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AGirlWonder posted:I'm half-joking when I bring up PB being creepy. Do I think she's evil, or set to be a villain? No, but I do think that she's got some major character flaws that are worth looking at. You bring up the Ice King and Marceline, but both of those characters were introduced as antagonists for Finn and Jake, not as their friend or potential love interest. Aside from the GPS-in-ear, PB was super cool this episode. Her problems with control over others make her more interesting. Like, she's a crazy intelligent, brave, and strong princess. She's got to have flaws. I mentioned the flaws in my post actually. Those are fine, and usually interesting and/or funny. Obviously she's not perfect; no one in the cartoon is (except Cinnamon Bun, of course). However, recently it's seemed like people got really carried away focusing on her negative aspects, with some speculating about her actually being evil this whole time (though this may have been one of the joke posts, I'm not sure). I didn't count but I think we went at least a page or two the "PB is not good" line of thought after Burning Low, and it is really strange. But, yeah. I'm not objecting to people mentioning her questionable actions or creepiness. Especially since they're usually hilarious, like her making that paralysis stuff in the tart episode for no reason whatsoever; the GPS thing actually struck me as a similar throw-away joke rather than a hint at "PB is crazy/obsessive/evil", and I thought it was another amusing detail. Those things don't seem like they should be taken too seriously to me. And yes, I realize the irony in talking about people taking cartoons seriously while typing this many words about said cartoons. Edit: Sorry if this is coming out aggressive or something; not trying to, I'm just really confused as to why PB of all characters got this huge focus about this. Her flaws and whatnot are interesting and, again, frequently hilarious, but I don't see why we got a big "might be evil/a terrible person" discussion out of them in the same thread where people talked about how sorry they feel for the Ice King after he stole everyone's organs. Roland Jones fucked around with this message at Aug 21, 2012 around 10:29 |
| # ? Aug 21, 2012 10:09 |
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| # ? May 25, 2013 09:34 |
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Roland Jones posted:I mentioned the flaws in my post actually. Those are fine, and usually interesting and/or funny. Obviously she's not perfect; no one in the cartoon is (except Cinnamon Bun, of course). However, recently it's seemed like people got really carried away focusing on her negative aspects, with some speculating about her actually being evil this whole time. I didn't count but I think we went at least a page or two the "PB is not good" line of thought after Burning Low, and it is really strange. Ha, yeah. I actually enjoy the speculation, though, even if I don't always agree with it. I do see where you're coming from, with people getting going about PB's quirks. As long as it doesn't consume the thread, I don't worry about it. I think a page or two is a healthy amount of speculation. As a disclaimer, I'm an English major.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 10:29 |
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I wonder what the gestation period is for Rainicorns? Perhaps they lay eggs or something. This pregnancy could be drawn out a while to keep the status quo with Jake and Finn.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 10:31 |
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Kwyndig posted:Ricardio's loose now since Ice King has a new heart made of candy and sinew and maracas. So does this mean Ice King is now longer wicked at heart but instead sorta sweet on the inside?
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 10:51 |
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AGirlWonder posted:Ha, yeah. I actually enjoy the speculation, though, even if I don't always agree with it. I do see where you're coming from, with people getting going about PB's quirks. As long as it doesn't consume the thread, I don't worry about it. I think a page or two is a healthy amount of speculation. I actually agree with most of the stuff you've said; I like speculation too and stuff, even though it sometimes goes into batshit territory. I even don't mind the "PB is evil" theory in and of itself, just the way some people went about it (would clarify, but that'd be even more  that are increasingly unrelated to Adventure Time itself and also not interesting).I posted:I wonder what the gestation period is for Rainicorns? Perhaps they lay eggs or something. This pregnancy could be drawn out a while to keep the status quo with Jake and Finn. That is an interesting point. I can see a few places, based on the episode titles, where they could have it happen this season, but if it doesn't happen this one I don't think they'll just not have it happen until the show's wrapping up (there are things suggesting the show will have at least six seasons, and I doubt they'll wait all the way until season six). Might be mid-late season five at the latest, I'd bet. I could be wrong, but I don't think the writers here are the type to try to ignore something that big after introducing it. Actually, what are the big shifts we've seen so far? Ice King's gone from "complete villain" to "guy they hang out with sometime, beat the crap out of the rest", and of course there's it becoming explicit that PB isn't romantically interested in Finn and Finn hooking up with Flame Princess, but I feel like there may be others that I'm missing. Finn getting new swords isn't major, although it and some other things are nice minor examples of continuity, like how Finn's called the Ice King "Simon" after learning his name (which, interestingly, Ricardio also called him in this last episode). Now, completely unrelated to anything prior, I wonder when we'll see Marceline again. Looks like the Nightosphere episodes might be her only appearance this season. Roland Jones fucked around with this message at Aug 21, 2012 around 11:08 |
| # ? Aug 21, 2012 11:02 |
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To be honest if Jake does get kids I don't think they really need to make a colossal change to the show. I feel like they could just be integrated into episodes if the story calls for it or just not mentioned in others, it's not like he'd have to be on dad duty all the time. Dogs grow up pretty quickly 
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 11:34 |
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Adventure Time thread: ICE KING, PLEASE LEAVE.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 13:27 |
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NoneSuch posted:To be honest if Jake does get kids I don't think they really need to make a colossal change to the show. I feel like they could just be integrated into episodes if the story calls for it or just not mentioned in others, it's not like he'd have to be on dad duty all the time. Dogs grow up pretty quickly Still might have to move out though. Even if they get around this by showing Jake and Finn on adventures and skipping the "Jake comes around to the treehouse on guy's night" step, if it's very clear that Jake still lives with Finn and Lady and the kids live elsewhere it's going to be a little weird. You're right that it might not matter too much on an episode-by-episode basis, but in terms of character development it might. Also since Jake dying would be super-grim, it's possible he (or his new family!) gets put in extreme peril during the next Lich thing and he decides it's time to hang up the whole adventuring thing, or at least make some other big shakeup change. They might be able to touch on the situation with the next episode, since the theme appears to be "Lemongrab mad about PB" so there's some creator and created themes going on there.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 14:51 |
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Roland Jones posted:Now, completely unrelated to anything prior, I wonder when we'll see Marceline again. Looks like the Nightosphere episodes might be her only appearance this season. She's going to be in "Reign of the Gunthers", I think (there was some very early preview floating around somewhere I think, which had her
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 15:56 |
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Fangz posted:So does this mean Ice King is now longer wicked at heart but instead sorta sweet on the inside? He's always been sort of sweet. He's a hopeless romantic more along the lines of that awkward kid who just wasn't socialized correctly rather than being evil.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 16:21 |
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When Ricardio steps on Ice King he says "Silence Simon!" So Ice King's secret is the worst kept one on Ooo. edit: Also George Takei is amazing.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 16:30 |
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Peanut President posted:When Ricardio steps on Ice King he says "Silence Simon!" Well, I figured that was obvious after Finn and Jake invited everybody over to watch his tapes at Christmas.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 16:37 |
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Peanut President posted:When Ricardio steps on Ice King he says "Silence Simon!" Isn't he Ice King's heart, though? So he would know anyway?
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 16:39 |
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Peanut President posted:When Ricardio steps on Ice King he says "Silence Simon!"
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 16:40 |
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This was posted a few pages back:Evil Sagan posted:It's a cartoon, not a drat soap opera. Seems kind of like foreshadowing now...
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 16:56 |
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I did not know that Ricardio was Ice King's heart. I must've missed an episode somewhere.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 17:03 |
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The Ice King is the best character on the show. Also, I am a sociopath.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 17:27 |
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A long while back Pen Ward confirmed that Jake didn't, in fact, get his magic powers from a mud puddle. http://www.formspring.me/buenothebear/q/847547138 But it does sound like his powers were acquired, and since we haven't seen Joshua, Margaret or Jermaine get all stretchy... the chance of magic baby rainipuppies doesn't seem likely 
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 17:40 |
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Roland Jones posted:On a tangent about the thread getting terrible (warning, The Ice King gets the most sympathy because he's literally incapable of understanding the evil that he does. He's insane. Broken. He by definition cannot be evil because he lacks the faculties to make an informed choice about ethics.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 18:09 |
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Millions posted:But it does sound like his powers were acquired, and since we haven't seen Joshua, Margaret or Jermaine get all stretchy... the chance of magic baby rainipuppies doesn't seem likely This is the weirdest detail to worry about.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 18:10 |
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KingKalamari posted:I'm liking that we're getting more nods to PB's general moral ambiguity again It really is one of my favorite aspects of her character. The beating she gives Ricardio was grizzly. Holy crap, this episode was great.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 18:15 |
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I think my one of my favorite parts of this episode was the twist on the classic shrinking-down-and-journeying-though-somebody's-body episode so many cartoons do. I also died laughing at Ricardio's fake head. He's so grotesque, yet that loving taped on smiley face thing undoes his fearsomeness.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 18:31 |
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God of Evil Cows posted:(a bunch of stuff) Yeah, I was with you up until the "Jake dying" thing. That's just not going to happen, I don't think. But everything else seems pretty solid, and I do like the idea of "King Worm" being a foreshadowing of events later in the season. This is also supported by the Ice King running from a mega-Gunther (I took this as a reference to Reign of Gunthers), and the part with Flame Princess I believe, is probably a reference to an event in "Ignition Point." But this is all pure speculation, we could end up finding that "King Worm" doesn't have as much significance as we think it does. It could just be trippy weirdness. But I hope that isn't the case. And I think the writers of this show know what they're doing when they make an episode like that.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 19:02 |
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weirdojace posted:Yeah, I was with you up until the "Jake dying" thing. That's just not going to happen, I don't think. He has been awfully into that croak dream stuff lately 
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 19:14 |
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Yeah, I know. I guess I'll rephrase: I don't think we're going to see Jake dying at the end of season 4 when we already know there's two more seasons on the way.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 19:19 |
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I'll throw out an opposing theory here: the vision of Jake dying is a fake out. Remember that there were two dream levels in King Worm. After Finn destroys the frozen worm, he finds himself in another dream world. The Jake in the first dream world I believe to be real. He is having fun with Lady. He is just as puzzled and lost as Finn is, and is supportive of Finn's attempts to find out what the hell is going on. He helps Finn chase after the Worm King and they destroy the frozen Worm King. In the second dream level, there are TWO Jakes. The Jake that is walking around with Finn is the Worm King in disguise. He attempts to persuade Finn that they're in reality now and that Finn doesn't need to question whether he's in a dream anymore. However, another Jake shows up in a picture on the wall, and the picture Jake tells Finn how to defeat the Worm King for good. Finn destroys the picture Jake, which turns into several mini Jakes. The mini Jakes we now take to symbolize the fact that Jake is going to be a father. This symbolism is tied to the Jake in the hanging picture, which is "good" Jake (still not sure if this was the real Jake or just a positive projection of Jake from Finn's mind). The symbolism of the dead Jake is tied to the "fake" Jake, which was the Worm King in disguise.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 19:27 |
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Guys Jake is gonna die eventually. Even if it's in a Breakfast Club-esque where they are now segment where it says "Jake died several years later surrounded by his family". It has been forshadowed. Even Donny's magic dog died.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 19:33 |
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Or else Finn and Lady will have to do a musical duel against Death. Hell, we just need more Death, that guy was awesome.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 19:50 |
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God of Evil Cows posted:This brings us to my final prediction. This prediction is crazy and messed up and wrong and even I refuse to believe it. Jake is going to die at the end of the season. He is going to be killed by the Lich. There's no way that would ever happen on children's cartoon, right? It also directly contradicts his croak dream, so it's just not going to happen. Well, it was established several seasons ago that Jake is 28 years old in magical dog years. Now that could mean that he can live forever and age at whatever rate is convenient to the plot. But it was established that Finn and Jake were babies together and so Jake is in fact aging at a much faster rate than Finn. If the show keeps going for several more years, legitimate questions will be raised as to the age difference between Finn and Jake as Finn continues to age and Jake does not. We see in "King Worm" Jake's flesh melt off his body and collapse in a pile of bones. All that is left of Jake is his memory in the form of a picture on the wall. But that picture is his legacy and from it emerges many more tiny little Jakes: his puppies. I need to revisit this theory in light of recent discussion because as I previously pointed out, the theory is wrong. There is just no way that they are going to kill off Jake of "Adventure Time with Finn and Jake." Everything I said in it besides Jake getting killed by the Lich makes sense though, so where did I go wrong? I misinterpreted a very key piece of imagery:  Look at that. My initial thought was, "Jesus, Jake just died a pretty horrible death!" But watch the scene again. If Jake just had his flesh melt off, why isn't Finn freaking out? Even if he knows it's just "Dream Jake," he should still be a bit disturbed by it, but he isn't. That's because that is NOT an image of Jake dying, it's an image of Jake aging. As pointed out earlier, the show absolutely needs to address the fact that Jake is aging much faster than Finn, and as other people have pointed out, Jake can't just keep living in the tree house with Finn after he is a father. So Jake must move out but Finn doesn't want him to, which is symbolized by the immediately preceding scene with Finn chasing after Jake. When Jake finally stands his ground and confronts Finn, he assures Finn with a smile on his face that "Everything is fine, everything is normal." Aging is a normal process, and Jake is happy to be a dad. Jake's picture is on the wall not because he has left this mortal realm, but because he has left the tree house. I'm going to go a step further. It was ultimately the return of Dream Jake that turns the tide in Finn's battle against King Worm. It will be the return of Jake to visit Finn in the tree house that turns the tide in the battle against the Lich. I am far more confident in this theory than the last. God of Evil Cows fucked around with this message at Aug 21, 2012 around 20:09 |
| # ? Aug 21, 2012 20:00 |
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In spite of everything, Jake isn't going to leave the treehouse, because Finn is still a bit too young to look after himself, and it's silly. Jake simultaneously fills all sorts of roles, including best friend/big brother/father (to Finn, as well as would-be pupsters).
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 20:15 |
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That whole episode was just  over and over.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 20:25 |
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Jake already once this season though. Kinda silly of him to go and die again.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 20:32 |
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But as long as Finn is around Jake, Jake can't die. ...so if he moves out to take care of the pupsters...
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 20:57 |
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Adventure Time: It's us, we are the Ice King
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 20:59 |
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Knight of the
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Jonas Albrecht posted:It really is one of my favorite aspects of her character. The beating she gives Ricardio was grizzly. "I just wanted to impress you" "YOU DIDN'T" Probably my favorite line in the episode. Millions posted:Adventure Time thread: ICE KING, PLEASE LEAVE. I support this title change.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 22:46 |
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I know this show isn't afraid to let changes happen, but my money's on Jake not having to be responsible for his children for very long before they leave the nest.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 22:56 |
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I might just be spouting wild theories but I'm wondering if Lady Rainicorn's pregnancy is going to tie into the season finale with The Lich. Like what if The Lich tries to revive himself using one of Jake's kids, Jason goes to Hell style?
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 23:11 |
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Boy, it's almost like the Lost thread again with all the crazy theories.
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| # ? Aug 21, 2012 23:22 |
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TwoPair posted:"I just wanted to impress you" One of my favourite little touches. Your generic good guy princess character would just be disgusted by Ricardio for doing something bad, PB is mostly disgusted that his seduction attempt sucks. Amateur hour Frankenstein shenanigans? For the woman who created an immortal, amoral godling to be her successor? Please, Ricardio. If I had to guess though, PB kind of seems like she's being set up for a fall. Too much hubris. Flame Princess better get some serious character development soon rather than representing a bunch of obstacles for Finn to help develop him (hell Bubblegum got more development out of Burning Low than she did), otherwise she's starting to look like the character the villain kills off to show the audience the situation is serious.
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| # ? Aug 22, 2012 00:20 |
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| # ? May 25, 2013 09:34 |
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Jake already died. In Sons of Mars, remember? We're totally fine here guys. In all seriousness, I don't think we're in danger of seeing Jake die, at least for a while. I mean, besides how huge that would be, doing it while there's also the whole pregnancy/puppies thing would escalate an already huge thing. As far as AT goes sometimes, I don't know if we'll see that in a kid's show. (Also, Jake dying would make me sad.) Chocolate Teapot posted:She's going to be in "Reign of the Gunthers", I think (there was some very early preview floating around somewhere I think, which had her Awesome. KingKalamari posted:I might just be spouting wild theories but I'm wondering if Lady Rainicorn's pregnancy is going to tie into the season finale with The Lich. I actually considered the Lich episode as a possible one for the pregnancy to come into play, with the Lich doing something like kidnapping Lady and the puppies, but I didn't consider that. Definitely possible, though. As we already know, the Lich King is not funny. Dolash posted:One of my favourite little touches. Your generic good guy princess character would just be disgusted by Ricardio for doing something bad, PB is mostly disgusted that his seduction attempt sucks. Amateur hour Frankenstein shenanigans? For the woman who created an immortal, amoral godling to be her successor? Please, Ricardio. In her defense, the "amoral" part was Finn and Jake's fault. Mostly Jake's. But yeah, I can definitely see something bad happening to PB. She can definitely have an ego, even when she's being really good. And, well, we know the Lich is coming back, so there's a good opportunity for something like that to happen; he's kind of a dick and all. I also agree about FP; I like her, but she really needs more screentime and development. There's an upcoming episode called "Ignition Point", so I'm hoping we get some of that there. ...And now talking about both Flame Princess and the Lich, I'm wondering if he might try to use her ability to, you know, destroy the world, in his plans. Oh dear. Roland Jones fucked around with this message at Aug 22, 2012 around 03:10 |
| # ? Aug 22, 2012 00:24 |
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