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VERTiG0
Jul 11, 2001

go move over bro


quote:

CRTC will rescind ‘unlimited use’ Internet decision – or Ottawa will overturn it

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...article1892522/

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Suniikaa
Jul 4, 2004

Johnny Walker Wisdom

This was really refreshing to watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYizoh_r6D0#t=304s

teethgrinder
Oct 9, 2002

Nurse?

Not everyone at the Post is a ridiculous old fuddieduddie, i.e. Jameson Berkow seems to have a clue. But Andrew Coyne sure doesn't know when to call it a day, sheesh.

edit: ^^ holy gently caress the "shareholder" in that video was an ignorant assclown. Unbelievable.

teethgrinder fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 04:46

Isizzlehorn
Feb 25, 2010



About loving time. I guess the Tories didn't want to have something like UBB loving over Canadians hanging over their heads going into this *wink wink* election season *wink wink*.

Maybe now we can get fair use for 3rd parties, so that someday I can look forward to Teksavvy DSL higher than 5mbit? Oh, and burn Bell corporate to the ground. Still want that.

teethgrinder
Oct 9, 2002

Nurse?

You can switch to TekSavvy Cable when it's offered in your area for higher than 5mbit.

I still think the speed is reasonable, but whatever.

But yeah, if the Tories had supported the CRTC decision, they'd have lost the entire next generation of voters.

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Suniikaa posted:

This was really refreshing to watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYizoh_r6D0#t=304s

Yeah Burger handled that extremely well, responded in a very even tone despite facing the whiny nasal accusations of being "parasitic". I like that he hammered home the actual cost of delivery finally, I get so tired of hearing the bandwidth freeloader argument.

quote:

But yeah, if the Tories had supported the CRTC decision, they'd have lost the entire next generation of voters.

What's really frustrating is that this puts things in an awkward spot because the CRTC is needed so that telecoms and cablecos can't run wild but at the same time they need to be held in check because of how thoroughly penetrated they are by corporate interests. I think we simply need a new regulatory body to manage it but that's a really complex issue.

Crumbletron
Jul 21, 2006

KNÆLE.


Suniikaa posted:

This was really refreshing to watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYizoh_r6D0#t=304s



I love that that shareholder was just cut off at the end. He sounded like a tremendous rear end in a top hat and it was obvious the only thing he cared about was his wallet and that he gave no gently caress about anyone. It's easy to say you're for this and that when you're so rich you can probably download any amount of anything you want every month and it still wouldn't make a dent on your bank account.

Shumagorath
Jun 5, 2001


Suniikaa posted:

This was really refreshing to watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYizoh_r6D0#t=304s
The only way this could be better would be if someone ran up behind Kevin O'Leary and slapped his bald head with a dead fish.

Saving this here since Rogers will never approve it:

quote:

Nice try, Rogers, but you aren’t going to legislate you competitors out of business. Either compete fairly (and that includes licensing content to Netflix) or get out of the market.

I was a Rogers customer until 2007 when I noticed my encrypted connections being throttled (Remote Desktop and BitTorrent). I called and complained three times and was told my line was not being shaped. Only when I switched to a much stronger SSL VPN did my connections go longer than a minute without dying. When I called customer support with this evidence I was told to cancel my account if I didn’t like it. I did exactly that and went to TekSavvy.

I’ve since moved on to TekSavvy cable since Bell’s last mile to my area is wired with cans and string, and that you would have the audacity to imply that fixed bandwidth allotment to resellers over your last mile is justified in being marked up 10,000% percent is criminal.

Canadian consumers have had enough of your anti-competitive, anti-consumer practises and are now aware that better service lies elsewhere. Wireless and Video-on-Demand are next.
http://redboard.rogers.com/2011/rog.../#comment-20656

They are getting worked harder than the National Post editorial board.

Shumagorath fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 05:04

VERTiG0
Jul 11, 2001

go move over bro


Burger is a very well spoken man and dished it out like a champ. He owns. I hope Teksavvy cable comes to my area sooner than later.

Shumagorath
Jun 5, 2001


Parachute Underwear posted:



I love that that shareholder was just cut off at the end. He sounded like a tremendous rear end in a top hat and it was obvious the only thing he cared about was his wallet and that he gave no gently caress about anyone. It's easy to say you're for this and that when you're so rich you can probably download any amount of anything you want every month and it still wouldn't make a dent on your bank account.
Kevin O'Leary is a tremendous rear end in a top hat and would likely back UBB imposition on resellers even if he understood how the Internet worked, as shown by his continued use of the word "parasite". I also have it on good authority that he regularly crank-calls his cell provider's customer retention line to get a better deal, so he must enjoy overpriced telecom services on a perverse level.

ZShakespeare
Jul 20, 2003

The stroke of death is as a lover's pinch, Which hurts and is desired.

Shumagorath posted:

Kevin O'Leary is a tremendous rear end in a top hat and would likely back UBB imposition on resellers even if he understood how the Internet worked, as shown by his continued use of the word "parasite". I also have it on good authority that he regularly crank-calls his cell provider's customer retention line to get a better deal, so he must enjoy overpriced telecom services on a perverse level.

I find O'Leary amusing because he is literally a caricature of the evil, greedy capitalist that would sell his own mother into slavery for a nickel.

Shumagorath
Jun 5, 2001


Isizzlehorn posted:

Maybe now we can get fair use for 3rd parties, so that someday I can look forward to Teksavvy DSL higher than 5mbit? Oh, and burn Bell corporate to the ground. Still want that.
Wasn't TekSavvy supposed to be granted access to the new fibre networks independent of other lovely rulings? Not like it matters though; Bell has advertisements for it all over my neighbourhood (including on loving phone booths) while we're limited to their 6/1 Mbit DSL that's 4/0.5 in practise.

Stanley Pain
Jun 16, 2001

In humility and with no need for Divine Guidance, I make this pledge.


Suniikaa posted:

This was really refreshing to watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYizoh_r6D0#t=304s

That was so amazing I'm speechless. The second Teksavvy cable is ready in my area I'm signing up and driving over and giving George a lil sum sum

ZShakespeare
Jul 20, 2003

The stroke of death is as a lover's pinch, Which hurts and is desired.

I agree. I'm definitely switching to Teksavvy once I stop getting these sweet student deals from Shaw. $24/mo for 100GB @ 15Mbits is a great deal (for Canada) any way you slice it.

Isizzlehorn
Feb 25, 2010



Shumagorath posted:

Wasn't TekSavvy supposed to be granted access to the new fibre networks independent of other lovely rulings? Not like it matters though; Bell has advertisements for it all over my neighbourhood (including on loving phone booths) while we're limited to their 6/1 Mbit DSL that's 4/0.5 in practise.

That's not even mentioning the deliberate throttling of torrents. I hardly ever see full use of my line, it's usually at the deep dark of night. But hey, it's all about the wall, not how fast you get there.


As for Teksavvy cable, I'll definitely be all over that.. when they get it over here. Their track record for their cable roll out is abysmal right now. The most recent location they just got coverage in was... North York or something? Based upon their original estimates of roll out, I can look forward to the Durham Region getting service... sometime in 2013.

Don't get me wrong, I love their service so far. But I've been pretty pissed off with the slow rollout and UBB rearing it's ugly head without any options. Now, it's pretty much gone, so no more worries. Clement better not re-neg on his twitter promise, or else myself and thousands more will flip.their.poo poo.

Suniikaa
Jul 4, 2004

Johnny Walker Wisdom

Shumagorath posted:

(including on loving phone booths)

I don't think I've seen a payphone in 5 years.

less than three
Aug 9, 2007

Fire Sights and LED Lights

ESC 2010 Never Forget

Suniikaa posted:

I don't think I've seen a payphone in 5 years.

We used to have Telus phone booths everywhere. Then they dissapeared. Now we have Bell phone booths.

I'm not sure if they charge Bell's 50c, or the more common 25c. Bell hasn't been as big of jerks out west as they do in the east, probably because they're not the incumbent.

8ender
Sep 24, 2003

clown is watching you sleep


Isizzlehorn posted:

As for Teksavvy cable, I'll definitely be all over that.. when they get it over here. Their track record for their cable roll out is abysmal right now. The most recent location they just got coverage in was... North York or something? Based upon their original estimates of roll out, I can look forward to the Durham Region getting service... sometime in 2013.

I'm in Ingersoll Ontario. Cable internet will likely be eclipsed by wireless technologies before Teksavvy rolls it out here.

Godinster
Jan 2, 2005

No more tripping, Emery

Haha George Berger is awesome.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...zoh_r6D0#t=481s

Comparison between Bell charging $2 a gig and the CRTC regulating Money For Nothing. I wish TekSavvy was in my area.

Pweller
Jan 25, 2006

Whatever whateva.

ZShakespeare posted:

I agree. I'm definitely switching to Teksavvy once I stop getting these sweet student deals from Shaw. $24/mo for 100GB @ 15Mbits is a great deal (for Canada) any way you slice it.

please elaborate on how you got this Shaw deal my good man

Shaw is always superduper unwilling to bend on their rates whenever I give them a call to see if they will match or beat MTS (their only competitor in MB).

Pweller fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 07:56

Godinster
Jan 2, 2005

No more tripping, Emery

Pweller posted:

please elaborate on how you got this Shaw deal my good man

Shaw is always superduper unwilling to bend on their rates whenever I give them a call to see if they will match or beat MTS (their only competitor in MB).

You generally pay for it all at once and it usually requires Cable TV as well, but I've heard of such a deal. You need proof of student ID as well and the Cable TV package is limited.

Nomenklatura
Dec 4, 2002

If Canada is to survive, it can only survive in mutual respect and in love for one another.


Godinster posted:

Great news.

http://twitter.com/TonyClement_MP appears to have verified it.
I probably shouldn't have followed the link to Andrew Coyne. Jesus Christ, that guy's an absolute tool. How the gently caress is foreign competition going to do anything to a natural monopoly based on buried fiber under right-of-way? Is Google supposed to swoop down and set up a loving ansible or something?

It's somewhat gratifying to know that our marketeers are such utter dipshits, since it makes it easier to knock them down. But holy hell, it makes me embarrassed to share a country with this guy.

Edit: Here's a quote:

quote:

So yet AGAIN govt caves to loudest squawks. We'll all wind up paying more, for slower service, so a few bandwidth hogs can pay less..
I eagerly scoured his twitter feed to discover how monthly bills prevent evening-hour congestion, since not a soul has explained that to this day. No joy.

Nomenklatura fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 08:12

Kreeblah
May 17, 2004

INSERT QUACK TO CONTINUE

Nomenklatura posted:

I eagerly scoured his twitter feed to discover how monthly bills prevent evening-hour congestion, since not a soul has explained that to this day. No joy.

People should suggest expensive road tolls to prevent rush hour congestion every time somebody tries that line. It's the same flawed concept, but it'd probably make more sense to people who don't really get this whole "internet" thing.

Vergeh
Jan 15, 2008

Pockets!

It was nice to see that they picked the slimiest investor they could find to go up against George Berger. I really hope this generates the usage-based backlash I've been looking forward to for the past few years.

Dudebro
Jan 1, 2010
I AM ING TO -->


Isn't that guy one of the show's hosts? He must be feeling so butthurt this morning.

Hirez
Feb 3, 2003

Weber scored 49 points?



The good thing about this is Teksavvy should get an increase in subscriptions, especially when all the reports are now saying it in basic laymen terms of Bell = not unlimited, Teksavvy/Other Resellers = unlimited for the same price or less.

Why wouldn't you switch if you knew this (and aren't locked in a contract or don't want to deal with the hassle of switching for a few bucks saved/gigs more)

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Dudebro posted:

Isn't that guy one of the show's hosts? He must be feeling so butthurt this morning.

Yeah it is the host. It could not have played out better. He came off as the whiny corporate dickhead who is only motivated by greed and that's exactly what people needed to see. "MY CAPITAL!!! ". Yep, exactly what this whole exercise has been about.

edit: missed this last page "also, The Gunslinger, a fellow niagara-West-Glanbrookian/ gunslinger fan? city/town? Pelham here" - Grimsby

The Gunslinger fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 16:39

Antioch
Apr 18, 2003



This is really good news, maybe I can actually get Netflix now.

I'm currently on Shaw in Red Deer, and I'm loathe to drop from the 15/1 plan, but it's still going to have the 100GB cap right? I checked out TekSavvy and all they have is DSL packages out here. I'm not a big DSL fan.

Any other central Alberta goons know of a better deal, or am I stuck with scummy Shaw until TekSavvy Cable or some form of fibre?

Squibbles
Aug 24, 2000

Mwaha ha HA ha!

The Gunslinger posted:

Yeah it is the host. It could not have played out better. He came off as the whiny corporate dickhead who is only motivated by greed and that's exactly what people needed to see. "MY CAPITAL!!! ". Yep, exactly what this whole exercise has been about.

edit: missed this last page "also, The Gunslinger, a fellow niagara-West-Glanbrookian/ gunslinger fan? city/town? Pelham here" - Grimsby

Isn't that guy that Burger was arguing with one of the "Dragons" on that Dragon's Den show? All of those people are super greedy capitalists so his attitude should come as no surprise.

VLADIMIR GLUTEN
Oct 28, 2006

GAZE INTO MY RYES AND YOU WILL SEE THE TRUE POWER OF CARBOHYDRATES


Ughhhh, I'm getting interviewed for a CBC piece on the UBB issue. Anyone have any soundbites that wouldn't make me sound like an idiot on National Television....

Godinster
Jan 2, 2005

No more tripping, Emery

Moist von Lipwig posted:

Ughhhh, I'm getting interviewed for a CBC piece on the UBB issue. Anyone have any soundbites that wouldn't make me sound like an idiot on National Television....

What's your involvement with it? Very cool either way.

Emphasize on the fact that it costs a fraction of a penny to provide bandwidth and that Canadian costs to provide are actually less than American counterparts, despite our market being far less saturated. Also the fact that major telecom companies in Canada already have the highest profit margins in the world and the fact that the UBB is conveniently coming out as Netflix gains in popularity, lowering the likelihood people are going to use Shaw or Bell or Rogers on demand, especially when the price of one movie is often the same as an entire month of Netflix.

There's a million points to be made, none of which benefit UBB.

Godinster fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 17:51

teethgrinder
Oct 9, 2002

Nurse?

Moist von Lipwig posted:

Ughhhh, I'm getting interviewed for a CBC piece on the UBB issue. Anyone have any soundbites that wouldn't make me sound like an idiot on National Television....
You should make it clear that they greatly exaggerated their costs, and this policy would have given Canada the most expensive internet access in the entire world. Anyone have the recent numbers/charts handy?

You could repeat that image too just explaining that it would now be cheaper and faster to courier hard drives around the country.

Kreeblah
May 17, 2004

INSERT QUACK TO CONTINUE

Moist von Lipwig posted:

Ughhhh, I'm getting interviewed for a CBC piece on the UBB issue. Anyone have any soundbites that wouldn't make me sound like an idiot on National Television....

Seriously, make a comparison to charging tolls on roads ostensibly to clear congestion at rush hour. , I know, but it's not going to do a drat thing there either and it's something people will understand is bullshit.

VLADIMIR GLUTEN
Oct 28, 2006

GAZE INTO MY RYES AND YOU WILL SEE THE TRUE POWER OF CARBOHYDRATES


Godinster posted:

What's your involvement with it? Very cool either way.

Emphasize on the fact that it costs a fraction of a penny to provide bandwidth and that Canadian costs to provide are actually less than American counterparts, despite our market being far less saturated. Also the fact that major telecom companies in Canada already have the highest profit margins in Canada and the fact that the UBB is conveniently coming out as Netflix gains in popularity, lowering the likelihood people are going to use Shaw or Bell or Rogers on demand, especially when the price of one movie is often the same as an entire month of Netflix.

There's a million points to be made, none of which benefit UBB.

I'm one of the starters of the facebook protest group, this has kind of blown up moreso than I expected but I'm excited, regardless

This is all good stuff that I already knew but reading it is going to reinforce it in my mind so thank you.

teethgrinder posted:

You should make it clear that they greatly exaggerated their costs, and this policy would have given Canada the most expensive internet access in the entire world. Anyone have the recent numbers/charts handy?

You could repeat that image too just explaining that it would now be cheaper and faster to courier hard drives around the country.

This is really good too!

Part of what I'm worried about is that my job involves transferring multi-gigabyte files and I don't want to sound like "That Guy Who Uses All The Bandwidth" versus Average Joe.

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Personally I'd mention the fact that these providers are using caps to stifle innovation and competition with their products. The CTV example is a recent hot button issue you can refer to. VOD is another one. In most cases its consumers seeking a superior product and instead of trying to legitimately compete the companies are trying to force you to use their more expensive, less desirable options. This might be fine if the CRTC would fulfill its mandate and protect the public from natural monopolistic practices but instead something like UBB just gives them a legalized method of stamping out competition.

Avoid the bandwidth hog thing, it has nothing to do with bandwidth hogs and any time its brought up is a negative because people will often choose the simplest ideas to relate to if they don't understand the topic material.

The Gunslinger fucked around with this message at Feb 3, 2011 around 17:40

VLADIMIR GLUTEN
Oct 28, 2006

GAZE INTO MY RYES AND YOU WILL SEE THE TRUE POWER OF CARBOHYDRATES


The Gunslinger posted:

Personally I'd mention the fact that these providers are using caps to stifle innovation and competition with their products. The CTV example is a recent hot button issue you can refer to. VOD is another one. In most cases its consumers seeking a superior product and instead of trying to legitimately compete the companies are trying to force you to use their more expensive, less desirable options. This might be fine if the CRTC would fulfill its mandate and protect the public from natural monopolistic practices but instead something like UBB just gives them a legalized method of stamping out competition.

Avoid the bandwidth hog thing, it has nothing to do with bandwidth hogs and any time its brought up is a negative because people will often choose the simplest ideas to relate to if they don't understand the topic material.

Sorry can you clarify the CTV part? And you are right about the bandwidth hog thing, it detracts from the issue every time.

Rukus
Mar 13, 2007

Hmph.


Moist von Lipwig posted:

Ughhhh, I'm getting interviewed for a CBC piece on the UBB issue. Anyone have any soundbites that wouldn't make me sound like an idiot on National Television....

Say what everyone's been telling you so far, but don't expect them to air anything you say. It was my impression that when less than three was interviewed that they barely used anything he said and just decided to run with the "lol he uses too much! back to you, Peter!"

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Moist von Lipwig posted:

Sorry can you clarify the CTV part? And you are right about the bandwidth hog thing, it detracts from the issue every time.

Bell bought CTV and also provides their own television delivery service. Rogers provides a video on demand service and traditional broadcast cable. Their internet products have a direct conflict of interest with their own core offerings, particularly with regards to streaming video. It is in their own best interest to force caps on the consumer, both their own and the reseller.

They are using caps and overages to effectively bounce you from one service to another but keep you within reach. If you don't like large overages which are profitable to them then your only recourse is their alternate product which has similar problems.

None of this would be a big deal if you could just switch to a reseller but of course they are using the CRTC to force the resellers to adopt their business model. Consumers seeking an alternative should be able to find one, they shouldn't be forced to deal with a natural monopoly by their own government. It's especially glaring because this is the kind of thing that the CRTC is ironically supposed to prevent.

Anyway that's the background, I would just use a broadstrokes "They want you to pay for expensive cable packages and stop you from watching youtube/netflix!" approach.

Crumbletron
Jul 21, 2006

KNÆLE.


Moist von Lipwig posted:

Sorry can you clarify the CTV part? And you are right about the bandwidth hog thing, it detracts from the issue every time.

Bell owns or is slated to own CTVglobemedia and would rather push you to watch its own content rather than Netflix or buying TV episodes from iTunes or something.

efb

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Martytoof
Feb 25, 2003



Awesome.

Awesome to
the MAX.




Maybe try throwing something like this in:

"Americans just received assurances that their internet access would be fair and open, where providers can't give preferred access to certain content delivery sources over others. Here in Canada, corporations like Bell and Rogers who own video on demand services have the option of delivering their content without penalty to your bandwidth cap, effectively giving preferential treatment to their own service while making competitors like Netflix a less viable option for consumers."

Also if you can find some actual numbers to back this up: "How can providers in America offer service with much higher, if not unmetered, bandwidth caps with a much larger population, while Canadians in urban areas still have to deal with archaic limitations? A family of four, netflix, 60gb cap, etc etc."

in addition to the "cents per gigabyte" UBB thing. If you hit the "Well Americans have this and this, why are we so behind?", maybe it'll be sensationalist enough to give birth to a soundbite or something. If nothing else, it might just hit some nationalistic pride nerve.

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