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Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Ainsley McTree posted:

Starbucks hasn't responded to my application yet :(

Yeah, the new thread title may be too optimistic.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 22:20 on May 14, 2010

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Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

MoFauxHawk posted:

I also really enjoy fajita burritos from Chipotle, with sour cream and stuff.

Sour cream is an abomination. Tacochat continues.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Aschlafly posted:

3.75/180 with three science majors, and I am officially... waitlisted at Harvard! Yay! I didn't really want to go very badly, anyway. I guess it's back to having panic attacks and figuring out what to do with my life!

That sucks. In retrospect, I wish I had tried to become a math teacher instead of an attorney. If you have no idea what to do with your life and want to do something constructive, maybe try teaching high school science?

Or just wait and reapply. I wouldn't be shocked if you could pull off a full ride at a T14.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

7StoryFall posted:

Do that and become a quant. You'll make more money, work less, and crash the stock market every so often.

Don't become a quant. Quantitative financial analysis, as currently practiced, is dreary as gently caress, completely soulless, and devoid of meaning. I have a math, CS, and econ background and did stochastic modeling for a summer. The math was fun, but the people who will hire you to do the modeling won't be interested in honest predictions, they'll want crazy-rear end models grounded in nothing that make them look good.

If you're in math withdrawal and don't want to give the law school application cycle another shot I'd say go back to grad school and then do something productive for society.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Petey posted:

Don't go to law school. Go for theoretical bio. You'll make more money and you'll actually help people.

So Petey, I know you've done a lot of research into graduate programs leading to degrees that enable teaching law and jurisprudence to undergrads. Given the job situation, my wife has given me the green light to pursue further education, assuming I can manage a full ride. I love jurisprudence (critical theory and neo-pragmatism in particular) and have really enjoyed the scholarly writing I've done in law school.

Do you know much about programs in the DC or NY areas, how to apply, what to look for in a program and so forth? If my clerkship doesn't come through and the PTO doesn't start hiring in the very near future, I think this may be my way forward. I'd also be down with philosophy, but my undergrad degrees aren't philosophy related, so I think that's out.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Napoleon I posted:

So, done with 1L as of Thursday!

Problem: due to my loving up the online application process, I can't apply for Law Review (or any other journal, for that matter).

How hosed am I? I have no interest in academia (or actually being on law review), but wanted to clerk.

Journal is extremely important if you're interested in clerking. If it really was a simple screwup on your part and you can make a straight-faced argument to whoever is in charge that it would be in no way unfair to the other competitors to make an exception to the normal process to enable you to apply, you should start hustling to make it happen.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

sigmachiev posted:

I'm already toying with some ideas for Princeton's MPA or PhD in policy, maybe look into those. We were talking in IRC earlier that the GRE requirements for getting into Woodrow Wilson aren't too bad and since you have some other scholarly chops and went to a good law school you might have a good path there.

Thanks for the suggestion - I'll check it out.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Blakkout posted:

The only thing better than celebrating the end of the year with finals, is celebrating the end of finals with a two week journal petition. I think this is "soul crushing" to a T.

Just wait until you're celebrating the end of the year by preparing for an interview during your final round of finals.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Draile posted:

Has there been a change in the qualifications for federal government jobs? I remember GS-11 jobs being entry level, requiring only a J.D. Now whenever I see a GS-11 job it requires either (1) one year of experience, or (2) top 1/3 class or law review membership to qualify. GS-12 now requires two years' experience, but I remember it as having required only one.

I was recently told (by the USPTO) that qualification at GS-11 requires either one year of specialized experience or a Ph.D., and that a J.D. alone will only qualify a candidate for GS-9.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Baruch Obamawitz posted:

This is accurate, except I think you need above a 3.0 for your JD to get GS-9, otherwise GS-7. Then again, I'm a GS-12 after two and a half years, so it's not like promotion comes slowly when working at the fed.

Between IBR and the speed with which examiners are promoted, I'm really not concerned with the level at which I'm hired; I'm just trying to get in. Unfortunately, the last opening was at GS-11.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Napoleon I posted:

Yeah, I tried this, got shot down. Emailed back, explained what happened, and received a terse and fairly rude email back stating that there were absolutely no exceptions.

Talked to two deans, neither was able/willing to do anything.

I (and at least 5 other people I know) all forgot to fill out a second required form. I generated an application number, assumed I was done, and then after the 5 p.m. deadline read the confirmation email, wherein I was informed about the other form.

That really really sucks. I'd tell you to take it up with a dean (particularly since a number of other people made the same mistake), but you already did that. At least you gave it a shot. As a last resort, you might try petitioning together. Assuming that the write-on hasn't begun there really is no reason I can think of, aside from administrative laziness, that in the scenario you've described exceptions shouldn't be made.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Baruch Obamawitz posted:

We're supposed to be opening up hiring back to the "general public" in October. I think we're hiring patent professionals now, though, and I think we might consider you currently if you've passed the patent bar even if you don't have work experience. Find a SPE's phone number in an art unit that matches your undergrad.

If you PM me, I might be able to help put you in contact with someone on Tuesday.

I appreciate it. Unfortunately though, based on what HR has told me, the new deal is that they have to approve a candidate before that candidate can sit down and talk to a SPE, so it's completely out of the SPE's hands if there isn't a current announcement. The bureaucratization of the hiring process has led to some absurd results. One of my friends from my former firm had three years of experience as an examiner, applied under the GS-11 announcement, and was rejected because they took so long in processing his application that he "missed" HR's arbitrary deadline for rehires.

I think the "patent professional" program was the GS-11 announcement, and I was ultimately rejected under that announcement as lacking the necessary year of experience.

The good news is that HR has also said that over the summer they plan to put up GS-9 postings for specific backgrounds, most likely CS, EE, and bio. I'm a Patent Agent with a CS background, a summer of preparation and prosecution experience at a patent firm, and a patent-related journal publication so, if and when that happens, I should be in good stead. Regardless, it would rock if they do open it back up to the "general public" in October. That makes me think that they might go back to hiring engineers straight out of undergrad.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 02:03 on May 10, 2010

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Napoleon I posted:

Yeah, I tried this, got shot down. Emailed back, explained what happened, and received a terse and fairly rude email back stating that there were absolutely no exceptions.

Talked to two deans, neither was able/willing to do anything.

I (and at least 5 other people I know) all forgot to fill out a second required form. I generated an application number, assumed I was done, and then after the 5 p.m. deadline read the confirmation email, wherein I was informed about the other form.

in absentia posted:

Last year we had a guy send an e-mail to the Editor-in-Chief threatening congressional hearings after the Westlaw dropbox didn't let him submit his packet on time.

It worked.

So, hopefully you know a Congressman?
Actually, is the competition itself run by the journal's editorial board? If so, I would email the current editor-in-chief directly explaining the situation, and tell the other people in your situation to do the same. There's really nothing to lose by doing that. The worst that happens is that he or she gets annoyed, and it's not like they'll have any power over you if you're denied the opportunity to write on.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

billion dollar bitch posted:

Should I mention the margin/font issue to him, that I heard that there were students that bent the rules for themselves and I was kind of pissed when I heard (which could make him watch out for it/maybe downgrade people). Or should I just do nothing?

Either response is reasonable. If you do decide to contact the professor though, I'd check your school's rules about communicating with a professor regarding an exam before the grades are out. It's strictly forbidden to do so where I'm at.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

HolySwissCheese posted:

My LRW final was legit lost-themed, I had to represent Hugo Reyes, sole proprietor of Reyes of Light vs John Locke, representative of the Island Condominium Poject

Your professor is awesome.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

omgwtfnoway posted:

I always envisioned finishing my last 1L final as the happiest day of the year. I was wrong. I feel so empty now.

I had the same feeling. Happiness will come (if at all) when your grades are released. In the meantime, try to chill out like a human being until your summer obligations kick in (assuming you aren't writing on right now, in which case I feel for you).

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

JudicialRestraints posted:

Does anyone know the proper format for a prayer to Tzeentch/Nyalothotep for an A on a law exam?

I believe that the preferred deity for these purposes is Shub-Niggurath. Try the following: "Ever Their praises, and abundance to the Black Goat of the Woods. Iä! Shub-Niggurath! Iä! Shub-Niggurath! The Black Goat of the Woods with a Thousand Young!"

Of course, if you happen to be studying admiralty, you can't go wrong with: "Iä-R'lyeh! Cthulhu fhtagn! Iä! Iä!"

The Iäs are important, be sure to get those right.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 05:53 on May 14, 2010

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

JudicialRestraints posted:

Why the gently caress would I pray to a fertility deity for criminal procedure? I feel like Yog Sothoth is the goto for law exams, but Nyalothotep probably personally crafted my state's criminal code so I figure his aid would be the most useful.

Well, you're looking for an abundance of points on the exam. That's Shubby's territory.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Petey posted:

So I'm thinking of working on a new, but much shorter article (or note) about Facebook.

The general idea would be whether or not we should think of Facebook as a monopoly, or more specifically as possessing the anticompetitive characteristics that make monopolies dangerous (see this for a rundown of the argument). I discussed this briefly in my old paper, but was thinking about actually doing an article, probably working with my thesis advisor, both a) to make it more likely to get published and b) have his guidance in working with more formal stuff.

The question I have for people here is: what is your recommended reading for monopoly / antitrust law? By which I mean not only cases and statutes, but also histories of how it came to be, the forces the drove its creation, the underlying principles animating its application, that sort of thing.

From my basic understanding of law on the books, I don't think Facebook would be considered monopolistic. The argument I'm interested in exploring is whether or not social network sites, which (like early telephone systems) rely on network effects to maintain marketshare more than the technology per se, should be monitored as such.

Seems to me that since network effects aren't subject to competition, at least in the same way other goods and services are, there could be an interesting argument made that the bar for regulating them should be lower.

But again, I haven't explored this at all, so anyone who has any books / articles / materials generally that might be helpful in my research, please send them along!

I completed a note this semester defending mandated network neutrality against potential First Amendment claims (counterintuitively, ISPs can be expected, once their administrative law arguments run out, to claim that the FCC's rules interfere with constitutionally protected editorial control). The note hinges on convincing the reader that the concentration of broadband market power is such that intervention is necessary to ensure the smooth operation of the marketplace of ideas. Luckily, communications jurisprudence is relatively sophisticated in the way that it deals with natural monopoly and network effects, so there's a lot out there to work with.

There's probably a lot of overlap in the direction of our arguments and I imagine that many of my sources would be useful to you. Feel free to send me an email and I can provide more, but Itheil de Sola Pool's Technologies of Freedom, Nuechterlien and Weiser's Digital Crossroads: American Telecommunications Policy in the Internet Age, Lessig's The Future of Ideas, and Zuckman's hornbook, Modern Communications Law, were all very helpful in producing the note. In terms of case law, I'd closely read Turner I & Turner II to understand the pro-regulatory communications law arguments that the Supreme Court has recently found persuasive. They generally revolve around the threat posed by market power over physical infrastructure.

I haven't taken antitrust, so I can't help you there, but your argument sounds like a logical extension of the pro-regulatory arguments made in the communications law context.

edit: Also, Lotus v. Borland (holding that a menu command hierarchy is a "method of operation" and therefore cannot be copyrighted) involves an interesting discussion of the impact of network effects on software development and the end user.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 05:33 on May 16, 2010

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Petey posted:

I have to do more research, but from what little I know I think some of the early telephone interconnection stuff is probably going to be helpful for me. While it has the added degree of complexity of physical infrastructure, the underlying dynamics of network effects seem fairly analogous.

Could you email me your paper (petey@somethingawful.com)? I won't be able to look at this stuff right away but I will drop you a line if I have any questions. Thanks again!

Sure thing - I just fired off the email. In terms of working by analogy to the phone system, I think that the best source from my first reply is definitely going to be Digital Crossroads. The authors do a fantastic job in that book of explaining the policies behind current communications regulation, with reference to the historical development of the phone system and lessons learned in dealing with natural monopoly and network effects. Their views and their sources are also completely orthodox, so you'll have firm ground to cite from in making your arguments.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Final final of law school tomorrow. Woot.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

SWATJester posted:

AHAHAHAHHA Got a B+ on that terrible rear end paper on whether avatars in MMORPGs should be afforded human rights protections. The one I had to re-write after exam period because I didn't do enough work the first time.

Awesome. I graduate Sunday. gently caress yes.

Congrats on sticking it out. I'm also graduating Sunday. Woot.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Lancelot posted:

I somehow fumbled my way into getting an offer from a BigLaw firm for a graduate position as a tax lawyer. This is what I've spent the last five years working towards.

...why do I only feel dread?

Congrats! I think the feeling of dread just means that you are sane and realize that you won't have much of a personal life for the next few years. It's probably worth it though, if you can knock out debt and/or set yourself up for a long-term career.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Adar posted:

David Brin's theory is that privacy is obsolete; technology makes snooping so easy that we may as well give up, admit there's no privacy anymore as a concept, and put restraints on what people can do with the information instead.

The man has a point. It's only a couple of more technological cycles until someone comes up with a surveillance cam that sees through walls, around corners and tags your Social Security number at the top of your face for 29.95 a month.
I regret not taking my school's privacy law seminar this semester. It seems like it would be a fascinating field for this reason, and it would be a lot of fun to write on. Instead I took Administrative Law, which was kind of pointless since all the information in that class can be absorbed much more efficiently by reading a hornbook.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Remember when U.S. Copyright Group targeted 50,000 bit torrent users with infringement lawsuits? The Electronic Frontier Foundation is now seeking "as many attorneys as possible" to assist in the defense of individuals accused of illegally downloading movies. Specifically, they are seeking attorneys who will be available to provide advice to targeted individuals and to file motions to quash subpoenas sent to ISPs. If you are already licensed to practice and are interested, you can provide your contact information to the EFF here. It will be added to a website provided as a resource for individuals targeted by the U.S. Copyright Group's lawsuits.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

JudicialRestraints posted:

what are the chances of us getting paid for this 'internet law'

Also, will it be in currency or mountain dew/hentai?
I don't know, but I'd imagine that mountain dew is the likeliest form of compensation.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

billion dollar bitch posted:

Remember, at the NALP conference in April, Leipold produced a slide showing all the ridiculous things law schools are doing to make it look like more people are “employed,” or to generally try to mitigate the effects of the recession:


1. Created or provided on-campus or post-graduate jobs: 42%
2. Increased the number of public interest fellowships: 31%
3. Provided financial assistance for bar exam related expenses: 12%
4. Extended access to student health benefits for recent grads: 12%
5. Expanded LRAP (loan repayment assistance) eligibility/increased LRAP benefits: 9%
6. Provided emergency loans otherwise not available: 5%


How are items two, four, or five "ridiculous"?
They aren't. Neither is the first, in my opinion. Having a job is better than being unemployed.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

evilweasel posted:

There's nothing wrong with giving their students jobs, what's wrong is using those cynically to manipulate employment statistics and using those employment statistics to recruit new students. The timing, nature, and reporting of those jobs all lean towards the cynical manipulation side.

No doubt. I'm just saying that law school administrators are going to manipulate their numbers in whatever way they can, and directly employing unemployed graduates is probably one of the least despicable ways to do so.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Abugadu posted:

I think the #1 tip is not waiting for work to come to you, you need to seek it out. Approach the attorneys to ask for work to do.

This is critical. Also, be proactive in getting assignments relating to the kind of law you want to practice. Once you impress the first few attorneys you work with, they'll let their friends know about you, and you'll end up getting a lot of related work. If there's a particular practice area that interests you in your firm, you can build up your network in that area over the summer, so that placing you there if you get an offer seems like a no-brainer to everyone involved.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

The Warp posted:

She's wondering who the gently caress you guys are and where are all the unemployed lawyers you're talking about? She thinks that's there's no harm in going to Western State because she'll get her JD and pass the bar exam like every other lawyer, that they all learn the same damned material and they offered her a really huge scholarship. She thinks that you guys are just saying that she won't have a house by the beach or a cushy corporate firm, but I don't think she understands that it's more dire than that.
I just graduated cum laude from Georgetown (T14). I was on moot court, I was an articles editor on one of the journals, I've been published, and I have a technical background and IP experience. I am unemployed.

The Warp posted:

I need to let this sit for a couple of days because now we're just straight up fighting about it. She thinks she has no choice in the matter and that this is what she wants to do, I should just shut up and support her, blah blah. She thinks that it'll be totally fine if she goes to a lovely school, it's fine if she settles, at least she'll have an edge on people with just undergraduate degrees if she has not be a lawyer and just enter the job market.
It won't be totally fine. It will never be fine again. Like Ainsley says, once she has a JD she will be at a disadvantage relative to undergrads for non-legal employment ("overqualified"), and it is highly unlikely that she'll ever have legal employment out of either of those schools unless she graduates literally at the top of her class. Even then, it's dicey.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Abugadu posted:



I know you've answered this question before, but how's the legal economy in Guam right now? Are there opportunities for new graduates?

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Abugadu posted:

:words:
Cool, thanks for the information.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Roger_Mudd posted:

This is true, your relationship is now doomed but you saved her from modern serfdom. Win some, lose some.
Well, there might be hope since she's actually doing an internship and learning a bit about what actual practice is like. She'll at least have something real to compare against whatever job it is that she does manage to find, so the odds of resentment are going to go down.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

J Miracle posted:

I got a B+ on a one-credit Microeconomics for Lawyers class, other than that I've gotten all As and 5 book awards and worked my rear end off so to me this "law school grades are arbitrary" stuff kinda sounds like loser talk

I would agree that it is easy to tell the difference between an A and a B- exam, and that the students who typically receive As are usually harder-working and/or smarter than their classmates, but I also think that it's fair to say that the difference between a B+ and an A- is frequently baffling. Law school exams fail to gauge mastery of the law in a finely tuned way that should inspire confidence in the validity of law school GPA as a sorting mechanism, at least in the middle ranges. Assuming basic familiarity with the subject matter sufficient to enable issue spotting, differences in grades on the typical exam seem to come down to writing technique and the quality of the respective students' outlines (which may have been borrowed anyway) rather than mastery of the material. That strikes me as problematic.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Jun 9, 2010

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

Torpor posted:

Welp, I managed to fumble my way into a job!
Congrats!

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

JudicialRestraints posted:

It's cool. I talked with the professor about the grade and he basically told me to quit caring so much about grades and that working for a firm was for idiots anyway so he was doing me a favor.

It's hard to be angry at you when all of my anger is reserved for him.
Yeah, that's probably the lamest attempt to make a student feel better I've ever heard of.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

PastaSky posted:

It has been suggested that I look into patent law. Being a lawyer doesn't really sound like my kind of thing, and from reading this thread, it doesn't seem like I should.
First, the other posters are right that you shouldn't go to law school unless you're sure you want to practice law. Beyond that, the advice to look into patent law might have been good 5 years ago, but the field was hit hard in the recession and has yet to recover. For the foreseeable future having a tech background isn't going to be the golden ticket that some people think it is. Also, patent litigation isn't all that different from any other kind of litigation, and a lot of people think that patent prosecution is incredibly boring. I like prosecution, but I can't find work (I have a math and computer science background).

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

OptimistPrime posted:

If Ersatz is still reading this, they started putting up postings for GS-9 level patent examiners on USAJobs. So far they have Electrical/Computer and Biomedical Engineering positions.
Awesome - thanks for alerting me to this!

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

I've just accepted an offer from the firm I summered with last year. I'm a bit dazed at the moment because after being no-offered originally I was convinced that I'd be frozen out of the profession, but am also really excited.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Jun 27, 2010

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Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005

sigmachiev posted:

Awesome! Congrats bud.
Thanks!

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