RPG Thread: SaGa Emeril Beyond

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > RPG Thread: SaGa Emeril Beyond

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Samurai Sanders posted:

It's way action-y, of course, but tough fights require planning in the form of what potions to chug down before you go at it. Potions are a HUGE part of the game. They offer absolutely massive stat bonuses, or other abilities like being able to see enemies through walls and stuff, but they fill your toxicity gauge, too high and you start seeing red flecks and stuff (which is also pretty awesome). I haven't seen what happens when you max it out though.

This is exactly right. I may be remembering wrong, but I'm pretty sure even the descriptions of the different difficulty options were basically telling you how heavily you were going to be relying on alchemy at each difficulty.

That said, the combat in that game is awesome.

# ¿ Oct 10, 2010 06:22

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# ¿ Apr 19, 2024 17:27

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Seconding Xenosaga, also Temple of Elemental Evil was just released on GOG.com. The most faithful rendition of 3e D&D rules, no random encounters, all turn-based and menu driven. I think the closest thing to a random encounter is monsters wandering by if you sleep in a dangerous area, which you never have to do.

# ¿ Oct 14, 2010 02:37

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Samurai Sanders posted:

I think I might give ToEE a try myself. I want to know though, does it have lots of diverse unique equipment hiding in dungeons, like Baldur's Gate? Dragon Age let me down in that department, as does the Witcher and hell...almost everything these days. Well-designed unique weapons have completely given way to either a crafting system, or randomized loot.

It's been quite a while since I played through ToEE, but I'd say it's probably closer to Baldur's Gate, although in a much more limited capacity. I think the reason for that is largely because it's significantly shorter than the BG games are, with fewer areas. It's not completely random equipment, and there is a crafting system but it's the one from 3e D&D. Only caster classes can make magic items, plus they need to take crafting feats with the limited slots you'll get with level 10 characters, and on top of that it costs XP to craft, so it's really only for things like a few stat-boosting accessories and pumping a weapon or two to +5 late in the game. Other than that you'll be using mostly found equipment, but between the length of the game and the fact that the ToEE itself is the only significant dungeon (unless I'm forgetting something), I wouldn't go into it expecting to find a Celestial Fury or Crom Faeyr or anything like that.

# ¿ Oct 14, 2010 04:18

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Passion for Dilbert posted:

Any mention in this thread of old sandbox CRPG Darklands? If a modern (and faithful) remake of the game happened it would be just swell

It's not a remake, but the game was recently put up on GOG.

# ¿ Oct 24, 2011 14:14

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Crossposting this:

This may be more exciting to people who have read the books or seen the series: an action RPG based on Game of Thrones is in the works for PS3, 360, PC. It's being developed by Cyanide, published by Atlus.

Source: http://rpgfan.com/news/2011/2410.html

Cyanide is also working on another action RPG. Apparently they made Loki, which I don't remember hearing good things about.

# ¿ Nov 11, 2011 04:49

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Wendell posted:

Holy poo poo, Cyber Org looks awesome! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9s7rpsl5Ik

Talk about completely opposite trailers - here's Another Mind. That Cyber Org trailer is amazing.

# ¿ Nov 12, 2011 16:04

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Ibram Gaunt posted:

Eh, that's a pretty harsh comparison. That scene linked is probably one of a small handful of goofy scenes which were really put in just to contrast with how gory and hosed up the rest of the game is.

Innocent young girl goes off alone in a creepy old house to lube her rear end... :stare:

butterpooper, no!

# ¿ Nov 28, 2011 08:44

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

brennon posted:

Yeah, I'm honestly not sure how any person can reasonably consider DA:O a 'step back' from BG2 in terms of RPG titles. I mean, the only thing in BG2 you really had any freedom over was the mechanics of your character, and to be honest it was a loving spreadsheet nightmare courtesy of the notoriously opacity of the D&D 2e system. Not only that, but it was a minefield of newbie traps and lovely builds, with absolutely massive power disparities between varying types of character, further aggravated by the fact that the items and situations the game presented to you heavily favoured certain weapon styles or builds over others with absolutely no indication that this would be the case. Granted, a lot has been learned about what makes a good game, but deliberately detrimental game mechanics were left in BG2 for no good reason. Nobody was forcing them to put poo poo like Toughness in.

I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about here, because in BG2 you don't really have a lot of control over the mechanics of your character specifically because of the way the 2E rules were adapted. Say you make a fighter, for example. You pick your race, roll your stats, and you pick your weapon proficiencies. That's it. Unless you count giving your fighter 18 intelligence and a single point in every weapon type, you can't accidentally make a lovely build. With more "complex" classes like spellcasters, the only thing you need to know is which stat you use for magic.

Are you maybe talking about NWN or IWD2 instead of BG2? Because unless I'm forgetting something, Toughness is not in BG2 (it's a feat in the 3E system).

# ¿ Dec 4, 2011 02:06

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

NOT PAUL LAYTON posted:

Most of the multiclass options are serviceable even if they aren't optimal. Having five other characters means even the worst selection won't cripple you.

You can't dual class during character creation. Dual classing is easy to screw up, sure, but the requirements for it are high enough that you pretty much have to intentionally build your character for it, suggesting that you know what you're doing anyway. It also gives you an explanation and a big warning when you actually choose to do it, just in case.

Weapon proficiency is barely an issue. Every class except fighter can only put two points into a proficiency anyway (Edit: a max of two - for most classes it's only one), so you aren't missing out a whole lot if you only put one point in. Fighters can put up to five so there's a lot of wasted potential there, but between the system being fairly intuitive and including explanations of exactly what the benefits are and the fact that fighters get an additional point every three levels, unless the player is deliberately putting points into weapons he isn't using it's hard to see there being a problem. There is the issue of weapons having different amounts of representation, but most weapon types have at least decent weapons so unless you're making a sling fighter or something you'll probably find something to use. Having five other characters again helps because the NPCs will have decent proficiencies.

Your problem with stats is also pretty exaggerated. Fighter-type classes have a higher max strength than other classes. It's poorly represented, sure, but the concept is simple enough. Constitution is also very straightforward: fighter-types continue seeing benefits above 16 CON. Other classes do not, but you aren't losing anything when you can just reroll for more stat points. Some stats aren't very useful, but it really is a very straightforward system. Strength for offense, dexterity and constitution for defense, and whatever casting stat your class uses. The sorcerer thing is a glitch, but you're right that that's a problem at least.

Also, here's the end of the description for the Wish spell, both in-game and in the ToB manual: "Lastly, the wiser the wizard, the better chance that he will choose the right wording. Wizards with low wisdom will more often than not meet with disaster when asking for a wish."

Armor-Piercing fucked around with this message at 04:16 on Dec 4, 2011

# ¿ Dec 4, 2011 04:09

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Zarick posted:

You don't see the problem when any character can allocate up to 18 in Con but sees no benefit over 16?

I see a problem with it in the same sense that I see a problem with the 18(xx) fighter strength. The cap on constitution bonus isn't clear unless you looked at the appendix in the manual (which I wouldn't expect anyone to). There can still be advantages to putting more than 16 points into the stat for a non-fighter: although you don't receive a larger HP bonus, the extra points act as a buffer against stat drain from an enemy before losing your existing bonus, and I think there are pieces of equipment and at least one quest that can lower your stats.

Regardless, not specifying that information on the character creation screen is a problem of implementation, not a design decision, and so if you're willing to overlook similar problems in DA:O I don't see why you wouldn't do the same in this case.

Also, it's entirely possible to take enemy casters without using breach. Inquisitors aside, you can also overwhelm defenses like stoneskin pretty quickly if you focus on individual enemies, and thieves (particularly assassins) can ruin a caster with a single backstab if you sneak in first. Breach is mostly so your own casters can use other offensive spells.

# ¿ Dec 6, 2011 22:46

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Lt. Danger posted:

Improved Mantle? Fireshield? Blade Barrier? Invisibility? Mislead? Time Stop?

BG2 is the game of wizard combat, there's no two ways about it.

Even if you don't have good enough weapons to get around it, Improved Mantle only lasts four rounds - kill something else or heal while you wait. Fireshield doesn't actually protect a caster from physical damage, it only deters melee (which you can get around with a potion) and does absolutely nothing to stop ranged attacks. Blade Barrier is good but in most environments you can get out of it after a single hit (also it's a cleric spell). Invisibility does very little for a wizard, and even the attack penalty from Improved Invisibility isn't going to matter given a wizard's AC (also clerics and I think inquisitors can use true seeing, plus there are potions to deal with this). Mislead can be dispelled easily, and correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think the image actually gets any of the protection effects on the caster so it'll live for a round at best. Time stop is rough, but unless I'm forgetting something the player can't do anything about an enemy casting time stop anyway, and it's useless in at least a couple boss fights.

I'm not claiming that wizards aren't incredibly useful for the player and quite dangerous to fight, but they are neither necessary nor invincible. Also, the only thing I even said in that post was that you can deal with them without casting Breach.

# ¿ Dec 6, 2011 23:53

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Megaflare posted:

Yeah. People seem kind of surprised by this assessment but being "wizard combat" has pretty much been a staple of every edition of D&D before 4e. Nostalgia is really, really strong with this game though.

Again, I don't think anyone has really said they've been surprised at how good wizards are, particularly since that's pretty par for the course universally, not just in D&D. You still don't need a wizard to beat BG2.

# ¿ Dec 7, 2011 01:32

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Langrisser 1 was localized for Genesis as Warsong, and is also worth playing.

# ¿ Jan 28, 2012 19:32

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

The first .hack game is on that list too, so I think you can pretty safely disregard it.

# ¿ Feb 25, 2012 02:20

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

I'd recommend 12 (although I'm hoping there'll be an HD rerelease announced sometime). It's not very grindy although you do benefit from it if you want to.

Captain Vittles posted:

I've never actually finished this one because there's no save points in the final dungeon; when the final boss kills you after two hours of dungeon diving and sub-boss fighting, it really discourages trying again right away.

This is exactly why I did try it again right away. If I lose a lot of progress in a game and then quit instead of doing it again right away, every time I think about playing it I just say "I really don't want to do all that again" and play something else instead. I lost on my first go at the final boss too and immediately went back for more (and thankfully succeeded on my second attempt).

# ¿ Mar 18, 2012 17:36

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Barudak posted:

And remember when I said the tutorial elements end when you get 20 hours in? Surprise, you actually unlock the last bits of your characters skills by beating the final boss.

I get that you hate the game, but I don't think unlocking the top tier abilities of each class is really something you could consider a "tutorial element." Also, while it's probably not the best solution, it's at least an attempt to make sure that the final boss somewhat challenging on the first run. For example, some people in the Xenoblade thread are lamenting the fact that, if they have been doing a bunch of the extra content and going after all the unique monsters, the final boss is an underwhelming pushover because they're overlevelled. Keeping the top of the crystarium locked until you've beaten the final boss once is supposed to help prevent that. It also encourages you to do some postgame content because there's a new opportunity for progression. Like I said, not necessarily the best solution, but it's hardly a tutorial.

# ¿ May 7, 2012 23:24

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

It doesn't really matter if you play them in order. There's no connection between the games, and they're both pretty different styles (FF3 being more like FF1 and FF4 being more like FF6, if you've played those) rather than one being a direct improvement of the other.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2012 17:33

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

At one point I was planning on suggesting in the Final Fantasy thread that we do a random class challenge for FF3 like what has been done with FF5 before (with obvious exceptions for one or two areas like when you need magic). Then I figured that even offering to play FF3DS with whatever the worst combination is (probably Scholar, Evoker, and anything else) would probably not convince anyone else to play it with me.

So pretty much just play FF4DS since you already own it and chances are you won't like FF3DS anyway. I'm saying this as someone who really enjoyed FF3DS and doesn't like FF4 (I played the PSP version) at all.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2012 19:21

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Paperhouse posted:

Can anyone suggest any good JRPGs that aren't particularly anime influenced? I feel like so much of it is, kind of wondering what's out there that has a different style to all of that. Bonus for if they're PS2 or DS games

Anachronox plays like a JRPG but is made by a Western developer. Story and characters are weird but interesting, though I hear the ending leaves a never-happening sequel to be desired. It's for PC, and is currently on sale for $3 on GOG.

# ¿ Dec 15, 2012 00:05

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

If you have a high intelligence anyway, grab Summon Ogre (third spell in its school) and keep at least one of those around all the time. They're level 30 and don't care that you're evil.

# ¿ Jan 13, 2013 01:01

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

I like Xenosaga II, including the combat system. If you can't play the first game, though, I wouldn't bother. Just watching the cutscenes from the first game without actually playing it sounds like a horrible time.

# ¿ Feb 20, 2013 18:27

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

adamarama posted:

I'm going to start my first play through of Arcanum soon; I've got the GOG version and seen the modding thread there, so I'll patch up. One thing though, I hear the combat is pretty unbalanced, favouring magic and backstab over melee, guns, and tech. Are there any good balance mods that make tech and guns viable? I'd like some challenge in the combat rather than every encounter being trivialised. Or are there any builds I should go for that make the combat challenging yet not a chore?

The balance issue is more that magic is stupidly overpowered than that tech and guns are underpowered. Tech characters have an easier time with lockpicking, so money and equipment are generally never an issue. Grenades are also fairly handy, and molotovs are easy to find components for. It would be a good idea to find yourself a companion or two to tank while you shoot things, though. Maybe not if you're throwing grenades.

# ¿ Apr 8, 2013 10:26

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

If you're using a softmodded system or Dolphin, you can also considering using cheat codes if you just want to see the rest of the story. I don't usually resort to it, but I'm glad I did in this case because I wasn't enjoying it at all and otherwise wouldn't have bothered finishing it either. Then again, I still didn't think it was worth the time.

# ¿ Sep 18, 2013 23:09

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Paperhouse posted:

In this kind of vein, can anyone recommend any JRPGs that are fun to play precisely because the encounter rate isn't obnoxiously high?

I wouldn't say that the encounter rate is specifically what makes these fun, but in both Final Fantasy VIII and the upcoming Bravely Default there are ways to decrease or eliminate random encounters when you don't want them.

# ¿ Jan 26, 2014 14:17

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

To further clarify, when you get the mission to fish, open your map and go to where the big red X is on it.

# ¿ Apr 8, 2014 17:56

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Bionic Dues is turn-based, has RPG elements, and you control a team of mechs.

It's not very story-focused or serious though. WHY WAS I PROGRAMMED TO FEEL PAIN

The Front Mission series is pretty solid too, although not new.

# ¿ Apr 29, 2014 00:39

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Rinkles posted:

I'd like to see the alternate world where Gallian Panzers became a successful IP of strategy RPGs.

Same, but with Valkyria Chronicles

We haven't even gotten rumors about another game being developed yet, have we?

Edit: Someone else can fix this up but something like "the game of girls (maidens) protecting the homeland and driving on the <something>"

Armor-Piercing fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Apr 30, 2014

# ¿ Apr 30, 2014 18:25

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

FillInTheBlank posted:

I wish they would release DQ8 on PSN. They ported it to Android/iOS already.

You know, the Android/iOS version of FF3 is going up on Steam. Maybe they'll port that DQ8 version too.

If you buy enough copies of FF3 :getin:

# ¿ May 19, 2014 05:40

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Ni No Kuni should have just been an adventure game where you run around and cast spells, and even that got boring after the first handful of heart piece quests and being told exactly when and where to use each spell ("Boy it sure would be great if there was a Bridge here!").

If you want to finish it pretty easily, get a Dinoceros, look up directions to one of the easy grinding spots, set the game to easy, and spam Earsplitter. Still not worth the effort, but at least it's less effort.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2014 05:28

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

There's a demo of Fairy Fencer F on the Japanese PSN store. I played through it a while back and it seemed alright. You're a cool-guy anime protagonist, you find a sword that is also a girl, and then you team up with other people who also have weapons that are people and you fight stuff. Pretty sure there will be a love triangle between you, your sword, and a mysterious girl.

Combat is alright. I haven't played Neptunia so I don't know if it's the same, but it's turn-based with free movement, so you can position yourself for team attacks and to avoid AoE skills. Your characters can also transform/merge with your weapon (I think the game called it "Fairilizing"?) to power up temporarily.

I don't know if the demo just didn't have the scenes, but after the opening two people join your party with no introduction, not appearing on the screen at all, just a prompt saying they joined. It was weird. One of them was this guy:

# ¿ Jun 28, 2014 19:34

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

I only got about halfway through Symphonia 2 on Wii before my save was deleted, and I haven't started the HD version yet, but I enjoyed what I played of it more than the first one. Fewer protagonists to dislike, more pokemon.

# ¿ Sep 13, 2014 07:30

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Neddy Seagoon posted:

You know, I like the premise of the pokeymans monster capturing with Dawn of the New World, but why the gently caress did they cripple it early on? To be able to try and form a pact with a monster, you need to swing the elemental grid into a majority of a single colour with Artes of the element you want. Fine. Except the only skill you have early on with an elemental attribute is the basic heal on Marta . Most fights are over long before you sit with a thumb up your rear end spamming heals to get it aligned right, just for a chance to potentially form a pact with a monster.

I'm pretty sure you get other elemental stuff fairly quickly, but just get a bear and use that for a while.

Why would you even want another monster?

# ¿ Sep 14, 2014 16:30

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

BloodWulfe posted:

It's such a simple mechanic next to everything else, and I know it's brought up a lot, but I wish more JRPGs had timed attacks like SMRPG did. It had the perfect approach to it too: take advantage of the mechanic if you want, but it's never required.

Coolest Game Final Fantasy VIII has timed attacks, but I will confess that I could never land them consistently with anyone other than Squall. Most of the other characters I could get it with once in a while, but I think with Rinoa I just gave up entirely on trying to figure out the timing.

Not that timed attacks matter for too long in that game, since you can pretty quickly start doing ridiculous damage without them.

# ¿ Sep 15, 2014 14:30

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

dis astranagant posted:

None of the other characters have them. That's the reason why Squall and Seifer both only crit for 150% damage instead of double like everyone else.

That makes me feel a lot better about not being able to pull it off with the other characters, but a lot worse for beating the game twice without somehow noticing that.

# ¿ Sep 15, 2014 14:41

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

U-DO Burger posted:

who was that, it's not in the archive.

Actually, if you read the datalog, you would know exactly who it was.

# ¿ Dec 5, 2014 23:32

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Omikron? It's on sale on GOG for $2.50 right now.

Edit: There's also Infinite Space on DS, I hear that's good.

# ¿ Dec 26, 2014 22:56

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Reason posted:

Were there any can't miss RPGs for 360, PS3 or Wii? (I already have Xenoblade) I'm catching up on consoles that I didn't buy until used.

Nier is the only must-have. Then, if you liked Nier (you should), get Drakengard 3.

# ¿ Feb 17, 2015 03:26

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Symphonia 2 is a pretty alright Tales game, and I like it more than Graces F (which has fun combat but the worst cast).

Courage is the magic that turns dreams into reality, you know.

# ¿ Feb 19, 2015 21:39

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Endorph posted:

graces has malik, pascal, and sophie

Sophie is okay sometimes, and Pascal would be great without 90% of the scenes between her and Sophie. I had to check to make sure Malik was the person I was thinking of, because I didn't have any problem with him except that I can't remember a single thing about him.

My main complaint is with the other three. The game starts you off with three dumb annoying kids and then there's a timeskip and somehow they're even worse.

Edit: It's not that I think Symphonia 2 has great characters, they're just less bad than the bad characters in Graces. Also you can have monsters in your party, which may be relatively useless but are still better than having more Tales characters.

Armor-Piercing fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Feb 19, 2015

# ¿ Feb 19, 2015 21:52

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# ¿ Apr 19, 2024 17:27

Armor-Piercing: Sep 22, 2009; Nightly dance
of bleeding swords

Codiekitty posted:

I love how NIER's opening...

Spoils the entire game. It even shows the final boss at one point.

This is why I just show people the condensed version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvyvQfn30uE

# ¿ Jun 23, 2015 22:21

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