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Goon Matchmaker
Oct 23, 2003

I play too much EVE-Online

Shumagorath posted:

How much does a good RAID-5 card cost?


Like $200-300 for a 4 port one.

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Fangs404
Dec 20, 2004

I time bomb.

Shumagorath posted:

How much does a good RAID-5 card cost?

A good RAID-5 card can cost you $300+ (areca good). That's why I was looking into software.

Thanks guys! I think I may end up going with FreeNAS and RAID-Z or RAID-Z2.

kri kri
Jul 18, 2007



There is a decent write up about building a WHS build for Vail if anyone is interested here:

http://www.mediasmartserver.net/201...e-lovely-title/

MonkeyFit
May 13, 2009


kri kri posted:

There is a decent write up about building a WHS build for Vail if anyone is interested here:

http://www.mediasmartserver.net/201...e-lovely-title/

Excellent link. I wish I had the money for it though. I downloaded all the iso's and everything and was just getting ready to set up a test box when I realized it was an Athlon XP processor. I'll just have to watch this thread and listen to what people say. Also people should experiment with dropping the volume drivers into their windows 7 boxes to see if they can read the hard drives.

PUBLIC TOILET
Jun 13, 2009



While their desire to completely alter the file system for Vail seems reasonable, it really is a dumb thing to do when you consider how widely supported NTFS is. I think their desired modifications will make the process of the OS spreading files among hard disks for duplication purposes much more efficient. However, having to install a special driver/application to access that data outside the server is lovely. It will make it initially impossible to recover data on an open source system (initially if Microsoft decides to make an SDK or something to make it easier to support in open source operating systems). Fat chance in that regard. What's more disturbing though is if they're admitting to having bugs with this new design when using more than ten hard drives, what are the odds we'll see another data loss issue in Vail like we did in WHS v1 pre-Power Pack 1? I'd say pretty good. I wouldn't trust my data in the hands of an altered file system design by Microsoft that they haven't tested anywhere else yet.

MonkeyFit
May 13, 2009


What are the odds of being able to obtain a copy of WHS v1 once v2 ships? Will it become absolutely impossible or do you think it will hang around for a while?

jeeves
May 27, 2001

Deranged Psychopathic
Butler Extraordinaire


I stupidly installed a dynamic disk on a single drive a few years ago, and when I tried to plug it into another machine via USB<->SATA adapter it wouldn't read no matter what, and was generally a giant loving nightmare to deal with.

I was really hoping to wait until Vail to try out WHS, but the idea of dealing with more software raid weirdness honestly feels like a nightmare. I hope they fix that before releasing Vail but I it sounds like they won't.

redeyes
Sep 14, 2002
I LOVE THE WHITE STRIPES!

jeeves posted:

I stupidly installed a dynamic disk on a single drive a few years ago, and when I tried to plug it into another machine via USB<->SATA adapter it wouldn't read no matter what, and was generally a giant loving nightmare to deal with.

I was really hoping to wait until Vail to try out WHS, but the idea of dealing with more software raid weirdness honestly feels like a nightmare. I hope they fix that before releasing Vail but I it sounds like they won't.

This is me too. I actually downloaded the entire thing and then was about to set it up and was like... uh I don't actually want to do this. I felt kind of sad so I decided to reload WHS v1 pp3 and optimize the crap out of it. Oh well. Nice to know ya WHS. I wonder how long MS will support v1?

jeeves
May 27, 2001

Deranged Psychopathic
Butler Extraordinaire


redeyes posted:

This is me too. I actually downloaded the entire thing and then was about to set it up and was like... uh I don't actually want to do this. I felt kind of sad so I decided to reload WHS v1 pp3 and optimize the crap out of it. Oh well. Nice to know ya WHS. I wonder how long MS will support v1?

It just kind of sucks because I deal with really nice raids enough at work that run on way too expensive of hardware for me to afford at home. So it's like I've been spoiled by them that dealing with them at work doesn't want to make me come home and deal with a much shittier software/cheap raid on my off-time for my own files.

I've been using Win2003 for the last 5 years on my home tiny low power home server that I upload like 100gb of stuff to for a lovely NAS for my housemates/gf to enjoy streaming from, so the 'just add your own disks if you want, they don't have to match sizes or whatever' JBOD setup that WHSv1 seems to have was appealing to me for eventually making a full time home server.

But dealing with bizarre software raid/dynamic poo poo like I recently just dealt with is quite a deal breaker for wanting to wait for v2 of WHS.

jeeves fucked around with this message at May 4, 2010 around 06:48

stgdz
Nov 3, 2006

158 grains of smiley powered justice

Is Veil going to have MCE integrated into it?

SwiftStrikerInc
Feb 5, 2002
[img]platypus[/img] The platypus stands as a testament to my own stupidity

stgdz posted:

Is Veil going to have MCE integrated into it?

Current status is No. It might be added later, but as of the current beta there is no Media center capabilities built into the OS.

PUBLIC TOILET
Jun 13, 2009



jeeves posted:

It just kind of sucks because I deal with really nice raids enough at work that run on way too expensive of hardware for me to afford at home. So it's like I've been spoiled by them that dealing with them at work doesn't want to make me come home and deal with a much shittier software/cheap raid on my off-time for my own files.

I've been using Win2003 for the last 5 years on my home tiny low power home server that I upload like 100gb of stuff to for a lovely NAS for my housemates/gf to enjoy streaming from, so the 'just add your own disks if you want, they don't have to match sizes or whatever' JBOD setup that WHSv1 seems to have was appealing to me for eventually making a full time home server.

But dealing with bizarre software raid/dynamic poo poo like I recently just dealt with is quite a deal breaker for wanting to wait for v2 of WHS.

It really is a shame because after playing with the Vail preview in VMware, it feels 75% easier to use than WHS v1. I guess Microsoft is sacrificing a lot under the hood to get this into the hands of consumers who want something more simple to play with.

kri kri
Jul 18, 2007



COCKMOUTH.GIF posted:

It really is a shame because after playing with the Vail preview in VMware, it feels 75% easier to use than WHS v1. I guess Microsoft is sacrificing a lot under the hood to get this into the hands of consumers who want something more simple to play with.
I'm happy to trade some performance and usage improvements for not being able to save data with an open source system. I am pretty sure Microsoft or some other coder will make a Windows recover tool for Vail hard drives.

LinuxGirl87
Feb 13, 2006

by Ozmaugh


Can WHS2 have an OS disk and a diskpool separate? (Say, a small 10k RPM OS drive and a large 7200 RPM storage pool.)

ClassH
Mar 17, 2008


LinuxGirl87 posted:

Can WHS2 have an OS disk and a diskpool separate? (Say, a small 10k RPM OS drive and a large 7200 RPM storage pool.)

Yes. We finally have the option to not include the OS drive in the pool.

blackswordca
Apr 25, 2010

Just 'cause you pour syrup on something doesn't make it pancakes!

I don't suppose the OS can be run off of a USB key..

kri kri
Jul 18, 2007



blackswordca posted:

I don't suppose the OS can be run off of a USB key..

Don't see why not. Anyone know off hand how much v1 WHS OS is?

blackswordca
Apr 25, 2010

Just 'cause you pour syrup on something doesn't make it pancakes!

kri kri posted:

Don't see why not. Anyone know off hand how much v1 WHS OS is?

Newegg.ca lists it as $110 canadian

Nephzinho
Jan 24, 2008



blackswordca posted:

Newegg.ca lists it as $110 canadian

I don't know if this was meant to be sarcastic, but given the context one can assume he meant disk space. It is not very large, probably would be doable with a 16gb stick easily with room to spare.

kri kri
Jul 18, 2007



zerox147o posted:

I don't know if this was meant to be sarcastic, but given the context one can assume he meant disk space. It is not very large, probably would be doable with a 16gb stick easily with room to spare.

Yeah I meant disk space. I would think if you could get the install down quite a bit, maybe 10 gigs or so? It would be awesome to run on a SSD I would imagine.

blackswordca
Apr 25, 2010

Just 'cause you pour syrup on something doesn't make it pancakes!

I wasn't meaning sarcastic. I thought you meant cost. Im torn between WHS, UNraid and a headless Ubuntu install at the moment... Im just trying to get all the info about WHS before I throw down the cash for it.

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

"That which can be destroyed by the truth should be." Do not flinch from experiences that might destroy your beliefs. The thought you cannot think controls you more than thoughts you speak aloud.


blackswordca posted:

I wasn't meaning sarcastic. I thought you meant cost. Im torn between WHS, UNraid and a headless Ubuntu install at the moment... Im just trying to get all the info about WHS before I throw down the cash for it.

You can use the trial version. I ran the trial version for a year before I bought WHS by getting several copies of the trial and doing a simple server reinstall every 3 months.

Nephzinho
Jan 24, 2008



blackswordca posted:

I wasn't meaning sarcastic. I thought you meant cost. Im torn between WHS, UNraid and a headless Ubuntu install at the moment... Im just trying to get all the info about WHS before I throw down the cash for it.

What are your needs? I run a server that is just for within the house/access for friends and family to back up their stuff and access my movie and show library. WHS is easy to run and use for my purposes. Now if I wanted to start hosting anything that would get any decent amount of traffic, I'd start running into some trouble.

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

"That which can be destroyed by the truth should be." Do not flinch from experiences that might destroy your beliefs. The thought you cannot think controls you more than thoughts you speak aloud.


zerox147o posted:

What are your needs? I run a server that is just for within the house/access for friends and family to back up their stuff and access my movie and show library. WHS is easy to run and use for my purposes. Now if I wanted to start hosting anything that would get any decent amount of traffic, I'd start running into some trouble.

What kind of trouble that you wouldn't run in to on WHS alternatives?

Nephzinho
Jan 24, 2008



Thermopyle posted:

What kind of trouble that you wouldn't run in to on WHS alternatives?

Fair point. It is a nonissue for me, but I remember when deciding what to run for a server reading that WHS can get bogged down pretty easily. It very well might be a problem with home servers in general and more to do with bandwith limitations than anything in the hardware or os.

blackswordca
Apr 25, 2010

Just 'cause you pour syrup on something doesn't make it pancakes!

mostly im using to host and stream media.. videos and music specifically. It wont be high traffic. I have a mini PC running Ubuntu 10.04 with XBMC that I will be streaming to media too. I also got lucky with my condo, they have gigabit ethernet wired into the walls. Its going to be a high capacity server, starting out at 8 tb.

I like the dynamic drive pooling in WHC, redundancy isn't really a big issue for me. I wont be storing anything on there that I cannot afford to lose.

blackswordca fucked around with this message at May 5, 2010 around 20:01

EC
Jul 10, 2001

The Legend


blackswordca posted:

mostly im using to host and stream media.. videos and music specifically. It wont be high traffic. I have a mini PC running Ubuntu 10.04 with XBMC that I will be streaming to media too. I also got lucky with my condo, they have gigabit ethernet wired into the walls. Its going to be a high capacity server, starting out at 8 tb.

I like the dynamic drive pooling in WHC, redundancy isn't really a big issue for me. I wont be storing anything on there that I cannot afford to lose.

I was in your same situation, and ultimately went with WHS over unRAID because I was much more familiar with the Windows environment. I also find it easy to RDC into the box and be able to install various pieces of software (SAB, uTorrent, Growl for Windows, EyeFI manager, etc) that should be run on an actual server. That and being able to increase the drive pool size without having to do anything than physically installing the drive and clicking a few times is a big win for me.

There's also a fairly large user base for WHS, with a couple of different active forums and websites dedicated to it. The MS forum is great if you have a problem and can avoid talking like a jackass on the internet.

My only real complaint about WHS is that the console is so...loving...slow. If you happen to type in the wrong password, it waits for about 30 seconds before alerting you. I hardly use any of the plugins out there simply because I hate using the console so much.

LinuxGirl87
Feb 13, 2006

by Ozmaugh


Drizzt01 posted:

Yes. We finally have the option to not include the OS drive in the pool.

Good to know. It'll be quicker to rip (legally owned disk media, naturally) to the 10K drive and copy it to the "slow" shares (still gobsmacked that 7200 RPM is now "slow" ) rather than having to write directly to them.

LinuxGirl87 fucked around with this message at May 6, 2010 around 00:30

Shumagorath
Jun 5, 2001


LinuxGirl87 posted:

Good to know. It'll be quicker to rip (legally owned disk media, naturally) to the 10K drive and copy it to the "slow" shares (still gobsmacked that 7200 RPM is now "slow" ) rather than having to write directly to them.
If you're ripping disc media the optical drive is the bottleneck.

univbee
Jun 3, 2004

Let's maintain dazzling beer indefinitely.


kri kri posted:

Don't see why not. Anyone know off hand how much v1 WHS OS is?

It creates a 20 gig OS partition on the first drive in your system, with whatever's left over on your drive going to the pool (your main drive has to be at least I think 80 gigs for the OS to install at all). On my WHSv1 box, just shy of 10 gigs of the OS partition is in actual use. Since I've installed Windows 7 on a 16 gig SSD, I don't think there's any reason 16-20 gigs for a main drive wouldn't be more than enough, assuming you weren't going to be installing any large extra apps on the thing.

kri kri
Jul 18, 2007



Does anyone run a DVD/blu ray cataloging software on their WHS box? I looked at My Movies, but I am not thrilled being nickle and dimed with their features.

blackswordca
Apr 25, 2010

Just 'cause you pour syrup on something doesn't make it pancakes!

kri kri posted:

Does anyone run a DVD/blu ray cataloging software on their WHS box? I looked at My Movies, but I am not thrilled being nickle and dimed with their features.

I think if you use a program for streaming it like XBMC or Boxee it'll take of all of that for you.

kri kri
Jul 18, 2007



blackswordca posted:

I think if you use a program for streaming it like XBMC or Boxee it'll take of all of that for you.

XBMC has no real offline management.

Nephzinho
Jan 24, 2008



So I decided to set up my WHS for remote access yesterday. I have my desktop and server away from the router itself set up through powerline networking and an ethernet switch. While trying to configure remote access I played around with the port settings (80 to 8080 and 443 to 4433) to try to get past my ISP, but was unable to. Eventually I was about to get a response at servername.homeserver.com as I had set it up in the domain registry, but upon "add an exception" it just took me to my routers set up page. Gave up and came back a few hours later to find that my server and desktop now cannot see the rest of the network and I get a 400 bad request error whenever i try to access 192.168.1.1 to check the router, and no access otherwise. Took my desktop off the switch and directly into the powerline and it doesn't recognize anything. The desktop that is in the same room as the router is wired in and works fine. Wireless works fine. What did WHS do and how can I fix this?

e: tried system restoring a day back but I'm not sure what is going on. The desktop is now seeing the rest of the computers attached to the network, but is going incredibly slow and is still giving the 400 error. Its like its reading the home server as the router and going through it for everything.

e2: I think I've undone all the settings changes so that whs and my desktop are once again part of the house network, but I still am lacking remote access. Though I'm going to go ahead and assume that having the Router -> Powerline -> Ethernet switch -> WHS is something to do with the problem. Will run a cable straight between the linksys and server and see if that allows remote?

e3: No goddamn clue. Put the WHS box directly into the router and it didn't recognize it was even there. Not sure what the hell happened in this networking clusterfuck.

Nephzinho fucked around with this message at May 11, 2010 around 01:05

LLJKSiLk
Jul 7, 2005

We don't need a crystal ball to see the future. Roll Tide.

Questions on using this to serve media:

Would I be loving myself to put some WD "Green" 5400rpm drives to stream video, etc. to an XBox 360 or should I consider nothing less than 7200rpm?

I'm wanting to build one.

Is the Maximum PC build the way to go? What is the max I should look at putting into this as far as specs go (prior to veil or whatever)?

My use is pretty much file storage, media streaming of music/video to xbox 360, PS3, PC, Laptop.

Cryptic Edge
Aug 4, 2006

by Y Kant Ozma Post


SiLk-2k5 posted:

Questions on using this to serve media:

Would I be loving myself to put some WD "Green" 5400rpm drives to stream video, etc. to an XBox 360 or should I consider nothing less than 7200rpm?

I'm wanting to build one.

Is the Maximum PC build the way to go? What is the max I should look at putting into this as far as specs go (prior to veil or whatever)?

My use is pretty much file storage, media streaming of music/video to xbox 360, PS3, PC, Laptop.

I'm using 4x 2tb WD green drives in my WHS with a dual core atom processor. It works very well for streaming if you use PS3 media server on high quality for WIFI settings.

FCKGW
May 21, 2006

Buttcoin is the future of online butts. Buttcoin is a peer-to-peer butt. Peer-to-peer means that no central authority issues new butts or tracks butts.



SiLk-2k5 posted:

Questions on using this to serve media:

Would I be loving myself to put some WD "Green" 5400rpm drives to stream video, etc. to an XBox 360 or should I consider nothing less than 7200rpm?

I'm wanting to build one.

Is the Maximum PC build the way to go? What is the max I should look at putting into this as far as specs go (prior to veil or whatever)?

My use is pretty much file storage, media streaming of music/video to xbox 360, PS3, PC, Laptop.

You honestly don't really need much. If your primary use is storage and streaming, get a nice low-wattage processor and mobo. Fry's and Newegg have a few energy efficient cpu/mobo combos for sub-$100.

My server has a mix of regular and green drives, and I've had no issues. You're not really going to be hitting the transfer limits just serving files so go ahead with the green drives. I've even seen a few WHS building using laptop drives with no issues.

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

"That which can be destroyed by the truth should be." Do not flinch from experiences that might destroy your beliefs. The thought you cannot think controls you more than thoughts you speak aloud.


SiLk-2k5 posted:

Questions on using this to serve media:

Would I be loving myself to put some WD "Green" 5400rpm drives to stream video, etc. to an XBox 360 or should I consider nothing less than 7200rpm?



In all likelihood your network is going to be your bottleneck anyway.

Dobermaniac
Jun 10, 2004


I have 3 WD 1tb green drives(ears) and I haven't had any problem streaming 22gb movie files to my revo with xbmc. This is over a gigabit network.

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zin
Nov 3, 2003

WHEEEAOOOW

Same here, got my hp-box a few days ago and moved the WD green-disks from my workstation to it and streaming very large files is not an issue. Very pleased with WHS so far, it's quite a change from opensolaris but there's basically no administration when compared and selecting what to mirror on folder level saves me loads of diskspace

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