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I'm halfway through GotM, and if this hadn't been written years before A Song of Ice and Fire was a thing, I would swear that Kruppe was a parody of GRRM. I'm really liking this book so far. It is a bit rough, which is to be expected I suppose, and part 2 dragged a bit, but only because it was 75% introducing characters that seemed straight out of Aladdin. I like how casually and unceremoniously Erikson introduces important concepts and characters, like the T'lan Imass. He plops Tool down like he's just some soldier (albeit a strange one) sent to guard Lorn, but you slowly get the impression that he and his kind are going to become very important, most likely sooner rather than later. I like that he's letting me try to figure out what's important. Also, it has maps. Maps own.
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Dec 21, 2011 07:58
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The first part of the first chapter, where Sorry becomes Sorry, got me super excited for the rest of the book. I can't imagine the book without it. Prod and pull.
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Dec 25, 2011 16:23
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There is definitely some weird stuff in GotM that could stand to be rewritten, though. I think the weirdest thing was when Tattersail starts off liking Paran but not trusting him, then hating him, then hating him so much she almost kills him, then likes him again without reservation. All in the span of one section of a chapter. Not even a whole chapter. And, of course, at the end of the section Paran thinks it's a great idea to proposition the woman who was about ready to kill him 5 minutes earlier for sex. By putting his hand on her shoulder. And she accepts. So weird.
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Dec 26, 2011 03:13
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02-6611-0142-1 posted:Tattersail's POV chapters in Gardens of the Moon are strange. The way she describes magic in general feels very different to the way it's described by everybody else in the series. Well, most of her stuff is pretty early on in the book, so it's very possibly Erikson just decided to change the way he described magic after her sections. I just finished GotM. Very strange ending, mostly because it began more plot threads than it ended. Plus it was weird that the book was building up to a fight with the Jaghut Tyrant, but he is defeated unceremoniously. Then it's like Erikson realized he needed someone for Rake to fight so he busted out the REAL final boss. I might start Deadhouse Gates next, or I just got The Way of Kings so I might read that. e: someone should tell Erikson about lowercase Roman numerals, so he can start his books' prologues at page 1 instead of page 21 Conduit for Sale! fucked around with this message at 12:10 on Dec 28, 2011 |
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Dec 28, 2011 11:28
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Malazan thread, help me decide whether to start on Deadhouse Gates, or The Way of Kings by Brandon Sanderson.
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Dec 29, 2011 05:12
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Boy, Deadhouse Gates sure does start off differently than GotM.
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Dec 29, 2011 07:34
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What is the difference between Soletaken and D'ivers? Is it explained at some point? I'm about 120 pages into Deadhouse Gates.
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Jan 7, 2012 10:35
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Holy crap, Emperor Kellanved and Dancer are Shadowthrone and Cotillion.  And this is only the second book.
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Jan 7, 2012 11:00
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Ugh, why did they have to stop Duiker from strangling Nethpara? I hope to Hood that hateful little man gets his comeuppance.
Conduit for Sale! fucked around with this message at 23:08 on Jan 10, 2012 |
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Jan 10, 2012 20:30
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Genabackis looks like a cartoon slug. It's even got a mouth (Lake Azur), one eye (Lead Sea) and a little arm (The Twins)
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Jan 11, 2012 14:12
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I'm just curious, in Deadhouse Gates when Kalam speaks to Quick Ben through his magic stones or whatever, how far into Memories of Ice is that?
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Jan 17, 2012 23:43
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As much as I liked Deadhouse Gates, I'm glad to be back to the Genabackis storyline with MoI. For as much that was going on in the book, DG honestly just felt like a side story to GotM/MoI. I get the feeling that the majority of the important players in the world, or at least what we've seen of it, are focused on Genbackis at the moment. There's just so much more going on in MoI. Also, I completely disagree with anyone who says these books don't have any exposition. The first hundred or so pages in MoI are almost entirely exposition - and it's awesome. There's been more interesting history and worldbuilding in these 100 pages than most fantasy can muster in an entire series. It's kind of crazy how much has been revealed already - it's like Erikson knows exactly what the reader expects the book to be and then gets everything expected out of the way right at the beginning so he can move on to the awesome stuff.
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Jan 26, 2012 10:51
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BananaNutkins posted:I loved Deadhouse Gates, but currently reading MoI and really hating it. Too much ridiculous backstory world building fantasy crazy names, with 0 characters worth caring about. Hoping it picks up, because like I said, I enjoyed Deadhouse. I'm glad I'm not you, because I loving love all that stuff and I like pretty much all of the major characters introduced so far except for the caravan guards - although I'm guessing they will become more important later on considering they're on the cover of the book.
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Jan 27, 2012 00:16
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Would I be missing/spoiling anything if I read Midnight Tides before House of Chains? I can only afford to buy one or the other at the moment, and Midnight Tides is sounding more interesting to me right now than HoC. Also the cover of MT is way cooler. e: whoops, sorry about the double post
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Jan 27, 2012 03:05
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Screw it, I just bought both HoC and MT. So what if I can't eat? Books are food for your mind. Or something.
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Jan 27, 2012 04:37
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mcustic posted:I picked it up after finishing ASOIAF and if I were to compare the two series, I'd say that A Song of Ice and Fire reads like a TV series (I thought that even before the show was announced) and Malazan reads like the best pen and paper campaign ever. I like this analogy, not just for the obvious reason, but because when I used to play D&D and V:tM and Battletech the sourcebooks and histories and poo poo were always my favorite thing about them (that and designing awesome characters). I liked them more than actually playing the games.
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Jan 27, 2012 12:22
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02-6611-0142-1 posted:Are these K'Chain Che'Malle?
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Jan 28, 2012 01:30
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Kruppe himself is the series' full allotment of food description. Man, if the Pannion Domin ever got their hands on him...
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Jan 29, 2012 03:35
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It's unfortunate that the argument against Malazan in the fantasy/sci-fi thread has basically come down to "It has dumb looking words in it". There are legitimate complaints about the series, but they only seem of interest to a couple people. Everyone else begins and ends at "It has dumb looking words in it." e: I was just thinking, does it seem to anyone else like the more ornate a word is, the more ancient its origins? Conduit for Sale! fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Jan 31, 2012 |
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Jan 31, 2012 01:32
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There's a few more. Erikson does like his glottal stops, that's for sure. I just don't understand why it's a problem. Do some people just fly into a rage whenever they see or hear a glottal stop? The better hope they never find themselves in the company of people who speak Arabic, then. Erikson does use a handful dumb words in his books, but luckily books are full of words, so if I don't like one I can move on to the next. e: I think with this new-ish wave of gritty, realistic low fantasy that spurns traditional fantasy tropes, people are getting into fantasy who previously hated, or just got tired of, the more traditional fantasy. But Malazan, while it may seem to be of the more gritty and realistic fantasy on first glance, is firmly rooted in traditional fantasy. So people get into it thinking it's going to be like ASoIaF, but instead find what they were trying to get away from. And that's probably pretty off-putting. Personally though, what other people hate about the series I tend to love (not the dumb words, the other stuff). Conduit for Sale! fucked around with this message at 02:52 on Jan 31, 2012 |
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Jan 31, 2012 02:36
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The worst is K'Chain Che'Malle. Why couldn't he just pick one of those words?
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Jan 31, 2012 03:02
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To be fair, naming characters things like Picker or Fiddler is something straight out of Black Company, which Erikson clearly was a huge fan of. Anyway, I've been wondering: is there any difference, appreciable or otherwise, between a god and an ascendant?
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Jan 31, 2012 18:23
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I've been wondering why Memories of Ice is the only Malazan TPB not available on Amazon, and I'm starting to think it might be because it was a behemoth of a book. I just got House of Chains, and at ~670 pages it's thicker than the 900 page Peter the Great: His Life and World. Amazon says the MoI TPB was thicker than The Great Book of Amber, which is 1300 pages to MoI's 780ish. Someone tell Tor that they can actually make pages thinner now.
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Jan 31, 2012 23:59
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Leospeare posted:To clarify, gods have many worshippers while ascendants may have a few - gotta start somewhere, after all. In MoI, they show that Treach had worshippers before being recognized as a god of war, and there may be other examples I'm forgetting. I'm curious how something like Hood's Gates came into being if most (all?) gods came into being as mortals. I suppose the mechanisms were already in place, Hood just took control of them. Or it's only a myth that all dead people pass through Hood's Gates. I'm only halfway through MoI though and this is already been touched on a little bit, so I'm guessing there will be at least a bit more about it in the books to come.
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Feb 1, 2012 22:57
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farcry posted:Reading Deadhouse Gates and just got to the part where they meet the bonehunters on the boat in the warren and while I am normally ok with high fantasy stuff this really put me off somehow. The whole mud thing was just wierd and then the rest might also be me not being able to keep up so much with the whole plot thing going on in the scene, got the same feeling also from when you find out the old emporer and dancer are cotilion and shadowthrone it just didnt seem right and like it was kind of forced in. Should I continue reading or is the series going to continue like this? And is it just me being dumb and not thinking hard enough or keeping up with plot thing? Keep in mind that you're kind of starting the story midway with GotM. There are a lot of important plot points that you're only going to find out after the fact and probably secondhand - like the Kellanved and Dancer thing. There's a lot that happened in Kellanved's time and with Laseen's ascent to power that is important to the story but we only find out after the fact. I've read through book 3 and I still barely know anything about Laseen and the empire - which makes sense because up until now the story has had very little to do with the empire proper, only with its agents. I do agree that the whole part with Felisin and Heboric and Kulp inside the warren was weird and didn't really fit. I'm sure it's foreshadowing of some sort but it seems like the only reason for including it was as a future callback. That kind of annoys me. I mean, I'm totally fine with putting in stuff that will only really make complete sense in future books, but only if it also has some sort of importance to the current story. eg Heboric's chopped off hands, Heboric finding and touching that big green dude, Otataral all have importance to the current story and have significance that will only be revealed in later books.
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Feb 10, 2012 08:08
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The flashback was just meant to tell how the Bridgeburners met Quick Ben/Kalam I'm pretty sure. e: also who Quick Ben was and why he has like 12 warrens
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Feb 15, 2012 15:21
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Antinumeric posted:Isn't Lady Envy's dog very special however? I recall it being (big spoiler) Fanderay Yeah. And Togg was in Toc. I can't remember what the other one was. I think it was an Ay but there was something else special about it.
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Feb 16, 2012 11:56
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:Malazan, like all fantasy novels, has tons of dumb stuff. The fact that literally everyone and everything is an ascendant or god or is nearing that status is one of them, and actually it detracts from one of the core themes of the book that we get a lot of philosophizing on that mortals can challenge gods/ascendants. This is constantly mentioned by Paran, who himself is an ascendant for no particular reason other than random 'chosen by fate' type stuff. It's never bothered me that much because we're at the center of the story, and there's a reason so many powers are gathering. Also I like Paran's role as Master of the Deck. It seems like a good - or at least interesting - fit. I like him a lot better in book 3+ than in book 1 at least.
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Feb 16, 2012 17:59
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bigmcgaffney posted:And following certain characters with power is still boring as sin. Like in MoI, you think Caladan Brood is gonna be awesome, and then he does fuckall except mope around, and all he uses his super powerful hammer for is trying to intimidate a fat guy. I get the impression that certain powerful characters are so burdened by their power and wanting to do the "right" thing with it that they end up just doing nothing. Conduit for Sale! fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Feb 18, 2012 |
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Feb 18, 2012 17:30
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BananaNutkins posted:The third book was so bad that I will probably never read another book in the series. I couldnt care about any of the characters, the magic system got out of hand, too many side plots were presented, and resurrections get handed out like candy, long winded meeting scenes where nothing happens are followed up by long winded meeting scenes where nothing happens, every viewpoint character spends the first half of the chapter giving an introspective monologue, etc. There really are a lot of things I can't stand about this book, but take my opinion as subjective, of course. Lots of people have said Memories of Ice is their favorite book. I won't argue this point by point but I'll just say that enjoying MoI and really the series at large requires you to really enjoy the world and its lore and history. The story that eventually plays out (I'm assuming a bit; I haven't made it to the latter half of the series) is only just beginning in MoI. And yea, if you're looking for great characters I don't think you're going to find a lot of them in Malazan. Some, but not a lot. The only characters I really liked in MoI were Picker and Blend, Quick Ben to a point, Stonny, Lady Envy (goddamn I wish there had been more of her in the book or even a series of her own like the Korbal Broach/Bauchelain books), Crone, and Kruppe to a point. Other characters have interesting storylines (Paran, Toc, Gruntle) or are funny (most of the Bridgeburners) or just kinda cool but aren't really that great otherwise.
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Mar 10, 2012 00:31
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FlyingCowOfDoom posted:Yeah I'm about 300 pages in with MoI and I'm loving it. Unlike the first two this one had me gripped from the start, probably because it wasn't introducing 40 new characters, just like 15. You could say you are enraptored by the book.
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Mar 20, 2012 00:07
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Matron was just loving insane. One of my favorite moments from MoI is when Rake kills Matron by dropping the loving Moon's Spawn on her. Right before she was about to be killed anyway. Most of the ascendants are so useless in MoI, which is why I'm always confused by people complaining about there being too many powerful characters. Also yes just read the first book. MoI was pretty much a direct sequel to Gardens of the Moon.
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Mar 25, 2012 07:59
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I'm determined to never buy a mass market paperback whenever possible, so the fact that I may probably end up buying a book with this terrible a cover saddens me. Every time I look at it I think Christmas. People in red suits riding a green carriage. I didn't even see the undeads the first dozen or so times I saw it, so I originally saw it as Santa's sleigh falling down a mountain for some unknown reason. Then I saw the undead and it's Santa's sleigh being attacked by undead and falling down a mountain. Give me generic action dudes brandishing their swords any day over that poo poo. My favorite covers are probable the ones from Deadhouse Gates, House of Chains and Midnight Tides covers. I really don't know why I like the MT cover so much, as it's just some dudes standing around a dragon's skull, but I do. As a side note, a while ago when I read the books I was really crazy about Memories of Ice. I even argued with some dude about it on this very forum. But in retrospect I kinda like it less. It was a bit of a mess, with too many POVs, and too many dudes standing around talking about their power levels. Don't get me wrong, I really liked what the dudes standing around were talking about, but it was still kind of an entire book of exposition, plus a battle that I didn't particularly like - I don't much care for Erikson's battles, I much prefer his world and mythology building, and his occasional great characters. Also in retrospect I like Deadhouse Gates a lot more. I thought just about every character was great, it didn't have too much power creep, and it had a lot of simple human moments. Duiker was a great character to document the Chain of Dogs, especially because he was a historian and the history of the Malazan world is, as I said, one of Erikson's strong points. But it was also great because he wasn't a soldier (at that point in his life, anyway). We saw the battles from the point of view of someone who wasn't fighting (mostly), and was there to see how the battles were affecting the civilians so to speak. I really liked Felisin's journey and transformation as well. I thought she was a really great character, and Erikson really gets the type of desperate, fearful anger that Felisin displayed. Heboric was a good character as well, it's unfortunate DG was his only appearance in the series. I really should get to House of Chains one of these days. 
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Aug 30, 2012 09:06
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