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feld
Feb 11, 2008

Out of nowhere its.....

Feldman



Wheany posted:

I put my user javascript under a dropbox folder

I suppose I could do it in git... I don't trust dropbox and they don't support FreeBSD anyway

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NFX
Jun 1, 2008


It's also possible to do the same thing with a custom stylesheet for the site... F12 -> Edit site preferences -> Content.. That will save you several lines of userJS comments!

feld
Feb 11, 2008

Out of nowhere its.....

Feldman



NFX posted:

It's also possible to do the same thing with a custom stylesheet for the site... F12 -> Edit site preferences -> Content.. That will save you several lines of userJS comments!

that's the way I'm currently doing it but it's not portable. I can't really sync that easily between all my opera installs. If I had my own extension I only have to install it once and it will update when I push updates.

Wheany, how the heck were you doing that with jQuery calls? jQuery isnt built into opera. I'm guessing you've got something going on locally in your userjs that makes jQuery available to any other script. Neat idea, but will scale simply horribly and probably will conflict with sites using jQuery. Yuck.

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


feld posted:

Wheany, how the heck were you doing that with jQuery calls? jQuery isnt built into opera. I'm guessing you've got something going on locally in your userjs that makes jQuery available to any other script. Neat idea, but will scale simply horribly and probably will conflict with sites using jQuery. Yuck.

http://docs.jquery.com/Using_jQuery...Other_Libraries

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

CATAƆ
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feld posted:

Wheany, how the heck were you doing that with jQuery calls?

I tested it in the console and because it worked, I assumed that nhl.com is using it.

This doesn't use jQuery
code:
// ==UserScript==
// @name hide scores at [url]http://www.nhl.com/[/url]
// @description Hide scores at [url]http://www.nhl.com/[/url]
// @include [url]http://www.nhl.com/*[/url]
// ==/UserScript==
window.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', function () {
	var css = 'div.score{display:none !important;}',
		style = document.createElement('style')
		
	style.textContent = css;
	
	document.body.appendChild(style);
});

Startacus
May 25, 2007
I am Startacus.

Is there a way to do button macros in the mail client? For example, I want to add a button that will take a message, mark it as read and then move it to the All Mail folder. I'm basically trying to make an archive button.

Ape Agitator
Feb 19, 2004

Soylent Green is Monkeys

Okay, the new Opera 12 build is really, really nifty because of Opera:CPU (continually updated tab processor tracking)

http://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blo...s-and-opera-cpu



Edit: Remains to be seen if the Virtual Function Call error/eventual crash persists or not.

Ape Agitator fucked around with this message at Apr 9, 2012 around 21:57

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

Even through it's just feature-matching with Chrome, that looks incredibly useful and very needed. However I've been skipping that build because the comments on it report that all the previous crashes are still there, and many more.

Cuntpunch
Oct 3, 2003

A monkey in a long line of kings

Lakitu7 posted:

Even through it's just feature-matching with Chrome, that looks incredibly useful and very needed. However I've been skipping that build because the comments on it report that all the previous crashes are still there, and many more.

It has actually been more stable for me.

AbstractNapper
Jun 5, 2011


The new opera:cpu view is an excellent idea. Like people said in that opera desktop blog post, they could expand on it, showing memory usage per tab and allowing you navigate to or close tabs that are hogging CPU / memory.

Also, if there was an option to quickly locate the tab making noise/playing music, that would be awesome too, especially if working with more than 30 tabs (which is my normal session).

But the build is still unstable, mostly because of that random virtual function call error (@ Win7 x64 SP1 at least). It's in the known issues, but it doesn't happen only upon launching Opera... it may also occur while browsing, and you don't find out until you close Opera frustrated because it has *mysteriously* stopped being able to load pages. Also, scrolling performance is still ridiculously bad for many sites.

Ape Agitator
Feb 19, 2004

Soylent Green is Monkeys

Hardly anything more than anecdotal, but no function call errors thus far for me and I used to get them frequently enough that I couldn't use the 12 build.

However, as a side effect to their new drag and drop function it seems that if you have any mouse motion while left clicking a link it will "drag" it and open it in a new window. I thought maybe I had a stuck shift key but it turns out I don't have as much mouse discipline as I would have thought because for some time I was confused about all these new tabs being opened.

Just a heads up in case it happens to anyone else. Hopefully they add some form of dead zone to make it so it happens when you want it and won't with natural minor mouse movement.

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

I decided to try the new build from yesterday. The Pure Virtual Function Call thing is gone, but now it just crashes or becomes unresponsive and has to be killed every few hours. At least with the Pure Virtual one I could move the box to the corner and keep going.

Ape Agitator
Feb 19, 2004

Soylent Green is Monkeys

I actually got a crash from the out of process thread that Vista closing closed all of Opera. I was under the impression that the whole idea of moving things to their own process was so they didn't bring the entire ship down with them when they crashed.

And it was a youtube video of all things, so it wasn't even some strange rogue flash program. Haven't replicated it though.

Edit: Still not virtual function call crashes but the drag and drop behavior on left clickable links may force me to downgrade because that is just no good.

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


Ape Agitator posted:

However, as a side effect to their new drag and drop function it seems that if you have any mouse motion while left clicking a link it will "drag" it and open it in a new window. I thought maybe I had a stuck shift key but it turns out I don't have as much mouse discipline as I would have thought because for some time I was confused about all these new tabs being opened.

Just a heads up in case it happens to anyone else. Hopefully they add some form of dead zone to make it so it happens when you want it and won't with natural minor mouse movement.

So that's what's causing it. I thought it was some other kind of bug. I guess I just need to be a bit less spastic for a while.

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

Lots of things were causing the hang for me, but youtube was very often the a trigger. After about one crash an hour I've given up and gone back to 1325. Downgrading took about 5 seconds, fortunately. I expected such crashyness with plugins with 64-bit so I purposefully used 32-bit and got it anyway .

Dyscrasia
Jun 23, 2003
Give Me Hamms Premium Draft or Give Me DEATH!!!!

Lakitu7 posted:

Lots of things were causing the hang for me, but youtube was very often the a trigger. After about one crash an hour I've given up and gone back to 1325. Downgrading took about 5 seconds, fortunately. I expected such crashyness with plugins with 64-bit so I purposefully used 32-bit and got it anyway .

Same here, even Amazon.com was crashing (flash), I switched back to regular Opera until the next build comes out.

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

http://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blo...tidx=0#comments

There's a new 12 build out. It is said to improve HWA performance and reduce the crashing with OOPP, but the comments seem to suggest that it's done neither. Meanwhile, they're almost ready to declare this beta status , and their solution to HWA performance being terrible is simply to disable it by default and say that only people with new hardware should enable it to see gains, even though people with new cards are complaining just as much .

Ape Agitator
Feb 19, 2004

Soylent Green is Monkeys

The unwanted "left click slight drag opens in a new tab" was too frustrating for me to continue using 12. I'm going to be depressed as hell if that doesn't get addressed before too long because I'm really interested in 12 stuff like a functional bookmark/history address bar autocomplete.

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


God I hope this isn't a jump-the-shark moment.

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

I expect a repeat of what they have done with the last few releases:

1) Declare something that should be pre-alpha as beta
2) Spend a week working furiously with huge changelogs every few days getting it to actually beta
3) Releasing that and call it final
4) Spend about a month slowly hammering that out into a quite-good .01 build that is what they should have released in the first place
5) Start breaking everything horribly again while adding new features

This cycle is awful since what scant advertising they do is encouraging people to download the major releases, but the major releases are never good until later. In this case they are rushing the release to be the first major HWA-enabled browser, even though the HWA is still terrible and won't even be enabled by default. It makes no sense to me.

Tesseraction
Apr 5, 2009


Scrolling in this new release (x64) seems a lot smoother, at least - with HWA/WebGL enabled. And the memory usage is back down to 11.6x levels instead of the double that it was before.

Cheer up Lakitu7 maybe this one won't be so tragic.

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

CATAƆ
LOVES
FISHƧIᖷ


Lakitu7 posted:

3) Releasing that and call it final version 11.[next available decimal]
4) Spend about a month slowly hammering that out into a quite-good .01 build that is what they should have released in the first place

Fixed that for you, and also:

4.5) Release a new version on Opera Next that has nothing to do with the current Opera release or the next actual release.

AbstractNapper
Jun 5, 2011


They are attempting to do too many things with this new build.

They have the WebGl support, HWA support, which are not fully stable,
they have new html5 features (drag and drop), user webcam support, also WIP, and the 64 builds with the plugin wrapper for windows, also unstable-not working quite right. And then they do mail fixes, address bar autocomplete/history modifications, the opera:cpu view etc.

I can see why they would want to add so many new features (some of them are indeed quite useful), but they end up with very unstable builds, when they are supposed to move towards something more stable... And then it's again the good old "we are interested in regressions and crashes".

So again, low priority is given to bugs that have to do with usability like, you know, being able to successfully log on to some sites, scroll down smoothly in many pages (some of them being very popular e.g. gmail), view youtube videos without freezes/crashes. I am through filling bug reports that get fixed one or two years later (like that nasty text selection rendering bug). I only report something in the comments section or send a crash report and that's it.

And yet somehow, the final product for quite a few stable releases now, still suffers from crashes and random freezes. And more often than not, it requires disabling extensions or even full uninstallation and a new clean install. How many users are willing to go through this process with almost every upgrade?

And the ones that do, are probably the ones that are not interested in "improvements" like the default "mouse gesture UI" (ugh), the (by default) absence of the dropdown arrow in the address bar, the partial showing of a url address (until you select "Show full web address"), and other such improvements that I have to manually change EACH AND EVERY time I do a clean install.

However, I agree with them in the decision (which they did not take lightly) to have HWA and WebGL disabled by default. Too many testers of the Next builds would report crashes for the HWA without updating their gpu drivers, trying a clean install or disabling extensions, and many frustrated reports where as stupid as "Opera now sucks".

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

CATAƆ
LOVES
FISHƧIᖷ


AbstractNapper posted:

And the ones that do, are probably the ones that are not interested in "improvements" like the default "mouse gesture UI" (ugh), the (by default) absence of the dropdown arrow in the address bar, the partial showing of a url address (until you select "Show full web address"), and other such improvements that I have to manually change EACH AND EVERY time I do a clean install.

Don't forget the bookmarks and speed dial entries. If you don't remember to remove those before syncing, you get bookmarks to sites you never use on your every device.

Even better was when the first page of my speed dial was filled with similar lovely links.

Ape Agitator
Feb 19, 2004

Soylent Green is Monkeys

I really wish they'd follow through on tab grouping. It feels like all it needs is a little noodling to figure out how to have selectable "open links inside tab group" and some sort of toggle to tab group by domain and it would be approaching workable. Right now it feels like a housekeeping minigame that I don't really enjoy all that much.

Maybe after they get in their "first!" obssession they can revisit stuff to really make it good.

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


Opera isn't even really the first browser to use GPU rendering. IE9's had it for quite a while now. No idea why they're rushing it.

Cuntpunch
Oct 3, 2003

A monkey in a long line of kings

Ape Agitator posted:

I really wish they'd follow through on tab grouping. It feels like all it needs is a little noodling to figure out how to have selectable "open links inside tab group" and some sort of toggle to tab group by domain and it would be approaching workable. Right now it feels like a housekeeping minigame that I don't really enjoy all that much.

Maybe after they get in their "first!" obssession they can revisit stuff to really make it good.

All I want for tab groups is a single setting "always open links from same domain in tab group"

That's it, suddenly tab groups would be hugely, hugely functional for me. Right now if I have 20 threads I want to watch here, for example, I have to drag and drop and it is just a hassle.

Also Opera Next now crashes instantly on startup if I enable HWA - build from yesterday and 560GTX with latest drivers. Hooray!

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

New Opera Next out today:

http://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blo...tidx=0#comments

After the last one's text I expected them to be rushing for beta and delivering huge changelogs, but apparently the most exciting thing here is a new program icon. There are some crash fixes listed, but they don't sound like the ones I've encountered. The comments so far suggest that plugin handling is still flaky, but nobody's mentioned the spontaneous hanging yet, so perhaps that's gone?

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


Can't say this isn't a good idea, really.

Kevin Bacon
Sep 22, 2010




Aw man, I was using that! (Opera Unite)

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


Kevin Bacon posted:

Aw man, I was using that! (Opera Unite)

For what? You're part of a very, very small group.

Kevin Bacon
Sep 22, 2010



Heresiarch posted:

For what? You're part of a very, very small group.

I use the file sharing bit of it on occasion! And that fridge note thing was kind of handy one time!

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

CATAƆ
LOVES
FISHƧIᖷ



I won't miss either. I've installed some widgets and played with them for a while before uninstalling them, but I don't think I've ever even installed one unite app. I never really saw the point.

Ape Agitator
Feb 19, 2004

Soylent Green is Monkeys

I use Unite only for UJS manager and it's a shame that it's going away. I can't really use an extension for that because extensions are broken if you enable javascript on a per-site basis.

Still, with the exception of UJSM, Unite and Widgets were a zero for me. The way Widgets were external to the browser made them really unattractive to me and Unite was something I honestly never really grasped conceptually.

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

I always thought widgets were dumb and useless. Unite seemed like it could be a good way to send someone a file while handling NAT traversal and such, but I always just forgot about it and e-mailed it or something.

But this is theoretically a move toward improving the core browser and ditching some of the strange extraneous features, so that sounds good. It seems like widgets could easily become extensions with a little extra extension API work though, and Unite would be nice as a separate standalone app that they could release and not really maintain (aside from fixing critical security holes, if any arise).

There's another build today, but I'm not feeling brave enough to see if it's actually usable yet. These vague "fixed some crashes" logs could go either way.

Heresiarch
Oct 6, 2005

Whosoever would undertake some atrocious enterprise should act as if it were already accomplished, should impose upon himself a future as irrevocable as the past.


RC for the first beta. Most important fix:

DSK-360316 - Opera stops loading pages after a while, and "pure virtual method called" error on exit

Now if they'd just address the link-dragging problem...

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

Well, I guess I'll give it a go. I don't understand how they they think "google maps is basically unusable" isn't a blocker though.

A bunch of my older skins (just ports / old versions of windows native) broke to where part of the url bar turned black, but it was easy to find replacements. Be warned if you're attached to some specific skin that never updates anymore though.

[edit] Seems stable so far. Google maps is basically unusable, and the accidental dragging on various links is annoying. But at least there's no hanging and new PURE VIRTUAL FUNCTION CALL boxes every few hours. I turned hardware mode back on it doesn't seem any faster or slower than without it, which is at least an improvement over when scrolling was terrible with it on. Basically if they fix the dragging stuff I'll be okay with it.

For now, I'm using 32-bit because I haven't seen anything about fixing incompatibility with G+ on 64-bit, and I actually use that. Anyone tried it to confirm either way?

[edit2] Just got my first crash, a whole 3 hours in. Still not stable enough.

Lakitu7 fucked around with this message at Apr 25, 2012 around 18:07

AbstractNapper
Jun 5, 2011


Once again they seem to be rushing to go to beta, ignoring very prominent and repeatedly reported (by most testers) issues.

A beta is still far from a final release, but still, at least in theory, more people will be motivated to try it, and this RC beta is by no means something that advertises Opera in a good way.

Lakitu7
Jul 10, 2001

Watch for spinys

I'm going back to 1325. At least when it "crashes" every few hours I can just ignore the dialog box and keep going, so it's sort-of like being stable. The new one's crashes every few hours are actual crashes or hangs and that's worse.

[edit] Oh wow, they actually did decide to call this thing Beta
http://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blo...6/opera-12-beta

Lots of comments so far are appropriately very negative about this decision.

Lakitu7 fucked around with this message at Apr 26, 2012 around 06:41

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Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

CATAƆ
LOVES
FISHƧIᖷ




Very philosophical.

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