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Superabound posted:Oh yeah, why dont you say that to Admiral Bill Adama? I'd stay with her if she were an attractive president of a space ship colony but only because I'd want to leverage her power for my own gain. She'd have to buy a nicer wig than the chick on BSG though.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:03 |
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| # ? Nov 21, 2009 08:57 |
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JGTheSpy posted:Watching BSG from the start right now is like starting to date someone who has terminal cancer. Not because it's ending but because there are only two good seasons plus four episodes. Do you really want to feel obligated to stay with her after her hair falls out? That's just gross. That's why you skip the bad stuff and go straight from the miniseries to the end of season 2.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:06 |
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SNAKES N CAKES posted:That's why you skip the bad stuff and go straight from the miniseries to the end of season 2. So you watch the boring part and all of the crappy episodes?
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:09 |
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If you don't like BSG from the first episode "33" then it isn't for you. And yes, Dollhouse has been steadily improving. This was a better episode than the last. There is no conflict between the next "game changing" episode of Dollhouse and the Battlestar finale however - just watch one of them on Hulu the next day.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:20 |
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Superabound posted:I think Stockholm Syndrome deals more with actually being held captive and identifying with your captors and their ideologies, rather than some misplaced but voluntary sense of love or obligation in a situation in which you are technically free to do whatever you want. So it might be accurate if someone is literally forcing redshirt to watch Dollhouse at gunpoint, but im not at all familiar with his personal lifestyle so who knows. With my "Joss Whedon is My Master Now" t-shirt on, I proclaim: If you only knew the power of the Dark Side! I must obey my Master.  Astroman I like your explanation of character name acceptance. With actors you know from other shows, of course. There is a moment of internal acceptance that each of us must go through. Fer instance, since I rarely watch the show, there is no way Angel is Booth or whatever is his name is on Bones. And so it shall be Dr. Fred until some little switch is flipped inside me head. Some actors can do it - Harrison Ford for example can credibly be both Han Solo and Indiana Jones. And also that Henry guy.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:34 |
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I don't remember if this has been mentioned/asked or not. Is the main Dollhouse lobby the same as the Wolfram and Hart building from Angel? Someone from another board brought it up and I'm inclined to agree, once I thought about it. http://leonardharman.com/FILM/WHLobby.html http://leonardharman.com/FILM/DollhouseMain.html I imagine the set is the same (sets are always reused), but the overall design of both is very similar.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:49 |
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Cardboard Box A posted:There is no conflict between the next "game changing" episode of Dollhouse and the Battlestar finale however - just watch one of them on Hulu the next day. Wrong. The Galactica finale won't be on Hulu the next day.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 17:57 |
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SNAKES N CAKES posted:That's why you skip the bad stuff and go straight from the miniseries to the end of season 2. jiffynuts posted:I don't remember if this has been mentioned/asked or not. Is the main Dollhouse lobby the same as the Wolfram and Hart building from Angel? Someone from another board brought it up and I'm inclined to agree, once I thought about it. redshirt posted:With my "Joss Whedon is My Master Now" t-shirt on, I proclaim: If you only knew the power of the Dark Side! I must obey my Master. Superabound fucked around with this message at Mar 15, 2009 around 18:19 |
| # ? Mar 15, 2009 18:17 |
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jiffynuts posted:I don't remember if this has been mentioned/asked or not. Is the main Dollhouse lobby the same as the Wolfram and Hart building from Angel? Someone from another board brought it up and I'm inclined to agree, once I thought about it. Judging from those pictures...no, not at all? I mean, W&H uses those same wood-paneled screens, but the Dollhouse is incredibly different in any way. Besides, Wolfram and Hart was all one floor. It was elevator area, reception, Wesley/Lorne/Gunn tucked somewhere in the back, Fred hidden in a lab somewhere, and Angel's office front and centre. The Dollhouse has plenty of different areas, and multiple levels. I don't see the similarity in the slightest.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 18:21 |
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Well, I was just referring to the Dollhouse lobby. Maybe it was all the wood paneling and floor that made me see a similarity.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 18:25 |
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There is a large staircase featured prominently in the W&H set. I certainly see tons of similarities between the two sets - they both seem specific examples of corporate evil.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 18:43 |
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DivisionPost posted:Wrong. The Galactica finale won't be on Hulu the next day.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 19:01 |
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redshirt posted:With my "Joss Whedon is My Master Now" t-shirt on, I proclaim: If you only knew the power of the Dark Side! I must obey my Master.  I have a "WWJD" t-shirt - "What Would Joss Do?"
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 19:18 |
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AnimeJune posted:
"WWWW" - What would Whedon write?
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 20:39 |
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josh04 posted:"WWWW" - What would Whedon write? Something that looks feminist on the surface, but sexist underneath?  EDIT: Fixed. drat firefox spellchecker. twistedmentat fucked around with this message at Mar 15, 2009 around 22:32 |
| # ? Mar 15, 2009 21:41 |
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twistedmentat posted:Something that looks feminist on the surface, but sexiest underneath? Nothin' wrong with being sexiest. 
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 21:46 |
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redshirt posted:Nothin' wrong with being sexiest. Definitely the sexiest.  Anyhoo, I can understand where the sexist argument comes from, but I personally don't agree with it. Your female characters can be flawed or evil or indecisive, and occasionally be aided and supported by males, without you being sexist. The Dollhouse has male and female dolls and, as explained by Dr Saunders ("Dr Fred"), the males are sent on whore assignments just as often as the females (for instance, Victor's been sent on love-stud assignments eight times already). The reason we see more of Echo's is because she's the protagonist.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 22:12 |
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On the other hand, without any depiction of equal-opportunity sexy, the impression that the show gives us is gender-slanted. I don't completely agree with it, sure, but I completely understand where people are coming from. It doesn't really matter if they tell us over and over again that sexy sexy Victor is being sent on kajillions of sexy sexy missions with men, women, and everything else, if what they show us week after week is Echo's bare gyrating glutes. There is what the show presents rationally as its non-sexist backdrop, but then what we actually see and connect with are uncomfortably sexist scenarios. Which isn't bad! It's not some evil horrible thing, especially if it's supposed to be part of the cognitive/moral dissonance of it all. It's just that, well, the whole "men are dolls too!" thing simply doesn't fly after a certain mileage and altitude. Heck, it's almost more dissonant if they try to convince us that Victor is having as many sexy hot adventures as Echo but never actually show it, than if they simply confirm, "Yes the female dolls get more play. Are you actually surprised?" Stonefish posted:There was nothing wrong with his explanation. "Echo was malfunctioning, so it may have been necessary to kill her. I was standing by in case it went that way."  It assumes that security guy has any authority whatsoever to make those kinds of calls or to freaking kill a doll, which he very obviously doesn't. And what happens when Boyd comes back with the report that A)he had requested an extraction that security guy denied, which is also dubiously within his authority to do, and that B)Echo actually wasn't malfunctioning at all? How's Boss Lady going to respond to being flat-out lied to on top of her active being killed by a peon for no real reason? She doesn't seem the forgiving type who brooks insubordination too well. And the Dollhouse doesn't seem the type of organization where getting fired is the worst thing that could happen when your superiors are pissed at you.That, combined with him very WTF?ly flying off the handle and assaulting Topher in the middle of his office -- over what, exactly? -- seem like incredibly bizarre acts of cognitive contradictions that normal people probably wouldn't do. Either the guy is just really obtuse, in which case how the heck did he get the job in the first place...or maybe he was programmed with that obtuseness and single-mindedness of purpose. ...Permaybehaps I'm overthinking it, of course. BrianWilly fucked around with this message at Mar 15, 2009 around 23:10 |
| # ? Mar 15, 2009 23:04 |
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BrianWilly posted:On the other hand, without any depiction of equal-opportunity sexy, the impression that the show gives us is gender-slanted. I don't completely agree with it, sure, but I completely understand where people are coming from. It doesn't really matter if they tell us over and over again that sexy sexy Victor is being sent on kajillions of sexy sexy missions with men, women, and everything else, if what they show us week after week is Echo's bare gyrating glutes. There is what the show presents rationally as its non-sexist backdrop, but then what we actually see and connect with are uncomfortably sexist scenarios. Still, if Echo's supposedly the main character but Victor gets more screen time that wouldn't make sense either, so to me it seems necessary that Victor's whore-time has to be mentioned in passing while we see Echo's up close. And, as the latest episodes have demonstrated, she's not a whore (in the traditional sexual sense) in any of them - bodyguard, safecracker, midwife, blind cultist. She's the main character, and we the audience are encouraged to empathise and care about her more. Again, we don't have a lot to go on yet because we've only had a few bare flashes of her personality/malfunction, so to have a bette argument I'll have to see some more episodes. I can just say from a history of watching Joss Whedon's shows that I've never thought them particularly sexist.quote:That explanation is completely ridiculous. But it does bring up DeWitt's reaction - I also thought it was weird, that she'd just get all pissy and say "Take the stairs" instead of actually taking action. Conversely, however, I have to wonder why when Dominic comes to her with legitimate worries about Echo's performance that she just shrugs if off, considering what happened with Alpha. For now, I'm going to suspend my disbelief and assume these questions will be dealt with later - the "naked shower" question was pretty satisfactorily resolved this last episode, so who knows what the next eps will reveal. quote:That, combined with him very WTF?ly flying off the handle and assaulting Topher in the middle of his office -- over what, exactly? -- seem like incredibly bizarre acts of cognitive contradictions that normal people probably wouldn't do. Either the guy is just really obtuse, in which case how the heck did he get the job in the first place...or maybe he was programmed with that obtuseness and single-mindedness of purpose. Dominic attacked Topher after he found out Echo smashed the crazy singer over the head with a chair and dragged her off to meet the celebrity's stalker. To Dominic's knowledge, Echo had been specifically programmed to protect the singer, but her recent actions appeared to be in complete opposition to her programming. The Dollhouse is founded on the belief that the Dolls adhere to their programming, period. The only example of a doll who didn't is Alpha, who, you know, brutally maimed and murdered a bunch of people, something that is Dominic's job to prevent. Naturally, he blamed Topher because Topher is the one who programs all the imprints, so any supposed flaws in programming would come from his mismanagement. Of course later they learn that Echo actually was acting in the singer's best interests, but based on what Dominic knew at the time his panic is completely understandable. Alpha didn't just escape - he murdered numerous people in a blatant and intentionally sadistic fashion, and continues to interfere with the Dollhouse's operations in dangerous ways. As head of security, keeping the Dollhouse and its inhabitants safe is Dominic's sole priority. If he thinks Echo endangers the Dollhouse, he thinks it's better to take her out now, and if he can do it with no one the wiser, so much the better.
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| # ? Mar 15, 2009 23:39 |
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jiffynuts posted:I don't remember if this has been mentioned/asked or not. Is the main Dollhouse lobby the same as the Wolfram and Hart building from Angel? Someone from another board brought it up and I'm inclined to agree, once I thought about it. Is Warner Bros owned by Fox or something? If not I'd think there's zero chance it's the same set. Plus they don't look to be the same set in those pictures anyway. They're both pretty generic lobbies with two floors visible but the resemblance ends there.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 00:34 |
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jiffynuts posted:I don't remember if this has been mentioned/asked or not. Is the main Dollhouse lobby the same as the Wolfram and Hart building from Angel? Someone from another board brought it up and I'm inclined to agree, once I thought about it. Unrelated to the question but I was browsing that guy's site and looking at the other pics he has for Dollhouse sets and I think I found a spoiler under the "Lair" section. Spoiler! http://leonardharman.com/FILM/IMAGES/DollLair2.jpg Spoiler! Is that Wash  ?
MacBook Air Gamer fucked around with this message at Mar 16, 2009 around 03:40 |
| # ? Mar 16, 2009 00:51 |
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I was thinking that too, but I think its a combination of them being open concept, natural material lobbies and both the last Seasons of Angel and Dollhouse are shot the same way. It wold be nice to see Echo in more roles that didn't involve her slutting it up as part of it. I will admit, when dealing when men, a hot slutty girl will distract them. Though I find the concept that the Dolls are used as hookers very creepy. It's probably easy money though.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 00:53 |
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Platter posted:Is Warner Bros owned by Fox or something? If not I'd think there's zero chance it's the same set. Plus they don't look to be the same set in those pictures anyway. They're both pretty generic lobbies with two floors visible but the resemblance ends there. Plus, since those sets are both from the same designer's site, I bet Whedon picked him specifically for Dollhouse based on his past work on Angel. An "I like what you did on the Wolfram and Hart set, can you design me something similar in look?" kind of thing. Also, after watching the most recent episode, which is my favorite so far, I think that we should change the thread title to: Joss Whedon's Dollhouse: Fox wants you to have a man reaction EDITEDITEDIT: MacBook Air Gamer posted:Unrelated to the question but I was browsing that guy's site and looking at the other pics he has for Dollhouse sets and I think I found a spoiler under the "Lair" section. WHOA. Mind blown, because I thought there was no way that the rumors were true. Edit 2: Also, is that a Mind wiping chair I am seeing in his lair? Superrodan fucked around with this message at Mar 16, 2009 around 01:12 |
| # ? Mar 16, 2009 00:54 |
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quote:It doesn't really matter if they tell us over and over again that sexy sexy Victor is being sent on kajillions of sexy sexy missions with men, women, and everything else, if what they show us week after week is Echo's bare gyrating glutes. For what it's worth, they did spend an entire B-plot in one episode on Victor Boner Watch. That's pretty invasive and creepy right there, especially considering the overall message was "Has the constant whoring we've sent him on left some residual feelings? No, he just likes a pretty girl. Lets mind-wipe the poo poo out of him!". They are equal opportunity in their skeezy exploitation, they just have to spend more time on the main character.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 00:58 |
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MacBook Air Gamer posted:Is that Wash Hell yes!
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 00:59 |
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Superrodan posted:Plus, since those sets are both from the same designer's site, I bet Whedon picked him specifically for Dollhouse based on his past work on Angel. An "I like what you did on the Wolfram and Hart set, can you design me something similar in look?" kind of thing.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:10 |
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BrianWilly posted:On the other hand, without any depiction of equal-opportunity sexy, the impression that the show gives us is gender-slanted. I don't completely agree with it, sure, but I completely understand where people are coming from. It doesn't really matter if they tell us over and over again that sexy sexy Victor is being sent on kajillions of sexy sexy missions with men, women, and everything else, if what they show us week after week is Echo's bare gyrating glutes. There is what the show presents rationally as its non-sexist backdrop, but then what we actually see and connect with are uncomfortably sexist scenarios.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:11 |
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IMDB listing quoted here, spoilered like the above (Alan Tudyk) # "Dollhouse" .... Alpha (1 episode, 2009) - Omega (2009) TV episode .... Alpha 
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:14 |
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MacBook Air Gamer posted:Is that Wash Efb 
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:15 |
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Isn't IMDB like wikipedia though and any idiot can edit it?
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:19 |
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IRQ posted:Isn't IMDB like wikipedia though and any idiot can edit it? I think so, but with that picture..
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:21 |
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IRQ posted:Isn't IMDB like wikipedia though and any idiot can edit it? Yes, but when paired with that photo of the "Lair" and the caption for said lair, it becomes pretty compelling.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 01:21 |
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The lair page was removed or something.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 02:57 |
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Braki posted:Yes, but when paired with that photo of the "Lair" and the caption for said lair, it becomes pretty compelling. Also, anyone who considers revealing which actor will play a part to be a spoiler is... not right in the head. But the "spoiler that poo poo" gang in TVIV is pretty large, so I best watch my mouth. Honestly, do some of you channel surf come September hoping to come across a show you like, refusing to even learn about upcoming shows, because the synopsis might "spoil" the 3rd minute of the premiere? When a movie trailer airs do you close your eyes and plug your ears when the "Starring..." part comes up? Superman has superpowers? SPOILER THAT poo poo!! Superrodan posted:Also, is that a Mind wiping chair I am seeing in his lair? I see a stool and a wooden chair? 
DVD Drive fucked around with this message at Mar 16, 2009 around 03:38 |
| # ? Mar 16, 2009 03:12 |
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Platter posted:Also, anyone who considers revealing which actor will play a part to be a spoiler is... not right in the head. But the "spoiler that poo poo" gang in TVIV is pretty large, so I best watch my mouth. There was a discussion in Whedonesque about this when the posted that same picture. People argued that, because Alpha's character has been pretty hidden, it could be a spoiler if they tried to do a fake reveal, or have the actor initially pretend to be someone else.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 03:38 |
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Platter posted:
There was another pictures from the now defunct "Lair" section which showed a homemade type chair like the mind-wiping station in the Dollhouse, situated right next to a bunch of computer monitors and a console. So yeah, I guess Alpha has his way of accessing his personalities . edit: here's the pic + a rehost of the last pic i posted in case it gets taken down too SPOILERS http://j.photos.cx/DollLair3-aaa.jpg http://j.photos.cx/DollLair2-dfe.jpg MacBook Air Gamer fucked around with this message at Mar 16, 2009 around 03:41 |
| # ? Mar 16, 2009 03:39 |
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Platter posted:Also, anyone who considers revealing which actor will play a part to be a spoiler is... not right in the head. Actually it could very well be a spoiler if the character were to be introduced as a "hey, this is just some dude, oh, twist! He's Alpha" sort of way. I liked this ep...it's probably the best one in terms of no corny dialogue and pretty cool twists. And dammit, get with the neighbor lady already. Looking forward to episode 6.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 03:45 |
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Braki posted:There was a discussion in Whedonesque about this when the posted that same picture. People argued that, because Alpha's character has been pretty hidden, it could be a spoiler if they tried to do a fake reveal, or have the actor initially pretend to be someone else. That's a valid point. I just doubt the character they introduced as having slaughtered Echo's family for no reason and being a mass murderer/disfigurer in general is going to posses so much subtlety as to not be identified seconds after he's shown onscreen. It would last one episode, at most. But maybe I'm given the writers too much credit. MacBook Air Gamer posted:There was another pictures from the now defunct "Lair" section which showed a homemade type chair like the mind-wiping station in the Dollhouse, situated right next to a bunch of computer monitors and a console. So yeah, I guess Alpha has his way of accessing his personalities . I guess with that info it seems Alpha is even more Dollhouse-obsessed than I thought. That would explain how (or at least why) he learned to interfere wirelessly with Echo. In order to do things like this he must not be as unstable as the organization thinks he is. Hell, he's got to be downright ingenious. He's doing things with the technology that Topher himself admitted last episode he can't do (wireless wipes). Not exactly the work of someone who is so dumb he stabs anyone who looks at him funny, especially if he just had all of his memories erased. But I guess they'll argue that imprinting messed with his psyche, blah blah blah. DVD Drive fucked around with this message at Mar 16, 2009 around 04:07 |
| # ? Mar 16, 2009 03:59 |
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That said, I think Alan Tyduk will probably be awesome and pull off the role with flair to spare. ( )
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 04:21 |
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Does anyone else get the vibe that Whedon looks up to the Battlestar Galactica crew and wishes to emulate them? We have the reference to EJO in an early episode, but more importantly he's created a show where we all speculate who might be a sleeper Active (anyone could be a Cylon!). I think it's an intentional similarity, though I think Whedon meant for it to be less noticeable. It's like he's trying to emulate his cool older brother or something.
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| # ? Mar 16, 2009 04:37 |
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