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sixide
Oct 25, 2004


Thuryl posted:

Download Daggerfall. May God have mercy on your soul.

I still play Daggerfall, actually. I was hoping for something with one of the aforementioned turn-based combats.

Also in Daggerfall only quests/loot/monsters/generic terrain between cities/dungeons is random, roguelikes have actual random dungeons.

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Nathilus
Apr 4, 2002

I alone can see through the media bias.

I'm also stupid on a scale that can only be measured in Reddits.

I remember playing Daggerfall and not having a mark spell outside of any given dungeon you were playing in was a death sentence and made it almost impossible to find your way back out. Good times.

TheOriginalEd
Oct 29, 2007

Caffeine Transcendent


Viral Thorn posted:

Nehrim,

Thanks for this. Going to give it a try when I get the chance.

Edit: also didnt see it in the thread, and am by no means suggesting it. Merely mentioning it. Sacred 2 in the skein of Diablo clones and isometric actiony RPG things. Its got a still waters run deep skill system. Most of the combat arts you get in the game are going to be the same ones you use throughout, its what you do with them that counts. Theres no MP, all combat arts and aspects run on cooldowns, all buffs lengthen the cooldowns when active. You take skills every few levels that do anything from reducing all cooldowns for a certain aspect or raise the power for them, to lowering the damage you take in pvp.. Cast one combat art from an aspect and the other combat arts in that aspect will get locked out for the duration of the cooldown too unless you stick them in a combo. You can even take skills to lengthen the combos and make them more powerful. Skill points put into the skills for a related aspect will unlock modifiers for the combat arts and do crazy things to them like making casted buffs into permanent buffs or adding more fireballs. You can eat more runes to power up a combat art but it will also lengthen the cooldown significantly. So you have the choice uber powerful skills that you can cast once a century or mass aoes you can fire off quicker than a regular attack. Its pretty easy to screw up a character if you dont know what youre doing and the game is hardcore repetitive and the story is balls to the wall lame from what Ive seen but if you skip the quests and just go slaughter the country side some fun is to be had.

TheOriginalEd fucked around with this message at Oct 4, 2010 around 14:48

casual poster
Jun 29, 2009

So casual.


TheOriginalEd posted:



Edit: also didnt see it in the thread, and am by no means suggesting it. Merely mentioning it. Sacred 2 in the skein of Diablo clones and isometric actiony RPG things. Its got a still waters run deep skill system. Most of the combat arts you get in the game are going to be the same ones you use throughout, its what you do with them that counts. Theres no MP, all combat arts and aspects run on cooldowns, all buffs lengthen the cooldowns when active. You take skills every few levels that do anything from reducing all cooldowns for a certain aspect or raise the power for them, to lowering the damage you take in pvp.. Cast one combat art from an aspect and the other combat arts in that aspect will get locked out for the duration of the cooldown too unless you stick them in a combo. You can even take skills to lengthen the combos and make them more powerful. Skill points put into the skills for a related aspect will unlock modifiers for the combat arts and do crazy things to them like making casted buffs into permanent buffs or adding more fireballs. You can eat more runes to power up a combat art but it will also lengthen the cooldown significantly. So you have the choice uber powerful skills that you can cast once a century or mass aoes you can fire off quicker than a regular attack. Its pretty easy to screw up a character if you dont know what youre doing and the game is hardcore repetitive and the story is balls to the wall lame from what Ive seen but if you skip the quests and just go slaughter the country side some fun is to be had.

Plus this game is less than twenty bucks at gamestop. My buddy said he had a great time with it. I may pick it up for some co-op with friends.

a medical mystery
Dec 15, 2007

You're cute!


Nathilus posted:

I remember playing Daggerfall and not having a mark spell outside of any given dungeon you were playing in was a death sentence and made it almost impossible to find your way back out. Good times.

Daggerfall is great fun if only to explore the ridiculous number of glitches. It's actually a pretty good game in itself, but the glitches make it hours of ceaseless entertainment.

Happy Hedonist
Jan 18, 2009

You have no respect for excessive authority or obsolete traditions. You're dangerous and depraved, and you ought to be taken outside and shot!

I don't think anyone linked Knights of the Chalice yet. It's a freaking great turn based indie RPG based on the OGL.

andrew smash
Jun 26, 2006

smooth soul

I thought that the random stuff in daggerfall was technically procedurally generated but the random seed shipped with the game, so everything was the same between installs and new games, etc? Am I wrong?

CitizenKain
May 27, 2001

That was Gary Cooper, asshole.


Lost Odyssey never felt like it was worth all the effort to play. Things just never felt like they took off in the game, which is odd considering what happens to the world. They really go out of their way to shackle you with characters you don't give a poo poo about the entire game, looking at you Palom and Porom.

I've got a pile of cRPGs that all got shelved for some reason, and I really need to pick them up and finish them. Especially The Witcher and Neverwinter Nights 2.

i am not zach
Apr 16, 2007

by Ozmaugh


CitizenKain posted:

Lost Odyssey never felt like it was worth all the effort to play. Things just never felt like they took off in the game, which is odd considering what happens to the world. They really go out of their way to shackle you with characters you don't give a poo poo about the entire game, looking at you Palom and Porom.

I've got a pile of cRPGs that all got shelved for some reason, and I really need to pick them up and finish them. Especially The Witcher and Neverwinter Nights 2.

I was semi-enjoying LO, it was a nice throwback to older JRPGS and one of the best on the 360, but when I got to the children and the scenes involving them I had to turn off the game it was so horrible. Another game falls victim to random anime stupidity. The other characters weren't actually that horrible up until that point either. The story was still really dumb though.

Skeezy
Jul 3, 2007

Oh! I Feel It.
I Feel The Cosmos!


i am not zach posted:

I was semi-enjoying LO, it was a nice throwback to older JRPGS and one of the best on the 360, but when I got to the children and the scenes involving them I had to turn off the game it was so horrible. Another game falls victim to random anime stupidity. The other characters weren't actually that horrible up until that point either. The story was still really dumb though.

I'm pretty sure the stuff with the kids is only for a dungeon/boss fight and that's it. After that they are just there.

i am not zach
Apr 16, 2007

by Ozmaugh


Skeezy posted:

I'm pretty sure the stuff with the kids is only for a dungeon/boss fight and that's it. After that they are just there.

That kind of poo poo just really turns me off of video games, JRPGs in particular. Call it petty if you will, but it just breaks my enjoyment of the game and kind of jars me out of getting into the story, if that makes sense.

casual poster
Jun 29, 2009

So casual.


holy gently caress does someone have a link or something that could help me in alteier rorona? I'm just not getting it for some reason.

Samurai Sanders
Nov 4, 2003



casual poster posted:

holy gently caress does someone have a link or something that could help me in alteier rorona? I'm just not getting it for some reason.
If it works the same as Atelier Totori I might be able to answer a question.

A Steampunk Gent
Oct 15, 2007


i am not zach posted:

That kind of poo poo just really turns me off of video games, JRPGs in particular. Call it petty if you will, but it just breaks my enjoyment of the game and kind of jars me out of getting into the story, if that makes sense.

The game has a few sketchy points after that as well; the kids are annoying whenever they turn up, Gongora continues to get zero character development and the ending is ridiculously sarachine and ignores all the themes built up through the thousand dream stories. Shame, because I generally enjoyed the battle system, broken as it was, and the art direction and music.

i am not zach
Apr 16, 2007

by Ozmaugh


SomeChump posted:

The game has a few sketchy points after that as well; the kids are annoying whenever they turn up, Gongora continues to get zero character development and the ending is ridiculously sarachine and ignores all the themes built up through the thousand dream stories. Shame, because I generally enjoyed the battle system, broken as it was, and the art direction and music.

Yeah, I would pretty much echo this sentiment. The game looked really good and the cinematics/music were awesome. The battle system had its flaws, but no more than your average JRPG. It sucks that there is such a large division in gameplay between JRPG and Western RPG by the major game producers, especially on the 360. I think I really need to get a DS the more I read about the RPG market.

dis astranagant
Dec 14, 2006





Anyone remember Dungeon Hack? It's pretty much Pool of Radiance: the Roguelike. You go through a randomly generated dungeon with a wide array of settings to tweak to get the style of dungeon you're after, possibly including multilevel puzzles, tweaking/disabling the hunger system, adjusting the encounter difficulty and much more. About the only downsides to it are being a D&D2e game and only having one pc instead of a party. I used to play it so drat much as a kid.

e: HOTU link

dis astranagant fucked around with this message at Oct 4, 2010 around 18:42

a medical mystery
Dec 15, 2007

You're cute!


ExiledTinkerer posted:

Well...there are some things out there banging along that include:

http://www.darklightdungeon.com/ Solo though, but the dev appears to be putting forth effort. Beta version currently out there that got a big update recently.
http://www.decklinsdemise.com/news.php Incredibly long in the making, but almost done as far as "expansions that essentially redo the source and then some with much content". Probably one of the things I'm most looking forward to in this regard assuming it can make the October release date.

Man, I wish there were more games in the style of Mordor/Demise. Despite the absolutely terrible art and UI in both there was something intensely addictive about them.

sixide
Oct 25, 2004


andrew smash posted:

I thought that the random stuff in daggerfall was technically procedurally generated but the random seed shipped with the game, so everything was the same between installs and new games, etc? Am I wrong?

I'm not sure, honestly. It could also be assembled manually from prefab segments. Either way, none of it is really random.

It does make me chuckle when I realize Daggerfall had the best leveling system and monster/loot scaling of any of the TES games despite being a buggy shitpile from 1997.

Boo This Man
Mar 25, 2008



SomeChump posted:

Barkley, Shut Up and Jam: Gaiden: One of the best freeware RPGs around in terms of game mechanics and production values, it would still be an entertaining game with a vanilla plot. What makes this special though is the consistently excellent humour. Set in the Post-Cyberpocalypse caused by the incredibly destructive b-ball technique the 'chaos dunk' which destroyed the city of New York, it follows former b-ball star Charles Barkley and his son Hoopz in his quest for redemption and protect his son from the fascist state forces led by collaborator Michael Jordan. It is absolutely ruthless in its parodies of jRPG conventions and internet culture including an underground village of furries, a plastic surgery full of anime cosplayers, unexplained allusions to Christian mythology, save points which rant about the superiority of Japanese videogames (all real, copied from forums) and all presented completely straight faced. It's the best freeware game I've played outside of Cave Story.

edit: link updated

I never played this. Butafter this post, I'm sold.

Defghanistan
Feb 9, 2010

2base2furious


Claven666 posted:

Then, there's King's Field. It is extremely hard to get the ball rolling with these games as your character always starts of pretty squishy, but every entry I've played has been extremely imaginitive and engrossing. The games take place in a very dark fantasy setting where humankind has to scratch out an existence while horrible monsters roam the earth trying to slaughter them. The game stresses exploration and discovery, and like most true "open world" games you're barred from the more advanced areas by monster strength, though some places are locked by magic or items. The graphics and game speed of the first King's Field are bad/slow but it is worth playing just because there is a relatively large amount of game to explore.

The King's Field series are amazing and I love them to this day. So many great memories with those games. That leads me to it's spiritual successor:

Demons Souls
This game is amazing. Dark, difficult, deep, beautiful.

Other favorites are:

Secret of Mana
Final Fantasy 2 (yes, TWO, not three)
Shining Force 2
Chrono Trigger
Final Fantasy 9

Mortley
Jan 18, 2005

aux tep unt rep uni ovi

I'd like to find a turn-based RPG that I can enjoy, as somebody who's always thought "well, I just don't like RPGs." I have a DSL and Wii, but I'd especially like to play a GBA game.
The grindiest game I've ever enjoyed was Circle of the Moon, which isn't bad, I realize. I used to watch my buddy play FFT and enjoy the discussions but never wanted to dedicate the solo time to it. Um... I liked Pokemon when it was still black and white?
It's a bit of a silly recommendation request because I don't have strong preferences, but I guess I'd like to play a portable time sink other than action/adventures like Metroid or Castlevania.
I might give up on turn-based games and play Secret of Mana via VC or emulation since I've never tried it. Is it "deeper" than Zelda or CotM?

Winedeck
Oct 3, 2010


Mortley posted:

I'd like to find a turn-based RPG that I can enjoy, as somebody who's always thought "well, I just don't like RPGs." I have a DSL and Wii, but I'd especially like to play a GBA game.
The grindiest game I've ever enjoyed was Circle of the Moon, which isn't bad, I realize. I used to watch my buddy play FFT and enjoy the discussions but never wanted to dedicate the solo time to it. Um... I liked Pokemon when it was still black and white?
It's a bit of a silly recommendation request because I don't have strong preferences, but I guess I'd like to play a portable time sink other than action/adventures like Metroid or Castlevania.
I might give up on turn-based games and play Secret of Mana via VC or emulation since I've never tried it. Is it "deeper" than Zelda or CotM?

Check out Golden Sun. It sounds exactly like something you'd enjoy. It's an older game for the GBA, so you can expect to find it pretty cheap. The only problem is actually finding it. However, depending on your area, you might not have any issue with that. I know my local GameStop carries the game still.

If you end up enjoying it, there is also a released sequel for the GBA and a third game coming out for the DS at the end of November.

Lets Fuck Bro
Apr 14, 2009

by Ozmaugh


Mortley posted:

I'd like to find a turn-based RPG that I can enjoy, as somebody who's always thought "well, I just don't like RPGs." I have a DSL and Wii, but I'd especially like to play a GBA game.
The grindiest game I've ever enjoyed was Circle of the Moon, which isn't bad, I realize. I used to watch my buddy play FFT and enjoy the discussions but never wanted to dedicate the solo time to it. Um... I liked Pokemon when it was still black and white?
It's a bit of a silly recommendation request because I don't have strong preferences, but I guess I'd like to play a portable time sink other than action/adventures like Metroid or Castlevania.
I might give up on turn-based games and play Secret of Mana via VC or emulation since I've never tried it. Is it "deeper" than Zelda or CotM?
No, Secret of Mana is a lot less deep than any Zelda or Castlevania. It's basically a beat em up with stats. However it is a great game and quite a lot of fun, better than Circle of the Moon at least.

Do you have a flash cart for your DS? If so, then download Mother 3 for GBA (it's not available to buy in America, but you can download the Japanese ROM and the translation patch). It's basically the best portable RPG of the decade, it is turn based, and is not very grindy at all. It does require a bit of strategy later in the game but nothing insurmountable.

If you don't, then check out Chrono Trigger for the DS. Everyone likes Chrono Trigger.

Lets Fuck Bro fucked around with this message at Oct 5, 2010 around 01:50

Miketopus
Jan 24, 2010

Absolutely. If we put little wheels on the bottoms of our shoes, we could just roll around everywhere...


Lets gently caress Bro posted:

No, Secret of Mana is a lot less deep than any Zelda or Castlevania. It's basically a beat em up with stats.

Correction, my friend. Secret of Mana 1 (Seiken Densetsu 2) for the SNES is less deep. Secret of Mana 2 (Seiken Densetsu 3) is easily on equal footing with either Zelda or Castlevania. Legend of Mana, I daresay, is even moreso, although the combat needed work in that one. Everything else about it was fantastic.

Xythar
Dec 22, 2004

echoes of a contemporary nation

I liked SD3 a lot (beat it 3 times in fact) but I'm not going to call the combat deep. I got through most of the battles by just holding down whatever button made you auto-attack.

The character selection and class trees are pretty cool though.

InnercityGriot
Dec 31, 2008


I wouldn't call Legend of Mana deep. There are lots of things to do in that game, but the battle system is just totally broken. I never, ever felt threatened by any enemy in that game, and magic is pretty useless. The pet/golem raising is all cool, though, and I still think Legend of Mana is worth playing for the beauty of the presentation. The music and artwork is fantastic to this day, and weirdly, the lack of a real central plot works for the kind of weird, fairy tale-ish world it has created. It's almost like JRPG Alice in Wonderland, where it's just your main character stumbling through a bunch of loosely or not related at all stories en route to the end and meeting a bunch of really weird people and monsters.


There are slave labor teddy bears with some retard language, a walking teapot, an onion dude, a cute looking rabbit who is actually a con artist rear end in a top hat, sentient plants, and loads of other weird poo poo. Some of the locales are really interesting too, like the flying dragon dungeon and the weird lamp-lit town with the aforementioned slave bears. It's not really a great GAME, but there's a lot of cool stuff to do and it's really pretty to look at.

octobernight
Nov 24, 2004
High Priest of the Christian-Atheist Church

Is there games like Ogre Battle? I miss the mix of RTS/RPG/squad based combat. The closest I can find was Soul Nomad, but it doesn't feel the same.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006




Xythar posted:

I liked SD3 a lot (beat it 3 times in fact) but I'm not going to call the combat deep. I got through most of the battles by just holding down whatever button made you auto-attack.

It has theoretically deep combat where you can duck around enemy attacks, but in reality all you're going to be doing is mashing A like a madman (if you have Kevin/Hawke/Duran) or non-stop chaining spells (Angela), pausing only to eat some magic walnuts to regain MP.

Yeah I Like Girls
Aug 20, 2009

im gay

Elona. Surprised I didn't see it mentioned yet (unless I missed it). The game is pretty detailed considering it having such a simplistic look. Nice karma system that lets you be evil if you want to, and run around slaughtering people for fun until you get hunted down by hordes of guards.

Also semi-detailed character creation which is always a plus for me in RPGs.



It's similar to Everlong in that it is a singleplayer game developed over a long period of time with occasional updates still popping up and adding new content.

Also popular enough to have a long-running thread.

http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...hreadid=2901654

Yeah I Like Girls fucked around with this message at Oct 5, 2010 around 02:47

Jesto
Dec 22, 2004

Balls.


InnercityGriot posted:

I wouldn't call Legend of Mana deep. There are lots of things to do in that game, but the battle system is just totally broken. I never, ever felt threatened by any enemy in that game,

In NewGame+ they give you a book in your house that lets you adjust the difficulty. Every single encounter becomes a nightmare if you set the difficulty high enough. On the plus side, the drops/gold/EXP raise significantly as well.

TheOriginalEd
Oct 29, 2007

Caffeine Transcendent


InnercityGriot posted:

I wouldn't call Legend of Mana deep.

I cant let that slide. Legend of Mana is psychotically deep. Almost obsessively deep. There are stories you may never even see if you dont set up the map perfectly and follow the story lines right. The Tempering alone requires a college text worth of reading just to understand how it works.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/256525-l...mana/faqs/10806

Without tempering you cant even scratch the surface of combat. Sure your average enemy is just hit hit hit dead but theres three difficulties ala diablo and new plunge attacks to temper on to your weapons (of which there are what.. 8? and dozens of techs for each?) Youre not playing the game until your weapon is shooting out money as you kill things. Yeah. theres a plunge attack that does that.

InnercityGriot
Dec 31, 2008


When I made my not deep comment, I was referring more to the combat, but you're right that the story system can be really deep and hard to figure out.

I still maintain that despite having a complex system of skills and learnable abilities, that does not a deep game make if the core combat is so lacking in balance you have to beat the game once for it to become even remotely a challenge.

It's still a cool, underrated game though. The theme song from whenever the juggling monkey and his one-man-band friend show up is still really cool.

JammyLammy
Dec 23, 2009


octobernight posted:

Is there games like Ogre Battle? I miss the mix of RTS/RPG/squad based combat. The closest I can find was Soul Nomad, but it doesn't feel the same.

Let me steal this question for my own personal gain. Is there a game with a story as good as Ogre Battle? Something that doesn't make you embarrassed watching.

Tired of teens saving the world from cliche overlord.

Node
May 20, 2001



JammyLammy posted:

Let me steal this question for my own personal gain. Is there a game with a story as good as Ogre Battle? Something that doesn't make you embarrassed watching.

Tired of teens saving the world from cliche overlord.

Be more specific. There are a lot of rpgs that fit that criteria.

a clogged toilet
Mar 14, 2007

this anime really speaks to me on a spiritual level


Man I am shocked at all the love Legend of Mana is getting, I remember when it came out it was completely torn apart because it didn't have a big angsty JRPG story or huge world map. Personally I think its the best game in the series, I love the ridiculous degree of customization and the short, mostly unrelated quests. A loving blast in coop, too.

InnercityGriot posted:

When I made my not deep comment, I was referring more to the combat, but you're right that the story system can be really deep and hard to figure out.

I still maintain that despite having a complex system of skills and learnable abilities, that does not a deep game make if the core combat is so lacking in balance you have to beat the game once for it to become even remotely a challenge.

It's still a cool, underrated game though. The theme song from whenever the juggling monkey and his one-man-band friend show up is still really cool.
They definitely made it way too easy, but I don't think an easy game can't also be really deep mechanically. Sure, those mechanics are pretty much completely unnecessary to beat the game, but they're fun to gently caress around with.

InnercityGriot
Dec 31, 2008


Final Fantasy Tactics has a really good story when it doesn't fall victim to the 'Western religion is literally the devil' thing, Planescape: Torment does some pretty fantastic dialogue, Nier actually manages to evoke some emotion and has some genuinely well-written moments, and that's all I can think of right now. It's funny that the genre is supposed to be story-driven, but like so many video games, the stories are mostly terrible with a slight sprinkle of good in some areas.

Dr_Amazing
Apr 15, 2006

It's a long story

octobernight posted:

Is there games like Ogre Battle? I miss the mix of RTS/RPG/squad based combat. The closest I can find was Soul Nomad, but it doesn't feel the same.

Behamuts Lagoon, mentioned above, might have what you want.

Jesto
Dec 22, 2004

Balls.


JammyLammy posted:

Let me steal this question for my own personal gain. Is there a game with a story as good as Ogre Battle? Something that doesn't make you embarrassed watching.

Tired of teens saving the world from cliche overlord.

Exit Fate - The main character is an adult and a general. Out of the 75 characters in the game, I'm 99% certain every single one of them is likewise an adult, except the animals by merit of being a cat and a dog. Furthermore, he doesn't even save the world, it's just a dispute between two three Kingdoms.

You don't save the world, you don't kill God, you don't have superpowered teenagers, your main character isn't mute, you don't have a Forced Love Interest subplot. The main character doesn't even hook up with anyone in the game, or consider it. I'm not even sure if it can be considered an RPG if it doesn't have at least one of those tropes, can it?

Jesto fucked around with this message at Oct 5, 2010 around 03:33

JammyLammy
Dec 23, 2009


Node posted:

Be more specific. There are a lot of rpgs that fit that criteria.

I guess something with very grim and gritty storylines, just tired of band of kids band togethor to fight big bad, cue j-pop and sexualized teens.

Someone from another messageboard wrote up an example of the type of decisions you come across in Knights of Lodis


quote:

Which is a shame because its plot is far superior to FF: Tacticsand most RPGs in general. In fact, it's probably done the best job ever of truly morally ambiguous choices. Townspeople refuse to help the newly liberated country (ungrateful fucks), preferring to sit back while the evil empire counterattack comes and subjugates you. Do you respect their wishes even though it means the rebel army will be crushed, or do you follow the (realistic partisan tactics) order to dress as enemy soldiers and slaughter the town in order to sway public opinion to your cause? Go along with it and opinion goes against the empire while you get a cushy job in the new government. Refuse and the town gets burned anyway but the blame is placed on you as you spend the game on the run from rebels and revenge-minded bounty hunters. Later on you confront the scumfuck leader who framed you, but an enemy country invades at the same time. Kill the bastard and plunge your country into chaos in the middle of an invasion, or let him live to work together against the invasion?

Also Legend of Mana is awesome, anyone who disagrees has no soul.

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InnercityGriot
Dec 31, 2008


homeless snail posted:

Man I am shocked at all the love Legend of Mana is getting, I remember when it came out it was completely torn apart because it didn't have a big angsty JRPG story or huge world map. Personally I think its the best game in the series, I love the ridiculous degree of customization and the short, mostly unrelated quests. A loving blast in coop, too.

It's just very charming. One of the few video games I've ever played that ever felt like it had a legitimately original vision in terms of its world and inhabitants. There are fairies, but even they are not very fairy-ish, and they get totally overwhelmed by all the strange original stuff like the ducks wearing military hard hats and throwing egg grenades.

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