Search Amazon.com:
Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«41 »
  • Post
  • Reply
WindyMan
Mar 21, 2002

Respect the power of the wind

Hello, and welcome to the new Roller Derby Megathread!

This thread intends to be a one-stop shop for any information you need on the sport of roller derby in its current incarnation. In this post you will find current events and news. In the second post you will find information about roller derby including important points to know, key roller derby terms, and links of interest. Please find the original GBS thread here, and read on for everything you need to know about derby today:

Last Updated on 1/25/2013
This post: Upcoming Events, News/Announcements
Next post: Roller Derby 101, Basic Rules, History, WFTDA, Derby Organization, Links <--- Read this if you have not seen roller derby recently, because it's not like wrestling anymore No really, it isn't. It kind of looks like it still but that's because roller derby is still dumb


Roller derby in Minnesota

Upcoming Major Events

April 19-21 - Derby Ink Invitational - Probably the biggest derby event this year, if not ever, it's a $20,000 jackpot banked track tournament for both men and women. $8,000 go to each of the winning teams. It's put on by MADE, the co-ed derby organization based in the east coast, but many WFTDA skaters are already confirmed to be going, including Team Bionic and a WFTDA mash-up of skaters from Gotham, Philly, and Charm City. It will be live-streamed, but streaming details are not yet available. Do not miss this one.

May 17-19 - Spring Roll - The biggest men's flat track derby (MRDA) event of the regular season, with 10 teams playing in various games over the three-day weekend. (There will also be WFTDA and Juniors games.) Considering the insanity at MRDA Champs, this is probably going to be must-see-Internet-TV as well.

June 7-9 - Battle on the Bank VI - Banked track derby's (RDCL) big event. This year will be extra-significant since it will be played under a new rule set that is no longer a derivative of WFTDA rules. So that right there is reason to check it out.

June 28-30 - East Coast Derby Extravaganza - The WFTDA's big "regular season" finale, with a lot of great teams coming together to play a lot of games. This is the last weekend before playoff rankings are locked in (see below), so it's always crazy-busy as far as action goes.

News/Announcements

Hello, 2013! It's the biggest year yet for roller derby.

First, some major news. The WFTDA has announced a big shake-up with its new national rankings system, a switch from regional polling. This has allowed the WFTDA to introduce divisions to break up teams by skill level (sort of) and compel them to better schedule games. Details on the change can be found here.

Oh yeah, and everyone is releasing updated rules for 2013, too. Freakin' finally, the WFTDA has updated their rules after a 2Ĺ year wait. With no more minor penalties and some major housekeeping changes, most of the bad stuff has been removed. But it's a big unknown if it will be an overall improvement. RDCL (banked track), USARS, and MADE have updated rules out or coming out soon as well, so everyone is slowly but surely (but some faster than others) figuring things out.

WindyMan fucked around with this message at Jan 26, 2013 around 04:22

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

WindyMan
Mar 21, 2002

Respect the power of the wind


Roller derby in Seattle

What is roller derby?

In a nutshell, roller derby is an American-invented contact sport that involves two teams of five players each, all on roller skates, attempting to pass each other on an oval track for points. I like to call it a combination of football, hockey, and NASCAR; there are very similar traits of those sports found in roller derby.

The Basics of Roller Derby

In all forms of roller derby, two teams of five skaters each compete against each other on a specially marked oval track. The goal of the game is for a teamís designated point scorer, called the jammer, to overtake and then lap the skaters on the other team, while the other teamís jammer tries to do the same thing at the same time. This happens during a timed scoring cycle known as a jam. A team gets one point for every skater of the opposing team that their jammer can lap on each scoring pass. The jammers wear a star on their helmets so you can see that they are the scoring player on a team.

The non-scoring group of skaters, known collectively as the pack, consists of up to four blockers from each team. The blockers attempt to help their jammer get through the pack, while simultaneously trying to prevent the other teamís jammer from doing the same, effectively making the blockers play offense and defense at the same time. A specially designated blocker, known as the pivot, is traditionally considered the boss of the pack for a team and can become a jammer under certain circumstances. Pivots wear a striped helmet.

Roller Derby History 101


Roller derby in Chicago's Comiskey Park in 1973

Although various skating competitions have been taking place in the U.S. since the 1880s, contemporary roller derby got its start in the 1930s when Leo Seltzer organized a simulated cross-country rollerskating race held on a banked skating track, featuring teams of male-female pairs. What was planned to be just an hours-long endurance race turned into a more physical affair when slower skaters started blocking the advances of faster skaters to prevent being lapped. Although this wasn't originally a part of the rules it turned out to be the most exciting part of the event, and because of its popularity Seltzer ultimately devised what is now known as the sport of roller derby. Due to its roots, pro roller derby teams have always had both men and women on them (alternating periods in a game) making derby unique in sports.

Derby continued to thrive up through the 1960s, during which time Leo's son Jerry took over to become the head of roller derby. During these years, roller derby was being played in front of crowds upwards of 16,000 in Madison Square Garden; 28,000 in Oakland Coliseum; 50,000 in Comiskey Park in Chicago. Part of the reason for derby's sheer popularity around this time was due in part to it starting to become more "sports entertainment" (a la the WWE) instead of just a straight sport. There would be fighting, hair-pulling, and more or less "illegal" things going on during some games, all of which was distracting from the actual sport of roller derby. Jerry Seltzer eventually shut down roller derby in the early 1970s due to financial and other reasons.

However, derby still stuck around in various mutations between then and now. In the late 80s there was a made-for-TV version of roller derby called Rollergames, wherein skaters had to skate on a figure-8 track, survive the highly-banked "Wall of Death," launch off of a jump for points, had a bitchin' rad 80s-futuristic scoreboard and, most famously, had an alligator pit in the infield. That only lasted for a year. In 1999, a modernized made-for-TV roller derby series called Rollerjam featured professional skaters using inline skates around a larger, faster track. This was awesome for all of half of the first season, but then it quickly devolved into wrestling on roller skates (almost literally, since TNA wrestling preceded it on the network it was on) and was cancelled after four TV seasons.

The modern revival of roller derbyóthat derby you've heard about recently and why you're probably reading this threadóstarted in 2002. A group of women in Texas thought it would be cool to try out the roller derby they remember watching while growing up, but actually make rules and play it legit. That has grown from an idea to over 1200 leagues in the United States and around the world. All roller derby leagues are completely skater-owned and operated on a volunteer basis. All players are amateurs (in that they donít do derby exclusively and are not paid) and do it primarily for love of the game. The Women's Flat Track Derby Association (WFTDA) sanctions interleague women's play in the U.S. and is growing internationally. The Men's Roller Derby Association (MRDA) was recently organized to handle the initial organization of the few men's derby teams that are starting to pop up.

Unlike all past forms of traditional roller derby, modern roller derby (at least for now) separates men and women into distinct and altogether separate leagues and teams. Traditional derby games also took place on the banked track, but nowadays (with a few exceptions as noted below) modern derby is played on a flat track due to cost and setup reasons. Any legit derby game you will go to will more than likely play under standardized rules created for the womenís flat track game.

The Modern Roller Derby Game

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2W2b1WBmm4
Flat track roller derby rules

In flat track games using standardized WFTDA rules, games last 60 minutes and are broken up into two 30-minute halves. Jams last two minutes. Pack skaters line up in a standing start with the pivots up front, the other blockers behind them. The two jammers start 20 feet behind the pack. At the start of a jam, one whistle sends the pack around the track, and a second whistle starts the jammers. The first jammer that can make their initial (non-scoring) pass through the pack without committing a penalty is declared the lead jammer. This is a special jammer status that allows said jammer to stop the jam early, to either stop the other jammer from scoring or for other strategic reasons, by placing their hands on their hips. Once given, lead jammer status cannot change, but there are situations where neither jammer is a lead jammer and a jam will go the full two minutes.

Referees can peg skaters for different types and severities of penalties during gameplay. If a skaters does something illegal but it doesnít affect gameplay, they are issued a minor penalty and get to continue skating. If a skater does something illegal that immediately affects gameplay for their own advantage or to the other teamís disadvantage, they get whistled for a major penalty and are sent immediately to the penalty box for a one-minute penalty. The skater is also sent to the penalty box for a minute if they collect four minor penalties. After getting seven majors during one game, the skater gets a penalty ejection and canít return. Ejections can also occur for gross misconduct, throwing punches, fighting, or other majorly bad stuff.

During which time a skater (or skaters) for a team is in a penalty box, that team needs to skate shorthanded for the duration of the penalty. If a jammer gets a penalty, the other team will enjoy a power jam situation, wherein they will be the only team that can score (as the other teamís jammer canít score from the penalty box). Any skaters sitting in the penalty box become pointsóthat is, ghost pointsófor the other team once the other teamís jammer scores on someone from the other team during a scoring pass.

Players can only legally block with their shoulders and booty, and can only hit people in their upper body region. Common penalties involve use of arms or elbows during blocks; passing someone out of bounds (cutting the track); intentionally breaking up the pack, which must stay together; blocking out of play, which is normally 20 feet outside of the defined pack; and blocking someone in their back (ramming from behind). The current WFTDA ruleset allows for skaters to stop on the track and skate the wrong way (clockwise), but all blocking must happen in a forward (counter-clockwise) direction.

Womenís Flat Track Derby Association (WFTDA)


2012 WFTDA Playoffs in San Francisco

Formed in 2006, the WFTDA is the major sanctioning body in womenís flat-track roller derby. As of late 2012, they have about 170 sanctioned leagues primarily located in the U.S., but leagues from Canada and Europe are also starting to get sanctioning. About 90 more are in WFTDA apprentice leagues awaiting full sanctioning. Leagues were previously divided by region, but now the WFTDA uses a division system that ranks all teams regardless of geographic location.

For the most part any roller derby league, sanctioned or not, will have different teams within their home league. These home teams play against each other and have their own league championship. Leagues will then pool together their best skaters from within their local teams into all-star travel teams, which play against other travel teams within their region and inter-regionally. The results of these games to determine official WFTDA regional rankings. These rankings determine seeding for the end-of-year playoffs, known as The Big Five. The top ten teams from each region get invited to the four regional tournaments to determine final regional ranking, and then the top three winners from regionals qualify for nationals the WFTDA Championships, where the best 12 teams skate it out for the whole ball oí wax.

If you want to see flat track roller derby at its best, the regionals and the championships are the best times to watch it. Luckily, games can be seen for free streaming over the Internet, and a lot of times games are archived for posterity. If you need to see a high-quality game of derby to truly understand what itís about, I recommend reviewing the 2009 Eastern Regionals final between Gotham and Philly to see one of the better games in modern derby history, which you can start watching here.

There are far too many WFTDA teams to list here, but you can easily find a fully-sanctioned league or up-and-coming apprentice league near you at the WFTDA website. You can also see regional rankings (and unofficial national rankings) for top teams in the first post.

Menís Roller Derby Association (MRDA)

For whatever reason, modern menís roller derby didnít get organized until 2008. Back then, the loose collection of men's derby leagues formed the Men's Derby Coalition. The MDC was not exactly a sanctioning body per se, but at the time were the only group available for menís leagues to turn to to help organize leagues and inter-league play.

Since then, the MDC has, according to their website, "grown up." As of March 2011 the MDC has been upgraded to the Men's Roller Derby Association (MRDC), the de facto sanctioning body for men's derby leagues. They are effectively the male equivalent to the WFTDA. However, although they use the WFTDA ruleset for consistencyís sake and many of the male skaters help organize, referee and coach WFTDA leagues and teams, the MRDA is otherwise unaffiliated with the WFTDA, although they collaborate with each other for the purposes of helping to grow the sport of roller derby.

As of January 2011 the MDC only has eleven sanctioned leagues in the U.S. However, much like womenís derby that number is likely to skyrocket in the next few years. Some of the better-known menís teams are the New York Shock Exchange, Harm City Homicide (Baltimore, MD), St. Louis Gatekeepers (MO), and Puget Sound Outcasts (Tacoma, WA). A full list of known menís leagues can be found on the MDRA website.

Modern Banked Track Roller Derby



Although flat track derby is the most prevalent form of the game being played right now, a few leagues are lucky enough to be in a position to play derby the way it has always been played historically: on the banked track. Games on a banked track are faster and harder hitting due to the nature of the banked skating surface and elevated outside railing. Itís also waaaay more expensive to run a banked track league since you need to both build the track (not cheap) and put it somewhere, either in storage or in a permanent venue (also not cheap). Remember, even banked track leagues are run by volunteers!

Because there are so few banked track leagues around the country, local banked leagues generally play within their local teams only, using their own rulesets. However, for the most part banked track games have slightly different rules on account of its nature. While games are still 60 minutes, there are instead four 15-minute quarters, and jams are only 60 seconds each. The lead jammer is always literally the jammer in the lead, so if one jammer passes the other on the track lead jammer status will change immediately. Skaters are not allowed to stop moving skate backwards under any circumstances. There are still minor and major penalties, but major penalties are not served until the start of the next jam and only last for the duration of the jam. Because of that, the last jam of a banked track game has different rules for penalties and scoring ghost points. Other than that, the game is effectively the same as flat-track derby.

Banked track all-star travel teams very rarely play each other outside of the Battle on the Bank banked-track roller derby tournament, which started in 2008 and takes place every summer. During this tournament they play under a standardized ruleset formed under a loose organization of banked leagues called the World Organization of Roller Derby (WORD), but outside of that there is no national sanctioning body for banked track leagues. However, starting this year (2011) banked track teams are starting to play against each other more than they have been. In addition, many established WFTDA teams are trying their luck against top banked track teams in full games using WORD rules.

If youíre mostly familiar with the flat track game or would just like see what roller derby on the high banks is all about, I highly recommend the 3rd place game between LA and Texas in this past summerís Battle on the Bank tournament. This particular game is more physical than your normal game would be, but itís still pretty freakiní awesome. Start watching it here.

Some of the better-known banked track leagues in the country are the Derby Dolls (Los Angeles/San Diego), TXRD (Texas), Tilted Thunder (Seattle), the Arizona Derby Dames, and others. Battle on the Bank also has its own website.

Other Organizations

USARS, or USA Roller Sports, is the recognized sanctioning body for roller sports in the USA. (If you play inline or rink hockey, it's them.) The recently came out with their own roller derby rules (which I helped write, sort of) and are attempting to advance the game to a new level, potentially an Olympic level. They just got started with their first games in 2012, but will come out with more exposure this year. Keep an eye out for these guys.

MADE, or the Modern Athletic Derby Endeavor. Based on the east coast, these guys are co-ed and play both flat track and banked track. Their rules are a modernized update to the classic roller derby rules, but played legitimately. Unrelated is the OSDA, the Old-School Derby Association, which plays by classic rules untouched, but still legitimately, although OSDA leagues are few and far between.

Renegade derby is a billed as a no-holds barred style of game, where there are fewer rules (if any) and is generally more wild and out of control. Do not mistake this for real, legit roller derby, because it is not...though it's an interesting way to watch the game being played.

Youíll also still hear about the old, classic banked track derby teams like the Bay City Bombers or the LA Thunderbirds. Nowadays these teams merely play exhibitions, make appearances, etc. Much like the Harlem Globetrotters, theyíre just there for the show, and not so much actual competition. You should also not mistake this kind of derby for real roller derby, although the history of teams like these should definitely be appreciated.

Find Roller Derby in your Area

If you live in a major city, or near a major city, or like to pretend you live near a major city, then there is a high probability you live near a local roller derby league or two. If you do a search for "<your location> roller derby" youíll find something easily. However itís very important to realize that since roller derby is still expanding, the league you find or the game you go to may not be representative of the overall quality of derby today.

For example, a leagueís games may be held in a warehouse or a full-blown sports arena. A game could be very competitive between two good teams, very competitive between two bad teams, or a blowout of a bad team by a good team. You could see one game, a double-header, or multi-game tournament at one event. If you just go to one game and donít like it, you shouldnít immediately put it off. (You wouldnít like basketball all that much if you only saw the Clippers and Nets play each other, right?) But for the most part, youíll like derby if you like sports, and a lot of people that donít generally like sports can enjoy (and play!) roller derby.

Because of its grass-roots revival, anyone can play roller derby. Even you! Women will have an admittedly easier time finding a league to try out for, but before not too long even you lazy-rear end guy goons will be able to find a male league looking for man-skaters. If you canít wait, womenís leagues need referees and volunteers of all genders, so find your local league and get involved!

Derby News Network

DNN is the go-to info site for everything roller derby. They try to cover as many games as humanly possible, with live streaming video, in conjunction with the individual leaguesí own in-house production teams. Much like roller derby itself, DNN is supported financially by its audience. Basically, if you want to watch roller derby but canít see it in person, you can watch it for free through their website when itís available. DNN also keeps an unofficial top-25 power rankings list for all derby teams regardless of region, and carries scores and other derby news.

If you want to see derby streaming live online, in addition to most games DNN covers, I highly recommend watching the webcasts for the Derby Dolls (Los Angeles and San Diego; banked track), Rose City Rollers (Portland, OR; flat track) or Gotham Girls Roller Derby (New York; flat track) since they have the best video quality and highest production values out there at this moment in time. Also, theyíre some of the best derby leagues in the country. You can find upcoming game and webcast schedules on the individual websites for the leagues or on DNN.

Links of Interest

http://wftda.com - Womenís Flat Track Derby Association (league and sanctioning info, rules, rankings)
http://www.mensderbyassociation.com - Menís Roller Derby Association (formally MDC; leagues and organization info)
http://www.derbynewsnetwork.com - Derby News Network (live streaming games, news, rankings, scores)
http://flattrackstats.com/ - Flat Track Stats (statistics and rankings)
http://www.derbydeeds.com - Derby Deeds podcast (news and views)
http://www.rollerderbyjesus.com/ - Personal blog of Jerry Seltzer, main promoter of derby through the 70s (derby history and insight)
http://windyman.net/ - My personal derby blog, WindyMan's Roller Derby Notes
http://www.derbyroster.com/ - Listing of all known roller derby leagues in the world
http://www.twoevils.org/rollergirls/ - Roller derby skater name registry

WindyMan fucked around with this message at Jan 26, 2013 around 04:37

Jiminy Krimpet
May 13, 2010

My name is Jiminy Krimpet, and I am a Falcoholic.

Welp, that's pretty comprehensive. Nice first post, thanks for putting all of it together. I'm no expert but I've been to my share of derby events over the past few years and you pretty much covered everything I know.

I will point out that "games" are called "bouts." I've never heard anyone who was familiar with derby call them "games," but you seem to know your stuff, perhaps they call them "games" in LA?

Jiminy Krimpet fucked around with this message at Oct 14, 2010 around 02:51

Totally TWISTED
Sep 13, 2005

Also, angels.




Suggested Addition: 'The Pack' is defined as the largest group of in bounds Blockers, skating in proximity, containing members from both teams.

This comes into play with strategy such as one team trapping a single blocker from the opposing team to slow the pack down.

As a fan of the Nashville Rollergirls I would be remiss not to mention how awesome they are, anyone in the local area should attend their first home bout (next season) and in the meantime catch them playing the Oly Rollers on Nov. 5th @ 7:15 via the live stream on DNN.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBznpPq--5k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQY8TIQf74s
Embedded this but you should really watch it in sexy 720p fullscreen.

WindyMan
Mar 21, 2002

Respect the power of the wind

Jiminy Krimpet posted:

I will point out that "games" are called "bouts." I've never heard anyone who was familiar with derby call them "games," but you seem to know your stuff, perhaps they call them "games" in LA?

No, they're called games. If Jerry Seltzer, the Jesus* of roller derby, calls them games, then they're called games. Always have been.

Jerry Seltzer posted:

I was at Kiel Auditorium in St. Louis and we sold out weeks in advance for this 10,000 seat facility. A writer from the St. Louis Post-Dispatch was at the game (not bout, dammit) and was amazed.

Jerry Seltzer posted:

After several years we started to expand our operations and as our television network grew, we were able to play games (not bouts) in more and more cities.

He makes reference to this fact all the time on his blog.

*The Son of The Father of Roller Derby

scorpiobean
Dec 22, 2004

I'll have one sugar coma drink, please.

Wow that was a nice first post! I especially liked the extra information about the banked track and other leagues. Since I've gotten to see a men's game, I'd love to see a banked track game next and from what I gather, DNN sometimes does show banked track games sometimes.

For anyone interested in joining a league, but not sure if there's one nearby, I'm going to reiterate WindyMan's point that there is a very good chance that there is some sort of league nearby. If little Ithaca can manage to get together two teams, where you live sure as hell probably has something. Even places like Cortland, Binghamton, and Oswego are just starting teams (upstate NY represent!)

Jiminy Krimpet
May 13, 2010

My name is Jiminy Krimpet, and I am a Falcoholic.

WindyMan posted:

No, they're called games. If Jerry Seltzer, the Jesus* of roller derby, calls them games, then they're called games. Always have been.

He makes reference to this fact all the time on his blog.

*The Son of The Father of Roller Derby

Oh, so it's a religious thing. Carry on then.

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


WindyMan posted:

No, they're called games. If Jerry Seltzer, the Jesus* of roller derby, calls them games, then they're called games. Always have been.


Seltzer may call them games, but basically everyone else involved in the sport calls them bouts.

Do we think there should maybe be a FAQ in the OP somewhere? Stuff to answer questions like "Is this sport faked like pro wrestling" and such.

Also, in the old thread OP there was a really nice infographic explaining the basic rules of the game that maybe should go in this OP.

Other than that, great OP and I'm glad this thread exists.

Jiminy Krimpet
May 13, 2010

My name is Jiminy Krimpet, and I am a Falcoholic.

Oh, also, this video might be handy in explaining the basics of how derby works.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_T8izdlc-dY

BRB, gotta move these microwave ovens.

Stickarts
Dec 21, 2003

literally


Excellent OP.

Anyone who is lucky enough to be within driving distance of some roller derby should get off their asses and go. A few friends of mine play in the local league (Canadian prairie and my city is only ~200,000 so you can probably find it almost anywhere) so I go and watch them play.

The game can get borderline raunchy, which is awesome. All the girls pick derby names like Clinty Gang Grenous that they go by and can also get pretty intense with the costumes/persona they adopt in-game.

I've been to a few of the after parties and let me just say that any rep derby girls get for being crazy is pretty much spot on. Like I say, it is awesome.


Plus it is actually an exciting sport. Derby is pretty heavily trained - each member has to consistently pass a set of benchmarks before they can even play in a real bout. Otherwise it is just practice, practice, practice.

This makes for bouts of fairly high competence as well. If the girl is actually on the track it means she knows what she's doing out there.

Stickarts fucked around with this message at Oct 14, 2010 around 14:46

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


Stickarts posted:

The game can get borderline raunchy, which is awesome. All the girls also pick derby names like Clinty Gang Grenous that they go by. They also can get pretty with the costumes/persona they adopt in-game.


Which brings up a point I wanted to discuss in the old thread but it ended before I could.

There's a pretty big debate going on in the derby community right now. As Stickarts said, derby has a sort pf punk-rock culture around it, there's a lot of fishnets and booty shorts and wacky derby names. And I personally love that about the sport, and a lot of others, fans and skaters alike, do too.

Some skaters, however, think that the absolute goal of derby as a community should be to be taken seriously as a legitimate sport, with box scores in the newspaper and all that. They further believe that the sport will never get that recognition as long as there are fishnets and derby names and craziness. So some skaters (notably the entire Denver travel team) use their real names. They wear more traditional athletic uniforms. And so on.

Now, I personally think that this is a travesty. It's an attempt to homogenize and sanitize a sport that is interesting because it is so different. Skaters have crazy names and wear these outfits because they like them. It's not a moneygrab or an attempt to cash in on sex appeal. And I don't think the sport needs to have the quirky fun bulldozed out of it to be a real sport. Some of these girls are amazing athletes, and I for sure do not want to meet Beyonslay or Thoroughbled in a dark alley.

My girlfriend is not a sporty type at all, she hates exercise, but she loves derby because it has such a differnet culture and feel to it and she feels welcome. If you aren't built for basketball you can't play basketball. If you don't have the body for volleyball you can't play volleyball. But any bodytype can play derby, and can play it well.

Aericina
Mar 3, 2005

Meez, please.

Having flair also makes it easier to pick out certain girls to target for hits. Homogeneous outfits provide easier cover especially for jammers. This might be part of why skaters are embracing this more and more.

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


Aericina posted:

Having flair also makes it easier to pick out certain girls to target for hits. Homogeneous outfits provide easier cover especially for jammers. This might be part of why skaters are embracing this more and more.

Maybe, but I've never heard it explained as such by teams or girls who do it.

Also, I don't just mean that everyone on the team wears the same thing. There's plenty of teams that have a uniform they all wear while still being "derby-ish", if that makes any sense. I don't have a problem with uniforms.

Aericina
Mar 3, 2005

Meez, please.

Nah I get what you're saying, but I am talking about wearing the same shorts, same color or no tights/fishnets, even down to the same helmet color. Currently Naptown wears a uniform shirt and sock design as required attire but everything else is up to the skater. Most of them wear something black on the bottom though since our colors are red and black.

As a girl on the one hand I understand the want to make it legit and using real names, same uniform etc because women's sports already don't get respect as it is. Then take into account people who come into derby with an attitude of "this is faked" and "look at the hoochies wearing mini skirts and fishnets". The fine line is making it enjoyable for the fans but also making sure that derby is real and the ladies go out there to win, at the cost of torn knees, broken legs and even the threat of paralysis (<3 Tequila Mockingbird).

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


Certainly I think it deserves respect and recognition as a sport. I just don't think they need to strip the fun and uniqueness out of it to get that. In other words, you can be a real sport without being treated exactly the same way as every other sport. Some girls skate because they find it fun and they love the game and the community, not because they want to be famous athletes.

Stickarts
Dec 21, 2003

literally


It would be a shame if derby went vanilla. Bouts are fun enough as it is, but so much is expressed through the attire that derby really is set apart from other sports. Part of what makes derby so enticing as a fan and, I can't help but imagine, as a player is the entire cult of culture behind it.

Jiminy Krimpet
May 13, 2010

My name is Jiminy Krimpet, and I am a Falcoholic.

I agree 100%.

Using real names instead of derby names doesn't change the competition on the track, but it does remove one cool thing about derby, and I am just not sure what the change is intended to accomplish. There are some things that I'd think are more important, for instance requiring a fixed number of refs or coming up with a standardized penalty reporting system.

I understand the desire for greater recognition but I would assert that derby already is a legitimate sport. We know it's not staged, it's not the televised derby of the 70's. We know these skaters and refs practice their asses off. It's an athletic competition that also happens to have a party atmosphere, where everyone gets along after the bout no matter the action on the track.

Getting on TV or covered by newspapers doesn't mean anything if no one cares about it. Look at the WNBA. They have full-time professional players, the league was (is?) subsidized by the NBA, they have their games broadcast, they appear on SportsCenter. Nevertheless, they can't make anyone care about it. Their average attendance last season was "about 7,800 people per game" according to Wikipedia.

Derby, where everyone has a different day job, where income is used to cover costs, which is almost never broadcast live on TV, which is not covered much in the news (except the repeated formulaic "personal interest" features e.g. "by day she works in accounts receivable, but by night she straps on the skates and is known as 'Shanka Ho', how wacky is that?!") and where everyone has a hell of a good time, drew over 6000 people for a recent bout in Seattle.

Derby got where it is because of what it is.

Aericina
Mar 3, 2005

Meez, please.

You all have very valid points.

I personally know several people who have quit derby because "it's not fun anymore" with the outfits and always new rule changes. Derby is drat hard to maintain for people who have full time jobs. You can pack the house at near 6000 fans like we did earlier this year but still run in the red or just over the black. There is some give and take with "how do we make this more profitable to cover our butts financially while still making it fun for spectators and ourselves."

Jiminy Krimpet posted:

I understand the desire for greater recognition but I would assert that derby already is a legitimate sport. We know it's not staged, it's not the televised derby of the 70's. We know these skaters and refs practice their asses off. It's an athletic competition that also happens to have a party atmosphere, where everyone gets along after the bout no matter the action on the track.

As a derby insider, you know this, but I can say that 75% of the people who I've asked to come to a bout don't know or realize any of this.

oldskool
Aug 9, 2010


Jiminy Krimpet posted:

Derby got where it is because of what it is.

I suppose their thought is that it'll go no farther without mainstream attention & it won't get that so long as it's "what it is".

I don't agree with the thought, but considering the last Derby mainstream attention I remember was RollerJam it is believable that they'd think "in a scripted environment designed to maximize excitement people collectively didn't give a poo poo a decade ago with some of the best legit Derby skaters available; why would they give a poo poo now?"

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


Jiminy Krimpet posted:

(except the repeated formulaic "personal interest" features e.g. "by day she works in accounts receivable, but by night she straps on the skates and is known as 'Shanka Ho', how wacky is that?!")

I swear to god if I read the words "It's not your grandmother's roller derby!" one more time...

zorch
Nov 28, 2006



WindyMan posted:

If youíre mostly familiar with the flat track game or would just like see what roller derby on the high banks is all about, I highly recommend the 3rd place game between LA and Texas in this past summerís Battle on the Bank tournament. This particular game is more physical than your normal game would be, but itís still pretty freakiní awesome. Start watching it here

Has Beavis casted any more games?

WindyMan
Mar 21, 2002

Respect the power of the wind

In response to "legitimate" derby, as much as I've always dreamed of seeing roller derby played legitimately, I still can't help but think what it "should" be now. Watching YouTube videos of roller derby in the 70s, seeing the hair-pulling and fighting made me long for legit derby. My first exposure to roller derby, Rollergames, made me (even when I was a kid) long for legit derby. I thought it would come with Rollerjam in 1999, but when that started becoming fake, I went back to longing for legit derby.

Now that we actually have real roller derby, part of me still longs for "legit" derby insofar as much as skaters not using their real names, dressing skimpily, and so on. I've read in places that part of the reason (some) girls dress they way that they do was partially because of the culture derby spawned from, and also to help get a paying audience in the stands. I don't know if that second part is necessarily true anymore, but you can't deny that's what may initially get some people to give derby a look-see.

I'm the type of fan that wants to see pro roller derbyólegitimate pro roller derbyócome back. Like Monday Night Football on ESPN, but roller derby. If it ever gets to that point, it'd have to start with real names on the skaters. I can't ever envision a scenario where Al Michaels, Joe Buck, or any other play-by-play man brodcasting to a live national audience say people's derby names and anyone take them seriously.

Still, I think it can be the best of both worlds. If there was ever a legit pro derby league, they could be all of that, and WFTDA and all the individual amateur leagues can keep doing their thing. However, the feeling I get is that, especially with women's leagues being the face of derby at the moment, people are going for the spectacle and staying for the sport. What I want them to do is go for the sport and stay for the sport, if you know what I mean. I'm very curious to see what will happen when men's derby starts taking more equal footing, to see if that will help with this, and also what will happen with women's derby and derby in general because of it.

Dominion posted:

Seltzer may call them games, but basically everyone else involved in the sport calls them bouts.

Seltzer calls them "games" because his father called them "games." His fatheróLeo Seltzerócalled them "games" because he invented roller derby. I would take it upon the inventor of the sport to know what to call his own games. You can call them whatever you want, but they've always been called games from day one.

(I jokingly call Jerry the Jesus of Roller Derby, because the father of roller derby is Leo, and Jerry is his son. He is literally the Son of the Father of Roller Derby. Get it?)

emoltra posted:

Has Beavis casted any more games?

That's Dumptruck. He's probably the best-known derby announcer there is, partially for his voice (which is his real, normal voice) and partially because he wears eccentric clothing and is one hell of a partier. He normally calls games for Denver but is as much a part of the national roller derby scene as anyone. He'll be doing the championships with DNN, too. I met him at that tournament, the Battle on the Bank, and that was actually his first-ever banked track derby event, seeing or announcing. He loved it.

Vintage Vixen
Jul 30, 2008


Thanks for mentioning the Arizona Derby Dames in the OP under the banked track section. We just completed our first season of banked track to much bigger, louder crowds that we had when we were flat track for four seasons prior. We're also the hosts of Battle on the Bank IV tournament in 2011. It will be held at Arizona Veterans Memorial Coliseum (our usual venue) in Phoenix June 10 - 12th.

overthefalls
Apr 17, 2005

"They called you exotic, which is just people talk for awesome!"

Awesome! I was thinking about the last thread and was hoping it'd show again.

I'm the assistant head ref for the Terminal City Rollergirls up in Vancouver, and we've just joined the WFTDA Apprenticeship program. Honestly, I'm a bit freaked out because this is the big time, basically. I admit, I'm not very up on what's going on with the WTFDA and all the other leagues: I barely have time to keep my own league in check, but this is a big move and it's going to be crazy seeing teams like Oly and Rat City rolling through here shortly!

Of the sport vs. spectacle viewpoint: I'm of two minds. I love the sport, but I love the community that's grown because of it. I mean, I have my own derby name and all that, and I carry that with pride.

Right now, I'm thinking: Nationals and the like? Go with the uniform and whatnot. On the other hand, house games and bouts and the like can use the spectacle. Draw people in with the show and keep people with the sport?

Whatever happens, though, it's a powderkeg. In the last 7 years, the sport's going absolutely crazy. I can't wait to see where it ends up.

Jiminy Krimpet
May 13, 2010

My name is Jiminy Krimpet, and I am a Falcoholic.

Well, your league is gonna get trial by fire for sure. But it's probably good to play tough competition, no? Oly/Rat City/Rose City will show you how it's done. By the way, Seattle's got the best and most well-organized reffing crew I encountered. Just a bunch of cool people.

By the way, new and unexpected "post-regionals" DNN POWER RANKINGS are out! Carolina back in the top 25. RAISE UP. Seems about right to me, they've gone 7-9 this year and played 8 currently ranked opponents.

Also, I think it's weird that they bother ranking London.

http://derbynewsnetwork.com/power_rankings/2010/10

echopapa
Jun 2, 2005

El Presidente smiles upon this thread.

overthefalls posted:

I'm the assistant head ref for the Terminal City Rollergirls up in Vancouver, and we've just joined the WFTDA Apprenticeship program. Honestly, I'm a bit freaked out because this is the big time, basically. I admit, I'm not very up on what's going on with the WTFDA and all the other leagues: I barely have time to keep my own league in check, but this is a big move and it's going to be crazy seeing teams like Oly and Rat City rolling through here shortly!

Did you come to the tournament in Boise? If so, we may have met.

overthefalls
Apr 17, 2005

"They called you exotic, which is just people talk for awesome!"

I wanted to but I didn't get time off this year. I heard the tournament was amazing, and I watched a couple of the games streamed.

Going to be trying to get out to more things this season, though; all our girls just started training now, so the ramp up begins.

Nationals are going to be crazy this year -- threw me a bit seeing Oly in the qualifying round, but will be some great games in there.

huplescat
Jun 8, 2005


Hurrah for derby Thanks for making a new thread, I got all sad when I saw the old one was closed.

I'm in training with the Victorian Roller Derby League (VRDL) in Australia, hopefully I'll be bouting next year if I don't manage to injure myself. Any Melbourne goons should come along to a game sometime, they're brilliant fun and now the Southsea (SSRD) league has started bouting there's lots of derby to choose from.

This is from Saturday's SSRD game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpUNlJEzhgM

Sailor Mouth Sadie is one tough (and currently very bruised) chick

EDIT: Just wondering, what kind of rankings are used for girls who are yet to hit bouting level in the US and other countries? I just assumed that the star system we use is the same for any WFTA leagues, but now I'm not so sure.

huplescat fucked around with this message at Oct 19, 2010 around 07:55

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


huplescat posted:

EDIT: Just wondering, what kind of rankings are used for girls who are yet to hit bouting level in the US and other countries? I just assumed that the star system we use is the same for any WFTA leagues, but now I'm not so sure.

Most leagues I have encountered use a star system for determining when skaters are ready to bout, but the system isn't standardized or anything. Charm City used to use white/yellow/orange/green, but recently dropped out the yellow and just do white/orange/green, with white being "passed tryouts for the league and can attend regular practices", orange being "can scrimmage", and green being "allowed to be drafted onto a home team and can bout".

Ria
Sep 21, 2003

You have an overpowering GENOCIDE COMPLEX, and have made it your sworn duty to KILL ALL LAND DWELLERS.



Dominion posted:

Most leagues I have encountered use a star system for determining when skaters are ready to bout, but the system isn't standardized or anything. Charm City used to use white/yellow/orange/green, but recently dropped out the yellow and just do white/orange/green, with white being "passed tryouts for the league and can attend regular practices", orange being "can scrimmage", and green being "allowed to be drafted onto a home team and can bout".

Yeah, ours is white/yellow/orange, but I'm pretty sure it's been pared down to just white and orange, since the freshies have their own practice and so the differentiation doesn't need to happen that much. Then again, I'm just a ref and the bylaws of my league is to keep those pretty separate (yay walls between partnered groups!)

huplescat
Jun 8, 2005


Groovy, thanks Ria and Dominion It's always struck me that there's not that much difference between yellow and orange so one of them seems a bit redundant. Guess it depends on the league, what they teach at each level and how many girls are going through training though.

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


huplescat posted:

Groovy, thanks Ria and Dominion It's always struck me that there's not that much difference between yellow and orange so one of them seems a bit redundant. Guess it depends on the league, what they teach at each level and how many girls are going through training though.

Yeah, with CCRG the only real distinctions are Can Practice, Can Scrimmage, and Can Bout, and people were getting confused about what the functional difference was between a white star and a yellow star.

Ria
Sep 21, 2003

You have an overpowering GENOCIDE COMPLEX, and have made it your sworn duty to KILL ALL LAND DWELLERS.



Dominion posted:

Yeah, with CCRG the only real distinctions are Can Practice, Can Scrimmage, and Can Bout, and people were getting confused about what the functional difference was between a white star and a yellow star.

Yeah, and even then, in LVRG, the freshies sometimes practice with the regular girls (after they've signed the waiver, of course) so... The line is muddled, to put it mildly.

huplescat
Jun 8, 2005




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2yiBPw1xPQ&

huplescat fucked around with this message at Oct 20, 2010 around 07:49

Ria
Sep 21, 2003

You have an overpowering GENOCIDE COMPLEX, and have made it your sworn duty to KILL ALL LAND DWELLERS.




Pretty much yes, forever. Urrk is a goddamn acrobat. Ballerina shenanigans all over the track.

delfin
Dec 5, 2003

SNATTER'S ALIVE?!?!


The more I look into this revival, the more I love it, especially since it's not just a token teams-in-eight-major-cities thing; both the Member Leagues and Apprentice Leagues sections of the WFTDA show teams all over the country (and even some overseas). Places like Essex Junction, VT and Lancaster, PA and Lubbock, TX and Appleton, WI get to get in on the fun too.

Also, some of those team logos are awesome.

Fanged Lawn Wormy
Jan 4, 2008
Living in this place, Staring into space we find, We might share the corners of our lives...

A league just sprang up here in Southern Illinois in the last few years. My girlfriend just joined the So Ill Roller girls, and is working her way up to being draftable for bouts.

For the few SA posters that may be in the region, there are teams in Carbondale and Cape Girardeau. The Cape Girardeau girls are fairly new, considered the sister team of Carbondale. I've only been to one of the games so far, but it was pretty impressive.

JoshTheStampede
Sep 8, 2004

come at me bro


delfin posted:

The more I look into this revival, the more I love it, especially since it's not just a token teams-in-eight-major-cities thing; both the Member Leagues and Apprentice Leagues sections of the WFTDA show teams all over the country (and even some overseas). Places like Essex Junction, VT and Lancaster, PA and Lubbock, TX and Appleton, WI get to get in on the fun too.

Also, some of those team logos are awesome.

Yeah, there are literally hundreds of leagues. The OP wasn't kidding when it said that if you live in the continental US, there is almost certainly a league less than an hour's drive from you.

WindyMan
Mar 21, 2002

Respect the power of the wind

Vintage Vixen posted:

Thanks for mentioning the Arizona Derby Dames in the OP under the banked track section. We just completed our first season of banked track to much bigger, louder crowds that we had when we were flat track for four seasons prior. We're also the hosts of Battle on the Bank IV tournament in 2011. It will be held at Arizona Veterans Memorial Coliseum (our usual venue) in Phoenix June 10 - 12th.

Yes, I know you ladies just got your banked track setup this year and LA helped you out a lot with that. The SoCal area is starting to see more banked track derby, too. LA and San Diego are well-established, but I also hear that Long Beach (CA) and Sugartown (Oxnard, CA) are starting to make plans for banked tracks. That would give our area four banked track leagues/venues within a two-hour drive. We're totally spoiled here.

By the way, since I now know where BotBIV is going to be, I need to start making plans for that. It's a seven hour drive for me (awesome). Anyone want to come with?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Vintage Vixen
Jul 30, 2008


WindyMan posted:

Yes, I know you ladies just got your banked track setup this year and LA helped you out a lot with that. The SoCal area is starting to see more banked track derby, too. LA and San Diego are well-established, but I also hear that Long Beach (CA) and Sugartown (Oxnard, CA) are starting to make plans for banked tracks. That would give our area four banked track leagues/venues within a two-hour drive. We're totally spoiled here.

Yes - LA Derby Dolls were a huge help to us along the way as we made the switch to banked. Tilted Thunder Railbirds in Seattle are in the process of building right now, too, and have their first banked track game at the beginning of December.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«41 »