'm surprised by the helpful part, does it also match unhelpful? :v:
Possibly not, but it does match "Thank you that was very helpful I can't understand this at all"

FoiledAgain
May 6, 2007


Is there a rule against swearing on the mathematica forum? How come 'gently caress' and 'poo poo' don't show up at all?

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Volmarias posted:

Having waffles for breakfast nearly every morning, an in-building coffee shop with baristas who do pour overs, a competent help desk, the assumption that a new coworker will be competent, HR and legal departments with a sense of humor and proportion, and generally being treated as a grown up is pretty nice. You can take the mercenary BFC approach of "more money = always more better" but I'm extremely happy at Google, even though someplace like Bloomberg would probably pay much better.

The salary fixing thing is an issue, but there are reasons to work somewhere that aren't just financial.
Christ alive. There's a bit of space between "personal pour-over barista" and "mercenary BFC more money" and pretending that it's a binary choice doesn't help anyone.

Trust me, I've had these same thoughts. I'm aware that I'm very well compensated in a relative sense. However, given the meek CS stereotype I think it's dangerous to broadcast the message of "settle for less because other fields are worse off." Cutting your fellow software engineers off at the knee and giving the profits over to MBA's who weren't interviewing day laborers for the same position anyway. The larger context of wages against real productivity flatlining since the 70's trumps the relativity.

Subjunctive posted:

Well, there was no wage fixing at my company, but mostly when I compare my compensation (well beyond salary) to that awarded to others who work as hard as I do for at least as much social gain, it's hard to feel too hard-done-by. I'm crazy lucky.
The person on the other side of the negotiation is not thinking in these terms. They will take advantage of this mindset and pay less than they can afford for your role.

rjmccall
Sep 7, 2007

no worries friend
Fun Shoe

FoiledAgain posted:

Is there a rule against swearing on the mathematica forum? How come 'gently caress' and 'poo poo' don't show up at all?

Lower-traffic boards have very different post profiles. I would guess that the mathematica forum is probably far more slanted towards news/views posting over help requests.

Also, the user base of a scientific package like mathematica is going to be very different from a general programming language.

feedmegin
Jul 30, 2008

Dessert Rose posted:

Fundamental to C-family languages. Well, except C.

And, indeed, Java (to start with and the way they've shoehorned it in is pretty much an afterthought), Objective C, and even early C++.

Steve French
Sep 8, 2003

JawnV6 posted:

Christ alive. There's a bit of space between "personal pour-over barista" and "mercenary BFC more money" and pretending that it's a binary choice doesn't help anyone.

More importantly, why does one need a barista to make pour-over coffee for you

ExcessBLarg!
Sep 1, 2001
Everyone's about the free food at Google but honestly it sounds like as good of a deal as a college meal plan, perhaps with better food. If you make more money, you can purchase breakfast at whichever trendy waffle shop you prefer.

It sounds like the perks that Google is really offering is convenience, as well as subtlely trying to encourage everyone to work longer hours. Again, sounds kind of like undergrad. That might be great if you're an early 20-something and want to extend that lifestyle. But if you're a little older, have family, or just want to socialize outside work, those conveniences are less meaningful.

Most other institutions (certainly the ones worth working for) also feature competent coworkers and to-help-you internal resource departments, those are hardly unique.

PrBacterio
Jul 19, 2000

Hughlander posted:

Does that mean you want to work in Visual Basic and mathematica?
For its intended area of application, I find Mathematica is actually pretty good? :shrug:

raminasi
Jan 25, 2005

a last drink with no ice

Zopotantor posted:

No, that's this one:

:rock:Lisp:rock:

Not pictured: useful, productive, easy.

Internet Janitor
May 17, 2008

"That isn't the appropriate trash receptacle."

:madmax:

EAT THE EGGS RICOLA
May 29, 2008


Brb writing a responsive website in SQL

Internet Janitor
May 17, 2008

"That isn't the appropriate trash receptacle."
Maybe you should look into this hot new framework.

yippee cahier
Mar 28, 2005


needs more orange

Paul MaudDib
May 3, 2006

TEAM NVIDIA:
FORUM POLICE

ExcessBLarg! posted:

It sounds like the perks that Google is really offering is convenience, as well as subtlely trying to encourage everyone to work longer hours.

That's always been my understanding of the calculus in offering big "lifestyle" perks. The free food and ballpit are there to keep you from caving to your human needs while you're pulling long hours at a desk.

Huragok
Sep 14, 2011

I think I'm going to unironically try building this as a gag.

Westie
May 30, 2013



Baboon Simulator

This but MongoloidDB.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

PrBacterio posted:

For its intended area of application, I find Mathematica is actually pretty good? :shrug:

It depends on what you believe Mathematica's intended area of application is

Same could be said for Matlab, too, but tons of people use these platforms for some horrendous poo poo

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Mogomra
Nov 5, 2005

simply having a wonderful time

Westie posted:

This but MongoloidDB.

I knew it couldn't have anything to do with the word "humongous."

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